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ARLISS Team NH

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  • Andrew (ARLISS)Andrew (ARLISS) Posts: 213
    edited 2011-03-03 16:28
    There's a minimal chance of rain but it could be pretty windy, depending on what time of day we launch. It is, after all, a desert.



    Yes! We have practice THIS SUNDAY from 1-4 PM

    From my hospital bed (I had emergency surgery today),

    Mr.Kibler
    :cool:

    Mr. Kibler,

    I hope you feel better soon! As for Obie's question, I believe the most common weather hazard in the Black Rock Desert would be wind, and consequently dust... unless you plan to launch in the winter! It snowed 5+ inches of snow last week, a sight hard for me to imagine.

    See everyone this Sunday!

    -- Andrew
  • Jake GoldsberryJake Goldsberry Posts: 85
    edited 2011-03-03 17:58
    Emily- I'm glad to know that you're working on a design as well. Once it is finished we will collaborate and decide which is the most effective and efficient for our needs. Then we need to plan how we will present our final design. (we will be presenting? Or is that valuable time wasted and should we do it on the blog?)

    Obie- as we all know well, all the teams are very interdependent. Instead of waiting until later and running in to catastrophe, we need to decide where the parachute will be placed. We need to really work together on this part of the project because it could decide wether or not the landing is a success. Keep up the good work!

    Get better soon Mr Kibler!

    How is vacation?
    -Jake-
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-04 08:04
    Emily

    I'm glad to know that you're working on a design as well. Once it is finished we will collaborate and decide which is the most effective and efficient for our needs. Then we need to plan how we will present our final design. (we will be presenting? Or... should we do it on the blog?)

    -Jake-

    Emily and Jake,

    I hope to see Emily's design posted ere on the forum (not a blog) just as you did Jake, so that we can all preview it before we meet on Sunday. As before, let's use practice time to build, and time outside of practice to design, strategize, and collaborate. So Emily and Jake, please have this discussion and collaborate before Sunday's practice.

    I'm curious if you can come up with a simple, functional parachute release mechanism. Have you researched on-line to see what designs already exist that we might use? No need to re-invent the wheel. See you on Sunday. I might be moving slowly!

    From the hospital, :blank:

    Mr. Kibler
  • Emily RoseEmily Rose Posts: 53
    edited 2011-03-04 09:47
    Team,
    Here is my idea.
    parachute release mechanism2.png

    Emily
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-04 10:05
    Emily Rose wrote: »
    Team,
    Here is my idea.
    parachute release mechanism2.png

    Emily

    Can you explain how it works?

    :cool:
  • Emily RoseEmily Rose Posts: 53
    edited 2011-03-04 14:09
    yes I can. The servo motor will turn a gear which is attached to a cadycane shaped piece of metal. That will take the piece from resting against the circular plate on the ASP to open the loop by having the metal swing over the edge. Then the Parachute will be released and the piece of metal will turn back to sit at resting point.

    Emily
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-04 16:43
    Emily Rose wrote: »
    yes I can. The servo motor will turn a gear which is attached to a cadycane shaped piece of metal. That will take the piece from resting against the circular plate on the ASP to open the loop by having the metal swing over the edge. Then the Parachute will be released and the piece of metal will turn back to sit at resting point.

    Emily

    Thanks for the explanation. If I understand your description and your diagram correctly, the "candy cane-shaped hook" goes through the circular piece on the ASP-BOT. Then, when the servomotor is activated the hook moves and releases the parachute's shroud lines ("strings"). If that's correct I see two or three problems:

    1) The ASP-BOT's weight is pulling downward while the inflated parachute is pulling upward into the candy cane hook. How will the parachute's shroud lines come out of the loop?

    2) If we build the robot that we talked about, the circular shape is one of the two wheels. The diagram shows the candy cane hook going through the wheel.

    3) If we build the robot that we talked about and if the circular shape is one of the two wheels, the ASP-BOT will land sideways on the other wheel, perpendicular to the ground. When the program turns the wheels on the ASP-BOT won't go anywhere. It will sit in the desert and spin around and around, sideways, on one wheel. That is, if I understood your diagram and your description correctly.

    Thanks for the update Emily!

    Mr. Kibler
    :cool:
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-04 16:55
    I just want to say that i am really proud to see that electronics are flourishing in NH. Although i wasn't born here, i consider it to be my home. Most people disregard the scientific aspect of New Hampshire, but i really think it is crucial and will help shape the future of the state...It is weird to think that i could have seen some of you and didn't even know it! Keep up the good work guys and girls:)

    Ravenkallen,

    Our team is always open to clever-minded kids like you. I'd like to invite you to come to a couple of our meetings to see if the team is anything you might be interested in. If you like the team and if you make it through three "try-out" practices, the pay-off is a trip to Nevada's Black Rock desert to launch our robot miles in the air inside a really big Stanford University rocket...!

    LINK TO: Video of our launch, a PowerPoint, and a technical paper:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vytVgv6pTZU

    > http://www.isunet.edu/index.php?option=com_docman&task=cat_view&gid=259&Itemid=88888955

    We meet in Dunbarton every other Sunday afternoon from 1-4 PM but we do a lot of our project work here on the forum. If you'd like to drop in on a practice, let the team members know here on the forum and have your Mom or Dad give me a call at 774-7595. Our next practice is Sunday, March 6th. Thanks for posting to our forum.

    Mr. Kibler


    L. Mark Kibler, M.Ed. - Project Mentor
    ARLISS Team New Hampshire - Rocket Launch for International Student Satellites
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-04 17:18
    Emily and Rocketeers,

    2) "If we build the robot that we talked about, the circular shape is one of the two wheels. The diagram shows the candy cane hook going through the wheel."

    Here's a video of a rover one of the Japanese teams built. Note where the wheels are and how they're attached. This rover navigates by GPS. Has anyone contacted any of the Japanese teams? If our project isn't launch ready there's no trip to Nevada...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmdlywujZNs

    Mr. Kibler
    :cool:
  • Obie WanObie Wan Posts: 46
    edited 2011-03-05 06:01
    The Japanese team's robot was pretty cool. The drop pod idea for deploying and landing the robot was awesome an seemed to work for that height. At first I even thought that the robot was just armored for its protection, until it dropped that is. The wheels were located on either side of robot's length and the wheels also look like gears. The BoE board, wooden plank, and other components were sandwitched in between the wheels. Actually this is basically how I pictured it when we talked about it. See ya all tommorrow,

    Obie
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-05 08:19
    ROCKTEERS:

    Tomorrow's practice is questionable because I'm still in the
    hospital at Dartmouth Medical Center.
    I thought I might be discharged
    today but right now it's a 50-50 probability. If I'm discharged
    tomorrow I doubt that I'll be able to get to Dunbarton until
    mid-afternoon. Can someone please pass this information along to
    Stephanie, or does someone have her e-mail address? If you do, please
    e-mail it to me so I can contact her.

    ** I'll make a decision about practice no later than 10:30 tomorrow
    morning. I'll let everyone know by e-mail, and on the forum.**


    Thanks for your understanding. *I hope we don't have to cancel
    practice because that will mean no cookies...!

    Mr. Kibler
  • Jake GoldsberryJake Goldsberry Posts: 85
    edited 2011-03-05 09:22
    Emily- You have peaked my intrest. I do however see a couple "kinks" that would need to be worked out.
    Hopefully we can come up with a final design that incorparates Both of our ideas. It appears to me that both of our designs require a servomotor to turn exactly 360 degrees. This is a start as we know what our program is going to be. We both used a servomotor, so that's also something to start with. That's about as far as they get with similarity.

    Kinks to be fixed (or not depending on our final diagram. We probably will toss certain components of both our ideas to create one.)

    1. If the design Obie decides on is two circular shaped wheels with a board inbetween, It seem that your components (gears and shaft and whatnot) will be resting directly on the panel. It just doesn't seem that space efficent. Of course mine is also fairly chunky.

    2. It seemed like alot of moving parts. That's what really confused me. The more parts, the easier it is to break, and the flight up abd trip down will not be a walk in the park, I can tell you that.

    3. I'd like you to take another look at your idea and run through some "what if" statements. For instance: "What if the gears fall off in flight". Then you decide a way to prevent that.

    Keep up the good work!


    Mr. Kibler- Get better quick!!


    Have a good last few days of vacation! Hopefully i'll see you all tomorrow!
    -JAKE-
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-05 11:14
    ROCKETEERS,

    I'm being discharged from the hospital later today and so TOMORROW'S PRACTICE IS ON. The doctor was understanding and sympathetic of my need to be at practice and he called me a "committed and steely-eyed rocket scientist" (or something like that.) I took that as a compliment.

    I'll see you a little before 1 PM tomorrow. Bring your Parallax BOE protoboards with you; you should have them in a
    protective case by now and you will need them at tomorrow's practice.

    Stay cool, aim high,

    Mr. Kibler
    :cool:
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-05 11:23
    Emily- You have peaked my interest... -JAKE-


    Rocketeers,

    I always giggle a bit when I see this word written out. Phonetically it IS pronounced "peaked", but it's spelled differently: PIQUED. It means "to excite greatly (interest, curiosity, etc.)", as in "You have piqued my interest." Now you've all learned a new word for the SAT test: PIQUED.

    Jake, thanks for posting. I'm curious about Emily's idea for a parachute release mechanism, and yours too. I'm eager to see them both at tomorrow's practice. Recall that you have to have a prototype built and working in two weeks, and the final mechanism built AND PROGRAMMED in a month.

    Mr. Kibler
    ;-)
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-05 11:36
    .
    Jake's comments in dark letters ,mine in red:

    1) Hopefully we can come up with a final design that incorparates Both of our ideas.

    1) Does the design NEED to incorporate both of your ideas?


    2) It appears to me that both of our designs require a servomotor to turn exactly 360 degrees. This is a start as we know what our program is going to be. We both used a servomotor, so that's also something to start with.

    2) Do you HAVE to use a servomotor at all? Is there a simpler, better,more "fail-safe" way to do it?


    3) We probably will toss certain components of both our ideas to create one.)

    3) Again, why must the design incorporate both of your ideas? Is there a good reason or do we just want everyone to "feel happy"? Not a good reason for designing any component a certain way.
    .
    .
    PART 2:

    1. If the design Obie decides on is two circular shaped wheels with a board inbetween, It seem that your components (gears and shaft and whatnot) will be resting directly on the panel. It just doesn't seem that space efficent. Of course mine is also fairly chunky.

    1) You will need to understand what "Obie's" rover is going to look like before you get too far ahead, or too far behind.


    2. It seemed like alot of moving parts. That's what really confused me. The more parts, the easier it is to break, and the flight up abd trip down will not be a walk in the park, I can tell you that.

    2) Good thinking Jake! Yes. there seem to be many moving parts? Are there too many? The more moving parts, the higher the probability that something will break. Recall Occam's Razor and K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple, Scientists


    3. I'd like you to take another look at your idea and run through some "what if" statements. For instance: "What if the gears fall off in flight". Then you decide a way to prevent that.

    3) Yes, what is your redundancy system (back-up plan) if something fails to work? Again, good thinking Jake. Good thinking is good planning and it saves valuable building time.


    Mr. Kibler
    ;-)
  • Andrew (ARLISS)Andrew (ARLISS) Posts: 213
    edited 2011-03-05 15:14
    ROCKETEERS,

    I'm being discharged from the hospital later today and so TOMORROW'S PRACTICE IS ON. The doctor was understanding and sympathetic of my need to be at practice and he called me a "committed and steely-eyed rocket scientist" (or something like that.) I took that as a compliment.

    I'll see you a little before 1 PM tomorrow. Bring your Parallax BOE protoboards with you; you should have them in a
    protective case by now and you will need them at tomorrow's practice.

    Stay cool, aim high,

    Mr. Kibler
    :cool:

    Mr. Kibler,

    See you and the team tomorrow at a little before 1 PM. I am eager to see the progress that each of the subsystem teams have made with their respective tasks!

    Andrew
  • Jake GoldsberryJake Goldsberry Posts: 85
    edited 2011-03-05 15:18
    Thank you Mr. Kibler for the tips. My dad was just explaining to me a couple of devices that don't have gears or spinning parts, but there is one that i really like that will work perfectly for my design. I don't know how we will get our hands on one, but that's all part of the challenge! It's called a soleniod. It's a tightly coiled wire that creates a magnetic field when elctricity passes through this. If the small bar in my design was magnetic, when the soleniod was activated, the bolt would pop straight out. This eliminates alot of possible problems with the design. Thanks for the comments!
    -Jake-
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-05 15:35
    Mr. Kibler,

    See you and the team tomorrow at a little before 1 PM. I am eager to see the progress that each of the subsystem teams have made with their respective tasks!

    Andrew


    Andrew and Dylan,

    I'm eager to see how the movement program and GPS navigation are coming along, too. Can you give us a brief update?

    Thanks,

    Mr. Kibler
    :cool:
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-05 15:39
    Thank you Mr. Kibler for the tips. My dad was just explaining to me a couple of devices that don't have gears or spinning parts, but there is one that i really like that will work perfectly for my design. I don't know how we will get our hands on one, but that's all part of the challenge! It's called a soleniod. It's a tightly coiled wire that creates a magnetic field when elctricity passes through this. If the small bar in my design was magnetic, when the soleniod was activated, the bolt would pop straight out. This eliminates alot of possible problems with the design. Thanks for the comments!
    -Jake-


    Hmmmmmm,,,, a solenoid!

    Where and how would you use it in the parachute deployment mechanism design?

    Have you researched them on-line so we have pictures ahead of time? Does Parallax sell them?

    How much voltage does a solenoid use?

    How much voltage do we have available? Where will the power come from (the BOE? Rover? Transmitter?)

    What does your design team partner think about using a solemoid?

    Mr. Kibler
    ;-)
  • Emily RoseEmily Rose Posts: 53
    edited 2011-03-06 06:56
    What does your design team partner think about using a solemoid?

    I think it would be a good idea except for one problem I can think of, a solemoid is released by energy pulses, aren't there going to be random energy pulse? They will read as zero's, would that interfere?
    Emily
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-06 07:15
    Emily Rose wrote: »
    What does your design team partner think about using a solemoid?

    I think it would be a good idea except for one problem I can think of, a solemoid is released by energy pulses, aren't there going to be random energy pulse? They will read as zero's, would that interfere?
    Emily


    Emily,

    I'm not quite sure what you mean. If a solenoid is "released by a high energy pulse", I think this means the solenoid draws a lot of voltage or millivoltage quickly in order to activate it ("open it up.") I'm not sure if it requires a constant source of power to keep it open. If it does, that could be a problem.

    Where would the "random energy pulses" that you mention come from? Would there be enough energy in one of these pulses to activate the solenoid...?

    See you around 1 PM,

    Mr. Kibler
    :cool:
  • Andrew (ARLISS)Andrew (ARLISS) Posts: 213
    edited 2011-03-06 07:46
    Andrew and Dylan,

    I'm eager to see how the movement program and GPS navigation are coming along, too. Can you give us a brief update?

    Thanks,

    Mr. Kibler
    :cool:

    Mr. Kibler,

    I'll let Dylan speak for himself on the matter of what progress he has made. As for myself, I have written a subroutine that, in theory, should activate the movement subroutine after ten consecutive zeroes have been outputted by the MAWD. However, without a MAWD or a way to simulate a flight with the MAWD, I have been unable to test my program and hope that is something we can accomplish at today's practice.

    To be honest, I haven't done too much with the GPS navigation program recently as I've been focusing on perfecting the movement and movement activation program. I could be mistaken, but I feel as that it wont be long until the movement program is completed, and we/I should have much more time to allocate to working on GPS navigation.

    See everyone soon!

    Andrew
  • Jake GoldsberryJake Goldsberry Posts: 85
    edited 2011-03-06 09:28
    Emily and Mr. Kibler- I see what you disagree with about using a soleniod. Although it is a faster more efficent way to remove the bolt in my design, it also has it's drawbacks, like the possibility of to much energy being used to activate it. I'm sure there is another way around this.

    -JAKE-
    P.S i'm bringing snickerdoodle cookies again!
  • CurtGCurtG Posts: 1
    edited 2011-03-06 11:36
    Jacobs excel file incase he needs it.
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-06 14:37
    E-mail to Mr. Kibler from Dylan:


    Dear Project Team,

    This practice was a clearly needed one. Even though we didn't get a lot of, "physical" work done, we were able to sort everything out. By that statement I mean the fact that everyone found where exactly they were in terms of completing their tasks. Andrew and I have at least found the roots of the problems to come in the movement program. Obie seems to have come two 3 or 5 designs that seem to be the most reliable, efficient etc. to our mission goals. Emily and Jake also seem to have come to a conclusion of the release mechanism. But remember Jake and Emily. Review all of the designs that you find to be possibilities. See if they are truly too complicated or unreliable.

    Dylan Landry
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-06 14:38
    CurtG wrote: »
    Jacobs excel file incase he needs it.


    Who is Curt G...?
  • Mark KiblerMark Kibler Posts: 546
    edited 2011-03-06 15:31
    .
    DEAR ROCKETEERS:

    I agree with Dylan. Though we didn't get a lot of building done today there was some good strategizing and collaboration and we have a much better sense of where things stand as separate subsystems, and how the whole project fits together. I still wonder if the parachute release mechanism isn't a bit over designed, and I'm eager to see the "movement" subroutine work.

    Please mark these two important dates and times on your calendars:

    OUR NEXT PRACTICE is SATURDAY, March 19th from 1-4 PM.

    WEDNESDAY, March 30 at 7:30AM - An important and necessary fundraising presentation to the Bedford Rotary at the Manchester Country Club. I know it's early but you will be served BREAKFAST before you make your presentation!

    Thanks again for a good practice. Jake = Thanks for some excellent cookies (or 'cookie'. I only got one.)

    Aim high,

    Mr. Kibler
    :cool:
  • Jake GoldsberryJake Goldsberry Posts: 85
    edited 2011-03-06 16:23
    Mr. Kibler- I'm glad you enjoyed the cookie! I should have brought more... I also agree with Dylan, we didn't get any building done, but we have gotten on the right path. Curt G is my dad. He posted my original idea on the forum from excel that was on his computer. Sorry about the confusion. Saturday works great for me. And one final thing, is it okay with you that I miss school for the meeting with the rotary club?
    -Jake-
  • Jake GoldsberryJake Goldsberry Posts: 85
    edited 2011-03-07 04:07
    Hi all-
    A couple more questions I have:
    1. Do Emily and I have a budget for materials? I'm pretty sure we are going to need to buy alot of the materials to build our release mechanism, unless you have spare parts laying around your house?
    2. Do Emily and I have a certain amount of voltage that we are aloud?
    3. How long will the meeting last with the rotary club? And is there anything you would like me to talk about specifically? (Since I haven't been to one, i'm unclear on how we present to them)

    Thanks for the help
    -Jake-
  • sylvie369sylvie369 Posts: 1,622
    edited 2011-03-07 09:58
    It is possible to set up a microprocessor (like the Stamp) to operate a solenoid. However, I think most solenoids require 12V supplies, and you don´t have one on your system. Solenoids also need some circuitry to be operated by the Stamp, and that might be a bit much. It´s worth looking into, but there are some difficulties that might make it impractical in your situation.

    I probably won´t be able to respond quickly to anything on this - I´m in Spain at the moment. But I´ll be reading your ideas as you go along.

    Paul
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