Shop OBEX P1 Docs P2 Docs Learn Events
Defender — Parallax Forums

Defender

CardboardGuruCardboardGuru Posts: 443
edited 2010-02-07 23:24 in Propeller 1
I'm trying to do Protoboard/Demoboard compatibility for my Defender remake. But I don't have either of those boards. Can someone give this download a try to see if it works?

There's a video of it in action on a Hydra here:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=z535xcDGt9Y

You'll need a keyboard plugged in to operate it.
KEYS Are:
Enter to start (From Title Screen)
A,Z - Up/Down
Caps Lock - Reverse
Right Shift - Thrust
Enter - Fire

EDIT: Download changed to new version 016
EDIT: Download changed to new version 017

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Help to build the Propeller wiki - propeller.wikispaces.com
Play Defender - Propeller version of the classic game
Prop Room Robotics - my web store for Roomba spare parts in the UK

Post Edited (CardboardGuru) : 12/29/2007 5:25:29 PM GMT
zip
zip
sw_defender_017 - Archive [Date 2007.12.29].zip
75K
«1

Comments

  • Oldbitcollector (Jeff)Oldbitcollector (Jeff) Posts: 8,091
    edited 2007-12-28 18:24
    Wow! This has come a long way!

    I'll test tonight using a Protoboard.

    OBC

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    New to the Propeller?

    Getting started with the Protoboard? - Propeller Cookbook
    Got an SD card? - PropDOS
    A Living Propeller FAQ - The Propeller Wiki
    (Got the Knowledge? Got a Moment? Add something today!)
  • parts-man73parts-man73 Posts: 830
    edited 2007-12-28 18:54
    I'll try it tonight after work on both a ProtoBoard, and a SpinStudio this is set up like a DemoBoard.

    Also I have a new SpinStudio plug in module I was going to announce this weekend. The PropJoy module will let you plug 2 Atari style joysticks into a SpinStudio, or if you modify a ProtoBoard like detailed in the Propeller Cookbook, it can be plugged into that as well. I'll try it on that as well.

    Did you strip out the joystick/gamepad routines in the Proto/Demo remake?

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Brian

    uController.com - home of SpinStudio

    PropNIC - Add ethernet ability to your Propeller!

    SD card Adapter
  • RaymanRayman Posts: 14,876
    edited 2007-12-28 19:02
    Looks great! But, the video locked up my Vista machine [noparse]:([/noparse]
    Anybody heard of a Jamma interface for the Prop? I might be interesting to hook the Prop up to my arcade cabinet one day (if there are more games like this!). Of course, I already have a Mame PC hooked up to it, but this might be interesting to do anyway...
  • tarikhtarikh Posts: 10
    edited 2007-12-28 21:12
    FYI I gave it a whirl and posted a report back here:

    http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=685888

    in the middle of the page i give some step by step instructions for getting #14 to work, some of these apply to #15. You can actually get this to work on the prop! While I wasn't able to get the keyboard working yet (probably have the wrong pins), it looks incredible.
  • CardboardGuruCardboardGuru Posts: 443
    edited 2007-12-28 22:00
    Download in first post now changed to new version 016. Is it better?

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Help to build the Propeller wiki - propeller.wikispaces.com
    Play Defender - Propeller version of the classic game
    Prop Room Robotics - my web store for Roomba spare parts in the UK
  • Oldbitcollector (Jeff)Oldbitcollector (Jeff) Posts: 8,091
    edited 2007-12-28 22:43
    Just got defender up and running on my SpinStudio/Protoboard. Awesome game!

    I had to modify both of the files "EPM_Defender_Sound_Engine*_***" with the following adjustments to get the audio up and running.

    PIN__AUDIO = %00000000_00000000_00000000_10000000
    *to*
    PIN__AUDIO = %00000000_00000000_00000100_00000000


    CTRAVAL long %00110 << 26 + 7 'DUTY single-ended, APIN=7
    *to*
    CTRAVAL long %00110 << 26 + 10 'DUTY single-ended, APIN=10

    My setup is a Protoboard with SpinStudio modifications, with a homemade NES controller on NES0
    I've also set the Keyboard to 0.

    Sweet Game! Yes, the new PropJoy device from Brian should work perfectly here.

    OBC

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    New to the Propeller?

    Getting started with the Protoboard? - Propeller Cookbook
    Got an SD card? - PropDOS
    A Living Propeller FAQ - The Propeller Wiki
    (Got the Knowledge? Got a Moment? Add something today!)
  • Oldbitcollector (Jeff)Oldbitcollector (Jeff) Posts: 8,091
    edited 2007-12-28 22:52
    For some really strange reason, I can't seem to launch the binary from PropDOS.

    If I launch BASIC first, I can spin it from Femto...

    Weird..

    I foresee a bugfix release of PropDOS soon...


    OBC

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    New to the Propeller?

    Getting started with the Protoboard? - Propeller Cookbook
    Got an SD card? - PropDOS
    A Living Propeller FAQ - The Propeller Wiki
    (Got the Knowledge? Got a Moment? Add something today!)

    Post Edited (Oldbitcollector) : 12/28/2007 10:57:39 PM GMT
  • parts-man73parts-man73 Posts: 830
    edited 2007-12-29 01:26
    Just tried version 16 with no modifications on a ProtoBoard with a SpinStudio audio/video adapter. The video is on the standard p12-p15. Keyboard is with the standard ProtoBoard accessory kit, so it's also on the standard pins (p26+p27)

    I get video, but when the game starts, the ship starts flying to the left and upward. It doesn't respond at all to any input from the keyboard.

    Later this evening after the kids are in bed I'll have to take a closer look, and also try to get it going with my new joystick boards that just arrived.

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Brian

    uController.com - home of SpinStudio

    PropNIC - Add ethernet ability to your Propeller!

    SD card Adapter
  • CardboardGuruCardboardGuru Posts: 443
    edited 2007-12-29 01:59
    Hi Brian,

    That's interesting feedback. The hydra uses pins 3-6 for the NES Gamepad. Have you got anything connected to those that might cause that left and upward movement? Other than that, there must be odd results coming back from the keyboard, because there's no other way the code would make the ship move.

    How did you move from the Title screen to the game screen if you didn't have either a working gamepad or keyboard?

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Help to build the Propeller wiki - propeller.wikispaces.com
    Play Defender - Propeller version of the classic game
    Prop Room Robotics - my web store for Roomba spare parts in the UK
  • parts-man73parts-man73 Posts: 830
    edited 2007-12-29 03:08
    Ok, I just compiled and ran the same code on a SpinStudio, with only a Audio/Video module plugged into socket B. That puts composite video on p12-p15 and audio on p10 and p11 (I know the audio is turned off with the keyboard mode turned on but I wanted to mention all connections to the Propeller) I left all the other SpinStudio sockets empty.
    I get the same results. a message "system tests ok" or something similar, then after a second or 2 delay, it goes straight to the game. The ship immediately turns left and accelerates and ascends. No keyboard input required, and keyboard input does not change anything.

    It skips by the title screen altogether.

    I ran an older version 2 weeks ago on the same hardware and had no problems. I was using a prototype joystick board, so the keyboard code was commented out.

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Brian

    uController.com - home of SpinStudio

    PropNIC - Add ethernet ability to your Propeller!

    SD card Adapter
  • parts-man73parts-man73 Posts: 830
    edited 2007-12-29 06:06
    I reverted to version 14, it works fine with my new joystick adapter. although I have to edit the bit encodings manually, I use a 5mhz crystal, but the bit encodings for the joystick are the same as the hybrid.

    I needed to make the bit encodings
    GP_RIGHT  = %00000000_00001000
GP_LEFT   = %00000000_00000100
GP_DOWN   = %00000000_00000010
GP_UP     = %00000000_00000001
GP_START  = %00000000_00100000
GP_SELECT = %00000000_00100000
GP_B      = %00000000_00100000
GP_A      = %00000000_00100000



    to make it fire on a one button Atari stick. As GP_START is the fire button, so shall the GP_A be.

    great game! Now I've got to mod so the sound works

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Brian

    uController.com - home of SpinStudio

    PropNIC - Add ethernet ability to your Propeller!

    SD card Adapter
  • ToleyToley Posts: 16
    edited 2007-12-29 16:20
    I try it on the Demo Board. Video is OK, no keyboard and no sound. I don't know where to edit the prog to set the keyboard and audio...

    Some informations. At startup it's written TESTS INDICATE : UNIT OK and then it automatically start, the ship is getting up alone and nothing kill it.

    Very great game, remember me all the quarters i've put on those machines 25 years ago.
  • CardboardGuruCardboardGuru Posts: 443
    edited 2007-12-29 17:25
    AH! I think I've got it!

    The routine I've got for reading the Hydra gamepad returns a value with bits set for the different buttons. However, I'd forgotten that if there is no gamepad it returns a value of $FFFF, so any test for a button press returns positive. I've fixed that now.

    Please try version 017 now attached to the first post. Press enter on the title screen to proceed.

    There will be no sound for keyboard users, it's an either/or I'm afraid. And the game is not yet complete, so whilst you can kill the aliens, they can't yet kill you.

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Help to build the Propeller wiki - propeller.wikispaces.com
    Play Defender - Propeller version of the classic game
    Prop Room Robotics - my web store for Roomba spare parts in the UK
  • CardboardGuruCardboardGuru Posts: 443
    edited 2007-12-29 17:34
    Hi Parts-Man,

    Thanks for the list of GP bitmasks. I'll set those up in the next release I do.

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Help to build the Propeller wiki - propeller.wikispaces.com
    Play Defender - Propeller version of the classic game
    Prop Room Robotics - my web store for Roomba spare parts in the UK
  • ToleyToley Posts: 16
    edited 2007-12-29 18:52
    Hi CardboardGuru, v017 works as expected on the Demo Board. Very very cool. Sorry I'm new to the propeller so I have newbie questions. Do you think I could add a NES gamepad on the Demo Board. You said that gamepad is on pins 3-6 on the Hydra and those pins are free on the demo board. Is there any schematic ? Maybe someone already done it ? Thank you.

    P.S. I know the best should be to buy an Hydra but I just buy the demo board and I have a lot to learn with it, the Hydra is on my wishlist.
  • CardboardGuruCardboardGuru Posts: 443
    edited 2007-12-29 19:41
    Hi Toley,

    Glad it's working. At last!

    I'm sure you could add an NES controller, but I's not really my field. There's probably someone who's already done it that'll be along in a moment.

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Help to build the Propeller wiki - propeller.wikispaces.com
    Play Defender - Propeller version of the classic game
    Prop Room Robotics - my web store for Roomba spare parts in the UK
  • Oldbitcollector (Jeff)Oldbitcollector (Jeff) Posts: 8,091
    edited 2007-12-29 19:49
    Grab a copy of the Cookbook at the bottom of this message, while it's intended toward Protoboard users, the Demoboard has the connections required for a NES controller. It's a straight wire to connection to make it work, and if you've got an old NES controller handy, you should be able to get it working in a few minutes.

    OBC

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    New to the Propeller?

    Getting started with the Protoboard? - Propeller Cookbook
    Got an SD card? - PropDOS
    A Living Propeller FAQ - The Propeller Wiki
    (Got the Knowledge? Got a Moment? Add something today!)
  • ToleyToley Posts: 16
    edited 2007-12-29 19:50
    I've been looking around since my last post and I found some infos. The Chapter6 of the Hydra is freely available from Parallax, and this chapter is all dedicated to the NES controller [noparse]:)[/noparse]. So I have all the infos I need, all I need is a old NES not very hard to find in any used store. If it can be done I will. Thanks again.
  • parts-man73parts-man73 Posts: 830
    edited 2007-12-29 20:51
    Version 17 works perfect! I used on my Protoboard with a keyboard with no problems.

    I then tried it with PropJoy and an Atari stick, again, it works great.
    CardboardGuru said...
    Thanks for the list of GP bitmasks. I'll set those up in the next release I do.

    I am almost certain that the same bitmasks would apply to the Hybrid if using a single button Atari joystick. Maybe separate the GP bitmask Defines from the other stuff...like the clock speed, keyboard and tv video pin info

    OBC said...
    I had to modify both of the files "EPM_Defender_Sound_Engine*_***" with the following adjustments to get the audio up and running.

    PIN__AUDIO = %00000000_00000000_00000000_10000000
    *to*
    PIN__AUDIO = %00000000_00000000_00000100_00000000


    CTRAVAL long %00110 << 26 + 7 'DUTY single-ended, APIN=7
    *to*
    CTRAVAL long %00110 << 26 + 10 'DUTY single-ended, APIN=10

    I did the same modifications and now I've got sound! Thank you!
    Toley said...
    Do you think I could add a NES gamepad on the Demo Board.

    When I'm done working on the documentation, I will be announcing PropJoy. It'll allow you to plug Atari Joysticks into SpinStudio, Modified ProtoBoards or a Demoboard with some clever wiring. Stay tuned.....

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Brian

    uController.com - home of SpinStudio

    PropNIC - Add ethernet ability to your Propeller!

    SD card Adapter
  • ToleyToley Posts: 16
    edited 2007-12-30 14:46
    A NES Controller (very simple with the Propeller Cookbook) the software modifications (Oldbitcollector above) and everything works fine on the Demo Board. Thanks to all.
  • Rory StormRory Storm Banned Posts: 16
    edited 2007-12-30 16:44
    Isn't "Defender" copyrighted?
    Do you have permission for this "re-make"?
  • CardboardGuruCardboardGuru Posts: 443
    edited 2007-12-30 17:10
    Rory Storm said...
    Isn't "Defender" copyrighted?

    William's Defender source code will be. But since I haven't got nor have seen a copy, I can't have copied any of it.

    William's Defender artwork will be, but mine only bears superficial similarities, they were all drawn from scratch, and none of them are even the same size, let alone identical.

    The sounds are all created from scratch by Eric Moyer specifically for this project, inspired by the originals, but not copying them.

    None of the text in the game is identical.

    Copyright of the superficial look and feel of software applications was tested out back in the early days of spreadsheets, and again with desktop UIs and and has never stood up in court.

    "Defender" the name is a word from the dictionary, and William's made no attempt that I can see to have it as a trademark. "Windows" is also a name from the dictionary. Microsoft tried to establish "Windows" as a trademark, and after some toing and froing in court, eventually settled out of court with Lindows, i.e. paid to stop them using a similar name to Windows rather than go on and lose in court. But that was years later. AFAIK Williams never even tried.

    There's are multiple programs that are called "Defender", e.g. "Windows Defender".

    My other game "Dodgy Kong" is so called because the combination of words "Donkey Kong" IS a trademark, and one that is current too. Though there's an interesting story behind that because Universal studio's believed they had "Kong" as their trademark because of the film, and sued Nintendo. But that failed in court, so I'm safe with that part.

    So AFAIK, it's all fine. There's nothing I'd need permission for. It's all my own work plus Eric's, apart from the comboKeyboard driver, and because that's from Obex, I know I can use it as I wish.

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Help to build the Propeller wiki - propeller.wikispaces.com
    Play Defender - Propeller version of the classic game
    Prop Room Robotics - my web store for Roomba spare parts in the UK

    Post Edited (CardboardGuru) : 12/30/2007 5:46:41 PM GMT
  • Rory StormRory Storm Banned Posts: 16
    edited 2007-12-30 18:19
    Yet, CarboardGuru, you·have called it a "remake".
  • BaggersBaggers Posts: 3,019
    edited 2007-12-30 19:14
    Hi Rory, I hope this clarifies things for you,

    Yes, he's re-made it in "his" way, so it looks and plays similar, but is his homage so to speak of the classic arcade game, same as his dodgy kong "remake"

    Yes, the original is copyrighted by Williams Games INC, or whatever their full title is, but this has been re-drawn, and re-coded by CardboardGuru, so therefore he owns copyright of his artwork, and source, and since he's not making any money off it,
    I doubt williams will have a leg to stand on, as they're not losing money on this, in fact, if anything it will re-kindle peoples interest in the game, and if they were to say pass an olde arcade, with a defender game they might now be tempted to go in and spend 10p or whatever it is now to play it.

    Also if it wasn't for us hardened retro gamers, Defender and the likes, would have been long forgotten.

    Baggers.
  • Rory StormRory Storm Banned Posts: 16
    edited 2007-12-30 20:02
    There is nothing "his" about it, nothing.· The gaul; it has been·"re-drawn" to look like the copyrighted work and·it has been "re-coded" to play like the copyrighted work.· It is a total rip-off, pure and simple, and·that youtube presentation is proof enough.· I know copyright infringement when I see it and·hypocrisy ( http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=697509·) when I smell it.
  • BaggersBaggers Posts: 3,019
    edited 2007-12-30 22:11
    Rory,·I think you should read this thread ( http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=697489·) before it all gets out of hand again,
    If it is an infringment of copyright, surely anything on game is an infringment of copyright, as they use tile/charmap levels and paletted characters and "sprites" and joypads / controllers for input.
    besides, if you don't like it, don't sweat about it, take a step down, and go read something else, and don't look at the games? to save yourself the hastle of getting into a tizzyfit about it.
    he's just showing his ability to write a game, it's a learning process, making games, and by imitating the classics, it gets others to appreciate it more, and besides, there's NOT many original uncopyrighted games/ideas left in the world.
    they've all been snapped up.
    he's doing something he enjoys, coding, and bringing pleasure to those who appreciate it, without any exchange of currency, just a smiley and a well done, is enough to know he's put smiles on the faces of others with his YES "his" hard work. because he took "his" time to make the game, be it, a remake/clone of another game.
    ·
  • Oldbitcollector (Jeff)Oldbitcollector (Jeff) Posts: 8,091
    edited 2007-12-30 22:26
    At risk of contributing to this and watching it snowball, it's called "Reverse Engineering"
    The method that Defender was created using reverse engineering is not only legal, but
    has been used many time successfully with products you use every day. Had he actually
    seen the source code to Defender then that would have been a different story.
    A great historic example of this was the BIOS for the first PC clone.

    Now back to Defender stuff...

    Is it normal for the game to reboot the prop after beating the 1st level?
    Also, wasn't there smartbombs in Defender? or am I thinking of another game?

    OBC

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    New to the Propeller?

    Getting started with the Protoboard? - Propeller Cookbook
    Got an SD card? - PropDOS
    A Living Propeller FAQ - The Propeller Wiki
    (Got the Knowledge? Got a Moment? Add something today!)
  • TheWizard65TheWizard65 Posts: 91
    edited 2007-12-30 23:03
    I want to add my thanks to: baggers,oldbitcollector, raymond and the many other people who are taking their time to take me back to the day's when from middle school to my high school day's when all I could think of was to get a little money to go down to our local arcade to play these Verry Cool games. Thus this is why I am thewizard65. Because at one time I was crowned Pinball and arcade Wizard of my home town back in 1983. Unfortunetly I lost the title in 1984.
  • CardboardGuruCardboardGuru Posts: 443
    edited 2007-12-30 23:25
    Rory Storm said...
    Yet, CarboardGuru, you have called it a "remake".

    I certainly do Rory. If you'd like to quote the law you think that's against and why, I'm all ears. I've given you my understanding of legality of the situation, I'd love to hear yours. As would the thousands of other people that do classic game remakes.

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Help to build the Propeller wiki - propeller.wikispaces.com
    Play Defender - Propeller version of the classic game
    Prop Room Robotics - my web store for Roomba spare parts in the UK
  • Rory StormRory Storm Banned Posts: 16
    edited 2007-12-31 00:04
    CardboardGuru,

    In "Who owns the codes here?" you posted at great length regarding your so-called rights to "your code", it is to laugh, and your expectations that your supposed rights to copyright should be assiduously respected, yet you trample the rights of others. ·Your "Defender remake" is a naked violation of copyright law just as any counterfeit is, all of your AFAIKs and "understandings" notwithstanding.

    Baggers,

    You go re-read it --·and then·practice it.
Sign In or Register to comment.