iPad with terminal program to microcontrollers?
Ken Gracey
Posts: 7,407
Hey all,
Doing a bit of research about the possibility of connecting an iPad to a BS2 or Propeller using a terminal program. I'm not interested in programming, but interfacing with one of our chips to download/upload data using a terminal program.
Didn't readily find a terminal program, but I see that there's a cable http://www.redpark.com/news.html that should make the connection physically possible.
The iPad seems to use the same OS as the iPhone, so this question could also pertain to iPhones.
Does anybody have any insight or experience about setting up such a serial connection?
Thanks,
Ken
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Ken Gracey
Parallax Inc.
Follow me at http://twitter.com/ParallaxKen for some insider news.
Doing a bit of research about the possibility of connecting an iPad to a BS2 or Propeller using a terminal program. I'm not interested in programming, but interfacing with one of our chips to download/upload data using a terminal program.
Didn't readily find a terminal program, but I see that there's a cable http://www.redpark.com/news.html that should make the connection physically possible.
The iPad seems to use the same OS as the iPhone, so this question could also pertain to iPhones.
Does anybody have any insight or experience about setting up such a serial connection?
Thanks,
Ken
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Ken Gracey
Parallax Inc.
Follow me at http://twitter.com/ParallaxKen for some insider news.
Comments
The OS does have provisions for serial I/O through the dock connector, but there's no terminal program that exists. Uploading or downloading data would be a real problem since Apple doesn't support any kind of interpreter or scripting other than JavaScript. You'd really have to develop a terminal program in C or C++ or Objective-C with upload / download capability and use either e-mail attachments and/or provide a webserver to get the data on or off the iPad / iPod Touch / iPhone.
I think you'd have the best luck making a webserver using a YBox2 or equivalent. You'd use Safari on the iPad to access and control it. The YBox2 would do the actual serial interfacing. If you made a YBox2 using a WiFi interface, you could establish a private WiFi network with the iPad. The web pages could contain JavaScript that would run on the iPad.
Got it. But, did you see the link I provided to the Redpark serial cable for iPad? Apparently it's built with Apple's blessing and the exact purpose of it is to enable connections to the kinds of hardware you and I like to use. I've also seen an iPad controlling an humanoid robot.
Makes me think that the OS has some simple provisions for serial I/O or basic terminal style functions. There must be a terminal style program out there, somewhere. I'm never the first person to come up with an idea, so somebody must be doing this already. . . somewhere.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Ken Gracey
Parallax Inc.
Follow me at http://twitter.com/ParallaxKen for some insider news.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)·
· Prop OS: SphinxOS·, PropDos , PropCmd··· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBlade Props: www.cluso.bluemagic.biz
The Apple stuff insn,t hard to hack,But who cares to use it.
Apple might have a small ran with its iphone, But when Bill brings his out, iphone game over.
I wouldn't waste My time with the apple MODs
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
The Truth is out there············___$WMc%___···························· BoogerWoods, FL. USA
I'm no Apple fan, but they've sure got the marketing part down pat. I doubt very much that MS could put much of a dent in·IPhone sales.
I did see the link for the cable. The problem is that there are no finished products using it and no software for general use. It's a reference design for OEM use. You may be able to get some samples and they may have some simple demo programs for its use, but you won't find a ready-made terminal program. The iPhone OS does have serial I/O calls as would other Unix derivatives. You could contact MochaSoft to see what their experience has been internally with other serial terminal programs.
Um, people.
Look at the X-box which burned peoples houses down when it first came out and the X-box 360 which melted your game inside it.
There are many phones with Windows CE on them and eveyone I have used has been slugish and prone to failures. My blackberry on the other hand has been like living with a 3GHz PC after running a 386.
More proof that not all things Microsoft live. Have you seen any HD-DVDs lately?
I run PCs because they are much cheaper then the equivalent Mac but lots of people are switching to Macs because they are willing to spend extra money for something that looks like it belongs in your living room instead of something that belongs in your office.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
devdot.wikispaces.com/Iphone+Serial+Port+Tutorial
I will echo this sentiment with some slight modifications:
I run PCs because people still insist I do so, but lots of people are switching to Macs because they are willing to spend extra money for something that works like it was meant to interface with human beings instead of something that belongs duct-taped to the back of that Ronald Reagan-era electron microscope you rescued from the junk yard.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Watching the world pass me by, one photon at a time.
Today I spoke with Redpark and learned more about the cable concept. Apple requires a license to use the Redpark reference design. And, normally each application must be bundled up in a way to be stand-alone with a finished product. On the surface it appears that the only way a microcontroller could be interfaced with an iPad/iPhone would be as another closed finished good (i.e., a Watt-O-Meter, a Paint Color Matcher, etc.). In other words, no customers like you and I who would connect nearly any sensor, robot or similar device using the microcontroller of our choice. I don't think the communication code between a microcontroller and the iPad could be opened up for general use, either.
The iPad software development environment has a learning curve. Redpark offers no terminal program, but some basic code as a starting point.
Further, these cables have some chips in them to provide authentication. These chips are programmed to work with the target device (and only the target device). The cables become very expensive even in high volume.
Redpark offers a hardware development kit. I'll leave the cost out of this post as it likely varies by customer.
I have to be careful what I write on these forums. So I'll just leave it with the closing remark that you and I are probably not their target type of developer.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Ken Gracey
Parallax Inc.
Follow me at http://twitter.com/ParallaxKen for some insider news.
You and I are probably not Apple's target type of developer. It's very clear that Apple does not see the iPad, iPhone, or iPod as a hobbyist tool in any way. They very clearly want only polished, well made (and finished) products to be associated with these. They support software developers who may want to develop software for "internal use" and who are large enough to jump through the necessary (not completely unreasonable) hoops, but you won't find any "hacker" hardware as you've discovered. The earlier iPods were much more open from a hardware perspective and are cheaper to hack, but less useful than the iPad or iPhone.
If you stick with a Telnet interface as I suggested, you could use an iPod or iPhone with MochaSoft's terminal program. The Telnet interface from NetBurner runs about $50 as a board and you'd need to plug it into a network with WiFi access.
With that connector it seems like it would only require an SDK, but I'm sure there's more to it than I know - like the SDK software will only work if it can communicate with their proprietary "chips" in the cable.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Ken Gracey
Parallax Inc.
Follow me at http://twitter.com/ParallaxKen for some insider news.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
I picked up the ipad last week, and I am a Apple Developer (AKA forked out the $99). I decided that my next project was going to be an iPad interface to the propeller and without much thought ordered the Sparkfun iPod breakout www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=8295.
From what I have figured out so far the Apple Accessory Protocol can be developed for with the SDK version 3.2, however Apple requests special agreement and company profile to be submitted to join their "Made For Ipod" program. From what it looks like that's the only official way to play without breaking the rules.
Now outside of the rules would be jailbreaking, but I was thinking a happy compromise of perhaps:
Ken,
I have been a few steps behind you... I saw some of your breadcrumbs on another forum yesterday. I will post my links and code as I go along.
OK... one more idea ... again its a little nuts, but should fit right in here. Since the iPad has VGA and composite out video, its possible to do a "visual bit bang" and then process the video on a Prop. This could be as simple as flashing a white and black screen. The audio input could be used as flow control.
You cannot even get a program into the ipad without signing the Apple NDA and getting their blessing. Talk about a closed system!!!
And I thought Apple was about the little guy...The do-it-yourselfer... Well not with the iphone/ipad.
I may be wrong (and I hope I am), but if this is how Apple operates I want no part of it.
Bean
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Use BASIC on the Propeller with the speed of assembly language.
PropBASIC thread http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=867134
March 2010 Nuts and Volts article·http://www.parallax.com/Portals/0/Downloads/docs/cols/nv/prop/col/nvp5.pdf
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
There are two rules in life:
· 1) Never divulge all information
Line6 has made a midi interface for the iphone, with a simple midi record/play functionality.
http://line6.com/midimobilizer/
Not sure if there's a in-between I/C in their connector, but it seems that tx/rx is directly accessible and could be directly linked to the external propeller or stamp.···
The other issue is the SDK is on a mac, so you'd need at least a mac mini for making the iphone apps.· The other case maybe going via USB, wifi, or bluetooth to the device.
Ironcially, i also saw this prop/iphone application on youtube, that turns on/off 3 color LED's.·
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNUQYdgvyI0
[noparse][[/noparse]edit] but he's using a web browser via html...
[noparse][[/noparse]edit]
also Spectrasonics has a iphone app that controls their instrument software as a remote.· It only works on MAC's, though...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3ma-fo9Giw#t=8m5s
I believe·developers could put their·app on their device without apple's blessing for testing, however I could be wrong, too.
Post Edited (Yendor) : 4/15/2010 2:40:25 AM GMT
Something about too much rf from its wifi.
One guy that works here tried to get one through customs at the
airport and they took it and put it in storage...he is pissed.
Surely they will work it out as it just seems weird.
Cypress have just released some very complex kit which is designed to link to various i-goodies:
http://www.cieonline.co.uk/news/fullstory.php/aid/1411
Regards,
T o n y
Israel and S. Koreas have OK'd the iPad for import.
Somebody, somewhere has used the Iphone as an interface for a robot
Since the iPad and iPhone OS's are essentially the same, it's only a matter of time for an iPad robot.
I have a lot of idea for applications and hardware that would use a iPhone or iPad. The markets for such devices are measures in the 100s or 1000s. Small volume, but the economics may not workout for going through all the other hassles. Time will tell because eventually I want to get back to these ideas.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Timothy D. Swieter, E.I.
www.brilldea.com - Prop Blade, LED Painter, RGB LEDs, 3.0" 16:9 LCD Composite video display, eProto for SunSPOT, PropNET, PolkaDOT-51
www.tdswieter.com
I'm hoping to have them on sale, as Timothy points out, in small volume, next month. I've posted pictures online using my iPhone and iPad to console into Cisco routers which you can see here:
http://resolvehax.blogspot.com/2010/10/iphone-serial-port.html
http://resolvehax.blogspot.com/2010/11/ipad-serial-port.html
There are instructions on how to build one in that first post, but for those who can't be bothered, I'm happy to build them for you.
You can make contact for that through http://www.ionetworks.com.au
Cheers.
The basic problem with the iPhone/iPad is that it is essentially evil. The entire system is closed so that Apple can monetize every single aspect of the system and software; including the fact that you can't even change the battery. Apple essentially acts like people accuse microsoft of being but they get away with it.
It's really too bad because it is a slick platform. I'm holding out for competitor tablets using Android or something else because they are more open.
Good luck with whatever you are working on.
Consider the Android and Google as a worthy alternative. Apple users are generally uber-consumers, not allowed to think in generic hacker terms about creative uses - just cradled in the Land of Buy More.
I have had similar frustrations on my Palm Zire72. Early Palm devices, like the Apple II, were friendly to RS232. But when USB became the only interface, being open to RS232 disappeared (and a lot of the fun).
Making money is evil? Isn't that why all companies exist?
If a company has something that's worth paying for, pay for it. If they want you to use it in a specific way to make it easier for them to support or charge for, either use it or don't, but evil is a pretty strong word; hyperbole helps no-one, especially in a market permeated with fanboyism. It only invalidates your attempts to share your opinion.
If a cheaper (or more free) version exists that does a better job, don't pay for it, and the free market will take care of the rest.
Done! Finished prototype two on the weekend; into production next week.
That's a pretty gross stroke of the brush. I know it's cool to be in the iPhone haters club, much like MS, but if you don't like it, jailbreak it. You need to root your Android to get full functionality as well.
That said, as soon as this is done I'll be working on a 'Droid version, but I'm obviously less interested in that as I don't use one.