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Why are there no P2 robots? — Parallax Forums

Why are there no P2 robots?

tempytempytemptempytempytemp Posts: 12
in Propeller 2

When will parallax release a P2 -powered robot?

Comments

  • Christof Eb.Christof Eb. Posts: 1,214
    edited 2023-02-28 07:49

    Hi,
    in 2019 Parallax Management decided:

    Chip and team have spoken about it quite a bit. We envision a fairly "flat" pricing curve where the low-quantity prices (5-10) aren't a whole lot different than the volume price (1K units). Beyond 1K, there likely won't be much of a discount. This pricing model reflects a couple of likely realities:

    (1) We're serving an American/European inventor's market
    (2) Products using the P2 are actually fairly expensive themselves (P1 products are from the hundreds to tens of thousands of dollars)
    (3) High-volume applications often seek the cheapest solution possible (not likely Parallax);
    (4) We have no semiconductor fab and must pay a higher cost; and
    (5) There's a lower-volume fit where we will succeed.

    From:
    https://forums.parallax.com/discussion/170809/p2x8c4m64p-approved-for-production/p2 Post #40

    According to this Parallax is aiming at some professional market, that has low volume and high product cost.
    Non professional makers or other private persons are not mentioned.

    I suppose, it is somehow in line with this decision, that Parallax actually does offer parts for robots for P2:
    https://www.parallax.com/product-category/servos-motors/

  • VonSzarvasVonSzarvas Posts: 3,486

    There is a P2 powered robot kit being designed at the moment.
    Keep an eye on Ken's P2 announcement mailings over the coming 1-2 months. :wink:

    -> Propeller Newsletter signup form at the end of this webpage: https://www.parallax.com/propeller-2/

  • jrullanjrullan Posts: 168

    @VonSzarvas said:
    There is a P2 powered robot kit being designed at the moment.
    Keep an eye on Ken's P2 announcement mailings over the coming 1-2 months. :wink:

    -> Propeller Newsletter signup form at the end of this webpage: https://www.parallax.com/propeller-2/

    Will be closely following this!

  • Christof Eb.Christof Eb. Posts: 1,214

    @VonSzarvas said:
    There is a P2 powered robot kit being designed at the moment.
    Keep an eye on Ken's P2 announcement mailings over the coming 1-2 months. :wink:

    -> Propeller Newsletter signup form at the end of this webpage: https://www.parallax.com/propeller-2/

    May we see this as some sign of a changement in business strategy?
    Is even a P2 project board in the pipeline or thinkable after all?

  • knivdknivd Posts: 102

    This one is very much a robot. The P2-Stamp module can be seen in the top left corner

  • avsa242avsa242 Posts: 452

    WOW...great looking board...so nice to see that Stamp module

  • ManAtWorkManAtWork Posts: 2,178

    Nice board. Can you tell us a bit more about its functions? What are the other PLCC modules in the upper right corner? Motor drivers?

  • MaciekMaciek Posts: 675
    edited 2023-03-04 13:14

    Yes, this is a really good looking board indeed.

    Whatever the intended purpose of this board is, and I am curious too, I don't think it is destined to withstand excessive shocks or high ambient temperatures.
    Maybe it's a controller for a CNC machine or some kind or a robotic arm or a laser cutter/engraver ?
    One thing is for sure - this isn't a small hobby board for its cost (my estimate is around 300 USD just for the parts).

  • knivdknivd Posts: 102

    It is a control board for industrial robotic system, and yes, those other things are high-precision stepper drivers.
    The exact function or features of this board don't matter so much as the initial point - yes, there are robotic P2-based systems out in the world, but probably not so much products for the hobby market.
    I am yet to get this whole thing up and running, but the P2-Stamp module did fine and without smoke on its first run, so I hope it might eventually see wider use one day

  • ManAtWorkManAtWork Posts: 2,178

    @knivd said:
    ... and yes, those other things are high-precision stepper drivers.

    Just curious... I can only recognise 8 MOSFETs and some caps. Do you generate the PWM signals directly with the P2 or do you use some kind of external stepper control IC (trinamic, smart step or some other)?

  • knivdknivd Posts: 102

    @ManAtWork said:
    Just curious... I can only recognise 8 MOSFETs and some caps. Do you generate the PWM signals directly with the P2 or do you use some kind of external stepper control IC (trinamic, smart step or some other)?

    No, there are many parts on the bottom of those modules, just like on the bottom of the carrier board as well. Those modules are built around TMC5160A

  • ManAtWorkManAtWork Posts: 2,178

    @knivd said:
    No, there are many parts on the bottom of those modules, just like on the bottom of the carrier board as well. Those modules are built around TMC5160A

    Ah, thanks. While most ICs from Trinamic I've seen so far has been somewhat limited this new chip looks quite universal and powerful. I think it should be possible to do everything in software and control the driver bridges directly with the P2. But that would be a quite challanging task and, of course, doesn't make much sense unless you build a lot of them and it's worth saving the $4.5 for the Trinamic IC.

    I tried to build a P2 based stepper driver with minimal external components two years ago. At least, I've managed to get the motor running. But as often when there is no customer who pays for it the project wasn't finished.

  • knivdknivd Posts: 102

    @ManAtWork said:

    But as often when there is no customer who pays for it the project wasn't finished.

    Haha, totally hear you there
    This one is not one of those, though

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