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problem with TinyBasic on a new hydra — Parallax Forums

problem with TinyBasic on a new hydra

MelissaMelissa Posts: 11
edited 2007-09-11 02:32 in Propeller 1
Just got my Hydra in the mail today, and other than the fact that I still can't get the NES controller to fit, I've run into a problem.

The TinyBASIC demo appears to reset the Hydra every few seconds. I tried both versions on the CD. Do any of you have an idea of what could cause this, or where there's a newer version... ... or how to convince a game controller it really wants to be plugged in [noparse]:)[/noparse]

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Comments

  • epmoyerepmoyer Posts: 314
    edited 2007-09-05 04:00
    The NES controllers are really snug by design. Somebody said that a bit of Vasaline around the outside of the connector (the end attached to the controller cable) will help to mate it. WD40 would probably work too. After that a few cycles will fatigue the plastic a little and it will be easier to work with. I'd recommend supporting the back side of the Hydra while the insertion force is still high; If you try to do it with the Hydra just sitting on its 4 corner standoffs then the board will flex a lot and you'll risk damaging it.
  • MelissaMelissa Posts: 11
    edited 2007-09-05 04:08
    Hrm, I don't think I have anything vaguely Vasaline-like around here... man, too bad my mother threw out my *real* NES controllers years ago because they didn't match the decor or something. Thank you for the tip though [noparse]:)[/noparse]

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  • epmoyerepmoyer Posts: 314
    edited 2007-09-05 04:08
    Which Tiny Basic are you running? I tried RGW_JTC_TinyBasic_010, ts_hydrabasic_002, and RGW_TinyBasic_010 with the gamepad unplugged (just in case that was related) and none of them reset for me.
  • epmoyerepmoyer Posts: 314
    edited 2007-09-05 04:13
    There is a posting about connector insertion here: http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=659134
    Spork Frog said...
    I had the same problem at first. The controller port is extremely stiff I found for the first few times I inserted/uninserted the controller. Just put something directly under the controller port of the Hydra (like a block of wood so you won't snap it) then push it down as hard as you can until it's in. When fully inserted, the lip on the plug should rest on top of the port.
  • MelissaMelissa Posts: 11
    edited 2007-09-05 04:13
    RGW_TinyBasic_010, there seems to be two versions on the disk and I tried both, got the same effect each time. It also appears to happen regardless of what peripherals are/aren't plugged in.

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  • epmoyerepmoyer Posts: 314
    edited 2007-09-05 04:15
    And other demos are generally working well for you (i.e. not resetting)?
  • MelissaMelissa Posts: 11
    edited 2007-09-05 04:17
    Yes, the other demos work fine, at least the ones I've tried so far [noparse]:)[/noparse]

    Re: the controller, I think I got it halfway in...

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  • epmoyerepmoyer Posts: 314
    edited 2007-09-05 04:22
    If you load the Tiny Basic demo into EEPROM (F11 from inside the Propeller Tool), and then unplug your USB port, then power down your Hydra and power it back up (Basic will start, because it is resident in EEPROM now) does the Hydra still reset periodically, or does it only reset when connected to the PC?
  • MelissaMelissa Posts: 11
    edited 2007-09-05 04:29
    I haven't yet tested it connected to the PC, there's nowhere to keep the television it's hooked up to. I've been downloading it to eeprom (both the onboard and the cartridge).

    Exactly what happens is, it boots up, and you can just sit there and after a few seconds the screen will go black and it will reset, or you have exactly enough time to type something like 'print "a"' and see your answer before the screen goes black and it resets... So, the program itself is working, but for some reason it reliably resets every few seconds.

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  • epmoyerepmoyer Posts: 314
    edited 2007-09-05 04:41
    Hmmm. I cannot reproduce the reset you are seeing (tried burning EEPROM and decoupling from my PC and I don't get a reset). If you like, you can try loading the attached EEPROM file just to make sure that your source files are not somehow corrupt or out of date.

    The attached file is just my rebuild of Tiny Basic. I tested loading from the EEPROM file and confirmed that I don't get a reset.
    eeprom
    eeprom
    RGW_TinyBasic_010.eeprom
    32K
  • MelissaMelissa Posts: 11
    edited 2007-09-05 04:58
    Would you believe it *still* does it?! Every three seconds...

    There's probably nothing else to do at this point... must be something wrong in the hardware somewhere... I hope I don't run into it with any other programs.

    Thank you very very much for your help... but I'm probably out of options if a known good copy produces the same bug [noparse]:([/noparse]

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  • epmoyerepmoyer Posts: 314
    edited 2007-09-05 05:04
    Agreed. You should drop Andre' a note just in case he's run into another customer with the same problem, and then just forge on and see if it happens with any other programs. Andre has a posting in that connector insertion article I linked to above. Just go there, click the "PM" under his avatar and leave him a message; he's very good about responding.

    Best of luck!
  • MelissaMelissa Posts: 11
    edited 2007-09-05 05:07
    Okay. Thank you very much and goodnight. [noparse]:)[/noparse]

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  • MinimumWageMinimumWage Posts: 72
    edited 2007-09-05 05:36
    From reading one of your earlier posts, I think I got the impression you were downloading to your Hydra in one place and then moving it to a different location to connect it to the TV - is there any chance you are using a different power supply or plugging into a flaky power strip when you change locations? I know you said you tested other demos and they worked, but I wasn't sure if that was at the PC or at the TV...
  • MelissaMelissa Posts: 11
    edited 2007-09-05 18:00
    Yes, I have to move it to connect to the TV, but I move the power supply with it and the power strip has powered multiple computers and never given me a problem. Everything I've done has been at the TV away from the computer, there is really no way I could fit them both on my little desk... [noparse]:)[/noparse]

    Today I'll try go load all the demos + some stuff off this forums and see if its only TinyBasic that has this problem (I sure hope so).

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  • Mike GreenMike Green Posts: 23,101
    edited 2007-09-05 18:17
    You might try downloading FemtoBasic from the Propeller Object Exchange. There's a Hydra binary included. This is a very slow Basic compared to the one included on the Hydra CD, but it's written mostly in Spin and should be a bit more robust. In any event, if it behaves the same, then you probably have a hardware problem.
  • JT CookJT Cook Posts: 487
    edited 2007-09-05 20:45
    I wonder if might be a device problem? I would try unplugging the keyboard, mouse, cart, and any controllers you have plugged it. Also try unplugging the audio too. Then load up basic and it still resets then you have it atleast rulled out it is probably something on the Hydra board itself.
  • MelissaMelissa Posts: 11
    edited 2007-09-05 21:21
    JT, unfortunately it happens even when only the video cable is plugged in... now I can sit down and start loading other things like this FemtoBasic on it though, let's see where that gets me

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
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  • PocketLintPocketLint Posts: 31
    edited 2007-09-09 16:28
    Hi, RGW here...
    I've never seen TinyBasic do what you are describing. But, let see if we can figure out what's up.
    You may have already covered the following or tried my suggestions already but if you would try again..

    What version of the IDE are you using?
    The first thing that comes to mind is to rule out any external issues. If you have not already, please try the following..
    1) Remove any expansion card you may have installed.
    2) Remove any keyboard and/or mouse you may have attached
    3) Load TinyBasic to EEPROM (Using F11 from the IDE)
    4) Power down the Hydra unit
    5) Remove the USB/Programming cable
    6) Power up the unit
    Removing the USB cable is important because stray comm activity could cause the Prop Chip to reboot.
    If this fixes the issue, start plugging things back in one at a time until the issue come up again.

    Try another power supply. Long shot I know, but a faulty ps could cause the unit to reboot as more cogs are powered up.

    Other than that, at the moment at least, nothing much else comes to mind.
    Let me know the results and I'll see what else I can think of that may be the issue.

    Thanks,
    Bob
  • JT CookJT Cook Posts: 487
    edited 2007-09-09 22:40
    Another thing I would recommend trying is to select identify hardware under the run menu in the Propeller tool. I don't think there is anything other than verison 1, but if it is a newer revision that might explain the problem.
  • AndreLAndreL Posts: 1,004
    edited 2007-09-11 00:09
    I have seen this as well, its a software bug in the basic somewhere, its just a demo basic and no where near as complete as the femtobasic, so I would suggest if you want to do more robust programs in basic, use the femto basic. The hydra basic is a demo of a high speed ASM based basic and the source is there for you to add and tweak, but it still has some problems since its not a completed program for commercial use, just a demo to show that its possible to write an ASM based basic that fits on the propeller.

    Andre'
  • PocketLintPocketLint Posts: 31
    edited 2007-09-11 02:32
    Andre` is right about that.


    TinyBasic was put together under a tight time schedule to get it released on the demo CD when the Hydra launched. It was also the last demo I thought of so it had the least time alloted.


    After the CD went Gold, I had other Hydra projects in the works that I have been spending my spare time on and never went back to TinyBasic·to give the·detailed tweeking it really needs.




    The project I'm working on right now was one I had hoped to have for the demo CD but ran out of resources on the basic Hydra. Then along came the 512k ram card. I tried to cut that into the existing code and it did not work out as well as I had hoped. So, I started over and re-wrote the project, using the 512k card from the very start and I'm very happy with the results.·



    Bob

    ·
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