Forum Update - Announcement about May 10th, 2018 update and your password.

DVI or HDMI shield with true color output: 4.3" plugin works too

RaymanRayman Posts: 8,506
edited January 2013 in Propeller 1 Vote Up0Vote Down
This one has taken me several days to design and it'll be a minor miracle if it actually works:
Update: It actually works!

DVI_TrueColorVGA_layout1.png


There are only 2 chips and voltage regulator on this Propeller Platform compatible shield.
The chip on the left (Texas Instruments TFP410) drives the DVI connector on the left edge of the board.
The chip on the right (Solomon SSD1963) delivers 640x480 (essentially VGA) with true color, 24 bits per pixel.

Not even Prop2 will be able to do this without external chips.

Here's a new demo video:

Here's what it looks like on the Prop Platform USB:
Production4.jpg


Update: Just finished up testing the 4.3" touchscreen plugin module and it works too (see post #77 for photos).
So, there will soon be both analog VGA and 4.3" TFT plugin modules for this board available soon.

Another Update: 4.3" touchscreen plugin also works with Newhaven 5" touchscreens with 800x480 resolution.
The capacitive touch version can also work by using a small adapter board to connect the touch connector the DVI shield.

Product Page: http://www.rayslogic.com/Propeller/Products/DviGraphics/DVI.htm
Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
521 x 439 - 31K
1024 x 768 - 117K
«1345

Comments

  • 124 Comments sorted by Date Added Votes
  • TubularTubular Posts: 2,955
    edited February 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Ooh that sounds very interesting. Look forward to hearing how it goes
  • Dr_AculaDr_Acula Posts: 5,482
    edited February 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    This looks fun. How many prop pins does it need?
    Answers: 1) A quadcopter. 2) Very high. 3) The internet. 4) A lot. 5) No.
  • jmgjmg Posts: 11,425
    edited February 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Rayman wrote: »
    The chip on the left drives the DVI connector on the left edge of the board.
    The chip on the right delivers 640x480 (essentially VGA) with true color, 24 bits per pixel.

    What are their part numbers ?
  • RaymanRayman Posts: 8,506
    edited February 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    I've updated the top post with the chip names...

    I've used the TFP410 before, so I'm fairly confident that half of the circuit will work.
    The SSD1963, however, is designed to drive TFT LCD panels and not VGA monitors.
    I think people have tried to use the SSD1963 for analog VGA, but I could not find any reports of success.
    As far as I can tell, I'm the first to try it for DVI/HDMI connection...
    That is what has me worried. But, it will be so cool if it works, that I had to try it...

    I'm trying to use as few pins as possible here. I think that will be 12 (P16..P27). But, it may need 2 or 3 more...
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • JT CookJT Cook Posts: 473
    edited February 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    That looks really cool. So what do what kind of data do you have to feed into to get HDMI out? Do you feed in a VGA signal, or do you write to it like a frame buffer, or something else?
  • pedwardpedward Posts: 1,467
    edited February 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    A picture is worth a 1000 words:

    tfp410.png
    892 x 469 - 58K
  • CircuitsoftCircuitsoft Posts: 1,001
    edited February 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    http://www.allshore.com/pdf/solomon_systech_ssd1963.pdf

    Looks like it contains a 1MB framebuffer.
  • RaymanRayman Posts: 8,506
    edited February 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    The input to the HDMI chip is actually the same as the output of the SSD1963 chip (at least very similar) and also the input to the 4.3" TFT LCD touchscreens I sell...

    It is similar to regular VGA except the color is in 24-bit digital form instead of analog... Also, there's pixel clock and data enable signals..


    BTW: If, for some reason, people want regular VGA or NTSC video in true color, we can make a little plug-in board for this board to provide that option pretty easily...
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • Jimmy W.Jimmy W. Posts: 112
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Any update on this? Does it work? Is there a working object?
  • RaymanRayman Posts: 8,506
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Glad you asked... I just started populating the board today.

    Unfortunately, the SSD1963 proved a bit more difficult to solder by hand that I thought...
    I had 3 boards and 3 chips... Ruined 2 of each, but I think I have this last one right:

    Soldered.jpg


    Maybe tomorrow I'll know if I messed up the layout...
    First step is the get the SSD1963 talking...

    I have an SSD1963 driver working already. Posted about that in another thread...
    1024 x 768 - 131K
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • RaymanRayman Posts: 8,506
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    I'm still in shock, but guess what.... It works!

    ItWorks.jpg
    1024 x 768 - 79K
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • SapiehaSapieha Posts: 2,964
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Hi Rayman.


    NICE Work
    Regards
    Sapieha
    _____________________________________________________
    Nothing is impossible, there are only different degrees of difficulty.
    For every stupid question there is at least one intelligent answer.
    Don't guess - ask instead.
    If you don't ask you won't know.
    If your gonna construct something, make it as simple as possible yet as versatile/usable as possible.
  • BeanBean Posts: 7,845
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Rayman,
    First off, nice work.

    Can you make it HDMI instead of DVI ? Just wondering because HDMI seems to be available in most TVs now.

    Do you plan on selling these ? If so what would be a ballpark price ?

    Bean
    logo.png?91518163160380889
    Esterline Research & Design
    thitt@esterlineresearch.com

    We offer consulting on the following areas of expertise:
    Frequency Control - Micro-Controller/Processor Projects
    Test and Automation - General Programming and Coding
    Circuit Design - Board Layouts
  • RobotWorkshopRobotWorkshop Posts: 2,300
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Bean wrote: »
    Rayman,
    First off, nice work.

    Can you make it HDMI instead of DVI ? Just wondering because HDMI seems to be available in most TVs now.

    I think that some of the HDMI inputs can accept DVI output. There are several adapters available and it may work ok just by using a cable like this:

    http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10231&cs_id=1023104&p_id=2661&seq=1&format=2

    There are also adapters:

    http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=104&cp_id=10419&cs_id=1041902&p_id=2029&seq=1&format=2

    http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=104&cp_id=10419&cs_id=1041902&p_id=2080&seq=1&format=2

    Definitely worth trying out to see if it works.

    Robert
  • RaymanRayman Posts: 8,506
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    I'm fairly confident that you can just use a DVI to HDMI cable to connect to your TV.
    A "real" HDMI signal is slightly different because it uses a packet format and can include sound.
    My DVI chip is using a PanelBus format, which is more basic.
    But, my understanding is that TVs will accept both.

    Assuming everthing checks out, these could be for sale in just 2..3 weeks...
    Ballpark price is $29.99
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • CircuitsoftCircuitsoft Posts: 1,001
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    DisplayPort uses a packetized format that embeds sound in the stream. HDMI runs sound over its own channel which is very similar to S/PDIF, but can run at higher rates. HDMI DDC info includes sound capabilities, though.
  • Coder96Coder96 Posts: 42
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Any idea how this would compare to the gameduino?
  • RaymanRayman Posts: 8,506
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Coder96 wrote: »
    Any idea how this would compare to the gameduino?

    Well this has a digital, 24-bit color output at 640x480 , whereas that looks analog at lower resolution.
    This board has an 8-bit wide data bus, whereas that is 1-bit SPI.
    That board looks designed for games and it's possible it would be better for that...
    This one has a lot more pixels to push around and could be slower for full screen updates...
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • Bill HenningBill Henning Posts: 6,445
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Congratulations Ray!
    Rayman wrote: »
    I'm still in shock, but guess what.... It works!

    ItWorks.jpg
    www.mikronauts.com / E-mail: mikronauts _at_ gmail _dot_ com / @Mikronauts on Twitter
    RoboPi: The most advanced Robot controller for the Raspberry Pi (Propeller based)
  • jmgjmg Posts: 11,425
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Rayman wrote: »
    Well this has a digital, 24-bit color output at 640x480 ...

    Have you tried 800x480x24 yet ? ;)
    Now you have a raster and a board, you could try an Analog VGA operation ?
  • RaymanRayman Posts: 8,506
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    jmg wrote: »
    Have you tried 800x480x24 yet ? ;)
    Now you have a raster and a board, you could try an Analog VGA operation ?

    You must be reading my mind... I'm pretty happy with VGA, but most HDMI TVs are widescreen, so I'll have to see if that works...

    If you look at the layout in the top post, I've tried to create a 40-pin header in the middle of the board for accessory boards.
    One accessory board could be a 24-bit, 3-channel video DAC that would allow output over regular DB15 VGA cable.
    Also, the DVI connector actually has analog video connections. So, once this board is installed, you could just use a DVI to VGA adapter...
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • CircuitsoftCircuitsoft Posts: 1,001
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    If at first you do succeed, try not to look too surprised.
  • RaymanRayman Posts: 8,506
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    I was hoping all along this would work, but it was a real gamble as it has never been apparently done before...

    Anyway, this is a truly a day of days in my Propeller graphics adventures...

    Here's a pic of my TV showing a 800x480x24bit photo with this shield loaded from the sd card of the Prop Platform USB board:

    DayOfDays.jpg
    1024 x 768 - 56K
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 21,897
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Rayman,

    That's beautiful, remarkable work! Congratulations!

    Looking at the prices of the components, though, it mystifies me that you could come out okay at a $29 price point. Or is that for the bare boards?

    -Phil
    “Perfection is achieved not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. -Antoine de Saint-Exupery
  • Dr_AculaDr_Acula Posts: 5,482
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Oh wow. Very clever work!
    Answers: 1) A quadcopter. 2) Very high. 3) The internet. 4) A lot. 5) No.
  • LawsonLawson Posts: 870
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Rayman wrote: »
    Glad you asked... I just started populating the board today.

    Unfortunately, the SSD1963 proved a bit more difficult to solder by hand that I thought...
    I had 3 boards and 3 chips... Ruined 2 of each, but I think I have this last one right:

    Soldered.jpg


    Maybe tomorrow I'll know if I messed up the layout...
    First step is the get the SSD1963 talking...

    I have an SSD1963 driver working already. Posted about that in another thread...

    Solder Wick is key. I've soldered quite a few 0.65mm lead spacing parts using it. While I usually try to individually solder each pin for practice, I get the best/quickest results with "smash and grab". I.e. soldering the heck out of a bunch of pins, then sucking up all the extra with solder wick. I've even pulled a few chips off a board by using solder wick to remove as much solder as possible, then using a sharp point and a dry soldering iron to bend up each individual pin.

    For VGA, 3x simple R-2R DACs on the 24-bit pixel bus might be enough. (nice calculator)

    Also, this will make for some NICE looking video!

    Lawson
    micro-power experiments with the propeller.
    Drivers for TAOS TSL3301 line sensor Forum thread, and OBEX
    Lumen Electronic Jewelery Website
    My AWD motorcycle Website and action video
    What I'm paid to work on. UW Lidar Group.
    FME, a Spin-only floating point library with trig, exponential, and logarithm functions. OBEX and Forum.
  • Oldbitcollector (Jeff)Oldbitcollector (Jeff) Posts: 8,084
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    @Ray,

    Awesome.. Couple Questions...

    How much Propeller memory was used in the program that read that penguins image onto the screen?

    How fast was the screen drawn?

    OBC
    <br>
  • Cluso99Cluso99 Posts: 13,740
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
  • RaymanRayman Posts: 8,506
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Thanks guys. The cost may be a $5 more that I originally thought... We'll see...
    Bitmap drawing was slow, but I took a first cut at speeding it up today.. It's not so bad now:

    [video]http://www.youtube.com/embed/a9UHfcLmo8k[/video]

    My test program is a bit bloated with things that aren't being used, but anyway there are still 3,803 longs free.
    Prop Info and Apps: http://www.rayslogic.com/
  • mindrobotsmindrobots Posts: 6,494
    edited March 2012 Vote Up0Vote Down
    Brilliant, Ray!

    Cross another item off the "That's impossible with a Propeller" list!
    MOV OUTA, PEACE <div>Rick </div><div>"I've stopped using programming languages with Garbage Collection, they keep deleting my source code!!"</div>
Sign In or Register to comment.