Black HDPE? Don't do it, Rob/Roy! Don't sell out! Don't be seduced by the Dark Side! Don't unlearn what you have learned! You guys and I are Plywood Robot Brothers for life! Solidarity on this one! Stay the course! Thousand points of light! Sawdust & splinters 4 ever!
You can't glue to HDPE! Black material isn't virgin, it's cheap regrind with lots of impurities! Bad mojo! Bad for your health! Makes your hair fall out in clumps!
================
Mr. McGuire: I want to say one word to you. Just one word.
Benjamin: Yes, sir.
Mr. McGuire: Are you listening?
Benjamin: Yes, I am.
Mr. McGuire: Plastics.
================
:-)
White ABS: GOOD pure virgin material, glueable, sandable, paintable
Black HDPE:BAD impure cheap regrind (throw in any dark filler and it stays black), not glueable, doesn't sand very well, not paintable
All kidding aside, I've been in the plastics biz for 27 years. Fabricating things out of ABS would be much easier and yield better results. NOBODY reaches for a hunk of HDPE to build a model out of. That's why they didn't make Scribbler or S2 out of HDPE !
Hi all -
@ Roy - wow, you're way ahead of me- looks great!
@ Zappman - you're trackin' with me, I agree about adding additional levels.
Buying a second "base" to use as as 2nd level really won't look as good as it could, because it would have the cutouts for the motors / extra holes, etc.
@ Everybody - We're working on some additional "level" ideas too - Chime in! Give us your thoughts on preferred materials / dimensions / mounting schemes, etc.
@ Erco - Point well taken on ABS. We did look at many different types, but settled on HDPE for several reasons:
- Reasonable machine-ability.
- Lack of brittleness (not likely to crack or break when drilled into with "commonly available" tooling),
- "In the field use" durability,
- Available thicknesses of raw materials, in the quantities we could purchase.
- Quantity of Robot Bases that we expect to sell vs. # of units we could economically make per production run,
- Cost of raw materials, etc.
ABS would have been a good choice except for the last criteria - Cost of raw material was too high. The lowest price that we were able to find for a raw "blank" (in a reasonable quantity that we could purchase at a given time) was over three times the cost of the HDPE.
This puts the price of the raw material alone over $45. Add to this the machining time, sales overhead, cost of my In-N-Out Burger lunches, etc, and we're looking at a really nice looking ABS Robot Base, but at a much higher price, than what we can do with HDPE.
Is HDPE the perfect material? - of course not. We did consider the fact that you can't glue it, but (I) made the decision not to worry about that because I believed that the Base is really (in most cases) always going to be a "work-in-progress" - putting it together and taking it apart and rebuilding it to make it better is really what it's all about (at least to me). Gluing any glue-able plastic is generally a "one-way ticket".
Is ABS better than HDPE? - in some ways yes, and in some ways not.
Would there be enough demand for ABS Robot Bases at the higher price? I don't think so, at least not yet.
So, while I do agree that ABS has some properties that make it really cool, HDPE hopefully strikes a "happy balance" between Price and Functionality - and hopefully will be viewed as a "step up" from the plywood version.
@ Robert - you should have had it by now. Unfortunately we're closed until the 3rd - sorry about that - I'll check on it first thing!
-Matt
I think if you could mount four servo mounted rotatable pings on the left and right in the front and rear that would open up all kinds of possibilitys and it would reduce the number of pings needed for full 360 degree coverage from 10 pings to four pings.
Hello everybody,
I think the idea of additional levels (bases) is the best for many reasons. I also like very much the idea of a "vault"
So I tried to combine both. As you can see I have also moved the HB-25 on the top side (I think they are more protected there). I have also put a wirelles camera on the top. The camera can rotate verticaly (for the horizontal rotation we can rotate whole the robot). The last photo is the "Erco's version" because it has a lot of wood!!! . It has also a robot arm. I hope that Ken will support this robot with a robot arm (not necessarily the same as the one I suggest in the model) as an "extra" equipment!
p.s.You can give me a list of electronics parts for this robot!
e.g The parts I need to make the robot controlled through web.
I would think that an array of PING's around a robot's perimeter could complete a sensor sweep faster than one or two pings mounted on servos. I did like the dual PING's on servos that were on the Stingray project because you could follow a wall while looking for forward obstructions. Maze following made easy.
A nice option might be to consider using some of the aluminum t-framing that is pretty common. It is easy to work with and a lot of places carry it. You can see what I'm talking about here:
Old as in they were discontinued by Evolution robotics and unavailable for a while. I've heard rumors they may bring them back out again though. I've got a couple of them and they are pretty cool. One came from a swap meet that was salvaged from a university. That literally came in pieces. Someone had cut the drive belts and each one of the wires. I had to carefully match up and splice all the wiring back together. It was a pain but I was able to get it all working. They even cut the cords for the USB camera and each one of the drive motors.... Lots of soldering and heat shrink to clean that up.
Of course the ER-1 isn't nearly as old as many of the robots I have from the 80's but that is another topic and I don't want to derail this thread. Just because it's old doesn't mean it is bad or obsolete. In fact many of those older robots are still superior to anything available today.
Hi all,
Over the holidays, there was a marriage. The Groom was resplendant in his dark black tux, and his lovely Bride was absolutely radiant in her beautiful, flowing white gown.
As a Christmas project I had my sons help me put together a "couple" of new platforms that we'll be using over the coming months for development of some new, cool, robotic "thingy's".
When they're together, they do kinda remind me of a wedding though...
-Matt
@kevin101: You think switching from wood to plastic is "Moving on up"? I respectfully disagree; here's your theme song for recycled HDPE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5DnqW3F57E
Hi all,
To support my view about the vault I also suggest a frame between the base and the vault.
In this frame we can perfectly adapt the 10 PING ultrasonic sensors.
I think that this frame can also reduce the cost of the production because it abolish the 10 protector stands.
The HDPE Robot Base Kits should be in stock by Tuesday or Wednesday.
Some minor adjustments to the (included) hardware were made, such as:
1) Deleting the 6-32 nuts and washers intended for mounting the casters. They are no longer needed because of the self-tapping properties of HDPE.
2) The (6) socket head screws are now 3/8" long which allows for "blind" mounting holes for the casters - makes the top look cleaner too.
3) Added standoffs and #4-40 screws are for holding a 12v, 7.5ah SLA battery to the Battery Shelf.
4) There are additional mounting holes in the Battery Shelf that will accomodate BOE or Prop-proto board foot prints, as well as an up-coming SLA Battery charging circuit (so that you will no longer need to remove or disconnect the battery from your machine).
5) We are not chamfering the edges of the Base Plate. This allows the full 3/8" thick HDPE plate to be drilled into from the "side" as well - it doesn't split or crack like plywood (sorry erco). You can choose to chamfer the edges yourself with a utility knife router, etc., or not.
I've served up a mini plywood robot base kit of my own on an appropriate HDPE platter. All materials have their place!
erco, don't keep us waiting for what you're about to produce. What is that little robot you're showing in the picture? If that's a BS2, then your plywood base is about the size of a sandwich. Please do tell what you're up to!
The Wood Side is strong with erco! He's zigging when you think he's zagging! Don't believe everything he says! Stay the course - see past the darkness and walk in the light!
Comments
Now Parallax needs to come up with a matching top plate, so that you can add another deck.
I'm still waiting for mine to come it. I can't wait to try it out!
Robert
================
Mr. McGuire: I want to say one word to you. Just one word.
Benjamin: Yes, sir.
Mr. McGuire: Are you listening?
Benjamin: Yes, I am.
Mr. McGuire: Plastics.
================
:-)
White ABS: GOOD pure virgin material, glueable, sandable, paintable
Black HDPE:BAD impure cheap regrind (throw in any dark filler and it stays black), not glueable, doesn't sand very well, not paintable
All kidding aside, I've been in the plastics biz for 27 years. Fabricating things out of ABS would be much easier and yield better results. NOBODY reaches for a hunk of HDPE to build a model out of. That's why they didn't make Scribbler or S2 out of HDPE !
What do you think about a vault on the top side of the robot?
P.s I have made some 3d drawings for this robot using the Google ScetchUP.
Can I publish the drawings here in this thread?
@ Roy - wow, you're way ahead of me- looks great!
@ Zappman - you're trackin' with me, I agree about adding additional levels.
Buying a second "base" to use as as 2nd level really won't look as good as it could, because it would have the cutouts for the motors / extra holes, etc.
@ Everybody - We're working on some additional "level" ideas too - Chime in! Give us your thoughts on preferred materials / dimensions / mounting schemes, etc.
@ Erco - Point well taken on ABS. We did look at many different types, but settled on HDPE for several reasons:
- Reasonable machine-ability.
- Lack of brittleness (not likely to crack or break when drilled into with "commonly available" tooling),
- "In the field use" durability,
- Available thicknesses of raw materials, in the quantities we could purchase.
- Quantity of Robot Bases that we expect to sell vs. # of units we could economically make per production run,
- Cost of raw materials, etc.
ABS would have been a good choice except for the last criteria - Cost of raw material was too high. The lowest price that we were able to find for a raw "blank" (in a reasonable quantity that we could purchase at a given time) was over three times the cost of the HDPE.
This puts the price of the raw material alone over $45. Add to this the machining time, sales overhead, cost of my In-N-Out Burger lunches, etc, and we're looking at a really nice looking ABS Robot Base, but at a much higher price, than what we can do with HDPE.
Is HDPE the perfect material? - of course not. We did consider the fact that you can't glue it, but (I) made the decision not to worry about that because I believed that the Base is really (in most cases) always going to be a "work-in-progress" - putting it together and taking it apart and rebuilding it to make it better is really what it's all about (at least to me). Gluing any glue-able plastic is generally a "one-way ticket".
Is ABS better than HDPE? - in some ways yes, and in some ways not.
Would there be enough demand for ABS Robot Bases at the higher price? I don't think so, at least not yet.
So, while I do agree that ABS has some properties that make it really cool, HDPE hopefully strikes a "happy balance" between Price and Functionality - and hopefully will be viewed as a "step up" from the plywood version.
@ Robert - you should have had it by now. Unfortunately we're closed until the 3rd - sorry about that - I'll check on it first thing!
-Matt
-Matt
Hello everybody,
I think the idea of additional levels (bases) is the best for many reasons. I also like very much the idea of a "vault"
So I tried to combine both. As you can see I have also moved the HB-25 on the top side (I think they are more protected there). I have also put a wirelles camera on the top. The camera can rotate verticaly (for the horizontal rotation we can rotate whole the robot). The last photo is the "Erco's version" because it has a lot of wood!!!
p.s.You can give me a list of electronics parts for this robot!
e.g The parts I need to make the robot controlled through web.
http://www.techmasterinc.com/products5.html
http://www.minitecframing.com/
The old ER-1 robots were built using this type of framing and it is very common in other automation areas.
A nice structure could be built on top of the robot base using this system.
Robert
Oh, what sad times are these when passing ruffians can say Ni at will to old robots!
Of course the ER-1 isn't nearly as old as many of the robots I have from the 80's but that is another topic and I don't want to derail this thread. Just because it's old doesn't mean it is bad or obsolete. In fact many of those older robots are still superior to anything available today.
Robert
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9y4iXAso4I
Over the holidays, there was a marriage. The Groom was resplendant in his dark black tux, and his lovely Bride was absolutely radiant in her beautiful, flowing white gown.
As a Christmas project I had my sons help me put together a "couple" of new platforms that we'll be using over the coming months for development of some new, cool, robotic "thingy's".
When they're together, they do kinda remind me of a wedding though...
-Matt
- Matt
-Matt
However -
Your photos have given me reason to believe that we can strike a "happy truce" -
I've started a new Robot Base design based on your direct input!
Yes, the new Base is precision machined out of Lovely Aqua-Marine Porcelain Tile...
-Matt
Some minor oak (plywood) trim on this aquamarine ceramic tile would complete the "Sizzler" theme. Might find apps in the food service industry...
To support my view about the vault I also suggest a frame between the base and the vault.
In this frame we can perfectly adapt the 10 PING ultrasonic sensors.
I think that this frame can also reduce the cost of the production because it abolish the 10 protector stands.
The HDPE Robot Base Kits should be in stock by Tuesday or Wednesday.
Some minor adjustments to the (included) hardware were made, such as:
1) Deleting the 6-32 nuts and washers intended for mounting the casters. They are no longer needed because of the self-tapping properties of HDPE.
2) The (6) socket head screws are now 3/8" long which allows for "blind" mounting holes for the casters - makes the top look cleaner too.
3) Added standoffs and #4-40 screws are for holding a 12v, 7.5ah SLA battery to the Battery Shelf.
4) There are additional mounting holes in the Battery Shelf that will accomodate BOE or Prop-proto board foot prints, as well as an up-coming SLA Battery charging circuit (so that you will no longer need to remove or disconnect the battery from your machine).
5) We are not chamfering the edges of the Base Plate. This allows the full 3/8" thick HDPE plate to be drilled into from the "side" as well - it doesn't split or crack like plywood (sorry erco). You can choose to chamfer the edges yourself with a utility knife router, etc., or not.
@Nikos - nice work!
-Matt
erco, don't keep us waiting for what you're about to produce. What is that little robot you're showing in the picture? If that's a BS2, then your plywood base is about the size of a sandwich. Please do tell what you're up to!
The Wood Side is strong with erco! He's zigging when you think he's zagging! Don't believe everything he says! Stay the course - see past the darkness and walk in the light!
-Matt