Well, no, not always. If I post something I regret, and if it survives without comment, I'll delete it. But once it's commented on or taken to task -- even justifiably (and there are numerous examples of that) -- I feel a responsibility to leave it up. Otherwise, it's like being in the public stocks without a sign around my neck telling what I did, and that's unfair to the community. Granted, it's no fun having one's miscreant behavior publicly indicted by a moderator -- especially one of Mike Green's stature; but once that happens, a simple deletion can't undo the sin and wipe the slate clean. You just have to suck it up and try to be a better forumista in the future.
-Phil
strikeouts are a good way to handle this. I've said a one or two things on the forum that I felt were too harsh or out of line. Instead of deleting the content, a quick edit with strikeout allows one to "suck it up".
Well, the people you meet here are amazing. I bought 2 LCDs from P!-Ro, and instead of just paypalling him the money, he had me donate it to charity! It is amazing how nice the people are here.
as for the part about not referring customers to non-parallax stuff, Have you seen our hate for the arduino?
As someone said, this is one of the most civilized forums I have ever used.
My dog is upset. He thinks Parallax has gone over to cat lovers. I keep telling him we all have to accept changes, but he isn't listening to this. I try to explain that tolerance is part of any community experience and that the world is full of nice cats.
I'm sorry Parallax but I totally disagree with all this etiquette rubbish and i refuse to wear a suit and tie whilst posting, t-shirt and jeans for me!
Actually, while the Arduino is not often mentioned as an alternative product, plenty of other products are. That said, I think that the clear disdain and "hate" for Arduino, and I suppose, by extension, Arduino users, is one of the things makes the forum less than welcoming.
A lot of Arduino users do not use Stamps or Propellers, but they use a LOT of Parallax sensors, motor controllers, robot kits, etc. These users should be welcome and should be assisted in getting their Parallax products to work. Given that Arduino sketches are essentially C language, this should not be odious. If I run across Arduino users having trouble getting a Parallax sensor or controller to work, I am always reluctant to send them to the Parallax Forums, because I think that the negativity about the user's chosen platform will come through.
Personally, I would like to see C libraries for the popular Parallax sensors supported by Parallax -- nothing complex, but the basic wrappers. This would let both C users on any platform and Arduino users go to town. However, I don't think that's likely, and a lot of users have already created Parallax sensor libraries in C, so I would think that the Forum members might help bridge the gap. The basic concept for a Ping is always the same -- issue a trigger pulse, make the pin an input, wait for the pin to go high, measure the pulse. I often see where PIC or Arduino users are just told to go elsewhere for help, when they are trying to get a Parallax product to work.
I don't have a hatred of the "Arduino"; just total confusion as to why anyone would use it when the Propeller is there. Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing a few more Arduino shields with Propeller chips on them, doing what they do best..
Just wondering why there should be negative reactions to other designers product choices? I would assume that professional courtesy would include respecting a designers choice of devices and methods as they probably have all the facts surrounding their choices. All of the possible choices came into being for a (marketable) reason didn't they?
That being said, if I am visiting your firm, and told your clients that they should really go down the road to a competing firm that would rightly Smile you off would it not? You are (virtually) a guest of Parallax on this site. Why would you take advantage of what is offered here at no cost to you, benefit from much of it and then tell other customers that they would be better off down the road. And again, since one doesn't know fully why someone is here, doesn't that make one look awfully silly telling that person to try down the road?
Such behavior also tells others that you may not be comfortable with your own design choices by being here in a negative fashion, or that you are feeding your own "more correctness" by trying to convince others that they are less correct in their decision process.
I'm sorry Parallax but I totally disagree with all this etiquette rubbish and i refuse to wear a suit and tie whilst posting, t-shirt and jeans for me!
Just don't tell us your working commando, that would be way to much information........
It's getting off track, but I disagree with practically everything in #73.
I know of no instance where an arduina person was "chased off."
The arduina is not my bag.
A couple of times where arduina people showed up for "support", it turns out that they just wanted a "sketch", as though "support" and glomming a "sketch" were synonymous. It's not that they were unclear as to how to proceed, they didn't want to know or to learn anything.
I didn't chase them away, but I was blown away by their ignorance of their platform, unable to change an output to an input, basic stuff. They didn't want to work out their problem, they just wanted a "sketch", someone else to do their thinking for them. That's the "beauty" of arduina: chances are, someone, one of the millions of fans "world-wide", somewhere has done a "lib" or a "sketch", you don't have to think, just cut_&_paste your way to "achievment."
Recently, some arduina genius, a forum first-timer no less, wanted to know about maybe he should get an ADC module from some other vendor for his arduina and he was godsmacked for the news provided by none other than me that his wonderful arduina has analog inputs. The guy showed up on the Parallax forum to ask how to make his arduina work - and he got a competent resolution. Amazing!
This is an anonymous forum, so I don't get this cozy, nurturing, "welcoming" jazz.
@PJ Allen
Even though I particularly like the chip that Arduinos use, I haven't pursed the whole thing just because it seemed to avoid learning anything about microcontroller reality in a rigorous sense.
Artists, sketches, and so on do seem to make communication on a nuts and bolts level harder. I am not surprised that such users wander in and out without learning much as they have been buffered from a more mainstream approach.
The dog may have mistook one of the Arduino users for a cat and initiated a chase, but he is not telling.
Comments
Now I am. It one of the most disturbing 3 minutes I've ever experienced.
3a) NO BARNEY. EVER.
3b) NO NYAN SONG. EVER.
strikeouts are a good way to handle this. I've said a one or two things on the forum that I felt were too harsh or out of line. Instead of deleting the content, a quick edit with strikeout allows one to "suck it up".
OBC
I do ......
as for the part about not referring customers to non-parallax stuff, Have you seen our hate for the arduino?
As someone said, this is one of the most civilized forums I have ever used.
Here, try this one for musical fit.....
http://pbskids.org/rogers/
F
I am in agreement with you.
BTW I like cats and I have one.
Only if having tea and crumpets or in the presence of a cat.
C.W.
Actually, while the Arduino is not often mentioned as an alternative product, plenty of other products are. That said, I think that the clear disdain and "hate" for Arduino, and I suppose, by extension, Arduino users, is one of the things makes the forum less than welcoming.
A lot of Arduino users do not use Stamps or Propellers, but they use a LOT of Parallax sensors, motor controllers, robot kits, etc. These users should be welcome and should be assisted in getting their Parallax products to work. Given that Arduino sketches are essentially C language, this should not be odious. If I run across Arduino users having trouble getting a Parallax sensor or controller to work, I am always reluctant to send them to the Parallax Forums, because I think that the negativity about the user's chosen platform will come through.
Personally, I would like to see C libraries for the popular Parallax sensors supported by Parallax -- nothing complex, but the basic wrappers. This would let both C users on any platform and Arduino users go to town. However, I don't think that's likely, and a lot of users have already created Parallax sensor libraries in C, so I would think that the Forum members might help bridge the gap. The basic concept for a Ping is always the same -- issue a trigger pulse, make the pin an input, wait for the pin to go high, measure the pulse. I often see where PIC or Arduino users are just told to go elsewhere for help, when they are trying to get a Parallax product to work.
OBC
That being said, if I am visiting your firm, and told your clients that they should really go down the road to a competing firm that would rightly Smile you off would it not? You are (virtually) a guest of Parallax on this site. Why would you take advantage of what is offered here at no cost to you, benefit from much of it and then tell other customers that they would be better off down the road. And again, since one doesn't know fully why someone is here, doesn't that make one look awfully silly telling that person to try down the road?
Such behavior also tells others that you may not be comfortable with your own design choices by being here in a negative fashion, or that you are feeding your own "more correctness" by trying to convince others that they are less correct in their decision process.
Just random thoughts,
Frank
Just don't tell us your working commando, that would be way to much information........
Tell him not to worry Loopy, the more cats there are, the more cats he has to chase!
C.W.
I know of no instance where an arduina person was "chased off."
The arduina is not my bag.
A couple of times where arduina people showed up for "support", it turns out that they just wanted a "sketch", as though "support" and glomming a "sketch" were synonymous. It's not that they were unclear as to how to proceed, they didn't want to know or to learn anything.
I didn't chase them away, but I was blown away by their ignorance of their platform, unable to change an output to an input, basic stuff. They didn't want to work out their problem, they just wanted a "sketch", someone else to do their thinking for them. That's the "beauty" of arduina: chances are, someone, one of the millions of fans "world-wide", somewhere has done a "lib" or a "sketch", you don't have to think, just cut_&_paste your way to "achievment."
Recently, some arduina genius, a forum first-timer no less, wanted to know about maybe he should get an ADC module from some other vendor for his arduina and he was godsmacked for the news provided by none other than me that his wonderful arduina has analog inputs. The guy showed up on the Parallax forum to ask how to make his arduina work - and he got a competent resolution. Amazing!
This is an anonymous forum, so I don't get this cozy, nurturing, "welcoming" jazz.
Even though I particularly like the chip that Arduinos use, I haven't pursed the whole thing just because it seemed to avoid learning anything about microcontroller reality in a rigorous sense.
Artists, sketches, and so on do seem to make communication on a nuts and bolts level harder. I am not surprised that such users wander in and out without learning much as they have been buffered from a more mainstream approach.
The dog may have mistook one of the Arduino users for a cat and initiated a chase, but he is not telling.