Good PCB manufacturers?
simonl
Posts: 866
Would anyone be able to recommend a good PCB manufacturer?
I like to know what experience you've had, as I'm about to do my first PCB and don't know which of the many low quantity PCB manufacturers are any good.
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Cheers,
Simon
www.norfolkhelicopterclub.co.uk
You'll always have as many take-offs as landings, the trick is to be sure you can take-off again ;-)
BTW: I type as I'm thinking, so please don't take any offense at my writing style
I like to know what experience you've had, as I'm about to do my first PCB and don't know which of the many low quantity PCB manufacturers are any good.
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Cheers,
Simon
www.norfolkhelicopterclub.co.uk
You'll always have as many take-offs as landings, the trick is to be sure you can take-off again ;-)
BTW: I type as I'm thinking, so please don't take any offense at my writing style
Comments
Bean.
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“The United States is a nation of laws -· poorly written and randomly enforced.” - Frank Zappa
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www.hittconsulting.com
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Tom
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Tom Sisk
http://www.siskconsult.com
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They accept Eagle BRD Files or just Gerberfiles and an excellon drill file.
best regards
Franz
-Phil
I have used http://www.speedypcb.com/ with pretty good sucess (20 boards 80x48mm with 3oz. copper, black soldermasks and gold immersion plated 2 layer for 188$) - They are just funky with their order process. Ultimately their boards are made in China - even though this company is located in canada. I found service to be a little slow, but very nice and helped me with my order and tracking. They accept gerber only - but will give you instructions on how to create the gerber and drill files via eagle if needed.
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Cheers,
Simon
www.norfolkhelicopterclub.co.uk
You'll always have as many take-offs as landings, the trick is to be sure you can take-off again ;-)
BTW: I type as I'm thinking, so please don't take any offense at my writing style
ExpressPCB states "Use our MiniBoard service and pay only $51 for three boards (plus $8 shipping)."
Thats about $20 per board.
Am I being unreasonable or is that allot of money for three boards.
I am currently designing small a PCB. Max size should land at around 3 inches by 3 inches.
If I buy a lot of 20, am I dreaming that I can get the boards down to a cost of about $8 each?
I recently did a quick costing of my project and was not prepared for the percentage of total cost the PCB was incurring.
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- - - PLJack - - -
Perfection in design is not achieved when there is nothing left to add.
It is achieved when there is nothing left to take away.
Sid
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Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, and today is a gift.
That is why they call it the present.
Don't have VGA?
Newzed@aol.com
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-Phil
As with most manufactured goods, the prices will seem to vary quite a bit.
When you say $20 per board is expensive, compared to what? My last Expresspcb boards were 6.75" x 4", double-sided, done in two days, lead-free, silk-screened and solder-masked at $38 each including set-up charge, and shipping. They saved me $35 per board in assembly time over the previous "cheaper" board.
When you're calculating price per board, don't forget to put a value on fast service, good silkscreening, holes drilled, high quality materials and even consider the time you spend to get the board docs ready.
You can certainly get hobby-quality boards at lower cost but you sometimes give up board thickness, proper via conductors, solder mask, silk-screened text. You can even do them yourself with materials from Pulsar and similar folks.
Luckily, almost all the online board shops do instant quotes, so you can try a couple to see how the prices vary.
Mostly, you get what you pay for.
Cheers,
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Tom Sisk
http://www.siskconsult.com
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The board I need is not that complicated.
I could make them myself but I really want the quality of a manufactured product.
I'm fine with a $20 one off board. But in quanities of 20 it gets pretty expensive.
Phil's suggestion brings it down to under $8.00. Thats not bad at all.
I'll just have to keep at it and see what I come up with.
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- - - PLJack - - -
Perfection in design is not achieved when there is nothing left to add.
It is achieved when there is nothing left to take away.
I just priced at expresspcb a 3"x3" board WITHOUT soldermask or marking. 20 pcs = 204.30.
So that's a little over $10 per board.
If you got 60 boards they would be $8.01 each.
Bean.
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Never argue with an idiot.· They'll drag you down to their level then beat you with experience.
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www.hittconsulting.com
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·If you wanted 75 of them suckers and willing to wait 2 weeks, you could get them all for under 167$ - That's 2.22$ a board. :-)
I am going to make an order with them for sure for my next run.
Post Edited (OakGraphics) : 7/10/2007 1:28:11 AM GMT
····1. How good is the quality?
····2..Is their delivery what they claim?
····3. How much does shipping from China add to:
········a) the cost?
········b) the time?
Thanks,
Phil
Update: I came up with a fourth question:
····4. What is the import duty on printed circuit boards manufactured offshore?"
The answer: There doesn't appear to be any. Information about import classifications and duty for electronic items can be found here: hotdocs.usitc.gov/docs/tata/hts/bychapter/0702c85.pdf. I used harmonized code prefix 8534.00.00 to come to my conclusion, but one should always check with U.S Customs or a qualified broker for the final say on the matter. It's also possible to contest an assessment of tarriffs if the supplier ships under the wrong harmonized code.
Post Edited (Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)) : 7/10/2007 4:43:04 PM GMT
This was a run of 5 boards. $91.00 each. The boards were stepped 42 up and scored.
Material Type: FR4 Material Thickness: 0.062" Number of Layers: 2
First Dimension: 18.2" Second Dimension: 8.39" Finish Plating: LFSOLDER
Copper Outers: 1oz Copper Inners: 0.5 oz Smallest Hole Size: 0.024"
Top SMD Pads: 0 Bottom SMD Pads: 0 SMD Pitch: 0"
Solder Mask Sides: Both Solder Mask Type: LPI Solder Mask Color Green
Silkscreen Sides: Top Silkscreen Color White CNC Route Points: 4
Trace width/Space: 0.01" Tab Route No Scoring Yes
Gold Fingers: None Plated Slots No Plated Edges No
Counter Sinks: No Counter Bores No Dielectric No
Impedance: No
They still have the $500 dollar free to first time customers.
I use Eagle to make the board layout and Viewmate to step up the final board layout from http://www.pentalogix.com/
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Think Inside the box first and if that doesn't work..
Re-arrange what's inside the box then...
Think outside the BOX!
I would be honest with them.
Tell them you are a hobbiest and there is a good chance you may never order from them again.
If the say it's okay, I wouldn't feel bad at all if I took advantage of their offer.
They may be counting on you tell other people how great they are to give you boards for free.
Bean.
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Never argue with an idiot.· They'll drag you down to their level then beat you with experience.
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www.hittconsulting.com
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-Phil
I just did a quote with PCBCart. Even with a one time setup charge it was under $3.00 a board. (Qty of 20)
How can this be?
I see Phil has discovered them as well.
Has anyone used this company before?
They mentioned UPS and Fedex on the site, I wonder if the shipping charge would make it not worth the trouble.
Edit: I really wish Parallax would go into this business. [noparse]:)[/noparse]
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- - - PLJack - - -
Perfection in design is not achieved when there is nothing left to add.
It is achieved when there is nothing left to take away.
When I do a board for scoring, I usually lay it out in array form myself. They accept the score lines as a gerber file. Just lay it out on some additional layer with allowance for the score width, and tell them in a readme what it is. Scoring usually implies a simple rectangular outline. On the other hand, a tab routed design implies that the board has a funny shape or a notches etc, and I let them lay out the panel. After a while you learn the ropes about how to count the router points and figure the total board size. If in a revision I need to move a few traces or through-hole parts, they can redo the array so that the surface mount pads are all the same so that I don't have to buy a new stencil.
Speaking of stencils, they will also make a stencil for your board, several different styles. I did try that once and it was very nice stainless steel, but it was around $150. They make it from your top and bottom pads Gerbers. I've never tried the much cheaper mylar stencils that are available through Sparkfun. My assembler likes to make their own stencil to fit their machines, so Advanced Circuits emails me the final panelized Gerber files and I email those to the assembler.
Advanced circuits is also getting into the prototype assembly business, and they have some practically free first time offers. I haven't tried them on that yet. You have to provide them with the pick and place data. They will even buiild the BOM for you if it can be done from Digikey or Mouser.
Other services from 4PCB:
I always run designs through their free design rule check
They have a cheap bare bones service too.
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Tracy Allen
www.emesystems.com
Post Edited (Tracy Allen) : 7/14/2007 5:12:33 PM GMT
1) absolut perfect !!!! see:· http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?p=659398
2) Yes
3 a) when i order 25pcs·half Euro boards shipping adds USD 28,-
···b) 1 week + 2/3 days for DHL shipping
4) no tax etc.... !!!!!!
br
Franz·
They saved me a LOT of money.
Franz
On a side note, Advanced Circuits finally released their brand new PCB software.
Only had a few minutes with it, but it looks good.
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- - - PLJack - - -
Perfection in design is not achieved when there is nothing left to add.
It is achieved when there is nothing left to take away.