Please maintain the existing links for Google's use.
You raise an an interesting point.
One important and often ignored idea of the "WEB" is that links should never die.
If you have a resource at a URL why would it ever need to move? The URL should uniquely define that resource.
If you have a URL why would you put a different resource there? The same URL cannot define two different resources.
This post I am making now can be described as forums.parallax.com/this thread/this post. There is no reason this should ever change from now till the end of time. The facts of what it is are never going to change.
That is why there was such an upset when we had the last forum upgrade here. All of a sudden a million links did not work and there was a lot of work done to fix them.
Still you will find links "out there" that point to resources on the old Parallax forum that don't exist any more.
Did you say " toss". I'm appalled at such language
No amount of regex is going to help with this problem. I cannot begin to imagine the regular expression that would recognize all grammatically correct sentences in the English language. Let alone correctly raise alarms for all the "bad" language. English speakers can always adapt to get round any such censorship faster than software can be updated anyway. Did you ever wonder when "gay" went from meaning "joyful" to a term of abuse? Something that really hit me when my 12 year old son used the word some years ago. And let's not get into "Animalia".
Oh for certain. I primarily mentioned the regex to allow certain animals which might otherwise be obfuscated; you noted the wild *** but there are others, like the european shag, titmouse, boobies, and so many more. Though it might prove difficult to justify such exceptions on a electronic/robotic/programming/etc forum.
First: Please maintain the existing links for Google's use. There are SOOO many times I've used Google's site search to search Parallax forums with great success.
Two: Some of us who are getting older ahem.. wiser are developing vision issues with age our eyes. The "dark" theme you guys created last time was a real help in making the current forums comfortable to see.
All the links with the vB4 urls will get handled by VB5 or rewritten with some lovely apache rules, so they'll still work for anything referencing those links.
I'm not sure about plans for different themes, that can be discussed. If a simple purely color-code change can be made it'll be easier, though when the change requires modifications to different icons whose aesthetic is lost on a dark theme it adds time which would need to be evaluated by marketing. I'll be sure to bring it up though.
Shouldn't be too difficult to add a little 'top' feature to the pagination foot; I'm so used to the 'home' key and shift+space, but I would tend to agree that people look for the 'top' link.
That's probably the most interesting part about the upgrade. Except for the "What's New" button I don't care about the aesthetics, but there's been many times where I've wanted to create statistics about forum posts and an API would have been helpful.
Register a 2 year old with the name Ken Gracey (name picked at random) :-)
EMail to parent includes link, username and password:
Dear Parent/Guardian of Ken Gracey,
Ken Gracey has just signed up for an account at Parallax Forums Sandbox. This can be found at:
[URL]http://preview.forums.parallax.com[/URL]
This email has been sent to you because Ken Gracey has stated that they are younger than 13 years of age and [URL]http://preview.forums.parallax.com/member/35-ken-gracey[/URL] is in compliance with the Children's Online Privacy Protection Act of 1998 (COPPA).
To find out more about COPPA, please visit this page:
[URL]http://www.ftc.gov/opa/1999/10/childfinal.htm[/URL]
Please read the Parallax Forums Sandbox Privacy Statement also:
You must print out the permission form, fill it in and mail or fax it back to the webmaster. Details about how to return the form are on the form itself.
The form can be accessed through this page:
[URL]http://preview.forums.parallax.com/member/35-ken-gracey[/URL]
From that page, you can also view the profile and make any modification you wish. You will need these login details:
Username: Ken Gracey
Password: <REDACTED>
(Note that the password is case sensitive)
We thank you for helping us in keeping the privacy of children on the internet.
All the best,
Parallax Forums Sandbox
(I have also mentioned this in a couple of posts over in the preview forum)
1): Big problem: The size(width etc.) is fixed, that's very bad and against good browser UI guidelines. In particular, zooming on mobile devices doesn't work. In the current forum I double-tap on the text column of the thread I'm reading and it expands to fill my tablet screen. On the preview forum that doesn't work, in fact no method of zooming works. So the fonts are tiny, and just barely readble for my eyes on the 10.1"-inch tablet, and completely unreadable on my smaller Android device. This *must* change in my opinion, it basically would make the forum useless for me as an Android tablet is how I usually read the forum. And there the zooming also helps with hitting the tiny buttons for reading posts etc, always a problem on capactive touch screens.
2) There's no 'New Posts' button. On older VB versions, including the current forum, the 'What's New' button works the same way, which is 'view unread posts', the by far most important button on any forum which you read regularly. Newer VB versions broke this (where that button now maps to a useless function). The preview forum though only has a 'New Topics' button, it sounds like it will only show what we called new threads, I'm not sure - the preview forum does things differently in that it's now possible to comment on a comment and that will show as a reply directly on the original comment. So I assume something has to change (a non-linear 'Topic' will have new posts both early and late in the thread). But whatever way 'New Posts' work it doesnt seem to be giving me what I want: The ability to see and pick from every post I haven't yet read (or since I last hit the 'Mark Forums Read' button - there's a 'Mark Channels Read' button on the preview forum and presumably it works the same way for that).
[Edit: Ah, I see that Bump has already addressed that a few posts above - just be aware that how 'What's New' works by default in newer V-Bulletin versions is nothing at all like it works in the current forum.]
If the two changes above (relative to the current forum) aren't fixed then unfortunately I will be unable to follow it, so I sincerely hope this will be looked into.
Anyway, there's also a
3) As mentioned by Heater already: My birth date is nobody's business unless I volunteer it. I don't want to enter that anywhere where it's not relevant (I don't even do that on the company internal calendar - hate those automated birthday messages). But you can't get past that step, which enforces having to lie. I don't like that as an answer to any problem. If there's an issue about being minor or not, then a tickbox stating whether you are or not should be sufficient.
But you can't get past that step, which enforces having to lie.
Is lying to a mindless computer program really lying? I don't see that as an issue at all -- at least not a moral one. If you're not a minor and lie about your birthdate to register, no harm, no foul. I suspect that there will be an unnatural spike in January 1st birthdays once this thing goes online, and Publison will be very busy every New Year's Day with his birthday wishes!
The bigger issue is that's it's totally ineffective for identifying minors, who will probably lie anyway to get unfettered access without parental approval.
As a Parent/Grandparent I have never seen anything on this forum that would even justify one having to be of any specific age to view so I do not really think that this would even be an issue. I also do not see the need for a parent or guardian having to print out and snail mail a form to allow their child access.
The problem is to identify procedures that meet the requirement and -- possibly -- even to be effective. I suspect the new forum addresses the former but not the latter -- as if the latter were even technically achievable.
From the wording it doesn't sound like it's applicable to this site (and I haven't encountered that on any of the other technical sites I visit):
COPPA imposes certain requirements on operators of websites or online services directed to children under 13 years of age, and on operators of other websites or online services that have actual knowledge that they are collecting personal information online from a child under 13 years of age.
To me that requirement seems to be directed at sites specifically designed for young people. E.g. like that 'my pony' site for children.
1): Big problem: The size(width etc.) is fixed, that's very bad and against good browser UI guidelines. In particular, zooming on mobile devices doesn't work....
2) There's no 'New Posts' button. On older VB versions, including the current forum, the 'What's New' button works the same way, which is 'view unread posts', the by far most important button on any forum which you read regularly....
Anyway, there's also a
3) As mentioned by Heater already: My birth date is nobody's business unless I volunteer it...
1 - It's not fixed width, or we have different definitions of fixed width. There was however a nasty configuration in their style that didn't allow maximum scale to go above 100% The content panes are actually quite responsive. I took off the nasty bit in their mark-up on the preview forum; you should be able to zoom on mobile now.
2 - I will be looking into fixing that so that it more accurately conforms to the current version of the "what's new", though the people of vBulletin changed the underlying features which made the current version possible. I'll get as close as I can given the tools I have available.
Is lying to a mindless computer program really lying?
The bigger issue is that's it's totally ineffective for identifying minors, who will probably lie anyway to get unfettered access without parental approval.
Yeah, can't pin anyone down and force anything... which is fine. We do however have to comply with legal standards to put up what little shields we can when told to do so.
As a Parent/Grandparent I have never seen anything on this forum that would even justify one having to be of any specific age to view so I do not really think that this would even be an issue. I also do not see the need for a parent or guardian having to print out and snail mail a form to allow their child access.
There has been some very questionable material discussed in the grand scheme of topics for the Parallax discussion forums, but that's not really what it's about.
The easiest paraphrase, and close to what Phil added, is it's a legal requirement. We, Parallax, do target STEM and as part of our audience we include those that are protected by COPPA and because we are aware of this fact it is advised that we adhere to those requirements so that our collective bodies don't get untimely burned.
WOW!!! I can't believe they still exist. You should try to sell it on EBay as an unknown item to see what happens! Anyone remember losing this item and having to "guess" at the location of the 45 and seeing what happens?
1 - It's not fixed width, or we have different definitions of fixed width. There was however a nasty configuration in their style that didn't allow maximum scale to go above 100% The content panes are actually quite responsive. I took off the nasty bit in their mark-up on the preview forum; you should be able to zoom on mobile now.
Thanks Bump, it works now! That's a relief.
And Phil, I could answer that question correctly...! You may have a winner there..
Also, Bump, in case it scrolled off the front page and you missed it, there's a 10,000-character ceiling on posts. This needs to be lifted, else some posts from this forum will not transfer completely.
Also, Bump, in case it scrolled off the front page and you missed it, there's a 10,000-character ceiling on posts. This needs to be lifted, else some posts from this forum will not transfer completely.
-Phil
That's right. We don't want to discriminate against potatohead.
'Just wanted to "bump" this thread, now that Labor Day has passed and folks are strapped into their desk chairs again, ready for business. This forum is something we all use and rely upon, and it's important to be aware of the changes coming, So be sure to try out the preview forum and tell Parallax what you like -- or possibly don't like -- about it, while we still have a chance to influence the outcome.
So be sure to try out the preview forum and tell Parallax what you like -- or possibly don't like -- about it, while we still have a chance to influence the outcome.
Will we have to sign up for the new forum to continue participating?
I have registered there. Some things I have found - when I made a post there was no option I could find to delete it right after it posted. Also I get a BB error trying to put my signature in. I would like to see some
different forum skins for those of us that are 'blinded by the light'.
Comments
One important and often ignored idea of the "WEB" is that links should never die.
If you have a resource at a URL why would it ever need to move? The URL should uniquely define that resource.
If you have a URL why would you put a different resource there? The same URL cannot define two different resources.
This post I am making now can be described as forums.parallax.com/this thread/this post. There is no reason this should ever change from now till the end of time. The facts of what it is are never going to change.
That is why there was such an upset when we had the last forum upgrade here. All of a sudden a million links did not work and there was a lot of work done to fix them.
Still you will find links "out there" that point to resources on the old Parallax forum that don't exist any more.
Or has this been mentioned already?
Oh for certain. I primarily mentioned the regex to allow certain animals which might otherwise be obfuscated; you noted the wild *** but there are others, like the european shag, titmouse, boobies, and so many more. Though it might prove difficult to justify such exceptions on a electronic/robotic/programming/etc forum.
Oh yes, I need to create that again. It is perhaps one of the hottest buttons on our forums.
All the links with the vB4 urls will get handled by VB5 or rewritten with some lovely apache rules, so they'll still work for anything referencing those links.
I'm not sure about plans for different themes, that can be discussed. If a simple purely color-code change can be made it'll be easier, though when the change requires modifications to different icons whose aesthetic is lost on a dark theme it adds time which would need to be evaluated by marketing. I'll be sure to bring it up though.
Shouldn't be too difficult to add a little 'top' feature to the pagination foot; I'm so used to the 'home' key and shift+space, but I would tend to agree that people look for the 'top' link.
That's probably the most interesting part about the upgrade. Except for the "What's New" button I don't care about the aesthetics, but there's been many times where I've wanted to create statistics about forum posts and an API would have been helpful.
Register a 2 year old with the name Ken Gracey (name picked at random) :-)
EMail to parent includes link, username and password:
Haha, you DefCon hackers.... Good thing Parallax doesn't have a "Wall of Sheep" because I could've been posted to it.
Always make fun of me at anybody's leisure. I truly love the attention.
Ken Gracey
Is it still a bug if it's just a bad feature in the software?
Whatever it may be, it's not very security-forward. I'll poke at that with a stick.
1): Big problem: The size(width etc.) is fixed, that's very bad and against good browser UI guidelines. In particular, zooming on mobile devices doesn't work. In the current forum I double-tap on the text column of the thread I'm reading and it expands to fill my tablet screen. On the preview forum that doesn't work, in fact no method of zooming works. So the fonts are tiny, and just barely readble for my eyes on the 10.1"-inch tablet, and completely unreadable on my smaller Android device. This *must* change in my opinion, it basically would make the forum useless for me as an Android tablet is how I usually read the forum. And there the zooming also helps with hitting the tiny buttons for reading posts etc, always a problem on capactive touch screens.
2) There's no 'New Posts' button. On older VB versions, including the current forum, the 'What's New' button works the same way, which is 'view unread posts', the by far most important button on any forum which you read regularly. Newer VB versions broke this (where that button now maps to a useless function). The preview forum though only has a 'New Topics' button, it sounds like it will only show what we called new threads, I'm not sure - the preview forum does things differently in that it's now possible to comment on a comment and that will show as a reply directly on the original comment. So I assume something has to change (a non-linear 'Topic' will have new posts both early and late in the thread). But whatever way 'New Posts' work it doesnt seem to be giving me what I want: The ability to see and pick from every post I haven't yet read (or since I last hit the 'Mark Forums Read' button - there's a 'Mark Channels Read' button on the preview forum and presumably it works the same way for that).
[Edit: Ah, I see that Bump has already addressed that a few posts above - just be aware that how 'What's New' works by default in newer V-Bulletin versions is nothing at all like it works in the current forum.]
If the two changes above (relative to the current forum) aren't fixed then unfortunately I will be unable to follow it, so I sincerely hope this will be looked into.
Anyway, there's also a
3) As mentioned by Heater already: My birth date is nobody's business unless I volunteer it. I don't want to enter that anywhere where it's not relevant (I don't even do that on the company internal calendar - hate those automated birthday messages). But you can't get past that step, which enforces having to lie. I don't like that as an answer to any problem. If there's an issue about being minor or not, then a tickbox stating whether you are or not should be sufficient.
-Tor
The bigger issue is that's it's totally ineffective for identifying minors, who will probably lie anyway to get unfettered access without parental approval.
-Phil
Lying and morals aside what you are saying that the "requires a date" feature is a pointless and stupid inconvenience.
Perhaps confronting people with pointless and stupid the minute they hit the forum is not a good idea.
The problem is to identify procedures that meet the requirement and -- possibly -- even to be effective. I suspect the new forum addresses the former but not the latter -- as if the latter were even technically achievable.
-Phil
-Tor
1 - It's not fixed width, or we have different definitions of fixed width. There was however a nasty configuration in their style that didn't allow maximum scale to go above 100% The content panes are actually quite responsive. I took off the nasty bit in their mark-up on the preview forum; you should be able to zoom on mobile now.
2 - I will be looking into fixing that so that it more accurately conforms to the current version of the "what's new", though the people of vBulletin changed the underlying features which made the current version possible. I'll get as close as I can given the tools I have available.
3 - I will see what I can do.
Yeah, can't pin anyone down and force anything... which is fine. We do however have to comply with legal standards to put up what little shields we can when told to do so.
There has been some very questionable material discussed in the grand scheme of topics for the Parallax discussion forums, but that's not really what it's about.
The easiest paraphrase, and close to what Phil added, is it's a legal requirement. We, Parallax, do target STEM and as part of our audience we include those that are protected by COPPA and because we are aware of this fact it is advised that we adhere to those requirements so that our collective bodies don't get untimely burned.
Is there ever a good time to be burned?
1. What is this item?
a. Throwing star
b. 45 rpm record insert
c. Garden hose flow reducer
d. Lego propeller hub
-Phil
...oooo....oooo! I know! Number B!!!
Another rare B-side hit. Well, more rare than they used to be anyway.
And Phil, I could answer that question correctly...! You may have a winner there..
-Tor
Also, Bump, in case it scrolled off the front page and you missed it, there's a 10,000-character ceiling on posts. This needs to be lifted, else some posts from this forum will not transfer completely.
-Phil
That's right. We don't want to discriminate against potatohead.
Ken Gracey
Thanks,
-Phil
Good things to come?
As long as I don't log in I can see everything just fine. Maybe I confused it by lying that bit of misdirection about my date of birth.
I guess I can't validate my own underage account. Oh well.
Will we have to sign up for the new forum to continue participating?
different forum skins for those of us that are 'blinded by the light'.
Thanks,
-Phil