NEW PROPELLER DEMO BOARD - picture
cgracey
Posts: 14,133
Here is the new (Rev 
Propeller Demo Board. Kind of like the original, but with two PS/2 ports, a real headphone amp, an electret mic, and USB interface on-board. It shrunk to 3x3", too.
If you look at the board, you can clearly see almost all circuitry. You can see what it takes to make TV signals, VGA signals, PS/2 mouse/keyboard hookups, microphone interface, stereo integrators, etc.
These should be proven by the end of next week, then we'll make lots of 'em.
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Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.
Post Edited (Chip Gracey) : 4/16/2006 3:17:57 AM GMT
Propeller Demo Board. Kind of like the original, but with two PS/2 ports, a real headphone amp, an electret mic, and USB interface on-board. It shrunk to 3x3", too.If you look at the board, you can clearly see almost all circuitry. You can see what it takes to make TV signals, VGA signals, PS/2 mouse/keyboard hookups, microphone interface, stereo integrators, etc.
These should be proven by the end of next week, then we'll make lots of 'em.
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Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.
Post Edited (Chip Gracey) : 4/16/2006 3:17:57 AM GMT
bmp
702K
Comments
Good to see the 5-volt access.· The new demo board looks great!
Dave
Post Edited (Dave Scanlan) : 4/16/2006 2:35:45 PM GMT
It looks great.
"Thanks for the sneak peek!"
Rob7
Could you show the parts layout and the schematic that goes with this?
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Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.
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Stan Dobrowski
Is there going to be a AppMod header option for the dev boards. It would be useful so you can develop for the existing modules, and as you grow from the stamp/javalin you can take the modules with you onto the propeller....
James
The thing is, the Propeller can do such deeper and different things that many of those Stamp add-ons would be over-kill. For example, rather than hook up a Ping module, you could connect the ultrasonic transducers right to the Propeller (with maybe a few caps and resistors) and have an OBJect that performs the busy-work. This will integrate into your Propeller project much more deeply than the Ping would have. Now, you can have·a COG perpetually running the ultrasonic loop and reporting back to live variables what the measurements are. So, at your Spin level, you just read the variables. No digital protocols to 'intelligent' (read 'expensive') modules are required. I wish I had time to do just OBJect development, because this would be very fun work.
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Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.
Smaller is better since you can always wire it to a bigger board if necessary.
I'm really looking forward to the TV transmission thing.
My first game title will be called "FCC be damned".
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I wonder if this wire is hot...
How about increasing the via size by the leds on A16..23 so that it's easier to grab a few more i/o pins if needed for projects with things like keypads and matrixed leds.
I see what you're saying, but those pins have three networks of 240 and 470 ohm resistors attached to them for the VGA port. They are okay for outputing, but might make lousy inputs. Also, the holes would have to be spread out to .100" centers, causing things to crowd more. John Barrowman is making a "Professional Development Board" for the Propeller right now that is more generic than the Demo Board. Can I just send you one of those? I'm loathe to start changing the Demo Board again. Well, who knows? This may happen. I think I might have to make a few other minor changes, anyway. Thanks for the suggestion, in any case.
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Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.
I could see they can't be spread out to.100 without bloating the layout, and soldering in wires at finer pitch is nasty. Either the pdb or something like Phil's PropStick will be very convenient for larger scale prototyping, and plugging a DIP Propeller into a breadboard is easy enough.
Russ
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Truly Understand the Fundamentals and the Path will be so much easier...
Is this really okay or does it expose a hot lead on the edge of the board?
And, if you trim these boards during production, don't you risk loosing some of the wire?
Maybe I am a worry wart or just don't know enough about the production.
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"When all think alike, no one is thinking very much.' - Walter Lippmann (1889-1974)
······································································ Warm regards,····· G. Herzog [noparse][[/noparse]·黃鶴 ]·in Taiwan
Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.
I was comparing the new demo board with the beta one, and while the beta board made a8 and a9 available on the prototype connector, the new board has the sigma-delta circuit for the electret microphone on those pins. I do like that.
Questions though. What are the components?
* One element from top of electret to Vdd,-- bias resistor for the electret?
* One element from top of electret to a9 -- capacitor for coupling?
* One element from a9 to ground -- capacitor for delta-sigma with a9 as input?
* One element from a10 to a9 -- resistor for sigma-delta with a10 as feedback output?
Compare that with an earlier post, which is a more complicated circuit:
http://forums.parallax.com/forums/default.aspx?f=25&p=1&m=115264
That has two integration capacitors for symmetry. Also, I was wondering about the length of the traces. From earlier discussion I got the idea that the components practically had to be soldered to the pins of the Propeller in order for it to work correctly. Do you have some new insight on the layout and components?
In another item of related interest, a company has been advertising a new digital output MEMs microphone www.akustica.com/. I've ordered a data sheet and sample, but it looks like a wait. Apparently it reads the analog via sigma-delta, and its digital output is the resulting pulse-density modulation.
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Tracy Allen
www.emesystems.com
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Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.
www.akustica.com/documents/AKU2000ProductBrief.pdf
www.eetimes.com/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=180207742&pgno=1
Knowles already has a line of surface mount MEMS microphones:
www.knowlesacoustics.com/html/sil_mic.html
These are meant for voice and show a rising response at 8khz. They typically don't show what happens at high frequencies. We use certain Knowles microphones in the ultrasonic range, far above the data sheet limits.
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Tracy Allen
www.emesystems.com
In all honesty I am looking to hack the VGA port for now. I cannot seem to find the resistor values though I clearly see the DB15 output configuration.
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"When all think alike, no one is thinking very much.' - Walter Lippmann (1889-1974)
······································································ Warm regards,····· G. Herzog [noparse][[/noparse]·黃鶴 ]·in Taiwan
I guess it would be best to just wait and buy the board due to the question of stability.
So it is all NTSC and PAL for now.
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"When all think alike, no one is thinking very much.' - Walter Lippmann (1889-1974)
······································································ Warm regards,····· G. Herzog [noparse][[/noparse]·黃鶴 ]·in Taiwan
From A16 to A23....
240 - V (A16)
240 - H (A17)
470 - B (A18)
240 - B (A19)
470 - G (A20)
240 - G (A21)
470 - R (A22)
240 - R (A23)
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Beau Schwabe
IC Layout Engineer
Parallax, Inc.
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"When all think alike, no one is thinking very much.' - Walter Lippmann (1889-1974)
······································································ Warm regards,····· G. Herzog [noparse][[/noparse]·黃鶴 ]·in Taiwan
This is further born out by Beau's listing of the values and thier labels, you'll see two R (red), two G (green), and two B (blue).
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1+1=10
We are currently building 1,500 of these at Parallax and they will be available soon for $129.
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Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.
Post Edited (Chip Gracey (Parallax)) : 5/9/2006 5:42:50 PM GMT
Wow... the parts list as well... The only way I can mess up now is to do a poor job in making the board!
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Just tossing my two bits worth into the bit bucket
KK
·
Well, I keep flip-flopping as information comes in. Buy a TV, a Video Card, and/or another VGA.
I presumed the DACs were tiny ICs, but it appears that Chip has them created in software [noparse][[/noparse]as Virtual Peripherals].
I was misreading [noparse][[/noparse]mis-guessing] the LED indicators [noparse][[/noparse]nice feature] as being the DACs that Jon mentioned.
[noparse][[/noparse]I do now understand there are 3 required].
I would just like to say that a deeply appreciate Parallax's policy to freely publish this information. It really allows people to learn. Other vendors begrudge such info as proprietary and think it will get them more sales. Usually it does the opposite.
Happily I can now breadboard the VGA.
But, my conclusions are quite firm.
I will buy the DEMO board BECAUSE there are too many features to pack into a homebrew item without having a lot of trouble.· Having the Headphone Amp, the Mic, and the USB on board really cinch the deal.
Building can be fun, but it is not programing [noparse][[/noparse]which is really what the Propeller is about].
Just not buying the USB2SER·for my homebrew board·added at least a day in construction. And several days waiting for information to become clear.
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"When all think alike, no one is thinking very much.' - Walter Lippmann (1889-1974)
······································································ Warm regards,····· G. Herzog [noparse][[/noparse]·黃鶴 ]·in Taiwan
Post Edited (Kramer) : 5/10/2006 4:51:16 AM GMT
What you said makes me feel really good. I, too, am weary of this over-controlling attitude that dominates business nowadays. A few years ago, I had an epiphany and I came to the simple and sudden conclusion that no matter what they've got, if they act that way,·I DON'T NEED IT! Once I adopted this policy, things became a lot simpler and·clearer.·I realized that there had never been even a chance of real prosperity in dealing with them, anyway. To 'just say no' has been so liberating. Make the decision to do the same and see how things go.
The more of this entrenched pig-headedness·we see in the world, the more we realize that Parallax must be the opposite. It needs to be open and foster a sense of equity and belonging with·its customers. I don't feel that we are competing with other companies nearly so much as we are competing against this dark·mindset which is repulsive to the human spirit. In a way, it seems we can't loose. And if we do lose, we've fought the good fight.
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Chip Gracey
Parallax, Inc.
Post Edited (Chip Gracey (Parallax)) : 5/10/2006 8:48:41 AM GMT
(No password protected area, program only or similar. Besides that it would probably have made the design larger and more complicated)
BTW: Either you're somewhere in Europe, or you're burning up an awful lot of midnight-oil. Please don't do that... Sure, we'd grumble at not getting the next snippet of data as fast, but we'd really be P.O. if you burned yourself out...
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Don't visit my new website...
Nice! Any chance of a visible pin 1 marking on the QFP? Perhaps even (as deep luxury) a pin number on the corner pins?
I know it's probably too late, but I've got to ask...
Similarly, if the shells of the PS/2 connectors aren't grounded (are they? Hidden / implicit grounds are evil...) is there any chance of a couple of ground test points, to solder a bit of tinned copper wire between, to glomp 'scope grounds onto? I see a fair few hours playing with this board, and a handy ground is sooo nice [noparse]:)[/noparse]
Steve
From what I understand, once you book the sales, you are considered to have made the money. The accountant and the bank then are willing to figure that into making monthly payroll. I think someone said you have 38 employees to feed each month. With backlogs everywhere [noparse][[/noparse]Mouser is being slow to me, Digikey was slow...., writing documentation is slow...], I imagine it wouldn't hurt.
Two things have take a while for me to really believe.
1. Chip is not Ken in disguise.
2. These guys are really sincere.
SteveW,
The ground for a scope is an excellent idea!
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"When all think alike, no one is thinking very much.' - Walter Lippmann (1889-1974)
······································································ Warm regards,····· G. Herzog [noparse][[/noparse]·黃鶴 ]·in Taiwan
Post Edited (Kramer) : 5/10/2006 12:18:10 PM GMT
I've written a very simple speech recognition engine for low end embedded MCU's that I might want to port. Right now, it just recognizes "yes" and "no".
It's in C right now so it would probably be best to write it in spin first.
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www.speechchips.com
Speech & Video IC's for BasicStamps
Post Edited (KenLem) : 5/11/2006 12:39:18 PM GMT