RamBladeProp - A propeller plus 512KB SRAM and microSD for ZiCog, PropDos, etc
Cluso99
Posts: 18,069
This design has changed so please see the new thread...
·· RamBladeProp with SRAM to run CPM & ZiCog plus other LMM software
·· http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=838091
The RamBladeProp is a 25mmx50mm (1"x1.96") pcb designed to run large programs on the propeller.
Features:
Further information is on the thread··TwinBladeProp - Another SBC (single Board Computer) to run CP/M etc in a box·· http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=806697
QUESTION:·· I had intended to do this pcb together with the TwinBladeProp pcb to share the pcb tooling between the 2 pcbs. However, something came up that I need to do which has delayed the layout of the TwinBladeProp pcb. If a separate project, estimated costs (depending on numbers)·US$10 for a bare pcb, US$40 fully assembled.· How many are interested in this pcb?
For orders etc, please email me cluso@bluemagic.biz
Please do not ask for features (the design is done). It will be an open design. ··
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBladeProp, RamBlade, TwinBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: Micros eg Altair, and Terminals eg VT100 (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
Post Edited (Cluso99) : 9/4/2009 12:33:55 PM GMT
·· RamBladeProp with SRAM to run CPM & ZiCog plus other LMM software
·· http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=838091
The RamBladeProp is a 25mmx50mm (1"x1.96") pcb designed to run large programs on the propeller.
Features:
- Propeller chip has
- 512KB of static RAM (non-multiplexed)
- microSD socket
- 2 wire (ultra high speed serial) to another propeller or terminal
- No Eeprom
- Can be loaded by another propeller or processor via 3 additional I/O pins
- Can be loaded by optional cheap on-board microprocessor
- Can plug into Propeller Proto Board. The PPB then becomes a smart programmable peripheral to the RamBlade
- Designed to run high speed RAM in applications such as CP/M emulation (running ZiCog)
- Designed to run the future (PropDos/PropCmd) propeller operating system from microSD
- This is roughly equivalent to Blade #2 on the TriBladeProp board.
- Other info
- All ICs are SMT (surface mount)
- PCBs will be available as
- Bare PCB
- Assembled PCB (optional connector and on-board microloader)
Further information is on the thread··TwinBladeProp - Another SBC (single Board Computer) to run CP/M etc in a box·· http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=806697
QUESTION:·· I had intended to do this pcb together with the TwinBladeProp pcb to share the pcb tooling between the 2 pcbs. However, something came up that I need to do which has delayed the layout of the TwinBladeProp pcb. If a separate project, estimated costs (depending on numbers)·US$10 for a bare pcb, US$40 fully assembled.· How many are interested in this pcb?
For orders etc, please email me cluso@bluemagic.biz
Please do not ask for features (the design is done). It will be an open design. ··
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBladeProp, RamBlade, TwinBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: Micros eg Altair, and Terminals eg VT100 (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
Post Edited (Cluso99) : 9/4/2009 12:33:55 PM GMT
Comments
Congratulations. Sounds like a perfect solution for "intelligent" devices.
Ross.
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Catalina - a FREE C compiler for the Propeller - see Catalina
I want to order a fully populated board. Can you point me to the code? I lost the posting reference. RAM & other I/O discussions have greatly heated up as of late. I can't keep up
What time is it from your boat? Is it NSW time? Man, I miss Sydney...
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JMH
Post Edited (James Michael Huselton) : 5/27/2009 12:58:16 PM GMT
Refreshes per Hour:
3.6x10^8 seconds
4167 days
11.42 years
1.142 decades
Refreshes per Minute:
2 months 8 days 14 hours 40 minutes
6x10^6 seconds
1667 hours
69.44 days
9.921 weeks
0.1903 years
Refreshes per Second
1 day 3 hours 46 minutes 40 seconds
27.78 hours
1.157 days
Comparison as time:
~~ 3.5 x 8-hour workday ( 8 hr )
Calculations just FYI... Taken from www79.wolframalpha.com/
This is why I chose Ramtron parts:
1M bit Ferroelectric Nonvolatile RAM
• Organized as 128K x 8 bits
• High Endurance 100 Trillion (1e14) Read/Writes
• 10 Year Data Retention
• NoDelay™ Writes
• Advanced High-Reliability Ferroelectric Process
Very Fast Serial Peripheral Interface - SPI
• Up to 40 MHz Frequency
• Direct Hardware Replacement for Serial Flash
• SPI Mode 0 & 3 (CPOL, CPHA=0,0 & 1,1)
Write Protection Scheme
• Hardware Protection
• Software Protection
Device ID and Serial Number
• Device ID reads out Manufacturer ID & Part ID
• Unique Serial Number (FM25VN10)
Low Voltage, Low Power
• Low Voltage Operation 2.0V – 3.6V
• 90 µA Standby Current (typ.)
• 5 µA Sleep Mode Current (typ.)
Industry Standard Configurations
• Industrial Temperature -40°C to +85°C
• 8-pin “Green”/RoHS SOIC Package
Ordering Information
FM25V10-G - Device ID, 2.0-3.6V - 8-pin “Green”/RoHS SOIC
FM25VN10-G - Device ID, S/N, 2.0-3.6V - 8-pin “Green”/RoHS SOIC
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JMH
Post Edited (James Michael Huselton) : 5/27/2009 1:50:36 PM GMT
First, for the flash, read's don't wear it out, so what we have is a minimum guaranteed 100k write/erase cycles per page. On a 2MB/16Mb part, there are 512 sectors of 4K each. If you kept writing/erasing the same sector, you could do so 11.4 times per minute, or about every five seconds, for a year. If you implemented even minimal wear leveling, you could erase and re-write a sector almost 3000 times per minute - for a year. You just can't treat it like ram, re-writing the same spot non-stop, every second. FYI, some people have gotten WAY more erase/write cycles, however erasing and programming took longer.
Now the FRAM's claim 10^14 read/write cycles because even reads degrade each row as I recall, and row's are not nearly as big as 4K... however even that included, while its not 10^14 pre location, they are impressive devices, which I will be using when appropriate. The FRAM's are also far more expensive per KB.
They are both excellent devices, just for different purposes.
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Largos - a nano operating system for the Propeller
www.mikronauts.com - a new blog about microcontrollers
I'm designing with these devices for the forseeable future. I consider these devices cheap as dirt for all the headaches I avoid. If I go into mass production, I will look at my designs with a different eye. For the time being, this is a hobby.
The more, the merrier
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JMH
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Largos - a nano operating system for the Propeller
www.mikronauts.com - a new blog about microcontrollers
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JMH
I'm working like crazy so I can show off a prototype of Largos at the Expo, along with some other LMM stuff..
Btw, Largos supports the WX25xxx Winbond chips, and does automatic wear-leveling to REALLY extend the lifetime of the chips.
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Largos - a nano operating system for the Propeller
www.mikronauts.com - a new blog about microcontrollers
Post Edited (Bill Henning) : 5/27/2009 5:20:35 PM GMT
Garooovy!
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JMH
I am using 512KBytes of SRAM. There is no wear cycles, nor write delays, so it does not compare with Flash.
I am using microSD which uses Flash. It costs less than $10 for 2GBytes and is removable. It uses Flash and has inbuilt wear levelling. It can be backed up (or file transfers) to a PC with a cheap converter. When it wears out or you think it might be on its way, replace it.
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBladeProp, SixBladeProp, website (Multiple propeller pcbs)
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: Micros eg Altair, and Terminals eg VT100 (Index)
· Search the Propeller forums (via Google)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
"Over the next week I will post schematics, design reasoning, etc. It will be an open design."
Thanks,
Doug
I've put my name down for a twinblade. I'm not sure about this one re the lack of an eeprom to boot it. How else would you boot it and what are the options there? I'm very interested in gettting a platform for the zicog (I still don't seem to have all the parts for the triblade and each $1 part I need comes with a $30 shipping cost). So I'm very interested in some sort of platform but not sure which one to go for. A platform that is a 'one stop shop' is the best option - ie all bits included. Hmm - how long till the twinblade comes out - weeks or months?
This is necessary as the eeprom may conflict with the bus layout to the SRAM. Remember, this design is for speed and this is the downside.
The RamBlade, when implemented on the TwinBlade, the on-board processor will not be present, and the RamBlade prop will be loaded by the other prop (the intelligent peripheral) from it's eeprom which will be a 24C512.
Wrong thread, but...
TwinBlade ETA - maybe 4 weeks?? (most of the pcb design blocks are done but just need to be interconnected and the power supply and propplug added)
Is the on-board PropPlug circuit required? - if not I can put in a 6 pin connector which will take the PropPlug or (via a cable) Digilent modules (RS232, etc) or perhaps an ENC28J60 board or XPort board.
Dr_A: what parts are you missing? - did you re-use the RAMs on that missile project???
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBladeProp, SixBladeProp, website (Multiple propeller pcbs)
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: Micros eg Altair, and Terminals eg VT100 (Index)
· Search the Propeller forums (via Google)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
I guess its pins 28 and 29 plus RES pin. Like hinv I think there are a few others who would like to see more detail.
I did put my name down for a Ramblade board today. At $40 fully assembled, plus the cost of a PDB, it sounds the easist way to get up and running.
I had considered purchasing another RPM board and installing an SRAM Chip on the prototyping area, that is until I found the latest efforts by Cluso99.
My webserver project really needs lots on RAM and the microSD card
Ron
Post Edited (Ron Sutcliffe) : 5/28/2009 3:39:41 PM GMT
Thanks,
Doug
However, the testing Beau did was without synchronised clocks. Up till this time I believed a synchronised clock was required. I now know this not the be the case.
I am still trying to find the time to finish the TwinBlade so that I can manufacture both pcbs simultaneously. I would love to bring them to the Prop Expo in June, but I haven't even booked a flight as I don't know if I can spare the time yet.
SUBJECT TO CHANGE:
The connection to the Prop Proto Board will be SIL 8x0.1" (VDD,VSS,-RST,SO,SI,G1,G2,G3) which solders/connects directly to the PPB holes without requiring wires (VDD,VSS,P0,P1,P2,P3,P4,P5). Note P5 is optional. SO and SI are used for the normal serial
The RamBlade propeller connects to the SRAM as follows:
And sorry guys, I won't post the complete schematic until the pcbs are ready - I need to keep some things up my sleeve and I have·one minor feature that·I have deliberately not revealed yet
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBladeProp, SixBladeProp, website (Multiple propeller pcbs)
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: Micros eg Altair, and Terminals eg VT100 (Index)
· Search the Propeller forums (via Google)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
Post Edited (Cluso99) : 5/29/2009 3:58:27 AM GMT
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Largos - a nano operating system for the Propeller
www.mikronauts.com - a new blog about microcontrollers
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBladeProp, SixBladeProp, website (Multiple propeller pcbs)
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: Micros eg Altair, and Terminals eg VT100 (Index)
· Search the Propeller forums (via Google)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
Ron
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Largos - a nano operating system for the Propeller
www.mikronauts.com - a new blog about microcontrollers
I love the concept and the cost is good too. It seems there will be lots of cogs spare but hardly any pins, so we'll need some kind of expander for more general purpose use.
Don't forget some mounting holes!
Look forward to the detailed detail...
tubular
Unfortunately mounting holes are pin stake holes of 0.040" (no room and·the size is fixed for other reasons, including a possible box to mount it in).
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBladeProp, SixBladeProp, website (Multiple propeller pcbs)
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: Micros eg Altair, and Terminals eg VT100 (Index)
· Search the Propeller forums (via Google)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
Using P0..2 to RST, P30, P31 means I can use Chip's Prop to Prop loader, sounds good. No need for ultra high speed serial transfer for this boat project [noparse]:)[/noparse]
Ron
Plus they can act as a pilot hole for drilling an tapping
tubular
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBladeProp, SixBladeProp, website (Multiple propeller pcbs)
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: Micros eg Altair, and Terminals eg VT100 (Index)
· Search the Propeller forums (via Google)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
I've suffered a touch screen which had mounting stakes in 3 but not 4 corners... it was bad enough having to add some kind of mechanical support, a standard pip (pad) is all thats required to help locate consistently.
The self tapping spacer I have in mind has a 1.6mm diameter thread... if that doesn't work there will be other options.
tubular
I wanted it to be small and therefore surface mount.
Anyway, I have been thinking... so a question...
RamBlade·only (the TwinBlade will have to wait) - specs as above
What's your preference...
For your interest,·attached is the unfinished smt layout
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBladeProp, SixBladeProp, website (Multiple propeller pcbs)
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: Micros eg Altair, and Terminals eg VT100 (Index)
· Search the Propeller forums (via Google)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
So in this case my vote would be for the SMT.
Happy to co-panellise and/or hand solder if that helps push the SMT version through
tubular