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Interfacing a Stamp with a NON-Sony Infrared Controller — Parallax Forums

Interfacing a Stamp with a NON-Sony Infrared Controller

knightofoldcodeknightofoldcode Posts: 233
edited 2005-10-11 04:26 in BASIC Stamp
Group,

I need to be capable of decoding a infrared code from a remote that is proprietary.

The remote controls some medical equipment (nothing life risky). I'd like to be able to recieve the codes and retransmit them. I need to send the code back out an LED and into the computer.

My problem is figuring out how to capture the IR information. I know how to interface with the computer. What I don't know is how I would go about retransmitting it, and capturing it in the first place. I originally attempted to read the controller using the example code for the Sony remote, hoping that might work, it obviously didn't.

I'm willing to purchase a Stamp Logic Analyzer and a USB O-Scope from Parallax, if that will solve the problem. The usage is a critical thing. I purchased something from Smarthome to do the same stuff, and it was REALLY hard to interface, then it didn't work half the time. And the application that I have, I need it to work more reliable.

The IR transimission will be almost point blank, the recieving will be less than 30 feet, probably even less than 15 feet.

I am using a standard BS2, but if I need the speed I'm more than willing to upgrade to a BS2P.

My main question is finding out how to go about decoding this proprietary remote interface. I can tear apart the remote and find the IC number if that'd help. [noparse]:D[/noparse]

TIA,
Knight.

Comments

  • OrionOrion Posts: 236
    edited 2005-10-10 01:35
    I would start with an oscope on the IR transmitter of the sending unit, if you can crack it open. Granted it’s going to take some time to measure and document each code that could be used.
  • knightofoldcodeknightofoldcode Posts: 233
    edited 2005-10-10 02:15
    As with all medical equipment, this is a really expensive piece. Brand new, and about $20,000 (upside is it's a 20 year warranty, parts, labor, anything). For an area that actually starts most employee's at minimum wage. (Most houses in the area run in the 25,000 to 75,000 range) I'd really rather not have to do anything to the unti itself..... I was thinking I'd hook up a ir reciever to a basic stamp, and using the Logic Analyzer see what kinda information the remote outputs. Putting the ir reciver and remote inside a cardboard box (hey, it works perfect for my Tivo!).

    This way I never touched anything electrical with the medical device, and I won't have to worry about the warranty not being good.

    I say "medical device" like it's a big secret, I just didn't think anyone cares what it is, but it's a phorotor. Or, Refractor. They are the things that the eye doctors put in front of your face and move the lenses around, then get your prescription from. Only this one is controlled 100% with IR. And I need to integrate that refractor into my VB program.

    I'm just wondering if the Logic Analyzer can allow me to decipher the codes for the remote, in the way I mentioned above?

    Knight.
  • knightofoldcodeknightofoldcode Posts: 233
    edited 2005-10-10 02:24
    Oh, and a little bit of background. After tearing apart the remote control, I found that it has a chip in it labeled, 64F3664FP, below that it has H8/3664

    The H8/3664 in google turned it up as being a microcontroller. So this means it's not just a normal IR asic, it's a MCU. So, I can't just look up it's protocol. [noparse]:([/noparse]

    The IR LED looks pretty standard, so on second thought, hookin up a O-Scope to the LED's leads, might not be a bad idea...... It would eliminate the possibilty of the inaccuracys in timing on watching the actuall output from going through IR itself.....

    Knight.
  • Bruce BatesBruce Bates Posts: 3,045
    edited 2005-10-10 03:52
    Knight -

    You may want to take a look at this I/R Analyzer for less than $100.00 US:
    http://www.mpja.com/directview.asp?product=8837+RB

    Regards,

    Bruce Bates
  • knightofoldcodeknightofoldcode Posts: 233
    edited 2005-10-10 04:03
    Bruce Bates said...
    Knight -

    You may want to take a look at this I/R Analyzer for less than $100.00 US:
    http://www.mpja.com/directview.asp?product=8837+RB

    Regards,

    Bruce Bates

    Bruce,

    Looks interesting. But I would think that's it esecially similiar to the Stamp Logic Analyzer, with a IR detector on it. Right?

    I'd rather get a stamp logic analyzer, that way I can use it for the staps too....... Unless you can see some other difference to this IR analyzer that might make it werth the additional purchase. [noparse]:)[/noparse]

    I do appreciate the help though!

    I think what my main question outta be is, can the Stamp Logic Analyzer be used to determine the IR information from a non-sony remote?....

    Knight.
  • allanlane5allanlane5 Posts: 3,815
    edited 2005-10-10 14:05
    Yes, you need one of the "SSIR" sensors Parallax sells. Really, all you need is an "IR-Decoder" module -- a little three-pin active device, that looks for the 38 Khz modulated square wave (on == 38 Khz, off = silence) which makes up the 'front-end' of virtually all equipment IR recievers.

    The SSIR is nice, because it has an IR transmitting LED as well as the reciever in a nice, small, easily interfaced package.

    So, you connect this thing up, attach your logic analyzer, and aim your 'mystery device' remote at it. The logic analyzer should show you the stream of bits that the device sends.

    Now, generating that stream with a BS2 can be a problem. If you use a 555 timer to generate the 38 Khz signal, you can 'modulate' that signal using "PULSOUT" to generate your bits.· But at least this gives you a place to start.
  • Chris SavageChris Savage Parallax Engineering Posts: 14,406
    edited 2005-10-10 14:23
    Allan,

    ·· The SSIR is currently discontinued, so it can't be ordered right now.· I don't have a projected date on a return.

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Chris Savage
    Parallax Tech Support
    csavage@parallax.com
  • allanlane5allanlane5 Posts: 3,815
    edited 2005-10-10 14:57
    OK, it's not too hard to put together an SSIR from RadioShack parts. Basically an IR-LED, a current limiting resistor, and an IR-Decoder device.
  • Chris SavageChris Savage Parallax Engineering Posts: 14,406
    edited 2005-10-10 15:04
    Allan,

    ·· This is true, I just wanted to save someone calling in to order one and finding we don't have any.· =)

    ▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
    Chris Savage
    Parallax Tech Support
    csavage@parallax.com
  • Larry~Larry~ Posts: 242
    edited 2005-10-10 18:04
    I think all you will need is a radio shack metal can IR detector

    a bs2p may do the job bs2 is a bit slow and maybe 16 or so pulsin commands

    a scope would be nice but you can get by without

    the 16 pulsin commands will read the value of 16 pulses if your remote only uses 8 then fine you will only need

    8 commands ( it could use more )

    save the values of each pulsin and display using debug the value of pulsins will look like 288 150 150 288

    that would be something like 1001 or 0110 it really doesn't matter how you read it there is usually a start bit

    which is longer (ex. 400) so you just loop until you read a 400 then go on to the rest of the pulsin commands

    but to start you will just read all the pulsin commands just to get the timing correct and look for common

    factors· like example above 288 150 150 288 this will tell you the differance between low and high. all the

    numbers are examples not correct values just what may be streaming out of your remote.

    this should get you started.
  • Jayguy5000Jayguy5000 Posts: 139
    edited 2005-10-11 01:47
    hey knight, I have been trying to accomplish a similar task, I have a O-scope so i will be starting some experiments with that and maybe we can swap some info after some trial and error. my email address is kb3eez@aol.com
  • knightofoldcodeknightofoldcode Posts: 233
    edited 2005-10-11 04:14
    Jayguy5000 said...
    hey knight, I have been trying to accomplish a similar task, I have a O-scope so i will be starting some experiments with that and maybe we can swap some info after some trial and error. my email address is kb3eez@aol.com

    Gladly. I don't know how much help my experiences will be to you, since I'm using a Nidek Phorotor, but I'm going to be releaseing everything I find on the net. [noparse]:)[/noparse]

    Knight.
  • knightofoldcodeknightofoldcode Posts: 233
    edited 2005-10-11 04:26
    allanlane5 said...
    Yes, you need one of the "SSIR" sensors Parallax sells. Really, all you need is an "IR-Decoder" module -- a little three-pin active device, that looks for the 38 Khz modulated square wave (on == 38 Khz, off = silence) which makes up the 'front-end' of virtually all equipment IR recievers.

    The SSIR is nice, because it has an IR transmitting LED as well as the reciever in a nice, small, easily interfaced package.

    So, you connect this thing up, attach your logic analyzer, and aim your 'mystery device' remote at it. The logic analyzer should show you the stream of bits that the device sends.

    Now, generating that stream with a BS2 can be a problem. If you use a 555 timer to generate the 38 Khz signal, you can 'modulate' that signal using "PULSOUT" to generate your bits. But at least this gives you a place to start.

    Thanx! I have the following already:

    http://www.parallax.com/detail.asp?product_id=350-00018
    http://www.parallax.com/detail.asp?product_id=350-00014

    So, I think with these two, I should be able to do it. I did like the idea of it all being in one compact unit! But oh well, two separate components is fine.

    Just to clarify, the IR LED listed above is called a "IR Transistor", is there any difference in operation or even in connections to a normal LED? IE, if I'm using a 5v+ source, using a 470OHm Resistor should be fine as a current resistor, and nothing else needed?

    I ordered a Logic Analyzer, and a BS2 (All of my Basic Stamps are integrated, and I only purchase the PIC's themselves from Parallax, so I never had a true, "Stamp", just a "basic". [noparse]:D[/noparse]), via 2nd day air, so hopefully will get it Wednesday, so we'll see what I can do on Wednesday. I have tried to get the info without a scope, and I don't think there's anyway I can do it. Once I get the data, I'll try to figure things out on my own....however, I've NEVER had ANY success with IR in the past! I HATE IR. I can do all kinds of stuff, but NOT IR! lmao. I don't know why, but it NEVER works for me. (Except normal ALL for one remotes that I programed with the original remote) I've tried doing SIMPLE IR stuff, like detecting a beam, doesn't werk....

    TIA,
    Knight.
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