1600 Pound Model Rocket

erco · 2014-01-15 13:28

1/10 scale Saturn V rocket has a beautiful flight & perfect parachute deployment. It even lands upright! If the comments are correct, this hobby rocket uses no steel or aluminum. Man, that's a LOT of other materials (cardboard tubes, plywood, maybe carbon fiber ?). Things have changed a bit since I was flying my littles Estes CamRoc! Any rocket builders here?

davejames · 2014-01-15 14:35

erco wrote: »

Any rocket builders here?]

...a long time ago, in a state far, far away.

Mike Cook · 2014-01-15 14:42

erco wrote: »

Any rocket builders here?

One of my loves from when I was a kid. Still fly every now and then. I have an altimeter that lives on a breadboard that I would like to fly one day.

GordonMcComb · 2014-01-15 15:05

San Diego county has long not allowed "safe and sane" fireworks (includes many types of model rocket engines) except in designated areas, and I grew up in a definitely NON-designated area -- the foothills of the county with dry manzanita brush all over. So, strictly forbidden.

But for a time I did play with Vashon model rockets, which were propelled by pressurized Freon. So while I didn't start any brush fires, I contributed to a few extra holes in the ozone layer. That's right; blame me.

User Name · 2014-01-15 15:14

That was a beautiful launch and recovery! But what record was broken? Clearly not altitude. Maybe weight?

Publison · 2014-01-15 15:16

erco wrote: »

Any rocket builders here?

Two of these puppy's to build here. My son has a third.

Been Estes rocket since 1974.

Too_Many_Tools · 2014-01-15 15:27

GordonMcComb wrote: »

San Diego county has long not allowed "safe and sane" fireworks (includes many types of model rocket engines) except in designated areas, and I grew up in a definitely NON-designated area -- the foothills of the county with dry manzanita brush all over. So, strictly forbidden.

But for a time I did play with Vashon model rockets, which were propelled by pressurized Freon. So while I didn't start any brush fires, I contributed to a few extra holes in the ozone layer. That's right; blame me.

For your reading enjoyment Gordon.

http://www.mindspring.com/~vashon/history.html

http://www.oldrocketforum.com/showthread.php?t=776

Dave Hein · 2014-01-15 15:50

User Name wrote: »

That was a beautiful launch and recovery! But what record was broken? Clearly not altitude. Maybe weight?

It's the largest and heaviest amateur rocket ever flown.

LoopyByteloose · 2014-01-15 16:09

Seems to be something like an under-powered V2 rocket. 1600 pounds is certainly a lot to get moving in any one direction, especially up.

It seems the V2 roughly weighed 4500 kg (empty) though, so it is smaller by weight.

http://www.v2rocket.com/start/makeup/design.html

RDL2004 · 2014-01-15 16:27

So, it's been about 5 years since that Saturn V model was launched. Amateur rockets have now made it into space and gone supersonic many times over. So what is the cut-off? When does a model rocket become a real, though still amateur, rocket? Does it have to do with the materials of construction? I noticed it was mentioned that Saturn V used no metal (okay, steel or aluminum). Or is it maybe that it has to use off the shelf "model rocket engines", or something else?

LoopyByteloose · 2014-01-15 16:29

I believe the US government sets the limit on putting navigation into the device.. no gyros. But there may be limitations to flight path as well.

Here are specifics...

http://www.nar.org/cabinet/waiverinst.html

RDL2004 · 2014-01-15 17:22

It looks like you cross the line when you stop using off the shelf, commercial model rocket engines.

High Powered Rocketry is still considered "model rocketry". They use commercially manufactured motors, though some user assembly is permitted. Metal is allowed in their construction, but I didn't see any upper limit to size. You do have to get FAA permission to fly in most cases. I did not find any information as to whether navigation systems were an issue.

Mark_T · 2014-01-15 18:10

RDL2004 wrote: »

When does a model rocket become a real, though still amateur, rocket?

When amateur groups fly teddy bears upto a miniature orbital space station and bring them back safely on a later mission!

Erlend · 2014-01-16 00:03

Couldn't comment. This is rocket science to me.
: ]

Erlend

erco · 2014-01-16 08:46

20+ years ago, I helped my first-grade neighbor with his model rocket science fair project. Robert actually did every bit of the work, I just made a video of each step of assembly and flight testing. He showed that video at the science fair. My little "Rocket Man" (yes, that was our theme song on the video) won first place! I'll have find that (ugh) VHS tape and Youtube it someday.

mindrobots · 2014-01-16 09:21

My brothers and I used to do rockets....this way back when NASA had those silly Gemini and Apollo sending people into space!

My one brother had built this really sleek, black, single stage rocket about 12-15 inches long. On it's maiden flight on a perfectly calm day, it went straight up and as best we could tell at max altitude, the parachute charge shot the rocket cartridge out the back instead of popping off the nose cone. Once this happened, the rocket was immediately nose heavy so it went nose down and started heading for the ground......it landed no more than 3 feet from the launcher and stuck itself about 4 inches into the ground. We got very quiet as we realized what had happened and how lucky we were not to be standing *THERE*!

Being 6, 12 and 15 at the time, launch operations shortly resumed.

JonnyMac · 2014-01-16 12:14

A long time ago I was a product manager at Toro (for sprinkler timers). We teamed with Motorola on product development and to "launch" the relationship a friend and I built a 4-foot model rocket and launched it over a crowd of Toro employees using wireless tech from Motorola. It was a blast -- literally and figuratively, and even netted a flying high-five from the Director of Marketing. Model rockets are fun.

LoopyByteloose · 2014-01-17 09:04

And they are get movie props. That 1/10th model launch looks real enough in the early stages to fool just about anyone.

Dave Hein · 2014-01-17 09:54

Loopy Byteloose wrote: »

Seems to be something like an under-powered V2 rocket. 1600 pounds is certainly a lot to get moving in any one direction, especially up.

It seems the V2 roughly weighed 4500 kg (empty) though, so it is smaller by weight.

http://www.v2rocket.com/start/makeup/design.html

Here's a picture of a V2 that I built in my back yard. It does weigh less than Steve Eves Saturn V, and it's smaller.

ctwardell · 2014-01-17 10:11

mindrobots wrote: »

My brothers and I used to do rockets....this way back when NASA had those silly Gemini and Apollo sending people into space!

My one brother had built this really sleek, black, single stage rocket about 12-15 inches long. On it's maiden flight on a perfectly calm day, it went straight up and as best we could tell at max altitude, the parachute charge shot the rocket cartridge out the back instead of popping off the nose cone. Once this happened, the rocket was immediately nose heavy so it went nose down and started heading for the ground......it landed no more than 3 feet from the launcher and stuck itself about 4 inches into the ground. We got very quiet as we realized what had happened and how lucky we were not to be standing *THERE*!

Being 6, 12 and 15 at the time, launch operations shortly resumed.

I had a similar incident, didn't end up as well for the rocket though...

It was a Estes WAC Corporal, it had a long tapered balsa nose cone. The engine popped out instead of the chute and it came straight down and hit the concrete parking spot nearby. The nose cone splinted like an exploding cigar...

C.W.

ctwardell · 2014-01-17 10:12

Dave Hein wrote: »

Here's a picture of a V2 that I built in my back yard. It does weigh less than Steve Eves Saturn V, and it's smaller.

WOW! That is a beautiful piece of work Dave.

C.W.

Dave Hein · 2014-01-17 10:24

I should mention that the camera was 5 feet from the rocket, and I was standing 95 feet behind the rocket. The rocket is about 3 feet tall.

erco · 2014-01-17 11:20

Great pic, Dave. Pinhole camera?

twm47099 · 2014-01-17 12:15

Back in the early 1960's we had a model rocket club in our high school (Don Bosco in Ramsey NJ). The rockets we built back then were made from steel tubes 1.5 and 2.5 inches in diameter and 2 ft to 5 ft long. We used steel fins, nose cones and nozzels. They were designed using a book "Rocket Manual for Amateurs by Capt B. Brinley of the US Army.

There were a number of different fuels used back then (not commercial motors). We used Zn and sulfur fuels. Most groups that used ZN + S used powder fuel packed in the rocket, but in our last year we used fuel made from melting the Zn+sulfur mix into about 8-inch cylindrical sections and loading them into the rockets. We had a number of safeguards (including for the high temperature bath we use casting the sections), but I doubt that would be allowed today.

We did test the fuel and ignitors in the woods behind the school, but could only launch the rockets at an annual meet at an army base in Virginia. We were supposed to keep the altitude under about 10,000 ft, but the advantage of the cast fuel was the long burn time (and density of the fuel). Most powdered Zn + S rockets burned their fuel in less than a second. Our large one kept burning when it went through the clouds. We lost sight of it then, but an Army artillery observer was able to track it and later found it buried on the range and recovered it. (We didn't use parachutes, but planned to in following years.) We took first place at the meet, but the army never told us the altitude it actually went.

Unfortunately, that was the last year of the club. The faculty adviser got married and moved away, and no one else had the necessary 'sense of adventure'.

Tom

Publison · 2014-01-17 12:32

A good inspirational film for the budding rocket enthusiast

October Sky:

http://putlocker.bz/watch-october-sky-online-free-putlocker.html

1600 Pound Model Rocket

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