I now know just how behind we are, in the UK. Here we just get park and ride, in Finland they get ride and prop.
I have a blade2 both rams, latch, eeprom, sd card (full size) but no serial stuff as it sat on top of one of the Z80 things (which is going nowwhere fast). So I thought I would pretend to be busy and build a stand alone Blade2 that would eventually have a blade1/Demoboard sat on top. I only asked as I was sure that I saw a picture that showed the latch linked out (but now I'm wondering if the latch was hiding undeneath the pcb)
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The TriBlade was designed to be very flexible. In fact probably too flexible and it caused a lot of misunderstanding. It could be built without the latch but I never did a driver for it, so hence the requirement for the modification and the latch.
So to answer your question, yes, there was a photo of the pcb without the latch and I did test it.
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Just modded the ram /OE, before reading any of the above, even though it is single 512Kb and tested the SD with your PropCMD version ( forgot about it having to be FAT not Fat32 ).
Getting there slowly. I think I peaked a bit too early, the late 70's !!
ADDIT:- Put in those SD files and the Binary into the prop and ... YIPPEE!!!!!!! I have a 64Kb CP/M, 2 FD + 2 HD showing.
Thanks Guys. Now I have the promise of working hardware ....
I don't know why the dual ram attempt didn't work as I slavishly followed the ccts, this time I just juggled the data and addr lines around, to the ram, to make the PCB simpler. Hey-Ho.
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Post Edited (Toby Seckshund) : 10/24/2009 7:35:41 PM GMT
Just ran a MBASIC 10000 looped for-next, It took about 18 secs (@ 80MHz) that was about the same as the nascom @ 2MHz, if I can recall!!!!
The headers state that it is a 8080 emulation and when I tried a prog off the B drive it said up-yours, Z80 required. Just me ?? Perhaps I am still in Heaters past ( which hasn't happened yet ).
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No, I took the shilling and loaded Clusso's binary. I will have to get BST up and pounding, now there is the proof of happenings.
Hey, I aint picky. I was sooooo p..... o... that my cheapskate's ripoffof Cluso's hard work didn't work, I am one happy lil' bunny now it does. A few glasses of settled apple juice have been invoked (guess which bit of the uk I was from)
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The last few times I compiled I left the 8080 option defined. So now you have to compile using bst. Also, you seem to be using an older version (not rr126) as you have floppy support enabled. We are past that so that is why it probably didnt find drive B in floppy format. You should get a CPM message saying 8HD meaning 8 hard disks.
I published my TriBlade circuit so others could freely build their own copy/version. However, I am not publishing the actual pcb design
Would it help if I published a minimal version of the TriBlade Blade #2 circuit ?? Would anyone want a bare pcb of this if I made them - say $5-8 ea + postage for up to 10 $4.50 (unregistered airmail). I will see if I can find a way for cheaper postage for a single pcb. Bare pcb, no parts, except maybe microSD socket for a charge.
The RamBlade is a faster/smaller smt version (see RamBlade thread) and contains a few tricks that I am not revealling just yet.
Any questions, please ask.
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Re Cluso The last few times I compiled I left the 8080 option defined. So now you have to compile using bst. Also, you seem to be using an older version (not rr126) as you have floppy support enabled. We are past that so that is why it probably didnt find drive B in floppy format. You should get a CPM message saying 8HD meaning 8 hard disks.
Yes I've just taken the entire package of files Cluso gave me and stripped it back to just the necessary ones, put back in the right #defines and made sure the right files are on the sd card. Also edited the BST.BAT file, and copied the necessary .dll files over for a minimal teraterm.
It took about half an hour and you need to know the ins and outs of the code. There is quite a lot of code accumulating that is legacy code that adds the complexity of multiple nested #ifdefs. These ifdefs are starting to become a language in their own right, but they are not really structured, ie no indents and it is hard to match up the endifs with their corresponding ifdef. Also there are many #else commands that made sense when there were just two board options, but with the ramblade there will be three (and with a board I'm working on there will be four) so they all need to change from #else to #elseifdef. I don't know if there maybe is a way of adding to the #ifdef syntax in some way. I was wondering about the option of #ifdef mydefine and then #endif mydefine. That would be backwards compatible.
Bottom line is it probably is time to rerelease a package with everything in one file. All the spin code. All the working hard drive images (but not necessarily the ones we needed to get here, eg the floppy ones). Plus BST and ? a terminal program. I put one together and minus the hard drive images it is only 400k.
Re the comments on the schematic and board for just blade 2, that will almost certainly become unnecessary once the tiny ramblade comes out.
Hmm, Cluso, I just had a thought. Since many of the parts in the ramblade are a bit unusual and since shipping is so high for one chip and since you are throwing together a very attractive package (soldering up the tiny chips), I wonder about adding another $10 and including a micro sd card with all the software on it? The hard drive images, plus a folder you copy back onto the PC with all the spin code and BST etc? Ok, it will become obsolete over time, but at least that will be a package that will work out of the box just by plugging it into a demo board, and then users can see it working quickly and then once it works they can go online and get the latest version?
Drac: You jumped the gun! I am planning on releasing a version fully assembled with the eeprom programed and microSD card formatted and loaded. The board will be fully tested and will run with the addition of the power supply and serial interface (whichever option is chosen). I have a front end like PropDos/PropCMD to write (complete) to allow for the ZiCog/TriBlade/CPM binary or another binary or a question to ask after displaying the prop binaries found. The eerpom code should not require to be changed (ever I hope) because the initial binary will be loaded from the microSD on powerup. By changing a microSD, a new operating system or bootup can be done. No PropPlug should be required.
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Toby, then you should come to Australia. At present I am in Adelaide which is 1400km (about 870 miles) from Sydney and takes 16 hours to drive - done it many times. Sydney to Brisbane is about 800km (500 miles) and takes 9 hours to drive. We do this most months. I am just about to fly back from Adelaide to Sydney, then drive 2 days later to Brisbane. Driven from Sydney to Perth a number of times years ago - about 2800 miles - 3 1/2 days. London to SOuthhampton, Tiverton (& Cornwall?) then up to Liverpool and across to Oxford & Cambridge, and back to London was a walk in the park
Better get back to RamBlade & TriBlade...
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True but the way our roads are it takes half a day to cross London. From here the midlands it can take so long to get to Cornwall they have put on scheduled flights. I have done sone decent distances over in France and Spain. SHE didn't like it.
Back to the silicon. Compiled and loaded a more recent vesion of Zicog CP/M and now shows Z80 and 8 HD's. Bumped it up to 6MHz and it ran ok, tried a 6.55MHz xtal I had, recompiled but crashed on the ram clearing/loading bit, I think. Tried 12MHz pll8x and ok, pushed it to 14.3MHz and it just had an fit. This is with SM caps and tants right under the prop.
When I put the higher figure freq into the xinfreq line if I do 12 000 000 it throws a maths error, but 12000000 is ok. I don't know if this a bug or my denseness
Only got it going late last night, trying to break it already !!
Addit 1 Just checked the current for this, and it starts off at 3mA goes up to 80mA whilst it talks to the SD and then idles at about 40mA (46mA whilst looping in mbasic) so a 2AH lithium battery should last a while, even with a blade1 VDU.
Addit 2 What is the favoured thinking on the VDU bits. Shall I just bolt on a simplified Blade1 with its latch and memory, or just put a "demoboard" on with propcomm ?
If things are going Ramblade dirrections then what will the memory be used for ??
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Post Edited (Toby Seckshund) : 10/25/2009 8:06:04 PM GMT
Toby: 12 000 000 needs to be 12_000_000. In your use it is actually seeing 12 not 12000000.
Once you go much above 6MHz you will have to introduce a nop delay to the ram as the timing will be out of spec here. I will do the retiming later when my higher xtals arrive. IIRC 6MHz is about the timing limit. BTW 10nS parts will not solve this timing issue.
1. Forget my actual current tests. I expected that 1xram, prop, SD, latch & eeprom < 100mA max and yes IIRC the max I saw was 80mA running.
2. Forget the ram for Blade #1. I put the ram there to try for video buffer. Noone has tried it and I haven't had the time. So use any available board... Proto (w USB unless you have PropPlug which you must have I guess - I don't - I use a FT2232 board and extra transistors to give 2 equiv PropPlugs, but of course use the TriBlade section now as it is easier), Demo, Spin Studio, or any of the other boards on the market.
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I havent a clue where the 6.55MHz rock came from, but at 104+MHZ the overclocker bit. I wonder if the jiggled addr line order has had an effect ? I have now got a 12MHz running at pll8x so the pll bits are not the problem, and I do like the idea that 50/50 from the devide by 2 stage has to be a better ideal.
Wait states for the ram, This tread really does have nostalga !!! I seem to feel, somehow, a tad bit, more secure.
I had assumed that as the 5/6 MHZ were written without underscore separators that I could do the same I now wonder if there is a font issue so that I cannot see the underscores.
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Toby, the other issue with overclocking is that you require a quiet pcb - lots of decoupling and ground planes. Did you build pcb or are you just wiring it on a protoboard or veroboard or something (you may have said above, but I don't recall). If so, forget overclocking as this is not going to be quiet enough for reliable operation. Some pcbs will not do the higher speeds either because of their design.
BTW 6.5MHz & 14.31818 xtals are readily available, as are some other common frequencies.
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I'll make no claims that the PCB is of merchantable quality, but I do try to build as much of the past learnings into them. Single layer, wire links, no ground plane but the iron for the toner tranfer is mine. A version of the Demo Board has run at 14.3 X 8 with the same efforts. I was only trying to see how far it could be pushed and the back off a safe(ish) margin. My original Nascom1 would run at 4MHz even with its 2.5MHz Z80.
I wish I could do Thru hole, 4 layer stuff but my ironing just isn't good enough.
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Toby, that is a great achievement. How fine can you get the tracks/spaces ? I route most signals with 8/8mils (power I try 12 or 20mils).
For overclocking on the prop, ground planes and decoupling both sets of pins pwr/gnd (for DIP) is essential, plus a 10uF tantalum also. As I said, there are also timing issues with the ram that I haven't checked yet (for the higher overclocking). IIRC I checked to 100MHz and all was OK. Of course some chips will be better than others, but that's the risk we take with overclocking.
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Tesco value Photo paper, Glossy finish A4 170gsm. Its about £8 for 50 sheets, but I rarely use more than A5 so they can be sliced in half (100 attempts).
I tried loads of different paper types including some very expensive ones but the Tesco one seems best and cheap. It does leave some of the surface (clay?) behind after the bulk has soaked off, but a cloth, point and a bright light allows that to be picked out ok. Also have the PCB a fair bit bigger than the artwork or the edge bits will suffer. Very hot Iron required.
I would put a picture up but it doesn't want to focus.
The pitch is usually based around 100 mil chips so I tend to go as large as poss. 20 mil tracks with 10 mil guards for 60 mil pads. 12/15 mils is usually ok but I tend towards larger so that any undercut is not a problem.
I was reading Ale's CPLD thread earlier, about sunflower oil and UV. I feel a project forming.
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Post Edited (Toby Seckshund) : 10/26/2009 8:23:37 PM GMT
With much fanfare and excitement, the Southern Hemisphere Zicog/Tribade Conference (v3) was held earlier today. Apologies were noted from heater...
Cluso is getting very close to releasing the ramblade. One option available will be a presoldered version including a micro sd card with all the necessary software on the card. The single package version has got me thinking about this in a different way. Here we have a tiny CP/M computer all in one package that fits into a standard prop demo board.
But - it can fit into other boards too, as long as those boards copy the prop demo board standard. We discussed the software standards one could have. From the CP/M boards point of view, it can have 256 software I/O ports, eg OUT n,byte or IN n,byte where n is the port number. From the host boards point of view, each of these can be trapped in some spin code. From time to time, the CP/M board would ask for a list of changed I/O ports and those are sent over via a 2 wire interface.
But the possibilities for the host board are endless. It can have vga, keyboard, LCD display, audio and some analog I/O and relays and optocoupled inputs. It can also talk to three different types of wireless comms - RS232 modules (Hope/Yishi etc), raw RF modules with some filtering in spin, and even direct RF at a few megahertz with the appropriate antenna (?a loop antenna). It could talk to the 4dsystems serial camera module and capture pictures. It can use the nifty FSK object to send data via audio or a phone line or a handheld CB radio. Spin code in the host will pre-process the data to a format that CP/M likes, which is generally of the form of two bytes - one is a 'flag' byte to say a byte has arrived, and the other is the actual byte.
With radio and video capture, plus the multiple languages available in CP/M, it ought to be possible to start building intelligent networks, eg mobile robots that rove around taking pictures and sharing the information. We also discussed the ability to update software via wireless, even the protocols one could use to emulate a simple bittorrent upgrade system via wireless with multiple nodes.
Now the ramblade design has been fixed, I'm going to start thinking about the parameters for a host board. All very exciting!
Comments
I have a blade2 both rams, latch, eeprom, sd card (full size) but no serial stuff as it sat on top of one of the Z80 things (which is going nowwhere fast). So I thought I would pretend to be busy and build a stand alone Blade2 that would eventually have a blade1/Demoboard sat on top. I only asked as I was sure that I saw a picture that showed the latch linked out (but now I'm wondering if the latch was hiding undeneath the pcb)
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So to answer your question, yes, there was a photo of the pcb without the latch and I did test it.
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade, RetroBlade,·TwinBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
Binary included to save having to compile.
Please report any problems as I cannot test the binary because I am now using 6MHz(96MHz) on my TriBlade.
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
The circuit diagrams with the -OE modification and build description are here...
Page 23 contained posts of the Ram Test code. It only checks for the first 512KB. It is possible that it is configured for 6MHz xtal.
There is also a post here describing how to connect an SD card (it uses different pins to the microSD card, otherwise compatible)
Link to P23 http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=786418
The ZiCog thread on P24 has the FullDuplexSerial_rr004. The rest of the latest code is on the TriBlade thread P27 bottom (_rr126).
TriBlade thread P22 has·a photo of my TriBlade as built now (1x512KB ram) and a little below another post with a description of what is fitted.
TriBlade thread P21 contains a revised schematic & errata to do the -OE mod etc. Original schematics on P2.
This should be all that you require to get you circuit running, but if any problems just ask. Off to bed now (it's 2:35am)
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
Just modded the ram /OE, before reading any of the above, even though it is single 512Kb and tested the SD with your PropCMD version ( forgot about it having to be FAT not Fat32 ).
Getting there slowly. I think I peaked a bit too early, the late 70's !!
ADDIT:- Put in those SD files and the Binary into the prop and ... YIPPEE!!!!!!! I have a 64Kb CP/M, 2 FD + 2 HD showing.
Thanks Guys. Now I have the promise of working hardware ....
I don't know why the dual ram attempt didn't work as I slavishly followed the ccts, this time I just juggled the data and addr lines around, to the ram, to make the PCB simpler. Hey-Ho.
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Post Edited (Toby Seckshund) : 10/24/2009 7:35:41 PM GMT
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For me, the past is not over yet.
The headers state that it is a 8080 emulation and when I tried a prog off the B drive it said up-yours, Z80 required. Just me ?? Perhaps I am still in Heaters past ( which hasn't happened yet ).
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I'm cross posting again
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Did you have #define CPU_Z80 set when compiling zicog_cpm ? Instead of CPU_8080.
The are some progs there that require Z80. Mostly made for SIMH AltairZ80 and written in SPL.
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For me, the past is not over yet.
Hey, I aint picky. I was sooooo p..... o... that my cheapskate's ripoffof Cluso's hard work didn't work, I am one happy lil' bunny now it does. A few glasses of settled apple juice have been invoked (guess which bit of the uk I was from)
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Once you get into BST there is no going back.
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For me, the past is not over yet.
Yes next thing would be getting BST running. Then maybe a terminal program (if you haven't already got one) that can do Wordstar.
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www.smarthome.viviti.com/build
The last few times I compiled I left the 8080 option defined. So now you have to compile using bst. Also, you seem to be using an older version (not rr126) as you have floppy support enabled. We are past that so that is why it probably didnt find drive B in floppy format. You should get a CPM message saying 8HD meaning 8 hard disks.
I published my TriBlade circuit so others could freely build their own copy/version. However, I am not publishing the actual pcb design
Would it help if I published a minimal version of the TriBlade Blade #2 circuit ?? Would anyone want a bare pcb of this if I made them - say $5-8 ea + postage for up to 10 $4.50 (unregistered airmail). I will see if I can find a way for cheaper postage for a single pcb. Bare pcb, no parts, except maybe microSD socket for a charge.
The RamBlade is a faster/smaller smt version (see RamBlade thread) and contains a few tricks that I am not revealling just yet.
Any questions, please ask.
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
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For me, the past is not over yet.
Yes I've just taken the entire package of files Cluso gave me and stripped it back to just the necessary ones, put back in the right #defines and made sure the right files are on the sd card. Also edited the BST.BAT file, and copied the necessary .dll files over for a minimal teraterm.
It took about half an hour and you need to know the ins and outs of the code. There is quite a lot of code accumulating that is legacy code that adds the complexity of multiple nested #ifdefs. These ifdefs are starting to become a language in their own right, but they are not really structured, ie no indents and it is hard to match up the endifs with their corresponding ifdef. Also there are many #else commands that made sense when there were just two board options, but with the ramblade there will be three (and with a board I'm working on there will be four) so they all need to change from #else to #elseifdef. I don't know if there maybe is a way of adding to the #ifdef syntax in some way. I was wondering about the option of #ifdef mydefine and then #endif mydefine. That would be backwards compatible.
Bottom line is it probably is time to rerelease a package with everything in one file. All the spin code. All the working hard drive images (but not necessarily the ones we needed to get here, eg the floppy ones). Plus BST and ? a terminal program. I put one together and minus the hard drive images it is only 400k.
Re the comments on the schematic and board for just blade 2, that will almost certainly become unnecessary once the tiny ramblade comes out.
Hmm, Cluso, I just had a thought. Since many of the parts in the ramblade are a bit unusual and since shipping is so high for one chip and since you are throwing together a very attractive package (soldering up the tiny chips), I wonder about adding another $10 and including a micro sd card with all the software on it? The hard drive images, plus a folder you copy back onto the PC with all the spin code and BST etc? Ok, it will become obsolete over time, but at least that will be a package that will work out of the box just by plugging it into a demo board, and then users can see it working quickly and then once it works they can go online and get the latest version?
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www.smarthome.viviti.com/build
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
No, not that far down. Just Bath, Somerset. My parents now live in West Dorset, almost Devon. Only been to Tiverton once, it's miles from anywhere !!
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Style and grace : Nil point
Better get back to RamBlade & TriBlade...
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
Back to the silicon. Compiled and loaded a more recent vesion of Zicog CP/M and now shows Z80 and 8 HD's. Bumped it up to 6MHz and it ran ok, tried a 6.55MHz xtal I had, recompiled but crashed on the ram clearing/loading bit, I think. Tried 12MHz pll8x and ok, pushed it to 14.3MHz and it just had an fit. This is with SM caps and tants right under the prop.
When I put the higher figure freq into the xinfreq line if I do 12 000 000 it throws a maths error, but 12000000 is ok. I don't know if this a bug or my denseness
Only got it going late last night, trying to break it already !!
Addit 1 Just checked the current for this, and it starts off at 3mA goes up to 80mA whilst it talks to the SD and then idles at about 40mA (46mA whilst looping in mbasic) so a 2AH lithium battery should last a while, even with a blade1 VDU.
Addit 2 What is the favoured thinking on the VDU bits. Shall I just bolt on a simplified Blade1 with its latch and memory, or just put a "demoboard" on with propcomm ?
If things are going Ramblade dirrections then what will the memory be used for ??
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Style and grace : Nil point
Post Edited (Toby Seckshund) : 10/25/2009 8:06:04 PM GMT
Once you go much above 6MHz you will have to introduce a nop delay to the ram as the timing will be out of spec here. I will do the retiming later when my higher xtals arrive. IIRC 6MHz is about the timing limit. BTW 10nS parts will not solve this timing issue.
1. Forget my actual current tests. I expected that 1xram, prop, SD, latch & eeprom < 100mA max and yes IIRC the max I saw was 80mA running.
2. Forget the ram for Blade #1. I put the ram there to try for video buffer. Noone has tried it and I haven't had the time. So use any available board... Proto (w USB unless you have PropPlug which you must have I guess - I don't - I use a FT2232 board and extra transistors to give 2 equiv PropPlugs, but of course use the TriBlade section now as it is easier), Demo, Spin Studio, or any of the other boards on the market.
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
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For me, the past is not over yet.
Wait states for the ram, This tread really does have nostalga !!! I seem to feel, somehow, a tad bit, more secure.
I had assumed that as the 5/6 MHZ were written without underscore separators that I could do the same I now wonder if there is a font issue so that I cannot see the underscores.
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Style and grace : Nil point
BTW 6.5MHz & 14.31818 xtals are readily available, as are some other common frequencies.
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
I wish I could do Thru hole, 4 layer stuff but my ironing just isn't good enough.
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Style and grace : Nil point
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For me, the past is not over yet.
For overclocking on the prop, ground planes and decoupling both sets of pins pwr/gnd (for DIP) is essential, plus a 10uF tantalum also. As I said, there are also timing issues with the ram that I haven't checked yet (for the higher overclocking). IIRC I checked to 100MHz and all was OK. Of course some chips will be better than others, but that's the risk we take with overclocking.
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Links to other interesting threads:
· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)
· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBladeProp is: www.bluemagic.biz/cluso.htm
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For me, the past is not over yet.
I tried loads of different paper types including some very expensive ones but the Tesco one seems best and cheap. It does leave some of the surface (clay?) behind after the bulk has soaked off, but a cloth, point and a bright light allows that to be picked out ok. Also have the PCB a fair bit bigger than the artwork or the edge bits will suffer. Very hot Iron required.
I would put a picture up but it doesn't want to focus.
The pitch is usually based around 100 mil chips so I tend to go as large as poss. 20 mil tracks with 10 mil guards for 60 mil pads. 12/15 mils is usually ok but I tend towards larger so that any undercut is not a problem.
I was reading Ale's CPLD thread earlier, about sunflower oil and UV. I feel a project forming.
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Style and grace : Nil point
Post Edited (Toby Seckshund) : 10/26/2009 8:23:37 PM GMT
Cluso is getting very close to releasing the ramblade. One option available will be a presoldered version including a micro sd card with all the necessary software on the card. The single package version has got me thinking about this in a different way. Here we have a tiny CP/M computer all in one package that fits into a standard prop demo board.
But - it can fit into other boards too, as long as those boards copy the prop demo board standard. We discussed the software standards one could have. From the CP/M boards point of view, it can have 256 software I/O ports, eg OUT n,byte or IN n,byte where n is the port number. From the host boards point of view, each of these can be trapped in some spin code. From time to time, the CP/M board would ask for a list of changed I/O ports and those are sent over via a 2 wire interface.
But the possibilities for the host board are endless. It can have vga, keyboard, LCD display, audio and some analog I/O and relays and optocoupled inputs. It can also talk to three different types of wireless comms - RS232 modules (Hope/Yishi etc), raw RF modules with some filtering in spin, and even direct RF at a few megahertz with the appropriate antenna (?a loop antenna). It could talk to the 4dsystems serial camera module and capture pictures. It can use the nifty FSK object to send data via audio or a phone line or a handheld CB radio. Spin code in the host will pre-process the data to a format that CP/M likes, which is generally of the form of two bytes - one is a 'flag' byte to say a byte has arrived, and the other is the actual byte.
With radio and video capture, plus the multiple languages available in CP/M, it ought to be possible to start building intelligent networks, eg mobile robots that rove around taking pictures and sharing the information. We also discussed the ability to update software via wireless, even the protocols one could use to emulate a simple bittorrent upgrade system via wireless with multiple nodes.
Now the ramblade design has been fixed, I'm going to start thinking about the parameters for a host board. All very exciting!
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www.smarthome.viviti.com/build