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My helicopter project... Can you help me??? - Page 2 — Parallax Forums

My helicopter project... Can you help me???

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  • RGuyserRGuyser Posts: 90
    edited 2006-06-13 18:46
    i really like the helicopter. now that, that is a project a 16 year old kid could finish...

    [noparse];)[/noparse]

    (when i was 16 i was using commodore 64s to control rube goldberg devices)
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-06-13 21:08
    I doing research on building helis some time now...



    I came up to this...

    But there are many things I miss so just please do not blame me for not knowing... And I'm trying to do some seriouw work... NOT wooden toys...

    Anyway... m_fabio2:

    Would you give me a exable on how you interfaced the microcontrollers with the RC radios and the heli...

    What sensors were you using... (GPS, altimeters and so on...) (IC names please...)



    Thanks for your help and encouragement... Provas, Greece

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--
  • bennettdanbennettdan Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-15 06:10
    Provas
    Look at this websight they are working on something simular.
    http://autopilot.sourceforge.net/index.html
  • Tronic (Greece)Tronic (Greece) Posts: 130
    edited 2006-06-15 08:23
    Hello provas,

    I didint mention it before but ther is a member in our forum that works (and fly) miniatoure model helis that he bought on the local store "JUMBO" for something less than 70euro... I think it weights less than 500grams and its electric. Anyway his nickname is Dikos (send him a PM asking details...)

    He even gave me the RC controller part for free from a broken one.

    I can be easy to attach a BS2 on it to control it...

    Thanos

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    Greekbotics: Greek Robotics Forum
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-06-15 20:55
    Thanks for your help both of you guys... Now... I have found some prety staff on sensor...

    ADIS16250 from Analog Devices as iMEM Gyroscope... (Well Gyros are expensive so I've better make my·own one)
    And from altimeter I have found the MS5534 but I don't fing it's easy for me to order (Not for the sensor but the posting expenses really break my heart)

    I would be grateful if you can help me with my search... I know that what I'm willing to do is nearly impossible...


    BTW: GPS modules can provide me with altitude... I one I have in mind is +-5m accurate... Can it work as altimeter and have a ultrasonic sensor or one Sharp Ir distance sensor to mesure the distance between the heli and the ground for landing!?!?

    Thanks, Provas, Greece

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--
  • bennettdanbennettdan Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-15 23:52
    sparkefun has a breakout board with a gyro that is not too expensive.
  • PJAllenPJAllen Banned Posts: 5,065
    edited 2006-06-16 22:30

    get_real.jpg
    400 x 300 - 33K
  • crgwbrcrgwbr Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-19 12:48
    I'm coming into this late, but being a model airplane & rocket enthusiest, I figured I should post something.· Anyway, I would recoment buying the heli, maybe one of these.· That heli is radio controlled, but should be easily modified, as everything on it controlls like a servo.· For the rocket, you could use almost anything, but·I'd recoment this.· It's cheap, includes everthing needed to fly, and it looks like a missle.· To, ignite it, use a·a mosfet or somthing and one of the included igniters.

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    NerdMaster
    For
    Life
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-06-19 17:05
    Well it's no rocket but thank you...
    That heli you have the link for looks good.... But two of them better huh?!?!
    It's all about physics... I've been thinking of the complexity of·a two rotor system... It's not that difficult to understand but to practically use this theory... (The only think you need is 2nd and 3rd Newton laws)
    I'm now trying to solve the problem with the turning and pitching!!! Any ideas well accepted...


    Thanks...
    Provas, Greece

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--
  • GadgetmanGadgetman Posts: 2,436
    edited 2006-06-19 18:59
    THIS little beauty gives you a two-rotor system without the danger of blades crashing into each others...

    It's also electric, as you want, but will only fly for about 10 - 15 minutes...

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Don't visit my new website...
  • bennettdanbennettdan Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-19 21:57
    Hey check this twin rotor electric heli out.
    www.mscomposit.cz/helicopters/electric_58/ch-46-sea-knight---kit.html

    Post Edited (bennettdan) : 6/22/2006 10:33:38 PM GMT
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-06-22 22:11
    Gadgetman:

    I know about this stuff... the Greek market is full of them... They are very stable and trustwothy... Any unexperienced like me should try them out...



    Bennettdan:

    That's exactly what I'm looking for but... build one... not buy... Do you have access to the docs of this heli... it's very very intresting...





    Therefore, I've done some reaserch and made some thoughts and have made some conclutions about the rotors and how to make the heli move...



    There are two ways... Bending both rotor to the same side and increase the RPM so that the lifting force is ecual to it's weight and also have a horizondal force for moving... (Three axis accelerometer needed)

    The other way is by bending the whole heli and start moving. This with give the heli great manuverability but also more vulnerable to crashing... (two axis accelerometer needed)



    What do you suggest me to do...



    Thanks, Provas, Greece

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--
  • bennettdanbennettdan Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-22 22:31
    I plan on building a simular flying craft as this one in the WAM text. Page 3
    www.parallax.com/dl/docs/books/edu/Wamv2_2.pdf
    It uses two gas engines it should only need a 2 axis accelerometer like the one Parralax sells. The motors tilt front to back independantly to provide turning and forward and reverse flight. You would only have to control 4 servos 2 for throttle and 2 for motor tilt. I like the way they have the engines encased in framework incase of a crash!
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-06-23 08:29
    If you want to make a heli like this maybe we should help the one the other...

    So far am good in theory... what's your research so far...

    Do you have the web page of this heli...



    Thanks, Provas, Greece

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--
  • Kaos KiddKaos Kidd Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-23 15:27
    I am so glad I didn't post the reply I had typed during the very start of this thread... it would have so changed the outcome of the current discussion.
    Provos, I am glad for your improving communication skils, and the discontinued attempt at things many know as harmfull.
    Seriously, it was about to become a very serious issue for you, and I'm very happy it didn't.
    ^5's (thats a high five...)

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    Just tossing my two bits worth into the bit bucket


    KK
    ·
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-06-23 15:58
    I·would never thought of a mean and harmful thing, man, NEVER...
    I'm a peaceful god loving kid!!!cool.gif

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--
  • bennettdanbennettdan Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-23 18:13
    I think so of the other members was having a problem with the language difference that provas comes off wrong but I think he just wants to fly a cool RC heli he built for himself.

    I have not worked with much but due to other things going but I would suggest starting with the accelerometer first controlling servos to see how fast you can get it to react.
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-06-23 19:12
    Bennettdan thanks for the clean out... (well needed to restore my "fame" round here)

    ADXL202 is a cool dual axis accelerometer... (I've ordered free samples from analog devices...)

    and I've been centering servos and making them target with a laser and IR for a long time (heh the second one is just COOL!!!) so I'll come along other things...

    Well... I'll try to get the parts for the rotor as soon as possible and be sure that I'll post again when I got them!!!cool.gif



    Thanks all the guys who helped me so far....



    Provas, Greece

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--

    Post Edited (Provas) : 6/23/2006 7:21:10 PM GMT
  • bennettdanbennettdan Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-24 03:14
    The craft I suggest will have a gas engine and regular 8" prop the motor and prop will rotate together so it cuts down on the moving parts of a rotor system. Kind of drives like a tank.
  • CheetoCheeto Posts: 19
    edited 2006-06-24 06:09
    Im not sure what you mean by reversing the polarity. On Colective Pitch (CP) Heli's you idle up the main motor and then adjust the pitch from 0 degrees for know lift to a positive pitch for upwards lift and a negative pitch for downwards lift. If you got with a fixed pitch cheapy heli off ebay, just forget about it, the yaw rate gyros to control the tail are garbage and using the motor speed to control height and lift is a complete waste of time. You should check out the heli forums on rcgroups.com to get a better grasp on the different types of RC helis available and how much they cost. Personally I got out of RC heli's and switched to robotics because its cheaper. It sucks crashing and knowing you just blew $50, and I was flying a little Electric T-Rex.

    On another note I have been kicking around ideas of how I could use a head holding gyro to make an inverted pendulum robot
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-06-24 07:42
    Bennett do you mean something like a Bell V44?!?! but with two rotors...

    Cheeto I know what do you mean... Heah... My project is going to be an inexpensive one, but no problem as far as I got the cash...

    Why trying to control the speed of the rotor is a waste of time...

    Say that: 50% of thrust and the the lifting force is ecual to the heli's weight... giving more thrust to the motor is supposed to lift it off... BUT also the lifting force is adjust by the bent fo the two rotor blades so... we can have a lift off with less thrust... how about this...

    Just sujesting.... I don't know much about RC flying helis but this isn't going to be a common one...cool.gif



    Thanks, Provas, Greece

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--
  • CheetoCheeto Posts: 19
    edited 2006-06-24 16:43
    The higher your rotor speed the more control you have over the heli. I'm not sure how it works on a dual rotor system, but for a single rotor you need a high head speed in order to fly in anything but an indoor gym.
  • bennettdanbennettdan Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-24 20:50
    provas , Like the V22 Osprey the us military uses.
    look at this link
    http://www.helicopterpage.com/html/tiltrotor.html
  • PJAllenPJAllen Banned Posts: 5,065
    edited 2006-06-25 01:33
    KD-1A%20Web.jpg
  • GadgetmanGadgetman Posts: 2,436
    edited 2006-06-25 18:20
    That's an Autogyro, not a chopper...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autogyro

    Nice concept, but as they can't hover, is probably not a good idea for an autonomous platform.

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Don't visit my new website...
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-06-26 09:21
    The V22 is quite a more difficult project to handle.... that's because you switch between two modes...

    You also need more sensors and a complex calculations... Good luck... what's your status so far...

    Maybe I can help you some way...cool.gif



    Provas, Greece

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--
  • bennettdanbennettdan Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-26 17:46
    I really dont want to switch between modes just hover and forward flight about the same as a heli not go for full forward trust.
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-06-26 21:41
    I really get you but that's the point... You built a craft that can be stable, fast and can hover...

    Anyway... If so it's far more easy than this I'm trying to do... any other suggestions...

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--
  • bennettdanbennettdan Posts: 614
    edited 2006-06-27 02:47
    YOu can make a Coaxial heli and Have the lower rotor turn with the wind from the upper rotor that way you would not have to power the lower rotor.But the lower rotor will spin the opposite way to cancel the upper rotor out so it wont spin.
  • Tricky NekroTricky Nekro Posts: 218
    edited 2006-07-04 14:00
    Builting a coaxial heli isn't the point because it's something common and well known...

    I want to built something that will be if not cool... a prototype...

    So I'm working on it... Probably after summer I'll start with the construction... until then... have a nice summer...



    Provas, Greece

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    -Rule your Destiny-
    --Be Good. Be Bad. Be Provas--
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