Printing PCB etch resist directly with old inkjet printers
James Newton
Posts: 329
Not sure if this is the right place to post this, but I don't think the STAMP people do this much...
Guys who like to make thier own PCB's should check this out: A couple of guys figured out how to modify thier old Epson inkjet printers and found the right inks and process to directly feed PCB stock and print the echant resist at high resolution directly!
http://digg.com/hardware/Finally_Direct_to_PCB_InkJet_Resist_Printing_Make_your_own_PCBs_for_cheap
Once you can feed the PCB through the printer for etch resist, you can then feed it back through the printer for solder mask (yep, it masks solder!) and for component placement "silk-screen."
Considering how little you can get an old Epson C84 on eBay and the low cost of the inks (from a refiller outfit) this has got to be the cheapest way to prototype PCBs.
Anyone else have any favorite methods?
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James Newton, Host of SXList.com
james at sxlist,com 1-619-652-0593 fax:1-208-279-8767
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Guys who like to make thier own PCB's should check this out: A couple of guys figured out how to modify thier old Epson inkjet printers and found the right inks and process to directly feed PCB stock and print the echant resist at high resolution directly!
http://digg.com/hardware/Finally_Direct_to_PCB_InkJet_Resist_Printing_Make_your_own_PCBs_for_cheap
Once you can feed the PCB through the printer for etch resist, you can then feed it back through the printer for solder mask (yep, it masks solder!) and for component placement "silk-screen."
Considering how little you can get an old Epson C84 on eBay and the low cost of the inks (from a refiller outfit) this has got to be the cheapest way to prototype PCBs.
Anyone else have any favorite methods?
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James Newton, Host of SXList.com
james at sxlist,com 1-619-652-0593 fax:1-208-279-8767
SX FAQ / Code / Tutorials / Documentation:
http://www.sxlist.com Pick faster!
Comments
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It's Only A Stupid Question If You Have Not Googled It First!!
www.parallax.com/detail.asp?product_id=27949
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Beau Schwabe
IC Layout Engineer
Parallax, Inc.
Great post!
I have been pursuing this "holy grail" for prepping circuit boards directly from CAD to etch without intervening steps, off and on for several years now without good success. And these guys pulled it off. Good for them!
In fact it was exactly this application that was my interest in the "community milling machine" project. Of course milling (drilling holes) was only one of the applications; precision motion of a print head was another.
My biggest difficulty was locating a suitable source for inks that would withstand the chemical etching process, and I had migrated to the technology of "wax" printers.
This revelation by these chaps now may revitalize my interest the in the ink process.
Thanks for sharing!
Cheers,
Peter (pjv)
Just Kidding
After seeing James' set-up, I sent the ink supplier a note suggestion they develop a high solids ink that doesn't need baking. this could be quite a niche market for them. Colour matching isn't important so long as the ink can resist the Ferric Chloride.
Think of marketing an inkjet PCB printer James. If you use a "brand name" printer with an add-on that is a carrier to handle PCBs, you've got to be able to sell several tens of thousands of them to schools, technical training institutions and us hobbiests (Several hundres of thousands if you sell them internationally).
Just a thought from darkest Africa, the continent where we don't even know how to spell PCB.
John Bond
-dave
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This is not a sig. This is a duck. Quack.
Years ago I did something similar to your suggestion.
I modified the "pen" on one of those flatbeds to be a moving fiber optic thread.. fishing line actually.. and had an LED driving the fixed end. The LED was turned on/off by the "penup/pendown" commands. It traced the plotted lines beautifully at moderate speeds, and exposed the sensitized board properly.
It was quite slow as whole areas needed to be filled with just a small aperture, but the concept worked. I suppose that a stronger light like a laser would be MUCH faster.
Anyhow, I went back to silk screening the boards, but continued to be on the lookout for other direct CAD to Etch concepts. I believe the wax printer is a suitable candidate, but if proper liquid inks could be found then all sorts of other ideas become valid.
Hopefully John's enquiry to the ink supplier meets with some success.
Cheers,
Peter (pjv)
Right, and if you are moving the board under the Printer Head then you can increase the 96DPI
resolution. Although 96 DPI is not bad for PCB's, you get about·3.7 dots per millimeter.
·············· 96 DPI is pretty bad for PCB's because you only get about 3.7 dots per millimeter.
...But if you move the board rather than the print head, you can increase your resolution for making PCB's···············
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Beau Schwabe
IC Layout Engineer
Parallax, Inc.
Post Edited (Beau Schwabe (Parallax)) : 8/17/2006 6:00:30 AM GMT
I'm gonna have to disagree with you here.
My requirements are up to 12 mil lines and 12 mil spaces, and allowing for some etching undercut, I believe 1200 DPI is required to give a commercial quality product.
But that's do-able.
At 96 DPI, that is about the width of one dot, which would look really crappy other than on fat lines.
Cheers,
Peter (pjv)
Ok... see my edit...
Can you get 12 mils with the "community milling machine" project?
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Beau Schwabe
IC Layout Engineer
Parallax, Inc.
Actually I've been making some progress on that front. I believe the linear bearing issue is solved (another way). I'll post some more info in that thread when I'm a little farther along; but I thing we've cracked the hurdle.
The positioning accuracy I'm anticipating is still in that 3 mil range, but the repeatibility should be better than that. So on multiple/adjacent passes that should be plenty good enough. The issue of the print head is yet to be settled. The wax printer lays down nice regular dots around 1 mil diameter from about 120 "ink" jets. Lots more work to do here.
Cheers,
Peter (pjv)
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James Newton, Host of SXList.com
james at sxlist,com 1-619-652-0593 fax:1-208-279-8767
SX FAQ / Code / Tutorials / Documentation:
http://www.sxlist.com Pick faster!
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John R.
8 + 8 = 10
I've been talking to your ink supplier and they are keen to do some trials. I asked if they had inks that didnt need to be heated to accelerate curing. He was helpful and seemed very positive, This is a copy of their latest email...
>>Printing Archival ink on copper
>>Hello John,
>>Your questions are interesting but we have never tested the ink in this senario to offer an answer. >>Perhaps we can begin some testing. We have a number of inks that might help in achieving your end >>results.
>Please tell me what printer you use and we can look to send you some sample cartridges with some of >>the various black inks for you to test in your process.
>>Thanks,
"Marc" <support@inksupply.info>,
Quite obviously, they can't send ink to South Africa, It'll cost a lot more and it'll never arrive (Reason - Stolen, Lost, my refusal to pay a bribe). Please would you contact Marc and see if you and he have common ground.
Kind regards
John Bond
In regards to using an ink jet, I have printed transparencies for photosensitive exposure with mixed result.
While my old H/P Inkjet did perfect transparencies, my Cannon iP1000 doesn't stick to the material - just beads.
When I try to make a copy in the local copy shop, the transparency's black is not dense enough for photo sensitive exposure.·
So, if you use transparencies, the trick is really to get the density of black that will block out all light.
If you want to do an on copper resist, many markers and inks will do the job - but they have to be water resistant when finally dried as the etchant is always a water-based solution.
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"If you want more fiber, eat the package.· Not enough?· Eat the manual."········
And it is then useful not only for the etch resist, but also for soldermask and component silkscreen. Once you can feed a PCB through the printer and get an INK that really sticks, all the issues in making PCBs really fall away.
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James Newton, Host of SXList.com
james at sxlist,com 1-619-652-0593 fax:1-208-279-8767
SX FAQ / Code / Tutorials / Documentation:
http://www.sxlist.com Pick faster!