I was justing "thinking out loud" and thinking ahead. What we do on Sunday is really up to you because you're our Student Project Lead, the team captain. I would like time to speak with the new team members and the parents at the start. But after we "break out", the practice is yours to schedule and run.
I strongly suggest that you have a well developed plan written down. Otherwise you may find yourself floundering, with eager new team members waiting for a direction to go in... and no direction. So plan ahead and manage your time on Sunday so that you get accomplished what YOU want to accomplish. I'm just along for the ride. You're the team captain. Lead by fine example.
Your comments voice my concerns about 1) having enough memory space and 2) having enough power. I agree that if we go with the GPS-powered robot we are indeed, stepping into a new realm. I don't want to dissuade the Rocketeers from going in this direction by I am hesitant. It almost seems too challenging, especially since we only have two team members returning this year (Andrew and Dylan.) You and Tracy know our collective skill set. Do you think it's do-able? As a starting I would simply like to see us get the robot moving once it lands. Then maybe we can consider the GPS-power robot?
What about simply stacking one BOE circuit board atop the other as two independent devices? One would operate the ASP-2-- it would essentially be the same as last year-- and the other could be used to move and steer the robot's driving base. Some of the Rocketeers could work on one BOE and while others worked on the GPS driving base. At the very least we wouldn't be losing any ground since the ASP-2 would still be gathering and storing data. I worry about physical space inside the payload bay if we do this, and I worry about having sufficient power for the board with the GPS on it. What other considerations and complications do you foresee?
There is no reason NOT to have two separate systems, and it would make some things easier (memory space, power). I'm not sure how much work there'd be to do on the existing ASP device, though it could be a good project for the new group members. I think that learning to move a robot would be a good level challenge for the group. The GPS guidance part sounds pretty difficult to me, though, and without significant help from someone more experienced than I am, I have doubts that it could be done by September.
On the other hand, learning about how GPS works would be a great step for the group. Perhaps there might be a subgoal, something like simply logging GPS position as the bot drives around a little? Parallax has instructions somewhere on making a GPS datalogger on a Board of Education, so the directions for that should be quite straightforward. Oh, here it is:
I think that working through that project will teach you a lot. From there to GPS navigation is a matter of programming: how, given the current GPS data and (presumably) information about the target spot do you determine which direction to move? How do you determine which direction you are moving?
Did Santa find his way to you? Did you get new toys for Christmas? Santa got me an iPod, which I'm really enjoying, It's so small and it does so much! If only we could get to the same level of technological proficiency and prowess with the ASP-bot...!
Not much in the way of new toys, though I did get a Sparkfun micrologger from my brother, which I attached to an accelerometer and flew in a little two-staged model rocket on Sunday. My big exciting piece of technology is a new vacuum cleaner, to replace the twenty year old cannister I have, which does essentially nothing. I'm getting quite a bit of satisfaction out of pulling decades-old dirt out of my carpet. I vacuumed four times yesterday.
On the other hand, learning about how GPS works would be a great step for the group. Perhaps there might be a subgoal, something like simply logging GPS position as the bot drives around a little? Parallax has instructions somewhere on making a GPS datalogger on a Board of Education, so the directions for that should be quite straightforward. Oh, here it is:
I agree with you. Having the ASP drive around for a while, as it just logs onto a flashdrive its corrdinates seems like a first logical step to work towards if we choose to use GPS.
Hi everyone,
I was invited to attend the meeting on Sunday with the Team. I am delighted to go! Unfortunately, Sundays in the winter tend to be a problem for me, because of sports. Luckily though, this Sunday is free. I did have a couple ideas on the gps robot that will travel in the rocket. I noticed that you were having trouble, because the memory required to run the gps to bring the robot back to the luanch site is way over what the EEPROM can hold. Is there any chance that there is room for a second one? And could they be set up so that they "talk" to each other? Thanks so much!
-Jake-
How about all that SNOW we got today? 19 inches in our back yard, and that's with no drifting whatsover. Sylvie would feel right at home. It almost feels like WISCONSIN here on New Hampshire, Sylvie! (we should be so lucky, right?)
I've barely shoveled at all this year, so far. Probably no more than four inches, total. I'm sure that won't last.
Of course no-one in Wisconsin is thinking about snow at all, because we've still got the Packers in the playoffs. Go Pack Go!
I noticed that you were having trouble, because the memory required to run the gps to bring the robot back to the luanch site is way over what the EEPROM can hold. Is there any chance that there is room for a second one? And could they be set up so that they "talk" to each other? Thanks so much!
If you split duties right, there might not be any need for them to talk to each other. If the current board on the ASP does all the data collection and the new one just drives the 'bot and does the navigation, there's not really any need for communications. On the other hand, if you care about the location at which each gas sample was taken, then they do need to communicate.
Thanks for all the suggestions. They'll help guide us into our new project year when we meet on Sunday. As you can see we have several new Rocketeer 'candidates', with various levels of interest and expertise. I agree that if we go with the idea of GPS naviagtion, it could well take us until September to figure it out. I'd rather introduce our new members into the fundamentals of designing and engineering so they can make a product/ project that really works. As I mentioned before, maybe we could clone the ASP and let the returning team members, especially Andrew, work on GPS navigation. That way we could feasibly have two different payloads for mutltiple launches. Multiple high-power launches are always good.
Sounds like you're moving ahead with your electrical engineering experiments. I'm eager to hear more about the Sparkfun micrologger. Did it work well? Is it simple to program and use? I haven't launched a rocket since ARLISS in September.
And your new high-tech 'toy' is a..... vacuum cleaner? Maybe we can all pitch in and buy you one of those "Roomba' robotic vacuum cleaners. Now THAT would be fun! Think of all the sensors you could attach to it, all the data you could log as it zooms around the house. Heck, we might even launch a 'Roomba' at ARLISS and sweep up soil samples, then return them (robotically, of course!) to the launch pad.
Hi everyone! I'm Ashley Becker, but you probably know me as "Becker's sister", since that's how Mr. Kibler first introduced me.
I was invited to the January 16th meeting, but unfortunately, I have indoor soccer playoffs and can't make it. I crossed my fingers all week that the playoffs wouldn't interfere with the meeting, but I wasn't that lucky.
I am still interested in joining the ARLISS team though, since it would "expand my knowledge" and I am always looking for a challenge. I have also read up on previous posts to the forum about last year's project, and what you are thinking about for this year. I researched the things I didn't understand to clear it up. I will be researching more about ARLISS (my brother could help with that) and I apologize for not being able to make the meeting tomorrow.
This is just a reminder that we have a team practice, Sunday January 16th, at Mr. Kibler's house. Located at 8, Ray rd in Dunbarton. It will be from 1 - 4 p.m.. Although try to be ten minutes early to introduce yourself to everyone. All you need to bring to practice is a notebook and a few pens or pencils. Possibly a sheet of questions you wish to ask. You could also incase the notebook inside of a team binder, since you will need one shortly in the future.
We have made a last minute change on what our agenda at the practice will be. We will not be splitting into teams. After the presentation, we will all work on the program for a while, as we reactivate the movement portion of the ASP program back into play, as well as Andrew explains the physical aspects of the ASP and the program. After that, we will all take out our notebooks, (Although you should be taking notes on what Andrew was explaining in the first place), and take a look at the Pro's and Con's of adding GPS navigation to the ASP. It would be wise of you to go back a few pages in the forum and look at what Mr. Kibler and Sylvie said about what problems we could encounter from adding GPS navigation. This will help as ultimately decide if working towards GPS navigation is truly a good idea or not.
Hello,
About today's meeting, I do have a couple questions, actually, that I just thought of...
1st- When do you think that we will start building/improving the rockets? (That is if I make it on the team.)
2nd- To: Mr. Kibler~ You said probably Sunday we will meet, but do you mean every other Sunday or just this week (because that's what we are doing this week)?
That's it most of all I thought it was fun. Thanks for inviting me!
I think todays practice was EXTREMELY productive. It got us to practice team work, as well as integrating with other teams to pursue a common goal. At the same time, it got us to actually replicate a major section of the ASP. If you think about it, we re-made a few months of work in just about an hour. This furthered our understanding of the ASP, and just how it works. I noticed the green bins right before the presentation started. I thought you Mr. Kibler were just going to go over some parts and the BoE, but you caught me completely off guard!
I have some questions, both directed to Mr. Kibler and to everyone in general.
1. How do people feel about the fact that we can go to UNH to see their facilities on satellites and aerospace ?
2. Does everyone have a pretty good understand on the BoE so far? Need some clarification? If you do please speak up.
3. Could everyone Email me their Phone numbers, email etc? Just general contact information. My email is dylanglandry@gmail.com . I would like to keep a file with all of this information for general use and in emergencies. Andrew, I dont think you have to. I already have your phone from the emergency contact list we used last year, but still feel free to email me any information you would like me to know in case of emergency and whatnot.
I was delighted to meet everyone today, and get a sense of the new project team. I hope each of you got a sense about what the project is about, and learned something today. Below are some questions that each of you should keep in mind and discuss, but perhaps not necessarily come to a conclusion on right away.
1) We have discussed the advantages and disadvantages of GPS navigation extensively. What is your opinion on the matter and how do you think it will benefit our project, if at all? With GPS navigation aside, what are other ideas you have for a rover-related project? Perhaps simply a new sensor or something entirely different?
2) Putting all of the previously discussed project ideas aside, imagine for a moment that you could design, build and launch a project of your own. What would it be and how would it be beneficial?
Thank you for your prompt posts to the forum. This was one of our best "first practices" ever. There was excellent teamwork, problem solving, and communication. I have a very positive sense of our new candidates, and this year's team.
Andrew, I really liked your question #2. It shows real leadership, maturity, and insight:
"2) Putting all of the previously discussed project ideas aside, imagine for a moment that you could design, build and launch a project of your own. What would it be and how would it be beneficial?"
Let's keep the positive energy from today's first team meeting alive, here on the forum. Don't be a stranger here and ask lots of questions. I'm eager to meet with you all again in two weeks.
I propose that we meet again in two weeks, on Sunday January 30th from 1-4 PM. Let me know here on the forum whether this date and time will, or will not work for you. Dylan, please remember to thank your new team members and compliment them on their fine efforts today. A personal phone call or e-mail to say "Good work" goes a long way in building an effective project team.
I had an awesome time today, I learned alot more about the project, and I'm glad my parents attended to learn as well. I really enjoyed working with the homework boards and learning about the technology behind the ASP. Thank you Dylan and Andrew for answering my questions and helping me to understand the technology. I liked working as a team to (almost) complete a goal.
Questions:
1. what would the purpose of building the rover be (other than proving that we can)
2. how will we be sure the rover will land upright?
3. what other ways are there to bring the rover back to base if GPS proves impossible?
4. what other variables do we have to worry about other then space?
It was great to meet everyone, and thank you for having me. I had a blast.
Emily Rose
Hi, Obie here. I enjoyed the meeting so thank you Andrew for inviting me. I think the jumpstart straight into the program with us working on last years designs for ASP was brillant. I learned a good deal about the construction of electronic equipment, expecially being very careful with the equipment. Still, I need a few questions to be answered, but it definitely gave a decent overview of the ever changing project and construction processes. Answering your first question, Dylan, it would be a good idea to visit UNH because we'll be able to see how college level student's design and construct space/low-Earth orbit type craft. Also it can be fun and a bonding experience for the team. I'm for it.
First question: Dylan, what does BoE stand for?
2. Andrew, you will have to give me an overview of the advantages/disadvantages of the GPS before I can voice an opinion. (Well this isn't really a question)
3. The rover might have a problem with fitting, right? Well would it be possible to somehow compact it into a smaller space and, upon landing, effectively deploy into it current state?
4. How did you come up with the original circutry of the ASP? Is there a specific method you use to create and connect the circuts or does it come from experience?
5. Will we learn to program the Rover and ASP and what language is used? (I think Andrew gave me an overview of this)
Thanks again for inviting me, I had a blast.
-Obie
Emily,
Each and everyone of your questions are all things we have to think about. Those are the types of problems that we as a project team have to discuss and resolve. You are asking very good questions that would be good to put in the back of your head to be aware of for later.
Obie,
Your 3rd question is also along the same lines of Emily's. These are each types of questions that being in a team is benificial for.
" Will we learn to program the Rover and ASP and what language is used? (I think Andrew gave me an overview of this)"
We will all aquire a certain amount of knowledge in how to program both the ASP and the new compnents we might be adding. It just depends on how much we learn due to what we wish to do with our time as a team. The launguage we use is called PBASIC. It is Parallax's own launguage made for its own devices it manufactres or sells. We try to order parts from Parallax as often as possible due to compatability issues.
" How did you come up with the original circutry of the ASP? Is there a specific method you use to create and connect the circuts or does it come from experience?"
We were able to wire the components because of the resources we have. We used the item documentation on the Parallax website. We used our mentors, Sylvie and Dr. Allen. We even used professors from other schools, as well as employies from Parallax! There is no right or wrong way on how to go about wiring electronics, (Except of course if you litterally wire it wrong ). It just depends on what resources you have, and how you make use of them.
"What does BoE stand for?"
BoE stand for Board of Education. Yesterday, we were working on HwB's, Homework Boards. They are the circuit boards that Parallax sells for an extremily wider variaty of uses.
P.S. I will be able to make it to the next practice.
Sunday’s practice was quite the sight to behold! We got down to work and almost accomplished our goal! I’ve never seen a group work so well together without making many flaws (even though our SHT’s weren’t reading the correct temperature). I’ve been thinking about what I was going to post on the blog for the few days since the meeting, and I think I’ve pin pointed a couple things I’d like to point out about the actual meeting and the ASP-II (I hope that’s what was decided on for a name!). First though, I would like to thank Mr. Kibler for inviting us into his beautiful home. It was an honor to work with the ARLISS Team. I was completely thrown by surprise when we jumped into the midst of the project, by working with the HWB’s. I remember that about half-way through the project, Mr. Kibler came in and pointed out that the instructions were for a BoE, not an HwB. Although they’re alike, they may not be exactly alike. This could cause the SHT sensors to be off slightly. This brings it down to a wiring problem. I think that there is maybe only one missing wire, or one too many. Would this set off the sensors by a few degrees?
I also noticed a few problems with this year’s ASP. First, the most obvious one, is that of course it didn’t fit into the payload. That can be the difference of a trip to Nevada or not! The wheels fit in, but the BoE stand and the BoE did not fit. They were off by about two millimeters. The easiest way to fix this would probably be to “trim” the stand a little. Another problem I noticed was about the parachute. We don’t want to get too far ahead of ourselves, because the GPS is a huge part of “The Come-back Challenge.” It states it in the name! Unfortunately, the ASP is designed in a way so that if the parachute is not in the perfect position, then the ASP won’t be able to move at all. One of three things might happen:
A) The ASP will land upside down, and the wheels are NOT in the right position to be able to move no matter what way it lands The parachute will damage the raised BoE on release because of the power created when it is pulled out of the payload
C) And finally, the parachute may get tangled in the stand of the ASP and smash into the ground (No, I doubt you would still get data)
Think about it and then post ideas. “Where would the parachute have to be positioned to ensure a perfect landing?”
Remember, don’t over think it! We still have the GPS to get running, which thanks to Andrew and Dylan is already on the road to success!
There is also the problem of protecting something so oddly shaped. Remember last year how you launched in a sandstorm? And the ASP-I got dragged across the sand and dirt for a little over a mile? The ASP-II is a little less sturdy (it has moving parts!), and is likely to break in conditions like that. Think about and design a “shield” to protect the ASP-II for our next meeting. (Remember, it also has to be light weight!).
One last thing before I end this post (besides the questions of course). The 30th should work fine for me. I will have to check with my parents about it, but I believe that will be an okay weekend.
Questions (not including what we will have for cookies next meeting? ):
1) Think about it and then post ideas. “Where would the parachute have to be positioned to ensure a perfect landing?
2) Think about and design a “shield” to protect the ASP-II for our next meeting. (Remember, it also has to be light weight!).
3) What do you plan to do with the information that is hopefully gained for the launch? Presentations?
4) The idea for a “Roomba” (a self powered vacuum) was posted a while back. Maybe we could use a vacuum to collect soil samples? What would you like to learn from that?
Thanks-
One of the Rocketeers missed the Roomba joke; he took it too seriously since he doesn't often see my wry humor in the 'traditional' classroom. that's why I like ARLISS team/ practices. It's teaching at its best.
So you THINK the Roomba would clog with desert detritus after a meter or so...?!
GREAT PRACTICE on Sunday! Another group of heavy hitters this season!
you got me with that one! I thought you where completely serious about the "Roomba"! I still think it would be really interesting to see if we could collect a soil sample when it landed, like they do in NASA!
NOW you're talking...! :thumb: So what do you think about designing and building our robot to collect soil samples? The project is still wide open, you know. This is an excellent idea, one that deserves more consideration and discussion here on the forum.
OTHER ROCKETEERS (Dylan, Andrew, Sylvie, Dr. Allen, Emily, Obie, Stephanie, Ashley, and others who know the project):
What are your thoughts on a soil-collecting robot?
I think that having a robot that could collect soil would be really cool, I was thinking about Andrews question about what we would create if we had our own projects I would want to make a robot that could detect water in the dessert or on another planet one day? Maybe if the robot collect soil and could analyze the minerals it picked up then we could find a water source?
Emily
First off, I agree with Jacob. it would be cool to pick up a small sample of the soil/dirt the ASP 2 lands on, of course after factoring the weight of the other parts. I think a good answer to the protective shell around the ASP may be really thin sheet metal. It's fairly malleable, decently strong, and light weight. Its also possible that if we position it correctly we may be able to solve the problem of the rover landing upsidedown. Or we could take thin rods and bend them into semi-circles around the rover to keep it upright. Also question, How do we plan on powering the rover? Is it going to be battery powered or, I don't know, solar powered maybe?
Well can't wait for the 30th, so see you all then.
Obie
Isn't a humidity sensor (the SHT, which is already installed on the ASP-2) in essence a "water detector...? What is humidity? Scientifically speaking, why would we want to find water in the Black Rock desert? Or is this just a trial run for something your NASA robot might do when they hire you...?
Obie Wan,
Consider that we have two shortwave transmitters mounted on the ASP-2. Why are they there, what is a Faraday Shield, and how would a metal 'shell' around the ASP affect things, for better AND for worse?
Also, I just happen to have an 'Alta' reflectance spectrometer. How could that be used in analyzing soil, if that's a direction we want to go in...?
You "newbies" are doing really, really well so far. Keep up the good work!
To answer Mr.Kibler's question: "What is humidity?" Humidity is the amount of moisture in the air. Therefore, could measure the amount of water.
A soil collecting robot sounds like a great idea for the project.
~Ashley
ROCKETEERS AND ROCKETEERS WANNA-BES (those of you who are "trying out" for this year's project team):
Our practice on Sunday, January 30th will involve programming, not building like our first practice. To prepare, I suggest a few things:
1) Download the FREE Parallax "Basic Stamp Editor" program. If you have a laptop computer you can bring to next practice, load the program to your laptop. (**ANYONE who has a laptop with a serial port (and a USB), we could really use another laptop with a serial port.)
2) Go to "our" forum. Open up and save the ASP-2 program from last year (and any other simpler programs from the Parallax website that interest you and may be easier to understand.)
3) READ, READ, READ about Parallax PBASIC program code. Start understanding how it works, and how to make it work.
At our next practice you will be randomly grouped as before. Your task will be:
1) To re-program the ASP-2 to make it work differently (I won't tell you how quite yet...!)
2) "Open up" last year's ASP-2 program and make it run the servo motors you will be attaching to the BOE prototype boards you built at last practice.
This programming stuff may seem daunting at first because it's new. READ, READ, READ to understand, then ask questions... before our next practice. Take the initiative. Become a critical reader and a critical thinker thinker. This project is not for lightweights. It's the real thing.
Andrew and Dylan,
Guide your new teammates about what to read and where to find the information. You will want to brush up on this too, because you will be leading the team through the activity.
Mr. Kibler-
An 'Atla' reflectance spectrometer is a device uses light (including infared) to collect data. Am i wrong to say that we would be able to interpret what the soil is made up of?
all-
Thank you so much to the wonderful responses you gave me! It's great to know what the possible team is willing to accomplish! And I love how many of you are excited about the idea of collecting a soil sample! lets keep reaching for the stars! to comment on a few-
Obie- We have been working on building a TPS in Science class ( a thermal protection system) that will protect a small capsule from 1000 degrees and over. when Mr. Kibler showed the class sheet metal as a material, it burned up extremely fast. Although we would have a parachute, is it possible that there could still be air friction?
Dylan- My email is goldsberry13@live.com
Mr. Kibler (again)- Thank you for your energetic response! I will keep thinking about desgining a soil sample collecting attachment to the ASP.
thanks all
-Jake-
Comments
I'm confused,do you want to add something like this to our agenda for this up coming practice?
--Dylan Landry
I was justing "thinking out loud" and thinking ahead. What we do on Sunday is really up to you because you're our Student Project Lead, the team captain. I would like time to speak with the new team members and the parents at the start. But after we "break out", the practice is yours to schedule and run.
I strongly suggest that you have a well developed plan written down. Otherwise you may find yourself floundering, with eager new team members waiting for a direction to go in... and no direction. So plan ahead and manage your time on Sunday so that you get accomplished what YOU want to accomplish. I'm just along for the ride. You're the team captain. Lead by fine example.
Mr. Kibler
:cool:
There is no reason NOT to have two separate systems, and it would make some things easier (memory space, power). I'm not sure how much work there'd be to do on the existing ASP device, though it could be a good project for the new group members. I think that learning to move a robot would be a good level challenge for the group. The GPS guidance part sounds pretty difficult to me, though, and without significant help from someone more experienced than I am, I have doubts that it could be done by September.
On the other hand, learning about how GPS works would be a great step for the group. Perhaps there might be a subgoal, something like simply logging GPS position as the bot drives around a little? Parallax has instructions somewhere on making a GPS datalogger on a Board of Education, so the directions for that should be quite straightforward. Oh, here it is:
http://www.parallax.com/Store/Sensors/CompassGPS/tabid/173/CategoryID/48/List/0/SortField/0/Level/a/ProductID/603/Default.aspx
I think that working through that project will teach you a lot. From there to GPS navigation is a matter of programming: how, given the current GPS data and (presumably) information about the target spot do you determine which direction to move? How do you determine which direction you are moving?
Not much in the way of new toys, though I did get a Sparkfun micrologger from my brother, which I attached to an accelerometer and flew in a little two-staged model rocket on Sunday. My big exciting piece of technology is a new vacuum cleaner, to replace the twenty year old cannister I have, which does essentially nothing. I'm getting quite a bit of satisfaction out of pulling decades-old dirt out of my carpet. I vacuumed four times yesterday.
I agree with you. Having the ASP drive around for a while, as it just logs onto a flashdrive its corrdinates seems like a first logical step to work towards if we choose to use GPS.
Thank you for starting to go over the code with me during school on monday. I look forward to learning more.
I was invited to attend the meeting on Sunday with the Team. I am delighted to go! Unfortunately, Sundays in the winter tend to be a problem for me, because of sports. Luckily though, this Sunday is free. I did have a couple ideas on the gps robot that will travel in the rocket. I noticed that you were having trouble, because the memory required to run the gps to bring the robot back to the luanch site is way over what the EEPROM can hold. Is there any chance that there is room for a second one? And could they be set up so that they "talk" to each other? Thanks so much!
-Jake-
I've barely shoveled at all this year, so far. Probably no more than four inches, total. I'm sure that won't last.
Of course no-one in Wisconsin is thinking about snow at all, because we've still got the Packers in the playoffs. Go Pack Go!
If you split duties right, there might not be any need for them to talk to each other. If the current board on the ASP does all the data collection and the new one just drives the 'bot and does the navigation, there's not really any need for communications. On the other hand, if you care about the location at which each gas sample was taken, then they do need to communicate.
Thanks for all the suggestions. They'll help guide us into our new project year when we meet on Sunday. As you can see we have several new Rocketeer 'candidates', with various levels of interest and expertise. I agree that if we go with the idea of GPS naviagtion, it could well take us until September to figure it out. I'd rather introduce our new members into the fundamentals of designing and engineering so they can make a product/ project that really works. As I mentioned before, maybe we could clone the ASP and let the returning team members, especially Andrew, work on GPS navigation. That way we could feasibly have two different payloads for mutltiple launches. Multiple high-power launches are always good.
Sounds like you're moving ahead with your electrical engineering experiments. I'm eager to hear more about the Sparkfun micrologger. Did it work well? Is it simple to program and use? I haven't launched a rocket since ARLISS in September.
And your new high-tech 'toy' is a..... vacuum cleaner?
From the lab,
Mark
:cool:
I was invited to the January 16th meeting, but unfortunately, I have indoor soccer playoffs and can't make it. I crossed my fingers all week that the playoffs wouldn't interfere with the meeting, but I wasn't that lucky.
I am still interested in joining the ARLISS team though, since it would "expand my knowledge" and I am always looking for a challenge. I have also read up on previous posts to the forum about last year's project, and what you are thinking about for this year. I researched the things I didn't understand to clear it up. I will be researching more about ARLISS (my brother could help with that) and I apologize for not being able to make the meeting tomorrow.
~Ashley Becker~
We have made a last minute change on what our agenda at the practice will be. We will not be splitting into teams. After the presentation, we will all work on the program for a while, as we reactivate the movement portion of the ASP program back into play, as well as Andrew explains the physical aspects of the ASP and the program. After that, we will all take out our notebooks, (Although you should be taking notes on what Andrew was explaining in the first place), and take a look at the Pro's and Con's of adding GPS navigation to the ASP. It would be wise of you to go back a few pages in the forum and look at what Mr. Kibler and Sylvie said about what problems we could encounter from adding GPS navigation. This will help as ultimately decide if working towards GPS navigation is truly a good idea or not.
Can't wait to meet you all,
--Dylan Landry
About today's meeting, I do have a couple questions, actually, that I just thought of...
1st- When do you think that we will start building/improving the rockets? (That is if I make it on the team.)
2nd- To: Mr. Kibler~ You said probably Sunday we will meet, but do you mean every other Sunday or just this week (because that's what we are doing this week)?
That's it most of all I thought it was fun. Thanks for inviting me!
~Steph
I have some questions, both directed to Mr. Kibler and to everyone in general.
1. How do people feel about the fact that we can go to UNH to see their facilities on satellites and aerospace
2. Does everyone have a pretty good understand on the BoE so far? Need some clarification? If you do please speak up.
3. Could everyone Email me their Phone numbers, email etc? Just general contact information. My email is dylanglandry@gmail.com . I would like to keep a file with all of this information for general use and in emergencies. Andrew, I dont think you have to. I already have your phone from the emergency contact list we used last year, but still feel free to email me any information you would like me to know in case of emergency and whatnot.
Hope everyone had a fun practice,
Dylan Landry
I was delighted to meet everyone today, and get a sense of the new project team. I hope each of you got a sense about what the project is about, and learned something today. Below are some questions that each of you should keep in mind and discuss, but perhaps not necessarily come to a conclusion on right away.
1) We have discussed the advantages and disadvantages of GPS navigation extensively. What is your opinion on the matter and how do you think it will benefit our project, if at all? With GPS navigation aside, what are other ideas you have for a rover-related project? Perhaps simply a new sensor or something entirely different?
2) Putting all of the previously discussed project ideas aside, imagine for a moment that you could design, build and launch a project of your own. What would it be and how would it be beneficial?
Thanks again,
Andrew
Thank you for your prompt posts to the forum. This was one of our best "first practices" ever. There was excellent teamwork, problem solving, and communication. I have a very positive sense of our new candidates, and this year's team.
Andrew, I really liked your question #2. It shows real leadership, maturity, and insight:
"2) Putting all of the previously discussed project ideas aside, imagine for a moment that you could design, build and launch a project of your own. What would it be and how would it be beneficial?"
Let's keep the positive energy from today's first team meeting alive, here on the forum. Don't be a stranger here and ask lots of questions. I'm eager to meet with you all again in two weeks.
I propose that we meet again in two weeks, on Sunday January 30th from 1-4 PM. Let me know here on the forum whether this date and time will, or will not work for you. Dylan, please remember to thank your new team members and compliment them on their fine efforts today. A personal phone call or e-mail to say "Good work" goes a long way in building an effective project team.
Well done Rocketeers! :thumb:
Mr. Kibler
:nerd:
Questions:
1. what would the purpose of building the rover be (other than proving that we can)
2. how will we be sure the rover will land upright?
3. what other ways are there to bring the rover back to base if GPS proves impossible?
4. what other variables do we have to worry about other then space?
It was great to meet everyone, and thank you for having me. I had a blast.
Emily Rose
First question: Dylan, what does BoE stand for?
2. Andrew, you will have to give me an overview of the advantages/disadvantages of the GPS before I can voice an opinion. (Well this isn't really a question)
3. The rover might have a problem with fitting, right? Well would it be possible to somehow compact it into a smaller space and, upon landing, effectively deploy into it current state?
4. How did you come up with the original circutry of the ASP? Is there a specific method you use to create and connect the circuts or does it come from experience?
5. Will we learn to program the Rover and ASP and what language is used? (I think Andrew gave me an overview of this)
Thanks again for inviting me, I had a blast.
-Obie
Each and everyone of your questions are all things we have to think about. Those are the types of problems that we as a project team have to discuss and resolve. You are asking very good questions that would be good to put in the back of your head to be aware of for later.
Obie,
Your 3rd question is also along the same lines of Emily's. These are each types of questions that being in a team is benificial for.
" Will we learn to program the Rover and ASP and what language is used? (I think Andrew gave me an overview of this)"
We will all aquire a certain amount of knowledge in how to program both the ASP and the new compnents we might be adding. It just depends on how much we learn due to what we wish to do with our time as a team. The launguage we use is called PBASIC. It is Parallax's own launguage made for its own devices it manufactres or sells. We try to order parts from Parallax as often as possible due to compatability issues.
" How did you come up with the original circutry of the ASP? Is there a specific method you use to create and connect the circuts or does it come from experience?"
We were able to wire the components because of the resources we have. We used the item documentation on the Parallax website. We used our mentors, Sylvie and Dr. Allen. We even used professors from other schools, as well as employies from Parallax! There is no right or wrong way on how to go about wiring electronics, (Except of course if you litterally wire it wrong
"What does BoE stand for?"
BoE stand for Board of Education. Yesterday, we were working on HwB's, Homework Boards. They are the circuit boards that Parallax sells for an extremily wider variaty of uses.
P.S. I will be able to make it to the next practice.
Sunday’s practice was quite the sight to behold! We got down to work and almost accomplished our goal! I’ve never seen a group work so well together without making many flaws (even though our SHT’s weren’t reading the correct temperature). I’ve been thinking about what I was going to post on the blog for the few days since the meeting, and I think I’ve pin pointed a couple things I’d like to point out about the actual meeting and the ASP-II (I hope that’s what was decided on for a name!). First though, I would like to thank Mr. Kibler for inviting us into his beautiful home. It was an honor to work with the ARLISS Team. I was completely thrown by surprise when we jumped into the midst of the project, by working with the HWB’s. I remember that about half-way through the project, Mr. Kibler came in and pointed out that the instructions were for a BoE, not an HwB. Although they’re alike, they may not be exactly alike. This could cause the SHT sensors to be off slightly. This brings it down to a wiring problem. I think that there is maybe only one missing wire, or one too many. Would this set off the sensors by a few degrees?
I also noticed a few problems with this year’s ASP. First, the most obvious one, is that of course it didn’t fit into the payload. That can be the difference of a trip to Nevada or not! The wheels fit in, but the BoE stand and the BoE did not fit. They were off by about two millimeters. The easiest way to fix this would probably be to “trim” the stand a little. Another problem I noticed was about the parachute. We don’t want to get too far ahead of ourselves, because the GPS is a huge part of “The Come-back Challenge.” It states it in the name! Unfortunately, the ASP is designed in a way so that if the parachute is not in the perfect position, then the ASP won’t be able to move at all. One of three things might happen:
A) The ASP will land upside down, and the wheels are NOT in the right position to be able to move no matter what way it lands
C) And finally, the parachute may get tangled in the stand of the ASP and smash into the ground (No, I doubt you would still get data)
Think about it and then post ideas. “Where would the parachute have to be positioned to ensure a perfect landing?”
Remember, don’t over think it! We still have the GPS to get running, which thanks to Andrew and Dylan is already on the road to success!
There is also the problem of protecting something so oddly shaped. Remember last year how you launched in a sandstorm? And the ASP-I got dragged across the sand and dirt for a little over a mile? The ASP-II is a little less sturdy (it has moving parts!), and is likely to break in conditions like that. Think about and design a “shield” to protect the ASP-II for our next meeting. (Remember, it also has to be light weight!).
One last thing before I end this post (besides the questions of course). The 30th should work fine for me. I will have to check with my parents about it, but I believe that will be an okay weekend.
Questions (not including what we will have for cookies next meeting?
1) Think about it and then post ideas. “Where would the parachute have to be positioned to ensure a perfect landing?
2) Think about and design a “shield” to protect the ASP-II for our next meeting. (Remember, it also has to be light weight!).
3) What do you plan to do with the information that is hopefully gained for the launch? Presentations?
4) The idea for a “Roomba” (a self powered vacuum) was posted a while back. Maybe we could use a vacuum to collect soil samples? What would you like to learn from that?
Thanks-
-Jake-
Oh,
SYLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL... vie...?
(maybe he's out launching the Roomba?)
** Or... maybe you could use the Roomba to put out any fires that result from any errant rockets launched at Bong. A mobile robotic fire extinguisher!
Oh, yeah, I got the Roomba thing. I imagine that out on the dry lake bed, a Roomba would move about two feet, and be completely filled and immobile.
One of the Rocketeers missed the Roomba joke; he took it too seriously since he doesn't often see my wry humor in the 'traditional' classroom. that's why I like ARLISS team/ practices. It's teaching at its best.
So you THINK the Roomba would clog with desert detritus after a meter or so...?!
GREAT PRACTICE on Sunday! Another group of heavy hitters this season!
Mark
:cool:
Dylan- Going to UNH sounds like a good idea, and on #2 about the BoE, would you care to give me an explanation? Greatly appreciated.
Can't wait for the 30th!
~Ashley
NOW you're talking...! :thumb: So what do you think about designing and building our robot to collect soil samples? The project is still wide open, you know. This is an excellent idea, one that deserves more consideration and discussion here on the forum.
OTHER ROCKETEERS (Dylan, Andrew, Sylvie, Dr. Allen, Emily, Obie, Stephanie, Ashley, and others who know the project):
What are your thoughts on a soil-collecting robot?
Sylvie, what do you think...?
Mr. Kibler
:cool:
Emily
Well can't wait for the 30th, so see you all then.
Obie
Isn't a humidity sensor (the SHT, which is already installed on the ASP-2) in essence a "water detector...? What is humidity?
Obie Wan,
Consider that we have two shortwave transmitters mounted on the ASP-2. Why are they there, what is a Faraday Shield, and how would a metal 'shell' around the ASP affect things, for better AND for worse?
Also, I just happen to have an 'Alta' reflectance spectrometer. How could that be used in analyzing soil, if that's a direction we want to go in...?
You "newbies" are doing really, really well so far. Keep up the good work!
Mr. Kibler
:cool:
A soil collecting robot sounds like a great idea for the project.
~Ashley
Our practice on Sunday, January 30th will involve programming, not building like our first practice. To prepare, I suggest a few things:
1) Download the FREE Parallax "Basic Stamp Editor" program. If you have a laptop computer you can bring to next practice, load the program to your laptop. (**ANYONE who has a laptop with a serial port (and a USB), we could really use another laptop with a serial port.)
2) Go to "our" forum. Open up and save the ASP-2 program from last year (and any other simpler programs from the Parallax website that interest you and may be easier to understand.)
3) READ, READ, READ about Parallax PBASIC program code. Start understanding how it works, and how to make it work.
At our next practice you will be randomly grouped as before. Your task will be:
1) To re-program the ASP-2 to make it work differently (I won't tell you how quite yet...!)
2) "Open up" last year's ASP-2 program and make it run the servo motors you will be attaching to the BOE prototype boards you built at last practice.
This programming stuff may seem daunting at first because it's new. READ, READ, READ to understand, then ask questions... before our next practice. Take the initiative. Become a critical reader and a critical thinker thinker. This project is not for lightweights. It's the real thing.
Andrew and Dylan,
Guide your new teammates about what to read and where to find the information. You will want to brush up on this too, because you will be leading the team through the activity.
Aim high,
Mr. Kibler
:cool:
An 'Atla' reflectance spectrometer is a device uses light (including infared) to collect data. Am i wrong to say that we would be able to interpret what the soil is made up of?
all-
Thank you so much to the wonderful responses you gave me! It's great to know what the possible team is willing to accomplish! And I love how many of you are excited about the idea of collecting a soil sample! lets keep reaching for the stars! to comment on a few-
Obie- We have been working on building a TPS in Science class ( a thermal protection system) that will protect a small capsule from 1000 degrees and over. when Mr. Kibler showed the class sheet metal as a material, it burned up extremely fast. Although we would have a parachute, is it possible that there could still be air friction?
Dylan- My email is goldsberry13@live.com
Mr. Kibler (again)- Thank you for your energetic response! I will keep thinking about desgining a soil sample collecting attachment to the ASP.
thanks all
-Jake-