So far, the only propeller board I've used is the quickstart. I'd love to get ahold of one of the professional development boards, but they're a little out of my price range at the moment. I'll get one in a few months, but for now, have to work with the quickstarts I have. I like the quickstart a lot more now that I got the hib for it, it makes it 100 percent more useful for my purposes.
One of the boe boards would be nice to get my hands on too. I've actually been drooling over the hydra for 2+ years, but haven't managed to have all the funds required to buy the hydra development kit all in one place yet, and now it looks like I won't ever get me one, since I think I saw they've been discontinued.
<sigh>
Anyhow. If I could find someone who could solder, I'd be happy to roll my own, since Parallax makes it so easy, but alass, that dream will have to wait until my son takes shop or something.
I can wait a couple years for that I guess.
softcon: How old is your son? I started soldering at about 8-9 years of age - I made my own soldering iron using a bolt screwed into timber and a coil wound and connected to a Telecom 1.5V battery. I made many crystal sets from matchbox to shoebox sizes.
I cannot recall how old my kids were, perhaps 12, when they started soldering up projects. By 15 they were working in an SMT assembly company after school.
My guess, is if your son has the interest, anywhere from 6-8 and up (under supervision of course) could work provided someone can show him precisely what to do and how to avoid getting burnt.
I see the Hydra is still listed. If Parallax discontinues it you can go to www.xgamestation.com and get one. XGamestation is the company that makes the Hydra but they actually sell it at a higher price.
Well pooh, I missed the "Something I built" entry. (Haven't had my second cup of coffee this morning.) Of the pre-built boards I have... Quickstart, Prop Platform, Prop Demo and MSR1, I prefer the Propeller Platform.
Mostly though, when I'm cobbling things together, I build them on my twin PEK board. Lots of space to work in and it has 3.3, 5 and 12 volt power. (Occasionally experiment with automotive circuits).
Then, if I like it and it works, I can move it to one of the smaller boards.
Here's my own "something I built" entry. I use these a lot when whipping something together. It has a pretty beefy 5V regulator and provides that out to the breadboard. I have some small modules that will plug into that 5V bus to provide regulated 3.3V for my use on the breadboard if needed. There's plenty of real estate left on the board, and I've thought about what to add for a new rev., but it provides a good 'basic' propeller environment that I can quickly slap onto a breadboard already. The socketed EEPROM is handy when I want to provide a quick program change for another (built) board. Load the program here, then swap out the chips. I prefer to socket the memory on most of my projects, because nothing is truly ever 'done'!
I put one of these in the Savage Circuits Traveling Parts Box (I'm not giving anything away, I saw where someone else had already pulled it out).
My friend has the Propeller Professional Development Board but I did not want to spend the money on one so I built one on a solderless breadboard. It also gives me the flexibility to add whatever I want.
I purchased a protoboard to try out the prop and now use it for development/prototyping To date it is the only board I have purchased, which is a testament to it's reliability. The projects to date have all been custom boards with the propeller as the controller.
PPDB with big breadboard and all the good stuff there for playing around with new ideas. Easy to replace Prop after mistakes.
Old Protoboard (5 for $100) without USB for building one offs. I liked the center position for the Prop and the beefy regulators for 5 and 3.3. On my first one I mounted a small OLED display over it after everything was working. Drilling mounting holes around it was not one of my smartest moves.
I really liked @Phil's backpack, very useful to get some debug output on some cheap screen on site.
The Spinneret, for sure. Small form factor and some pins left. Like the back pack more like a add on to other projects.
Besides @Peter Jakaki's Ethernet modules the smallest way to go.
Never really liked my Activity Board and my Demo board. Breadboard to small, power over USB and all them reset issues with USB, I never got warm with them.
I really think that putting USB on every board is just WRONG.
As soon as some project is doing more then just executing some demo code you need some serious power supply anyways. Say moving actuators or driving some servos.
Just enhance the PropPlug to also provide +5 (or look at @Peter Jakaki's design with providing access to /reset and ic2 also)
You still could run just from USB for testing some stuff out, or for class room projects.
If there is no USB on my project I can plug in my serial connection to some debug monitor without problems and without resetting the Prop. Not so with USB on board. Some even reset when data is send and USB not connected.
So I pledge for boards without USB. A separate Prop Plug is always better (and keeps his Com Port)
This is the Diptrace board layout. It could probably use a few more capacitors in places (eeprom power pins for one) and I think there's also a way to improve the reset circuit, but I was trying to keep it as simple as possible and it's been working fine so far. If you want the Diptrace files, I can probably dig them up.
I found it on ebay, I think I bought a 5 pack but it was a couple of years ago. You don't want that kind anyway. I had a lot of problems with pads lifting off from heat. I have better luck with those that have pads on both sides and plated through holes, they seem harder to damage. Something like these (90x150mm is the size I used):
However... How well does the Prop fare when Wire-Wrap is used? (That's right gang the dreaded Wire-Wrap functions.) I figured that would be a good candidate for building one that way.
And I've got a line on several Prop chips in DIP40 form factor.
I have all the old school dev boards and still use them sometimes, but for serious work it's turned out to be quickstart + expressPCB shield. It's not even worth prototyping when the PCBs arrive in 3 days and half an hour of soldering builds it solid. Since this is for industry and it's worked so well the price increases for QuickStarts have hardly mattered at all.
QuickStart was my first Propeller, bought at R.S., since then I've purchased three more with proto board kits, extra proto boards, headers, hardware, two Human Interface Boards, and one WizNet. A nice compact setup, the LEDs and keypad have been added baggage since the first board.
QuickStart was my first Propeller, bought at R.S., since then I've purchased three more with proto board kits, extra proto boards, headers, hardware, two Human Interface Boards, and one WizNet. A nice compact setup, the LEDs and keypad have been added baggage since the first board.
I have a WizNet here. Got it from one of the three (easy to reach?) Micro Center stores in my area. I still haven't gotten it to work properly however.
That HIB is next, and probably a batch of Proto Boards as well. I might even add a PEK to the mix......
And as it happens, RDL, I found in my collection of PDF files this one, (attached), it describes the circuit above perfectly.
That one is Propeller Schematic. It basically sums up exactly what you've got in mind up there. And as it happens I also found the classic "blink" example. Learn site has it, in C, of course for the C tools, and while its not quite what I expected, it will work.
First steps will be to try the program out on the PAB since that's the target. Then to the QS and finally to the home made board described there. Soon of course. :chip:
Had the WizNet on my home network, with an html menu and general information I cold reference. Router reset and found I don't really need the network. Be nice to have the Propeller run the network, energy saving and faster boot up.
I still prefer the Propeller Protoboard original without the USB. Over the years, I have had at least two dozen boards and 5 or 6 DIP Propellers.
Most recently I purchased 5 Propeller Projectboards Rev.2 at a clearance price. I ended up giving 3 to Taiwan Forth Interest Groups (loaded with Tachyon, Propforth, and pfth) as I still like the old Protoboard better.
I do have the feeling that there are several configurations in the Smorgasboard that have never been given an adequate chance to see if they would develop high demand. A lot of people want something as small as possible for compact projects.
Apart from my Propeller BOE that's piggybacked with a battery pack, I use a PEK style basic setup with one of my M44D40+ modules, a PowerTwig, and the PEK breadboard set. I agree with others that USB is not necessary on every board.
I'd love to here more about the personal preference parameters. Why do you prefer the board you do?
Just polling which board is a favorite doesn't help Parallax commit to form factors that are popular and can be feasibly massed produced..
For instance,
I personally dislike the USB interface. Without it built in, I can easily use either RS-232 or full-duplex RS-422. I use a PropPlug when I need to program via USB.
I really have no need of the three pin Servo interface.
I like the 10 pin in line - 8 data i/o with 3.3v and Gnd in a row with, but would be even happier with maybe a 12 pin in line that offers a second Gnd and a +5.
I strongly dislike the 2x20 connector. Double inline connetors seem to crowd everything together and make a rat's nest out of building an add-on board.
An easy SDcard interface is something I look more and more for as my growing knowledge of the Propeller makes it more and more useful.
An easy parallel LCD interface has been always wanted, but never appeared.
The VGA, Mouse, and Keyboard features should be included together, or at least the VGA and Keyboard. Otherwise, it seems silly to include the VGA in many situation.
An ADC DIP plug-in chip slot on board a cheap project board would likely be very attractive.
SMD device pads, in particular MOSfets should be easily tied to maybe 8 i/o drive high power demanding devices. Just having SMD available on the other end of the board is awkward.
++++++++++++
What might evolve are several favorite form factors. That means people would buy and use more Propeller due to ease of getting started.
So far, it seems proto-type board have tried to do it all. Why not have an A, B, and C alternative boards that focus on the bulk of form factors the user wants to fit in.
When I use VGA, I generally don't need Servos.
When I need Servos, I might want to include an LCD with a few buttons for menus.
When I need ADC, I might want USB to monitor the data.
And of course, there will always be a demand for a 'study board' with a bit of everything that will never be used in a project. So don't eliminative those.
Comments
One of the boe boards would be nice to get my hands on too. I've actually been drooling over the hydra for 2+ years, but haven't managed to have all the funds required to buy the hydra development kit all in one place yet, and now it looks like I won't ever get me one, since I think I saw they've been discontinued.
<sigh>
Anyhow. If I could find someone who could solder, I'd be happy to roll my own, since Parallax makes it so easy, but alass, that dream will have to wait until my son takes shop or something.
I can wait a couple years for that I guess.
I cannot recall how old my kids were, perhaps 12, when they started soldering up projects. By 15 they were working in an SMT assembly company after school.
My guess, is if your son has the interest, anywhere from 6-8 and up (under supervision of course) could work provided someone can show him precisely what to do and how to avoid getting burnt.
Mostly though, when I'm cobbling things together, I build them on my twin PEK board. Lots of space to work in and it has 3.3, 5 and 12 volt power. (Occasionally experiment with automotive circuits).
Then, if I like it and it works, I can move it to one of the smaller boards.
I put one of these in the Savage Circuits Traveling Parts Box (I'm not giving anything away, I saw where someone else had already pulled it out).
* CpuBlade 1"x1" Propeller Board with 3V3 regulator, socketed xtal (will run with 6.5MHz=104MHz), transistor reset circuit. All I/O pins available.
* MemBlade 1"x1" 512KB SRAM + microSD. Plugs into CpuBlade to make a RamBlade4 that runs CPM2.2 with ZiCog.
* RamBlade 1.2"x1.9" Propeller + SRAM + microSD. Runs CPM2.2 with ZiCog.
I have a new set of boards coming, including...
* CpuBlade5 0.8"x1" Propeller Board - updated and smaller CpuBlade
see www.clusos.com
RDL can you provide a schematic for that thing you built earlier?
PPDB with big breadboard and all the good stuff there for playing around with new ideas. Easy to replace Prop after mistakes.
Old Protoboard (5 for $100) without USB for building one offs. I liked the center position for the Prop and the beefy regulators for 5 and 3.3. On my first one I mounted a small OLED display over it after everything was working. Drilling mounting holes around it was not one of my smartest moves.
I really liked @Phil's backpack, very useful to get some debug output on some cheap screen on site.
The Spinneret, for sure. Small form factor and some pins left. Like the back pack more like a add on to other projects.
Besides @Peter Jakaki's Ethernet modules the smallest way to go.
Never really liked my Activity Board and my Demo board. Breadboard to small, power over USB and all them reset issues with USB, I never got warm with them.
I really think that putting USB on every board is just WRONG.
As soon as some project is doing more then just executing some demo code you need some serious power supply anyways. Say moving actuators or driving some servos.
Just enhance the PropPlug to also provide +5 (or look at @Peter Jakaki's design with providing access to /reset and ic2 also)
You still could run just from USB for testing some stuff out, or for class room projects.
If there is no USB on my project I can plug in my serial connection to some debug monitor without problems and without resetting the Prop. Not so with USB on board. Some even reset when data is send and USB not connected.
So I pledge for boards without USB. A separate Prop Plug is always better (and keeps his Com Port)
Enjoy!
Mike
The circuit came from either the Propeller Manual or the PEK manual, I can't remember which. The original post is here:
Basic Propeller circuit on a proto board.
This is the Diptrace board layout. It could probably use a few more capacitors in places (eeprom power pins for one) and I think there's also a way to improve the reset circuit, but I was trying to keep it as simple as possible and it's been working fine so far. If you want the Diptrace files, I can probably dig them up.
I'll dig up the PEK one and read it.
It looks amazing, except for one question: Where did you buy the board its wearing?
http://www.ebay.com/ pcb double 90x150
However... How well does the Prop fare when Wire-Wrap is used? (That's right gang the dreaded Wire-Wrap functions.) I figured that would be a good candidate for building one that way.
And I've got a line on several Prop chips in DIP40 form factor.
I have a WizNet here. Got it from one of the three (easy to reach?) Micro Center stores in my area. I still haven't gotten it to work properly however.
That HIB is next, and probably a batch of Proto Boards as well. I might even add a PEK to the mix......
That one is Propeller Schematic. It basically sums up exactly what you've got in mind up there. And as it happens I also found the classic "blink" example. Learn site has it, in C, of course for the C tools, and while its not quite what I expected, it will work.
First steps will be to try the program out on the PAB since that's the target. Then to the QS and finally to the home made board described there. Soon of course. :chip:
Most recently I purchased 5 Propeller Projectboards Rev.2 at a clearance price. I ended up giving 3 to Taiwan Forth Interest Groups (loaded with Tachyon, Propforth, and pfth) as I still like the old Protoboard better.
I do have the feeling that there are several configurations in the Smorgasboard that have never been given an adequate chance to see if they would develop high demand. A lot of people want something as small as possible for compact projects.
from this post http://forums.parallax.com/discussion/comment/1020136/#Comment_1020136
Just polling which board is a favorite doesn't help Parallax commit to form factors that are popular and can be feasibly massed produced..
For instance,
I personally dislike the USB interface. Without it built in, I can easily use either RS-232 or full-duplex RS-422. I use a PropPlug when I need to program via USB.
I really have no need of the three pin Servo interface.
I like the 10 pin in line - 8 data i/o with 3.3v and Gnd in a row with, but would be even happier with maybe a 12 pin in line that offers a second Gnd and a +5.
I strongly dislike the 2x20 connector. Double inline connetors seem to crowd everything together and make a rat's nest out of building an add-on board.
An easy SDcard interface is something I look more and more for as my growing knowledge of the Propeller makes it more and more useful.
An easy parallel LCD interface has been always wanted, but never appeared.
The VGA, Mouse, and Keyboard features should be included together, or at least the VGA and Keyboard. Otherwise, it seems silly to include the VGA in many situation.
An ADC DIP plug-in chip slot on board a cheap project board would likely be very attractive.
SMD device pads, in particular MOSfets should be easily tied to maybe 8 i/o drive high power demanding devices. Just having SMD available on the other end of the board is awkward.
++++++++++++
What might evolve are several favorite form factors. That means people would buy and use more Propeller due to ease of getting started.
So far, it seems proto-type board have tried to do it all. Why not have an A, B, and C alternative boards that focus on the bulk of form factors the user wants to fit in.
When I use VGA, I generally don't need Servos.
When I need Servos, I might want to include an LCD with a few buttons for menus.
When I need ADC, I might want USB to monitor the data.
And of course, there will always be a demand for a 'study board' with a bit of everything that will never be used in a project. So don't eliminative those.