Simple Lan communicates at 10MBits/sec. My US Robotics router is ok with it but I've noticed that the light is Yellow instead of the green given to all other devices on the network. I'm guessing that it's because of the bit rate, I have not looked further since it works.
One more quick thing, in another note in the docs it mentions that the Find button uses Port 22002 via UDP so that path must be enabled by a router. I'd think the hub passes everything but the router is a bit more selective.
Does anyone know what NIC chip the SimpleLan uses? If it uses the RTL8019AS NIC chip then you will run into problems with certain chipsets that are used in certain routers / switches. The issue is that the RTL8019AS is a very very old chip and has an issue with negotiating the correct ethernet channel speed and configuration when it is connected to unforgiving network equipment (that is, cheap home switches / routers). The RTL8019 works 99.9% of the time, but there is a chance that it wont correctly negotiate with 10/100 auto negotiation switches.
That said, hubs are much more forgiving. They aren't smart, that is they don't route packets via MAC addresses. They just forward the packets as is to all channels. They also have a much easier auto negotiation process, which generally means you won't run into too many problems. In any case, products based on the RTL8019AS NIC chip generally function best on a 10baseT hub or a switch port configured for 10baseT only.
This RTL8019 compatibility problem is not extremely new. The problem is recognized by the manufacturer, Realtek. Other issues with this chip is that it won't correctly negotiate if you do not give it time to establish the ethernet link channel. That is, if you start trying to send packets before it is ready. I believe that other embedded modules (namely the Siteplayer) ran into the packet sending issue a few years ago. It was fixed by adding a DHCP delay of 2 seconds. This gives the NIC and hub/switch time to negotiate and establish link.
So moral of the story is to use a cheap 10baseT hub or a supported switch in between an incompatible network device and a RTL8019 based device.
In the mean time, you might try sending your water alert email directly to a Yahoo mail server. That might work or it might not. Your success will depend upon how picky Yahoo is about the credentials of those who send email to their users! said...
Do you know of a Yahoo mail service that isn't SSL? SimpleLAN doesn't work with SSL according to the docs.
At this point I'd settle for a free mail service that's compatible - my gut hunch says the SimpleLAN flash firmware would have to be rewritten (upgrade) to work with Clearwire and other similar mail servers.
I just checked on Yahoo's help page. They offer POP accounts IF you subscribe to Yahoo! Mail Plus for a nominal annual fee.
My SL works with my local internet provider AT&T Yahoo, but the hardware and protocols probably differ from provider to provider. I guess there's no guarantee that Yahoo POP accounts would work either. But you can try them for free for 30 days.
Thanks for the schematic, N0QBH! I'm using a Netgear hub and a Linksys switch. I think I see the switch polling, by its lights, and the led's on the SLan were blinking rapidly about 1/sec along with. The hub lights as well as the SLan's lights are steady when it's hooked up. The hub has an "uplink" port that goes to the switch in "working" configuration. I'm satisfied that I sorta understand what's going on. Anyway I have the thing working. Reversing the order might be OK but it's awkward right now.
On another track, has anyone hooked a true RS-232 to the tx/rx lines on the SLan? I'm thinking this is not a good idea. The mcontroller I'm using, Isopod, has a true rs232 port as its second i/o serial. In your opinion, should I put a MAX 232 in between? kinda hate to drive the chip count up...
Thanks to all of you.
has anyone hooked a true RS-232 to the tx/rx lines on the SLan? I'm thinking this is not a good idea said...
SLan serial is TTL (0-3.3v) only. If you need to interface with true RS232 levels (+/- 12 volts) you would have to use something like the MAX232. The SLan inputs are diode protected and work fine with 0-5v TTL, but I wouldn't go beyond those levels.
On another note, I'm looking into the Yahoo mail plus account. I plan to sign up and test the SLan email with it. When I get that done I'll report the results here.
One thing, the homework board is less than 5v, like 4.8 and the simplelan uploads but will not work properly as a mail server or a web server on less than 5v. try a 7805 and power it up on its own supply, it works fine on the propeller eval board 5v. not sure about the boe. but my homework board does not cut it even with a fresh 9v. I wrote some vb code to interface to it via udp in the propeller section.
I don’t believe voltage is the issue on the Homework Board you have…I believe current to be the more likely culprit. If you have a Rev B H/W Board the regulator will not be able to provide sufficient current to the device. This is probably causing a voltage drop but the underlying problem is current. Those with a Rev C H/W Board should be able to use it.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔ Chris Savage Parallax Tech Support
Further fun and games... I was unable to successfully reprogram the SLan over the net switch and the hub. I then tried just the hub, that is with a computer and SLan plugged into the same hub. Could not get either one to <find> using the SLan software. Had to use a crossover cable and a computer with a fixed IP in order to get the job done, even though the SLan software indicated success! I suspect there is no 2-way or echo on file upload, or even a packet check. You have to have a solid hook-up, no switches or packet-storagfe devices in the way. Too bad, not as useful as it might be. Maybe someone at avcom could comment?? Modified the Ipod per their instructions to 5v rs232, will try it.
I checked in to the Yahoo Plus mail service and the free 30 day trial ended the 15th of January.
I'm wondering if anyone has been able to send email with SimpleLAN using Yahoo plus mail SMTP server?
Figured it can't hurt to ask around before I plunk $20 for a mail service I don't need otherwise.
You should start looking at a webhost. A typical web host costs less than 5 bucks a month, and will allow you to do much more useful things such as hosting files, etc.
--
1and1 has a email only package for 99 cents a month ( http://order.1and1.com/xml/order/Mail ). They also have plenty of other packages that may suit your needs (I have only used their dedicated servers so I don't know if they require ssl on other services or not).
Westhost has some very good deals. I use their highest business package so I get vps ssh access. They allow smtp access (I have used it with the sx52 ethernet stack with no problems, in other words, it doesn't require ssl auth). Their cheapest package is about 4 bucks a month ( http://www.westhost.com/package-compare.html ). I would recommend Westhost, but beware, their servers freeze for a few seconds every few days. This usually won't cause a problem as most tcp clients will retry a connection (I am not sure if the simplelan does this or not).
Dreamhost is recommended by some people, but it is slightly more expensive then the other hosts I listed ( http://dreamhost.com/hosting.html ). Note that they will remove your account if you use too much cpu / memory, so don't try to host large sites, etc.
Gmail has smtp and pop3 support, but both require ssl.
--
In any case, I personally recommend Westhost. Their tech support is great (email, chat, phone). They will help you with any problems, heck I bet they will work with you to get email to work with the simplelan. I will never use a different host just because Westhost support is so great.
Harrison
Post Edited (Harrison.) : 1/25/2007 3:58:09 AM GMT
Has anyone worked out the SimpleLan email sending secret?
I've pretty much decided the Simplelan is a dead-end piece of &(^@ product. Same with SitePlayer.
SitePlayer has it's problems connecting with certain routers. I've seen them all, but it will reliably serve a web page. Sadly it has no email capability (and no tech support that will give you any satisfaction)
As for SimpleLan
I've tried 3 routers:
1. an old wired SMC barracade result:
Email packets won't even begin go out to internet, web page is fine.
2. A Linksys WRT54G results: - (very weird)
I can see the web page from a computer connected by wire but can't see the web page from a wirelessly connected laptop (tried two) or from the outside world. If I connect the same laptop with a wire, I can see the web page fine. It also will not pass the email packets to internet (used sniffer)
3. A brand new netgear (cheap forgot the model took it back) results:
Web page works fine wired, wireless, and from outside. Initial email packets go to internet but do succeed.
Even more strange. My friend has two older netgear routers and with same webpage and email setting and same basic code everything is fine. This is why I tried the newer netgear router, hoping it would work as well.
You can forget about tech support from both SimpleLan supplier and SitePLayer. I'm convined they are just selling boxes of old stock they inherited somehow and that you will never get any satisfaction on these products.
I hope someone can prove me wrong by giving me the secret else I'm going to a Rabbit (at about 10x the price). At least all the source code is available.
Yes I've seen the DIGI ME product. It's quite a bit like the Lantronix Xport.·The Lantronix device·has a web·web page interface for configuration of the Serial to Ethernet functions that they built to provide.·It appears that you can write a different web page for it, but it really wasn't designed to provide the functionality of the SimpleLan which·is to accept·and display a large numbe of user defined variables through the web page·and pass them to an attached micro.·I assume the same for the DIGI product.
Has anyone had any luck using the SimpleLAN email feature with Yahoo Plus email? I've been waiting for another one of Yahoo's 30 days free offers, but if you look at the fine print, they've all expired 1/15/07. Without a functional email sender, SimpleLAN doesn't have much to offer over the competition IMHO. Their tech support responds, but doesn't have any solutions. I've got a few other commercial electronic devices (web cams etc) that seem to work with any kind of email system, so it is doable.
I've pretty much decided to pack it in with the SimpleLan. See previous post. I went out and bought the exact same model Netgear WGT624 router that my friend has that works with the SimpleLan email. His is older V2 model. The new one I bought is V3. We went through all the settings and they are set up identical. His works, mine doesn't. He connects to the same ISP as I do although on the other side of town. I doubt that makes any difference.
So something in the router world has changed that the SimpleLan does not like.
Someone mentioned that they got it to do email. I'd like to know what router they are using and the ISP they connect to.
On another note. Has anyone been able to send email with the PINK module. I went on the Netburner site (who makes PINK) and saw no mention that it is able to do email with authentication.
Ok, so I went out and bought yet anothre router, the fifth I've tried. This time a D-Link D-524.
It works !!
The SimpleLan emails go out·now although it takes about 45 seconds for it to negotiate and finally send them, but that's no big problem. Same BS2 code, same email settings in SimpleLan and the same settings on this router as the rest of them - albiet a different setup screen. · I had the router crash about·4 times in the first couple of hours of playing with it so I ugraded the firmware from the D-Link site. It's been fine since although I have avoided sending any emails with the SimpleLan·just so I can be sure it it crashes again after emails that it might be SimpleLan related. ·I'll post my findings later.
Finally I hope I'm back on the road to a home monitoring system.
Sage
Email function successful using Yahoo Plus account.
Finally got a free 30 day trial Yahoo Plus email account today.
Put my SimpleLAN test jig back together and viola! It works.
The web server part seems to work well too.
Congrats to those who've gotten the sLAN to send email.· I've got mine setup and it is running an interactive webpage beautifully.· I can send and recieve data through it from me LAN and also across the internet.
I haven't had any luck with the SMTP feature though.· I wasn't sure if it was my ISP or what.· I tried using simple TELNET to send an email through my ISP mail server and failed.· I get a 550 error after sending my text, saying I didn't send the right headers or something.··I have outlook and it uses the SMTP protocol fine.·
So to figure out what the problem is, can someone please list the SMTP commands (or correct what I have) that will allow me to TELNET an email from my ISP server.· If that works I will know the sLAN is not working.
by the way - I can't get into my SMTP server without indicating port 25, otherwise it just sits there and times out.· Maybe this is the issue with sLAN?
telnet smtp.patmedia.net 25
HELO my email address
MAIL·from: my email address
RCPT·to: another one of my email addresses
DATA
blah blah blah blah
.
everything is cool up until finishing the message, then it says:
550 5.6.0 Required headers not found (see RFC2822 section 3.6)
and times out
thanks if you read this far.· I also have a linksys BEFSX41
Now I've got a new problem with the SimpleLAN. I've set up my router in the same manner as all my other mini web severs ( SitePlayer, web cameras etc) and I am unable to connect to the SimpleLAN from outside my local network??? Anyone else have this problem? I'm using a D-Link 604 router.
To get my router working properly, I had to setup DMZ forwarding to the MAC address of my sLAN. For some reason, even though the router was giving an IP to the sLAN, it wasn't able to foward packets with an IP address and required the MAC address.
My D-Link DI-604 DMZ set up has no provision for including the MAC address, only the local IP address.
I'm beginning to agree with some others that sLAN is not ready for prime time.
do you have nPNP port fowarding? You can use that to foward the HTTP packets to your simplelan. I really don't know what is going on with yours because I haven't had problems with getting the sLan on the internet. I've used nPNP fowarding, DMZ hosting, and one port range fowarding to send packets to the sLAN from the external internet. Are you not even seeing it on your LAN? There are some serial commands you can use to get the IP address from your sLAN through the basic stamp if you cannot locate it with the slan software (check the manual). Does your sLAN show up in your DHCP router table?
I still don't have a link light on my router for the sLAN, even though the activity light is lighting up all the time, so it may have some quirks there. But I have managed to get the router to assign it an IP through DHCP.
On another note, I just got my sLAN sending emails successfully. It turns out there was some syntax I wasn't catching that my ISP smtp server uses. I used etheral and sent some emails with outlook to get all of the proper syntax and included that in the fields and it works great now.
Yup. UPNP is enabled. I've always been able to connect to my Slan with in the local network using it's local IP.
I emailed the Wiese brothers (AVCom) and they asked me to send some more detailed info, so I sent a couple of Ethereal capture files of a successful local connection and a unsuccessful attempt from the outside world. I probably should have caught this sooner, but I was so wrapped up in trying to geth the email send function to work I overlooked the most important function - serving a page of info the email would advise me of!
I've got a half dozen other standalone web servers running on my network here that I'm able to check on from anywhere there's an Internet connection. 3 different cameras (2 D-Link, 1 Panasonic), a homebrew weather station as well as security and heating system monitors that use SitePlayer servers. They all work great. Slan has fought me every inch of the way.
Got a reply back from the Wiese brothers over at AvCom and they solved my problem.
Turns out SimpleLan will only respond to port 80.
D-Link DI-604 virtual server has entries for both a private and public port number for each device.
I just set my private port to 80 and left my public port at 8085.
Seems to work fine now.
I know this is a total noob question, but due to the Stamp's limitations on text processing, is the propeller the only (Parallax) platform that would make sense to use the Simple Lan product with?
Comments
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
necessity is a mother
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
necessity is a mother
That said, hubs are much more forgiving. They aren't smart, that is they don't route packets via MAC addresses. They just forward the packets as is to all channels. They also have a much easier auto negotiation process, which generally means you won't run into too many problems. In any case, products based on the RTL8019AS NIC chip generally function best on a 10baseT hub or a switch port configured for 10baseT only.
This RTL8019 compatibility problem is not extremely new. The problem is recognized by the manufacturer, Realtek. Other issues with this chip is that it won't correctly negotiate if you do not give it time to establish the ethernet link channel. That is, if you start trying to send packets before it is ready. I believe that other embedded modules (namely the Siteplayer) ran into the packet sending issue a few years ago. It was fixed by adding a DHCP delay of 2 seconds. This gives the NIC and hub/switch time to negotiate and establish link.
So moral of the story is to use a cheap 10baseT hub or a supported switch in between an incompatible network device and a RTL8019 based device.
Harrison
See attached schematic.
My SL works with my local internet provider AT&T Yahoo, but the hardware and protocols probably differ from provider to provider. I guess there's no guarantee that Yahoo POP accounts would work either. But you can try them for free for 30 days.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
necessity is a mother
On another track, has anyone hooked a true RS-232 to the tx/rx lines on the SLan? I'm thinking this is not a good idea. The mcontroller I'm using, Isopod, has a true rs232 port as its second i/o serial. In your opinion, should I put a MAX 232 in between? kinda hate to drive the chip count up...
Thanks to all of you.
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Chris Savage
Parallax Tech Support
I'm wondering if anyone has been able to send email with SimpleLAN using Yahoo plus mail SMTP server?
Figured it can't hurt to ask around before I plunk $20 for a mail service I don't need otherwise.
--
1and1 has a email only package for 99 cents a month ( http://order.1and1.com/xml/order/Mail ). They also have plenty of other packages that may suit your needs (I have only used their dedicated servers so I don't know if they require ssl on other services or not).
Westhost has some very good deals. I use their highest business package so I get vps ssh access. They allow smtp access (I have used it with the sx52 ethernet stack with no problems, in other words, it doesn't require ssl auth). Their cheapest package is about 4 bucks a month ( http://www.westhost.com/package-compare.html ). I would recommend Westhost, but beware, their servers freeze for a few seconds every few days. This usually won't cause a problem as most tcp clients will retry a connection (I am not sure if the simplelan does this or not).
Dreamhost is recommended by some people, but it is slightly more expensive then the other hosts I listed ( http://dreamhost.com/hosting.html ). Note that they will remove your account if you use too much cpu / memory, so don't try to host large sites, etc.
Gmail has smtp and pop3 support, but both require ssl.
--
In any case, I personally recommend Westhost. Their tech support is great (email, chat, phone). They will help you with any problems, heck I bet they will work with you to get email to work with the simplelan. I will never use a different host just because Westhost support is so great.
Harrison
Post Edited (Harrison.) : 1/25/2007 3:58:09 AM GMT
I've pretty much decided the Simplelan is a dead-end piece of &(^@ product. Same with SitePlayer.
SitePlayer has it's problems connecting with certain routers. I've seen them all, but it will reliably serve a web page. Sadly it has no email capability (and no tech support that will give you any satisfaction)
As for SimpleLan
I've tried 3 routers:
1. an old wired SMC barracade result:
Email packets won't even begin go out to internet, web page is fine.
2. A Linksys WRT54G results: - (very weird)
I can see the web page from a computer connected by wire but can't see the web page from a wirelessly connected laptop (tried two) or from the outside world. If I connect the same laptop with a wire, I can see the web page fine. It also will not pass the email packets to internet (used sniffer)
3. A brand new netgear (cheap forgot the model took it back) results:
Web page works fine wired, wireless, and from outside. Initial email packets go to internet but do succeed.
Even more strange. My friend has two older netgear routers and with same webpage and email setting and same basic code everything is fine. This is why I tried the newer netgear router, hoping it would work as well.
You can forget about tech support from both SimpleLan supplier and SitePLayer. I'm convined they are just selling boxes of old stock they inherited somehow and that you will never get any satisfaction on these products.
I hope someone can prove me wrong by giving me the secret else I'm going to a Rabbit (at about 10x the price). At least all the source code is available.
DRsage
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
It's Only A Stupid Question If You Have Not Googled It First!!
Sage
·
So something in the router world has changed that the SimpleLan does not like.
Someone mentioned that they got it to do email. I'd like to know what router they are using and the ISP they connect to.
On another note. Has anyone been able to send email with the PINK module. I went on the Netburner site (who makes PINK) and saw no mention that it is able to do email with authentication.
The Rabbit apparently does.
Do I smell Wabbit?
Sage
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
It's Only A Stupid Question If You Have Not Googled It First!!
It works !!
The SimpleLan emails go out·now although it takes about 45 seconds for it to negotiate and finally send them, but that's no big problem. Same BS2 code, same email settings in SimpleLan and the same settings on this router as the rest of them - albiet a different setup screen.
· I had the router crash about·4 times in the first couple of hours of playing with it so I ugraded the firmware from the D-Link site. It's been fine since although I have avoided sending any emails with the SimpleLan·just so I can be sure it it crashes again after emails that it might be SimpleLan related.
·I'll post my findings later.
Finally I hope I'm back on the road to a home monitoring system.
Sage
Sage
Finally got a free 30 day trial Yahoo Plus email account today.
Put my SimpleLAN test jig back together and viola! It works.
The web server part seems to work well too.
I haven't had any luck with the SMTP feature though.· I wasn't sure if it was my ISP or what.· I tried using simple TELNET to send an email through my ISP mail server and failed.· I get a 550 error after sending my text, saying I didn't send the right headers or something.··I have outlook and it uses the SMTP protocol fine.·
So to figure out what the problem is, can someone please list the SMTP commands (or correct what I have) that will allow me to TELNET an email from my ISP server.· If that works I will know the sLAN is not working.
by the way - I can't get into my SMTP server without indicating port 25, otherwise it just sits there and times out.· Maybe this is the issue with sLAN?
telnet smtp.patmedia.net 25
HELO my email address
MAIL·from: my email address
RCPT·to: another one of my email addresses
DATA
blah blah blah blah
.
everything is cool up until finishing the message, then it says:
550 5.6.0 Required headers not found (see RFC2822 section 3.6)
and times out
thanks if you read this far.· I also have a linksys BEFSX41
·
I'm beginning to agree with some others that sLAN is not ready for prime time.
do you have nPNP port fowarding? You can use that to foward the HTTP packets to your simplelan. I really don't know what is going on with yours because I haven't had problems with getting the sLan on the internet. I've used nPNP fowarding, DMZ hosting, and one port range fowarding to send packets to the sLAN from the external internet. Are you not even seeing it on your LAN? There are some serial commands you can use to get the IP address from your sLAN through the basic stamp if you cannot locate it with the slan software (check the manual). Does your sLAN show up in your DHCP router table?
I still don't have a link light on my router for the sLAN, even though the activity light is lighting up all the time, so it may have some quirks there. But I have managed to get the router to assign it an IP through DHCP.
On another note, I just got my sLAN sending emails successfully. It turns out there was some syntax I wasn't catching that my ISP smtp server uses. I used etheral and sent some emails with outlook to get all of the proper syntax and included that in the fields and it works great now.
I emailed the Wiese brothers (AVCom) and they asked me to send some more detailed info, so I sent a couple of Ethereal capture files of a successful local connection and a unsuccessful attempt from the outside world. I probably should have caught this sooner, but I was so wrapped up in trying to geth the email send function to work I overlooked the most important function - serving a page of info the email would advise me of!
I've got a half dozen other standalone web servers running on my network here that I'm able to check on from anywhere there's an Internet connection. 3 different cameras (2 D-Link, 1 Panasonic), a homebrew weather station as well as security and heating system monitors that use SitePlayer servers. They all work great. Slan has fought me every inch of the way.
Turns out SimpleLan will only respond to port 80.
D-Link DI-604 virtual server has entries for both a private and public port number for each device.
I just set my private port to 80 and left my public port at 8085.
Seems to work fine now.
http://www.slan.dyns.cx
(If you love Bush, don't visit [noparse]:)[/noparse]
Thanks.
Jeff