@Mickster said:
Another one is when you're laying on the floor, almost breaking your neck and you need to get your DMM probes on to the chip pins.
This is me, too. And it is exactly why everything I make for myself has socketted discretes at the “real world” connections wherever possible.
Example: The most recent disaster here in Texas left us without power for 5 days. I have a 404 Perkins diesel pushing a MecceAlt 20kw head. A Prop2 serves as the run/start/stop and engine controller. On Day 2 it just quit. 18F air temperature. After a few minutes of futzing with it I suspected an opto on the tach sense. I pulled it out and snapped another one in. It took-off and ran non-stop for another 3 days.
I like socketted interfaces! (And I’m learning not to trust offshore components from Amazon!)
If any one of these I/Os fails, the entire module needs to be replaced and those wires are all screw terminated.
New "Tibbit" interface modules (plus external SSRs):
I wonder if I can sweet-talk @Cluso99 for a modified layout with two double-row headers. I have empty shells for custom modules and it would be really cool for the Prop-1 to be a plug-in module
If any one of these I/Os fails, the entire module needs to be replaced and those wires are all screw terminated.
Do you see that light blue tab at the top of the terminal block? If you push down gently to unclip it, the whole terminal block then swings forward on a bottom pivot point.
If any one of these I/Os fails, the entire module needs to be replaced and those wires are all screw terminated.
New "Tibbit" interface modules (plus external SSRs):
I wonder if I can sweet-talk @Cluso99 for a modified layout with two double-row headers. I have empty shells for custom modules and it would be really cool for the Prop-1 to be a plug-in module
P.S. Pin 14 of RA13 needs reinspection, at least; possibly a case of a bit of flux and retouching with a fine solder pen (access partially blocked by a skylineskyscrapper-sized "resistor?")
P.S. II A "Stealth" U9, lying in between Q13/Q14.
P.S. III Wow, there are at least three instances of U9... Sure, copy/paste is not being going to be a dependable friend of your's, anymore.
@JonnyMac said:
You might consider bypass caps on all four sides of the P1.
Yip ..Underside has more caps for P1 and Protection diodes on output stages !! It was more of a post of how a prototype can be quite messy !> @Yanomani said:
SASqUATCH one, the missing link?
P.S. Pin 14 of RA13 needs reinspection, at least; possibly a case of a bit of flux and retouching with a fine solder pen (access partially blocked by a skylineskyscrapper-sized "resistor?")
P.S. II A "Stealth" U9, lying in between Q13/Q14.
P.S. III Wow, there are at least three instances of U9... Sure, copy/paste is not being going to be a dependable friend of your's, anymore.
Guilty as charged .. Copy and Paste has, indeed, been unkind ..
@Mickster said:
I served my apprenticeship as a panel builder and all I can say is that I find this wiring to be offensive
No ferrules
No wire idents
Crossed wires (fuse blocks next to the Pilz)
Rough-cut trunking lid
More than two wires in terminals!!!!
I’m sorta offended that you are offended at this offense. 🤣
On a serious note, I’m about to commit a similar crime. Can you point me to a good “best practices” document that covers the basics/standards? Would like to do a workmanlike job but honestly dont know where to start for this stuff.
"in the trade" those crossed wires at the top are "banjo strings". Nothing prototype about point-to-point wiring. Entire panel needs tossed out and re-done by a craftsman.
The Prop1 PLC looks great, quite impressive. With regards to the panel wiring it looks like a retrofit, so the customer more than likely doesn't want to pay for a whole new panel. And its not that bad. A little messy and working is better than pretty and not working.
@DigitalBob said:
The Prop1 PLC looks great, quite impressive. With regards to the panel wiring it looks like a retrofit, so the customer more than likely doesn't want to pay for a whole new panel. And its not that bad. A little messy and working is better than pretty and not working.
And so, you are brought in blind and expected to troubleshoot that thing and they are on your back wondering why you're taking so long.
You'll be cussing the panel builder.
Pretty certain that the customer didn't agree to a rat's nest and there's not even a cost saving anyway.
I've worked on worse, I've had rat nest machines, where I had to trace out every wire and create a schematic. QuattroRS4's Prop 1 PLC looks cool. Only he can tell us how well his project worked out. I have a upcoming rat nest job, looking foward to it. Pays well.
"in the trade" those crossed wires at the top are "banjo strings". Nothing prototype about point-to-point wiring. Entire panel needs tossed out and re-done by a craftsman.
Craig
My Prototype .... and this was during development. "Nothing prototype about point-to-point wiring. " - Less keyboard warrior ... more samples of your aforementioned 'Craftsmanship'
@DigitalBob said:
I've worked on worse, I've had rat nest machines, where I had to trace out every wire and create a schematic. QuattroRS4's Prop 1 PLC looks cool. Only he can tell us how well his project worked out. I have a upcoming rat nest job, looking foward to it. Pays well.
Thanks.
For the critics - This was during development and was a prototype ... worked out perfectly for the release version and in a high volume production facility ... I can only post development and not finished units or too much detail on what each unit does .. due to NDA's etc. I think I'll drop theses posts from now on ... and pull previous posts also no interest in that waffle..... done.
Sorry that happened @QuattroRS4
I really enjoyed reading your posts and successes- I find it motivating.
To @Mickster ... please try to be a little sensitive to the OP's standpoint when posting feedback. We can't all be at your standard "off the bat", but that shouldn't be used against anyone to belittle or be overly negative about their efforts. I'm sure from our good exchanges in the past that wasn't your intention at all, but it just reads that way sometimes. I must admit to wincing once or twice when reading your posts here! I can see how you got on a roll a little bit with your effort to share advice, as the topic seemed to tweak a nerve that I think we all suffer for certain things.
When we are sharing our experiences and positively encouraging our community friends, I think that helps us all improve, succeed and enjoy what we do even more in a really healthy way; together. Please let's all keep rockin' like that!!
@VonSzarvas said:
Sorry that happened @QuattroRS4
I really enjoyed reading your posts and successes- I find it motivating.
To @Mickster ... please try to be a little sensitive to the OP's standpoint when posting feedback. We can't all be at your standard "off the bat", but that shouldn't be used against anyone to belittle or be overly negative about their efforts. I'm sure from our good exchanges in the past that wasn't your intention at all, but it just reads that way sometimes. I must admit to wincing once or twice when reading your posts here! I can see how you got on a roll a little bit with your effort to share advice, as the topic seemed to tweak a nerve that I think we all suffer for certain things.
When we are sharing our experiences and positively encouraging our community friends, I think that helps us all improve, succeed and enjoy what we do even more in a really healthy way; together. Please let's all keep rockin' like that!!
My apologies to the OP and the community in general
It's not a "keyboard warrior" thing, I get in trouble all the time
Went to watch a live band with the missus and they were awful
missus: "Aren't they amazing?"
me: "No...Keith Richards plays this in open-G. Standard-tuning doesn't work and furthermore, the vocalist is making-up the lyrics!"
missus: "Why can't you just agree that they are amazing?"
She stormed-out and we didn't speak for a couple of days
Comments
This is me, too. And it is exactly why everything I make for myself has socketted discretes at the “real world” connections wherever possible.
Example: The most recent disaster here in Texas left us without power for 5 days. I have a 404 Perkins diesel pushing a MecceAlt 20kw head. A Prop2 serves as the run/start/stop and engine controller. On Day 2 it just quit. 18F air temperature. After a few minutes of futzing with it I suspected an opto on the tach sense. I pulled it out and snapped another one in. It took-off and ran non-stop for another 3 days.
I like socketted interfaces! (And I’m learning not to trust offshore components from Amazon!)
Your board looks good, I see resistor arrays and many white opto's, just curious it looks like you doubled up on the eproms.
I'm currently replacing this:
If any one of these I/Os fails, the entire module needs to be replaced and those wires are all screw terminated.
New "Tibbit" interface modules (plus external SSRs):
I wonder if I can sweet-talk @Cluso99 for a modified layout with two double-row headers. I have empty shells for custom modules and it would be really cool for the Prop-1 to be a plug-in module
Do you see that light blue tab at the top of the terminal block? If you push down gently to unclip it, the whole terminal block then swings forward on a bottom pivot point.
How many do you want? And dimensions?
@Cluso99
This is music to my...umm eyes. Very cool; I am totally committed to this format. I will contact you by email to discuss further
I have been looking for industrial strength P1 modules and controllers for years - count me in...
Removed
SASqUATCH one, the missing link?
P.S. Pin 14 of RA13 needs reinspection, at least; possibly a case of a bit of flux and retouching with a fine solder pen (access partially blocked by a skylineskyscrapper-sized "resistor?")
P.S. II A "Stealth" U9, lying in between Q13/Q14.
P.S. III Wow, there are at least three instances of U9... Sure, copy/paste is not being going to be a dependable friend of your's, anymore.
“J6”? 😜 and a missing Q1
You might consider bypass caps on all four sides of the P1.
Just curious, what are you using as a output power transistor Tip29, etc.
Yip ..Underside has more caps for P1 and Protection diodes on output stages !! It was more of a post of how a prototype can be quite messy !> @Yanomani said:
Guilty as charged .. Copy and Paste has, indeed, been unkind ..
Output stages from MCP23017 go to 2N3904 switching FQP47P06 Mosfets .. Protection diodes on Underside of PCB ..
Guilty of all charges ..
Removed
Very pretty board
However, for the tidy up, I'd like to see the use of these:
For the field wiring
+1 use them all the time
I served my apprenticeship as a panel builder and all I can say is that I find this wiring to be offensive
I’m sorta offended that you are offended at this offense. 🤣
On a serious note, I’m about to commit a similar crime. Can you point me to a good “best practices” document that covers the basics/standards? Would like to do a workmanlike job but honestly dont know where to start for this stuff.
I think you missed the point ..This is a boxed prototype .. hence labelling issues on PCB etc .. 'Those who can, do; those who can't, teach.'
Whatever. My one-liner is:
It's just as easy to do it right.
"in the trade" those crossed wires at the top are "banjo strings". Nothing prototype about point-to-point wiring. Entire panel needs tossed out and re-done by a craftsman.
Craig
The Prop1 PLC looks great, quite impressive. With regards to the panel wiring it looks like a retrofit, so the customer more than likely doesn't want to pay for a whole new panel. And its not that bad. A little messy and working is better than pretty and not working.
And so, you are brought in blind and expected to troubleshoot that thing and they are on your back wondering why you're taking so long.
You'll be cussing the panel builder.
Pretty certain that the customer didn't agree to a rat's nest and there's not even a cost saving anyway.
Craig
I've worked on worse, I've had rat nest machines, where I had to trace out every wire and create a schematic. QuattroRS4's Prop 1 PLC looks cool. Only he can tell us how well his project worked out. I have a upcoming rat nest job, looking foward to it. Pays well.
My Prototype .... and this was during development. "Nothing prototype about point-to-point wiring. " - Less keyboard warrior ... more samples of your aforementioned 'Craftsmanship'
Thanks.
For the critics - This was during development and was a prototype ... worked out perfectly for the release version and in a high volume production facility ... I can only post development and not finished units or too much detail on what each unit does .. due to NDA's etc. I think I'll drop theses posts from now on ... and pull previous posts also no interest in that waffle..... done.
Sorry that happened @QuattroRS4
I really enjoyed reading your posts and successes- I find it motivating.
To @Mickster ... please try to be a little sensitive to the OP's standpoint when posting feedback. We can't all be at your standard "off the bat", but that shouldn't be used against anyone to belittle or be overly negative about their efforts. I'm sure from our good exchanges in the past that wasn't your intention at all, but it just reads that way sometimes. I must admit to wincing once or twice when reading your posts here! I can see how you got on a roll a little bit with your effort to share advice, as the topic seemed to tweak a nerve that I think we all suffer for certain things.
When we are sharing our experiences and positively encouraging our community friends, I think that helps us all improve, succeed and enjoy what we do even more in a really healthy way; together. Please let's all keep rockin' like that!!
QuattroRS4, to bad you removed your pictures, nice work on the boards.
My apologies to the OP and the community in general
It's not a "keyboard warrior" thing, I get in trouble all the time
Went to watch a live band with the missus and they were awful
missus: "Aren't they amazing?"
me: "No...Keith Richards plays this in open-G. Standard-tuning doesn't work and furthermore, the vocalist is making-up the lyrics!"
missus: "Why can't you just agree that they are amazing?"
She stormed-out and we didn't speak for a couple of days
So much for honesty being the best policy
Craig