Micro_Who ??
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Micro@@@@ on Wednesday plans to take the wraps off its first commercial operating system for robots, with hopes of paving the way for a broader robotics industry and taking a central role in its development.
The technology, called , is a [url=mailto:Micro@@@@,WIN###-based]Micro@@@@,WIN###-based[/url] software platform designed to make it relatively simple to program robots--real or simulated. Compatible with several different pieces of hardware, like iRobot's Roomba or LEGO Mindstorms NXT "tribot," the software lets enterprising gadget hounds command a device to communicate, send alerts or perform scheduled tasks.
The software is free for hobbyists or researchers, but companies aiming to profit from its use must license a commercial version for $399.
·Mike, sell yours for $398.00 And throw in a propeller demo board [noparse]:)[/noparse]
Bill Must Be building a guest house .
Brian
ps. I never new I was a "Enterprising Gadet Hound"
Post Edited (truckwiz) : 12/14/2006 6:17:55 AM GMT
The technology, called , is a [url=mailto:Micro@@@@,WIN###-based]Micro@@@@,WIN###-based[/url] software platform designed to make it relatively simple to program robots--real or simulated. Compatible with several different pieces of hardware, like iRobot's Roomba or LEGO Mindstorms NXT "tribot," the software lets enterprising gadget hounds command a device to communicate, send alerts or perform scheduled tasks.
The software is free for hobbyists or researchers, but companies aiming to profit from its use must license a commercial version for $399.
·Mike, sell yours for $398.00 And throw in a propeller demo board [noparse]:)[/noparse]
Bill Must Be building a guest house .
Brian
ps. I never new I was a "Enterprising Gadet Hound"
Post Edited (truckwiz) : 12/14/2006 6:17:55 AM GMT
Comments
Andre'
You mean, this stuff will make robots more unstable and prone to inexplicable sudden crashes?
(I'm an OpenGL fan myself... And have been since the mid-nineties, when it appeared on OS/2. Not that I ever DID anything with it.)
I find the thought of 'one tool fits all' approach pretty worrying.
Programming a Lego or Roomba is 'rather a bit' different from programming a BOE-Bot.
Sure, it may make it easier for deadbeats to get their latest Lego robot to move, but for anything custom-built, you still need to know exactly what you do. And it's that way you need to go if you want to further development.
The M$ Robotics Tool, I fear, will encourage people to wait for others to build drivers and common building-blocks for new HW, instead of trying to make them, themselves. And THAT stifles innovation.
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Don't visit my new website...
Move along folks. Nothing to see here.
-Phil
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Brian Meade
"They who dream by day are cognizant of many things which escape those who dream only by night" - Edgar Poe
Brian
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Who says you have to have knowledge to use it?
I've killed a fly with my bare mind.
I had to make a little movie on OpenGL for a computer graphics course. It featured robots (of course), made out of cylinders, boxes and cones. It was so '80s. Anyway, the good thing about opengl versus directx is that it worked on Linux as well as Windows. Same goes for the robotics related software MS has put out recently. Microsoft's robotics studio is that it ties you to their god awful OS, as well as their .NET world domination initiative.
I'd have to say that I don't care if the smarts for a robot is lodged in a BSOD susceptible PC or not, if the BSOD shows up infrequently enough, and the robot does not need to be self contained. Most robot apps do not require the 'bot to be self contained.
This is a silver cloud with a known grey lining. A good thing all in all.
Yours, Tom P.
You can do the same thing with any programming language that allows you to access the relevant hardware involved. Java, C, C++, Delphi, Perl, Python, Lisp, Basic, etc. If you want to use .Net for this type of thing, that's fine, too. But it's not the only option.
I don't know how many game developers are on this board, but anyone that made games on the PC pre-DirectX knows it was a nightmare, heterogenous technology for everything. DirectX unified it into one technology and everything works now. The creation of DirectX by microsoft literally helped the economy in the computing sector, it gave thousands of developers the tools to make games on the PC without to huge investment in drivers, and development needed to support the hundreds of graphics cards, and sound cards at the time. These tools allowed the creation of billions of dollars of revenue by third parties.
On the other hand, as mike said its takes microsoft a bit to get it right, the first versions of directx didn't work well and DOS was still better, but by version 3.0, DirectX left DOS game dev in the dust. I figure by version 3 of whatever microsoft is doing it will be very good. The cool thing is once microsoft gets into something they may make mistakes, but at some point what they create is pretty damn slick.
Someone has to take a serious leadership role in robotics development, operating systems, and standards, and microsoft like google has the best computer scientists and programmers in the world, so I am sure they will do a good job. Of course, we are capitalist and marketing, deadlines, and hype have to drive revenues, so products don't always meet the expectations, but microsoft's technology including their operating systems run the world. And frankly without it, there are a lot of people that couldn't get work done.
What people don't realize is that when the spotlight is on you, everything you do is scrutinized. If Macs owned the market share that windows did in the consumer space we would hear how bad they are as well, full of security holes, etc. People would spend their lives hating macs and Steve Jobs!!! Instead of windows and Bill Gates. Its a tough job having the whole world jealous of your success, but microsoft has earned it. They play really rough, push the envelope, and business is war, and all is fair, but at the end of the day, they are doing the best they can. Let's be glad they are on our side!
Andre'
Maybe that's why it's so popular with all the hardcore OS X gamers...
(The game is Minions of Mirth
(Windaft players can join the fun, too)
They probably wouldn't say no to a little bit of help, though.
(But you'll need to know Python)
Anyone else play?
If so, send me a /T if you see me online.
(I go by the name Trrve Lionmane... )
As for M$ getting it right with V3, that's a myth...
Remember windows 3.0?
Of course, on winCE 3.0 they did manage to print, and even dynamically allocate memory between files and running programs... Something the competition had done for over a decade...
I have a 1989 vintage laptop with a NEC V30(i8086 clone with power-saving functions), 256KB RAM, 640x400 B/W screen, fully Pre-emptive multitasking OS with a GUI (which even handled redrawing correctly when moving windows).
The major PROBLEM with DirectX now is that the specification changes so quickly.
No sooner have you upgraded to one version then a new game comes along that requires a newer version, and THAT version again, isn't compatible with your graphics card...
Gamers now buy GPUs costing $800 - $1000 or more, just to be able to play the latest games...
I bought a BRAND NEW 50cc scooter for $1000 a few months ago...
We don't even use that kind of HW on the workstations used for CAD work at the office...
(They design roads, mostly, and often needs to load 10 - 20MB digital maps, and sometimes creates 3D simulations of how the roads will end up looking... This is heavy stuff)
As for hating Mac/OS X vs Windows..
I install and support windows-based PCs and servers at the office(About 20 servers and 300 PCs in my county), and have been doing that since 1993...
Server stability?
we had that until about 1997, I think...
(that was when the first of our servers were migrated from OS/2 V1.3 to WinNT 3.51)
My last PC was a laptop, and windows borked the HDD after a few weeks...
the iBook I bought after that disaster died... has now enjoyed one and a half year without a major crash.
(A single app dying is a minor inconvenience. the OS going down is a major crash)
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Don't visit my new website...
But, in all fairnesss, the problem is not companies, not capitalism, not microsoft. Its human beings. I think its silly to identify companies etc. that are "bad", the real problem is people in the companies, not companies. Give 99% of men too much power they abuse it, we are monkeys and until people's actions match their "virtues", big companies will always bully small ones.
There is not a single large company that makes a lot of money that is not corrupt and bad. When push comes to shove they will PUSH. It was so funny watching the legal battle with microsoft and the government, little scott mcnelly sitting there, crying "waaaahhh wahhhhh, I want to be the richest man on the planet". What really happened was bill gates out thought, out smarted, and out manuvered him.
Anyway, at the end of the day, I only care if software helps me get work done to make income and microsoft products and applications do that, so I am happy.
Andre'
"Basically, what they've done is lobotomize perfectly healthy robots (the Boe-Bot included),
install Bluetooth tethers, and control them from a program running on the PC.
The robot sends sensory data to the PC, and the PC responds with commands.
The autonomy is gone, and the robot is nothing more than an remote-controlled slave
to a Windows-based computer. PC control isn't what robotics is all about,
no matter how easy it might be to program. They've missed the point entirely."
So maybe the definition of "robot" should be changed/redefined -
TO :
"A robot is an electro-mechanical or bio-mechanical device or group of devices that performs autonomous
or preprogrammed tasks. A robot must act autonomously under the control of an onboard self contained
programmed computer."
FROM : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robot -
"A robot is an electro-mechanical or bio-mechanical device or group of devices that can perform autonomous
or preprogrammed tasks. A robot may act under the direct control of a human, such as the robotic arm on a space shuttle,
or autonomously under the control of a programmed computer."
This would raise the bar a bit...
Interesting thread!
Putting all of this stuff in the context of the prop, I see the Microsoft path as an evolution and repackaging of existing progress and tools. This is all they have really done and all they will continue to do. BTW: Direct X got so much better because Microsoft punched SGI in the sack over the Faherinheit (however you spell it) project. Prior to that, Direct X had significant issues. I agree with Andre where development is concerned. However I disagree from an ideological standpoint. Where a unified API makes sense, it also brings with it too much potential for abuse. Cost and control issues, mainly. Say what you want about the Unixy branch of computing, it's been the source of a lotta solid ideas, many of which still are not properly implemented in win32 systems today.
The multi-processing aspect of the prop is very significant, IMHO. Look at the project posted here recently on the robot that won a competition against far more powerful CPU's. The approach, forced by the design of the prop, clearly differentiated that robot from the others running the usual collection of stuff.
IMHO, Microsoft will do a good job of bringing more into that scene. That's all good. However, the scene is still really new. We need the melting pot of approaches and tools to remain for a while yet so that good ideas may continue to evolve.
I don't know if I *hate* Microsoft. If their software lets people get work done, like Andre says, that's a good thing. But there are sure a lot of things that annoy me to no end about their software, and the fact that it's so hard to avoid using it annoys me as well.
For example: Why does the OS crash so often? I'm talking hard crashes, requiring reboots. That's been a feature of every microsoft os I've had since DOS. I don't think it's a hardware problem. I dual-boot and my Linux install has never crashed on me. Ever. If some app crashes or hangs up on me (of course a lot of the ones that do have been written by me [noparse];)[/noparse] ) I just kill it and that's it. Failing Windows apps seem to take the OS with them about 50% of the time.
Or, Why can't they keep compatibility of their file formats? Or, Why does Windows clobber the mbr upon install? Why aren't NTFS's specs open? Or better yet, why can't Win be installed on some Filesystem that isn't Fat32 or NTFS? Why do people I work with use this horrible .doc format? Haven't they heard of latex? And why do I have use their GUI to use their OS? ARGGH.
Anyway: Their robot sim looks pretty slick. I bet the system is easy to use and it might make programming a robot easier. But, say I download their "Robotics Studio" (it's "free") and their robot OS, like them and invest a lot of time in programming a robot with them. Robot hardware manufacturers support them and everything works Ok. But then MS decides to move onto RoboticsStudioVISTA.NET3000 with an accompanying Robot OS, which is incompatible with previous versions, and support for previous versions is dropped. Oh, and now you have to pay for the new version. And it also has a couple of new "features" like "Robot Genuine Advantage", which means your robot has to be online so it can connect to microsoft and certify the OS isn't pirated. Robot hardware manufacturers soon make only RoboticsStudioVISTA.NET3000 compatible hardware. If I want to keep working on their platform, I have to buy the new version and port all my software to it.
Oh well, who knows. We'll see how this thing turns out.