USB2SER Shuts Mac-PC Down
Jamesx
Posts: 132
I've discovered an interesting problem with FTDI drivers and a USB2SER unit. The result of installing the FTDI drivers (from either the Parallax site or the FTDI site) and then connecting a USB2SER results in completely shutting down the PC.
Details:
The most important detail is that the machine is an Apple Intel iMac, running Windows under Boot Camp. So far, every other part of Windows has worked OK on this hybrid machine. I was hopeful that I'd be able the use the Apple_Intel_Windows unit is a functional PC for working with SX development, but I'm having serious doubts now.
In a nutshell, whn I first plugged in the USB2SER, it wasn't recognized. Windows asked for drivers and I directed the OS to the downloaded drivers. The drivers open and loaded fine, as far as I could tell. Then when I started a Windows program that opened that COM port, the OS immediately shut down. If I left the USB2SER plugged in, the machine was unable to start: each time it got to the 2nd Windows start up screen, it would shut down. If I unplugged the USB2SER, the PC would start, but now, with Windows up and running, as soon as I plugged in the USB2SER, Windows promptly shut down. Upon restart, there was a message that a Disk Error on C: had occured, and some disk scan had to happen.
As long as the USB2SER is not plugged in, the PC will start up, but plug it in, and it always takes down the machine.
I figured the Windows machine in an iMac would be flakey, especially with fake serial ports (actually USB). But now that I've found a real bug, anyone got any ideas on how to solve it?
Thanks,
J Cooke
Details:
The most important detail is that the machine is an Apple Intel iMac, running Windows under Boot Camp. So far, every other part of Windows has worked OK on this hybrid machine. I was hopeful that I'd be able the use the Apple_Intel_Windows unit is a functional PC for working with SX development, but I'm having serious doubts now.
In a nutshell, whn I first plugged in the USB2SER, it wasn't recognized. Windows asked for drivers and I directed the OS to the downloaded drivers. The drivers open and loaded fine, as far as I could tell. Then when I started a Windows program that opened that COM port, the OS immediately shut down. If I left the USB2SER plugged in, the machine was unable to start: each time it got to the 2nd Windows start up screen, it would shut down. If I unplugged the USB2SER, the PC would start, but now, with Windows up and running, as soon as I plugged in the USB2SER, Windows promptly shut down. Upon restart, there was a message that a Disk Error on C: had occured, and some disk scan had to happen.
As long as the USB2SER is not plugged in, the PC will start up, but plug it in, and it always takes down the machine.
I figured the Windows machine in an iMac would be flakey, especially with fake serial ports (actually USB). But now that I've found a real bug, anyone got any ideas on how to solve it?
Thanks,
J Cooke
Comments
I've got 2GB of RAM on order (to arrive sometime next week) and once I get it I will install Windows 2K (have a spare license for 2K but not XP) using Parallels Desktop. I'll post my experiences with it next week once I get it all together. If the FTDI drivers behave in the Windows virtual machine then Parallels Desktop may be a solution.
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I wouldn't connect that if I were you...
By the way, one additional piece of info: A Keyspan RS232-to-USB adapter seems to work fine with the Boot Camp Windows. I guess their driver hooks in a different way.
Jim C
Once I get the Parallels/Windows set-up I'll be sure to test the Keyspan functionality as well.
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I wouldn't connect that if I were you...
If it is bluescreening, there are troubleshooting steps that you can take to help narrow the problem down.
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Chris Savage
Parallax Tech Support
csavage@parallax.com
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OS-X: because making Unix user-friendly was easier than debugging Windows
links:
My band's website
Our album on the iTunes Music Store
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Chris Savage
Parallax Tech Support
csavage@parallax.com
Hey there. The RAM came in today. I'll get that installed tonight and see if I can't get Parallels Desktop/Win2K installed as well. If not tonight then I should have some results for you by tomorrow night. Pesky day job gets in the way of fun.
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I wouldn't connect that if I were you...
I upgraded my Mac min Intel Core Duo (1.66GHz) to 2GB of RAM. I installed Parallels Desktop. Within a Parallels Desktop Virtual Machine (VM), I installed Windows 2000 Professional. I installed the Parallels Tools which, among other things, allowed me to use SVGA resolutions and 100Mbit network connections. Without this, I would be limited to 640x480 (VGA) and 10Mbs Ethernet (!).
I have a Professional Development Board and a Board of Education both with BS2ICs installed. Plugging either of these in results in a Parallels Desktop message that indicates that the device is busy. The message confirms that Parallels is detecting the USB device change but it appears to stop short of making Windows in the VM "aware" of the port. This tells me that the Mac OS X driver (probably) has exclusive use of the device so it cannot be seen, much less used, by Windows in the VM.
I attempted to install the driver "manually" by going through the "Add Hardware" Control Panel. The operation never detects the USB ports so the installation cannot proceed.
Finally, right-clicking the "FTDIBUS.INF" file to use the Install contextual command has no effect.
My initial conclusion is that without resorting to heroic measures (I'm assuming that there are heroic measures), I think the Parallels Desktop/Windows combination doesn't have a chance at working like a Boot Camp/Windows combination since in the former case, the host OS (Mac OS X) takes over the USB ports while in the latter case, the OS that's running is the only OS that's running so there's no masking of the ports by another set of drivers. Of course, in the latter case, there may be a subtle, underlying incompatibility that will still prevent things from working (i.e., what happens on your iMac with Boot Camp and Windows will happen to me, too).
There are still some things to try:
1. See if the Mac OS X drivers can be disabled/unloaded without actually uninstalling them and then see if I can install the FTDI drivers in Windows in the VM.
2. Uninstall the Mac OS X drivers and see if I can then install the drivers in Windows in the VM.
3. Set-up a Boot Camp/Windows configuration and see what happens.
I'm still curious about the problem so I'll keep at it for a little while longer. I'll keep you posted.
On a positive note, the performance of Parallels Desktop software is very impressive. I've used QEMU and iEmulate on my iMac G5 2GHz and both leave A LOT to be desired performance-wise. They are almost unusable. Parallels Desktop, on the other hand feels like you're using an actual PC (you basically are since the Windows code is running on actual Intel hardware). It's very responsive...quick even.
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I wouldn't connect that if I were you...
Post Edited (aalegado) : 7/6/2006 4:25:20 AM GMT
Positive results. By not installing or by disabling the FTDI driver in Mac OS X, the Windows in the Parallels VM can see the USB ports allow the installation of the Windows FTDI driver. Not quite the "Heroic" measures I thought might be necessary but it is a non-standard work-around.
You might want to download the Parallels Desktop software and try it out. It may be the solution you need.
What I did:
I manually moved the /System/Library/Extensions/FTDIUSBSerialDriver.kext file out of the Extensions directory and rebooted my mini. This "disables" the FTDI driver and allowed Parallels to seize the USB ports and present them to Windows in the Parallels VM. As a result, I was able to install the FTDI driver in Windows in the Parallels VM. The Windows BASIC Stamp Editor had no trouble identifying the USB ports and communicating with my PDB and BOE.
Note that in order to move the driver out of the /System/Library/Extensions directory, you either have to login as root and move it via the GUI -OR- use a terminal/shell session, su to root, and then mv the extension file out of the /System/Library/Extensions directory.
Putting the Mac OS X FTDI driver back into the /System/Library/Extensions/ and rebooting restores the driver and allows the Mac BS2 application to once again "see" the PDB and BOE boards. As expected, Parallels is no longer able to seize the USB ports so Windows in the VM can no longer access the PDB and BOE.
I did not test the Keyspan driver but I'd expect it to work with Windows in the VM if I disable it like I did the OS X FTDI driver.
Boot Camp/Windows is still on my To-Do list.
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I wouldn't connect that if I were you...
Thanks for checking this.
I have a couple of questions:
1) re Parallels, I don't have it yet, but I wondered if an additional copy of Windows XP is needed. Microsoft gets kind of touchy if you use a copy of XP more than once, and I wondered if they'd see it as a second use, if XP was already set up in Boot Camp
2) I haven't yet put the FDTI drivers on the Mac OS, so I don't think I'll have to go through the extension removal thing
3) Is it correct that Parallels Windows cannot do USB 2, but can only do USB 1?
4) If you try the Boot Camp path, maybe you can sort another way at the FTDI ports. I got stumped.
Thanks again
Jamesx
#1. I think the XP activation methodology will consider the Parallels vm "different" hardware. That's a guess...I've no first hand knowledge since I don't have a spare XP license to use with Parallels. However, isn't there a grace period during which you can remain un-activated but still use XP?
Consider: With a stand-alone license (as opposed to an OEM license like you'd get if you boought a Dell with XP pre-installed, et al) it should be legitimate to re-use the OS license if the previous installation is destroyed. However, is there a mechanism for letting M$ know that's what you're doing when you activate the same license again?
#2. Yup, you won't have any issues like I did with respect to the driver.
#3. I've read about the USB1.1 limitation but didn't think to check it.
UPDATE: Within Parallels, there is a contextual pop-up that appears when you hover the mouse pointer over the USB device icon in the Parallels window. It reports that the USB is 1.1. I wonder that this shouldn't be something they can fix? When you first install Windows whatever within the Parallels vm, the network support indicates 10Mbps and display resolution is capped at 640x480. Once you install the Parallels Tools in Windows in the vm, you gain 100Mbps connectivity and a number of display resolution options...kind of like installing mobo drivers for a DIY PC...once you install mobo drivers you get access/control over mobo video, sound, network, etc.
#4. I'm assuming that with Boot Camp once you were booted into XP you just installed the FTDI drivers right? Did you have another FTDI-based product besides the USB2SER to test with like a development board? I suppose it will behave similarly since it's the same chipset. What happens if you connect some other USB device, like a printer?
It might be sometime before I try Boot Camp. I've read the docs and it looks like I have to partition the internal drive. After setting up my mini with the stock 80GB drive I've only 8GB free space which leaves very little to play with if I go through the process to set-up Boot Camp. However, I do want to u/g the drive to 120GB or 160GB (probably next month) and since I will have to re-load the drive I can go ahead and partition it before I go through that whole process.
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I wouldn't connect that if I were you...
Vive Le Tour!
July 1 - July 23
Post Edited (aalegado) : 7/13/2006 11:14:45 PM GMT
Thanks for the thoughts on the various Mac/Windows os issues.
Regarding your note #4 about installing FTDI drivers: I have not tried it with another FTDI product, although I do have a couple I could try. Also, for reference, the Boot Camp os was able to manage with a USB-RS232 converter by Keyspan just fine. That makes me think the problem is specfic to the FTDI drivers.
I haven't decided whether to tackle the Parallels os yet. Perhaps I'll wait a month or two and see if FTDI comes up with fix
Jamesx
I ran Parallels on the MacBook Pro, and installed Windows XP and updated it to the latest and activated it.
Parallels works great, but my first attempt at using a USB to Serial adapter to talk to the SX-Key failed. It was a Keyspan 19HS. With no drivers installed for it on the Mac side it remains free to "Connect" in Parallels to the Windows environment, and the Keyspan Assistant did indeed see the adapter and allow me to specify which Comm port it would be. However, the SX-Key couldn't see it, saw no comm ports at all.
Then I bought ($14.99 at Fry's) an AirLink 101 "Phoebe" Model AC-USBS USB to Serial adapter, and plugged it in, connected it to parallels, and installed the drivers in Windows XP from the provided CD.
Presto! The SX-Key software now sees it as Comm 3, and works fine!!
I heard from another user that the IOGear GUC232A works under Virtual PC (non-Intel Macs). I didn't try that one first because it is twice as expensive and its package is not easily opened for testing.
Probably a variety of adapters works, just be aware that some (e.g. Keyspan) don't.
Dave
But, the keyspan driver works fine under OS X, for mac apps (like the editor/assembler/compiler that I'm working on)... my USB-serial adapter is a Keyspan USA-19Qi.
I suspect that a variety of adapters will be needed for the near term, until all the driver bugs get worked out.... <sigh> such is life on the cutting (bleeding?) edge...