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Battery Backup (Lead Acid Battery) — Parallax Forums

Battery Backup (Lead Acid Battery)

ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
edited 2003-12-03 01:14 in General Discussion
I've built a few Alarm Systems using the BS2 and employed a battery
backup system using a standard battery pack as per ideas given in
this group (Using diodes). Using the same setup, I had hoped to
employ a Lead Acid Battery I got from B.G. Micro and have it stay
charged until needed. Anyone have any ideas on this? I have never
built a battery charger circuit before in which the battery was also
powering the device when main power was cut.

It seems to me Tracy or someone here mentioned at one time something
about how to connect the battery so that it's always got a trickle
charge. Remember, this is powering a BS2 Alarm System, so I want to
keep it simple.

To whomever did recommend a circuit at one point that preserved a
battery's charge, could it have been setup using a simple diode?

I will attempt yo search the archives as well...Thanks.

Chris Savage

Comments

  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-11-30 16:19
    Chris,

    I had a need also to charge Gel Cell batteries. After the major blackout we
    had here (Southern Ontario) in late August, I decided I needed a solution
    that would charge and maintain my battery collection.

    There were a few requirements that I had:
    - simple
    - would maintain a battery on charge indefinitely without the worry or
    overcharging it
    - low cost
    - readily available components

    Looked at several options and came up with a circuit using an LM317 and a
    handful of components. Take a look at: http://www.projectx.com/Kits/GelCell/

    It has full schematics, parts lists, theory of operation, setup instructions
    so you can DIY.

    John - VE3SVE

    Original Message
    From: Chris Savage [noparse]/noparse]mailto:[url=http://forums.parallaxinc.com/group/basicstamps/post?postID=B0_BngUsyI4X--WX846SpSt3hIPW4QN-6XhmRvQR-qt1YBhv4UqF2bsUasWLWyWzEdgkjXzs3rxWykSx2MJkrw]knight_designs@y...[/url
    Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 10:54 AM
    To: basicstamps@yahoogroups.com
    Subject: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Battery Backup (Lead Acid Battery)

    I've built a few Alarm Systems using the BS2 and employed a battery
    backup system using a standard battery pack as per ideas given in
    this group (Using diodes). Using the same setup, I had hoped to
    employ a Lead Acid Battery I got from B.G. Micro and have it stay
    charged until needed. Anyone have any ideas on this? I have never
    built a battery charger circuit before in which the battery was also
    powering the device when main power was cut.

    It seems to me Tracy or someone here mentioned at one time something
    about how to connect the battery so that it's always got a trickle
    charge. Remember, this is powering a BS2 Alarm System, so I want to
    keep it simple.

    To whomever did recommend a circuit at one point that preserved a
    battery's charge, could it have been setup using a simple diode?

    I will attempt yo search the archives as well...Thanks.

    Chris Savage


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  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-11-30 18:44
    You should be able to add a resistor directly between the transformer output
    and the battery to keep a trickle going. There's a few IC's out there that
    do a better job by monitoring the batteries voltage directly. Or perhaps
    consider just running the circuit off the battery 100% of the time and
    supplying a big enough charger to do both the battery and circuit draw.

    The biggest thing to be aware of is that all batteries technologies are not
    created equal, and lead-acid batteries have a totally different
    charging-curve than ni-cad or lithium-ion bats. All batteries are subject to
    damage or even explosion if over charged. That being said, if you're
    interested in a lead-acid trickle charger I could probably pick out the
    proper resistor values that would do the job. How big of a lead-acid battery
    are you using. Ni-Cads are a little trickier, and lithium -ion batteries are
    way beyond the scope of this course....

    Mike Sokol
    www.modernrecording.com
    mikes@m...

    " One should not increase, beyond what is necessary,
    the number of entities required to explain anything"...
    -William of Occam-


    Original Message
    From: "Chris Savage" <knight_designs@y...>
    To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
    Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 10:53 AM
    Subject: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Battery Backup (Lead Acid Battery)


    > I've built a few Alarm Systems using the BS2 and employed a battery
    > backup system using a standard battery pack as per ideas given in
    > this group (Using diodes). Using the same setup, I had hoped to
    > employ a Lead Acid Battery I got from B.G. Micro and have it stay
    > charged until needed. Anyone have any ideas on this? I have never
    > built a battery charger circuit before in which the battery was also
    > powering the device when main power was cut.
    >
    > It seems to me Tracy or someone here mentioned at one time something
    > about how to connect the battery so that it's always got a trickle
    > charge. Remember, this is powering a BS2 Alarm System, so I want to
    > keep it simple.
    >
    > To whomever did recommend a circuit at one point that preserved a
    > battery's charge, could it have been setup using a simple diode?
    >
    > I will attempt yo search the archives as well...Thanks.
    >
    > Chris Savage
    >
    >
    > To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
    > basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
    > from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject and
    Body of the message will be ignored.
    >
    >
    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
    >
    >
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-11-30 19:52
    >I've built a few Alarm Systems using the BS2 and employed a battery
    >backup system using a standard battery pack as per ideas given in
    >this group (Using diodes). Using the same setup, I had hoped to
    >employ a Lead Acid Battery I got from B.G. Micro and have it stay
    >charged until needed. Anyone have any ideas on this? I have never
    >built a battery charger circuit before in which the battery was also
    >powering the device when main power was cut.
    >
    >It seems to me Tracy or someone here mentioned at one time something
    >about how to connect the battery so that it's always got a trickle
    >charge. Remember, this is powering a BS2 Alarm System, so I want to
    >keep it simple.
    >
    >To whomever did recommend a circuit at one point that preserved a
    >battery's charge, could it have been setup using a simple diode?
    >
    >I will attempt yo search the archives as well...Thanks.
    >
    >Chris Savage


    Hi Chris,

    One simple solution is STMicroelectronics' PB137 regulator, a three
    terminal 13.7 volt regulator designed to float-charge 12 volt Pb-acid
    batteries. Find the data sheet on the Mouser site, where they cost
    50 cents ea.

    -- Tracy
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-11-30 21:20
    --- "John D. Kerr" <jdkerr@p...> wrote:
    > Chris,
    > I had a need also to charge Gel Cell batteries.
    > There were a few requirements that I had:
    > - simple
    > - would maintain a battery on charge indefinitely
    > without the worry or
    > overcharging it
    > - low cost
    > - readily available components
    > Looked at several options and came up with a circuit
    > using an LM317 and a
    > handful of components. Take a look at:
    > http://www.projectx.com/Kits/GelCell/

    John,
    While this looks like an excellent charger, my
    project calls for the battery to be charged until
    needed. Perhaps it's beyond the scope of asking in
    the group (Since it's really more about the power
    supply for a BS2 and not the BS2 itself). However, I
    was hoping to be able to have my BS2 run off a
    Wall-Wart or home-made supply (Which will include both
    5VDC & 12VDC outputs) and then if the AC power fails,
    the Lead Acid Battery would take over powering the
    circuit.

    Recently I have watched discussion regarding battery
    backups in BS2 circuits, and as I stated earlier, I
    was a part of an earlier one myself, but I wasn't sure
    if the same circuit would apply or not. I don't want
    the Lead Acid Battery to potentially lose it's charge
    over time, or, if when needed by the circuit, get low,
    then remain that way until next time it's needed.

    I guess what I'm asking is this: If you run the
    battery power to the regulator through a diode and do
    the same thing with the DC power from the Wal-Wart of
    supply, will the supply keep the battery charged
    through leakage via the diode.

    Somewhere back a ways was a discussion about
    this...But my connection keeps getting dropped
    everytime I start searching it seems... =(


    =====
    Chris Savage
    Knight Designs
    324 West Main Street
    Montour Falls, NY 14865
    (607) 535-6777

    http://www.knightdesigns.com

    __________________________________
    Do you Yahoo!?
    Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now
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  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-11-30 21:34
    --- Mike Sokol <mike.sokol@m...> wrote:
    > You should be able to add a resistor directly
    > between the transformer output
    > and the battery to keep a trickle going. There's a
    > few IC's out there that
    > do a better job by monitoring the batteries voltage
    > directly. Or perhaps
    > consider just running the circuit off the battery
    > 100% of the time and
    > supplying a big enough charger to do both the
    > battery and circuit draw.

    I could use a standard charging circuit if I have a
    relay switch over to the battery (While disconecting
    the battery from the charging circuit), however, I've
    no experience with that particular type of circuit.
    That is, switching without resetting or locking up my
    BS2. Any insights?

    > The biggest thing to be aware of is that all
    > batteries technologies are not
    > created equal, and lead-acid batteries have a
    > totally different
    > charging-curve than ni-cad or lithium-ion bats. All
    > batteries are subject to
    > damage or even explosion if over charged. That being
    > said, if you're
    > interested in a lead-acid trickle charger I could
    > probably pick out the
    > proper resistor values that would do the job. How
    > big of a lead-acid battery
    > are you using. Ni-Cads are a little trickier, and
    > lithium -ion batteries are
    > way beyond the scope of this course....

    This battery is, I believe a 12V 7mAh...


    =====
    Chris Savage
    Knight Designs
    324 West Main Street
    Montour Falls, NY 14865
    (607) 535-6777

    http://www.knightdesigns.com

    __________________________________
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    Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now
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  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-11-30 21:44
    --- Tracy Allen <tracy@e...> wrote:
    > Hi Chris,
    > One simple solution is STMicroelectronics' PB137
    > regulator, a three
    > terminal 13.7 volt regulator designed to
    > float-charge 12 volt Pb-acid
    > batteries. Find the data sheet on the Mouser site,
    > where they cost
    > 50 cents ea.

    Thanks Tracy...I will look it up...Hopefully this chip
    will help.



    =====
    Chris Savage
    Knight Designs
    324 West Main Street
    Montour Falls, NY 14865
    (607) 535-6777

    http://www.knightdesigns.com

    __________________________________
    Do you Yahoo!?
    Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now
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  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-11-30 23:16
    Hi Chris,

    If you have a sealed Pb-acid battery, it can be charged continuously
    at a constant voltage of around 13.6 to 13.8 volts. It will
    self-regulate to accept only the charging current that it needs. For
    example, if it is already charged, a 7 amp-hour battery will only
    suck up 10 or so milliamps. If the battery discharges during a
    power outage, then, when the power comes back, it will take a few
    hundred mA for a period of time and then taper off back to the 10 ma
    level.

    You asked about the charging circuit and maybe a diode, so you can
    both run your security system and keep the battery topped off at the
    same time. Very simple with float charging. Simply put the battery
    and the circuit in parallel on the 13.7 volt charger. No diode
    necessary.

    ;
    ; 13.7 volts
    wallwort+--| PB137 |----o
    ;
    `
    ' +| |+
    | battery circuit
    | | |
    o
    o
    '

    Notice that the PB137 touts as a feature that its leakage is only 10
    microamps, back into the regulator when the wallwort is disconnected
    or loses power. That is so that the battery won't discharge back
    into the regulator, and that means you don't need a blocking diode
    there. The dropout voltage of the regulator is 2 volts, so you need
    a wallwort capable of 16 volts.

    BTW. there are quite a number of Pb-acid chargers available in the
    form of wallworts (very cheap, too), but you can't use those in the
    above circuit. That is because they are (usually) automatic fast
    chargers, that allow the battery to fast-charge up to 14.2 volts, and
    then, when the current tapers off, the charger automatically switches
    back to 13.8 volt float charging. You can't run that in parallel
    with a circuit, because the circuit might hold the charger at the
    dangerous 14.2 volt level and overcharge and dry out the battery.
    What you want is a float charger for your backup, period.

    -- Tracy



    >--- Tracy Allen <tracy@e...> wrote:
    >> Hi Chris,
    >> One simple solution is STMicroelectronics' PB137
    >> regulator, a three
    >> terminal 13.7 volt regulator designed to
    >> float-charge 12 volt Pb-acid
    >> batteries. Find the data sheet on the Mouser site,
    >> where they cost
    >> 50 cents ea.
    >
    >Thanks Tracy...I will look it up...Hopefully this chip
    >will help.
    >
    >
    >
    >=====
    >Chris Savage
    >Knight Designs
    >324 West Main Street
    >Montour Falls, NY 14865
    >(607) 535-6777
    >
    >http://www.knightdesigns.com
    >
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-12-02 02:39
    --- Tracy Allen <tracy@e...> wrote:
    > Hi Chris,
    > If you have a sealed Pb-acid battery, it can be
    > charged continuously
    > at a constant voltage of around 13.6 to 13.8 volts.

    <trimmed>

    > Notice that the PB137 touts as a feature that its
    > leakage is only 10
    > microamps, back into the regulator when the wallwort
    > is disconnected
    > or loses power. That is so that the battery won't
    > discharge back
    > into the regulator, and that means you don't need a
    > blocking diode
    > there. The dropout voltage of the regulator is 2
    > volts, so you need
    > a wallwort capable of 16 volts.

    <trimmed>

    Tracy,
    This sounds like exactly what I need...Not what I
    expected, but then, I wasn't familiar with the PB137.
    I guess I'll have to get a few of these, and thanks
    for the info. This project has set on the bench for
    awhile because it's for my own personal use (As are
    all experimental projects)...I bought the battery to
    tinker with ideas, but probably should've read a few
    books on these type of batteris. But thanks again for
    the crash course.



    =====
    Chris Savage
    Knight Designs
    324 West Main Street
    Montour Falls, NY 14865
    (607) 535-6777

    http://www.knightdesigns.com

    __________________________________
    Do you Yahoo!?
    Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now
    http://companion.yahoo.com/
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-12-02 06:43
    Chris,

    This might be a solution for you.
    http://www.farcircuits.net/battery2.htm#2battery This charger uses the
    UC3906 chip specifically for sealed lead-acid batteries. I don't have the
    magazine article with me right now, but it provides one voltage and current
    while the battery is charging, another for the last 5-10% of charge, and a
    third when the battery is topped off.

    If you know any amateur radio operators (or are one yourself), find a copy
    of the 1992 Radio Amateur's Handbook by the ARRL. This project appeared in
    Chapter 27, figure 66. I just received the circuit board and IC, but I
    haven't assembled it yet so I can't give any real feedback.

    Also, I found this while searching Google for project above...
    http://www.geocities.com/vk3em/sla-charger/sla-charger.html This also uses
    the UC3906 chip. There is a higher parts count, and I haven't read the
    article closely enough to know if its better, but at least it has the theory
    of operation of the chip.

    Good luck!
    Brian, N7QJB

    >Message: 14
    > Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 13:20:22 -0800 (PST)
    > From: Chris Savage <knight_designs@y...>
    > Subject: RE: Battery Backup (Lead Acid Battery)
    >
    > --- "John D. Kerr" <jdkerr@p...> wrote:
    > > Chris,
    > > I had a need also to charge Gel Cell batteries.
    > > There were a few requirements that I had:
    > > - simple
    > > - would maintain a battery on charge indefinitely
    > > without the worry or
    > > overcharging it
    > > - low cost
    > > - readily available components
    > > Looked at several options and came up with a circuit
    > > using an LM317 and a
    > > handful of components. Take a look at:
    > > http://www.projectx.com/Kits/GelCell/
    >
    > John,
    > While this looks like an excellent charger, my
    > project calls for the battery to be charged until
    > needed. Perhaps it's beyond the scope of asking in
    > the group (Since it's really more about the power
    > supply for a BS2 and not the BS2 itself). However, I
    > was hoping to be able to have my BS2 run off a
    > Wall-Wart or home-made supply (Which will include both
    > 5VDC & 12VDC outputs) and then if the AC power fails,
    > the Lead Acid Battery would take over powering the
    > circuit.
    >
    > Recently I have watched discussion regarding battery
    > backups in BS2 circuits, and as I stated earlier, I
    > was a part of an earlier one myself, but I wasn't sure
    > if the same circuit would apply or not. I don't want
    > the Lead Acid Battery to potentially lose it's charge
    > over time, or, if when needed by the circuit, get low,
    > then remain that way until next time it's needed.
    >
    > I guess what I'm asking is this: If you run the
    > battery power to the regulator through a diode and do
    > the same thing with the DC power from the Wal-Wart of
    > supply, will the supply keep the battery charged
    > through leakage via the diode.
    >
    > Somewhere back a ways was a discussion about
    > this...But my connection keeps getting dropped
    > everytime I start searching it seems... =(
    >
    >
    > =====
    > Chris Savage
    > Knight Designs
    > 324 West Main Street
    > Montour Falls, NY 14865
    > (607) 535-6777
    >
    > http://www.knightdesigns.com
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-12-02 06:57
    I also forgot about A&A Engineering (http://www.a-aengineering.com/). They
    have a couple of complete kits.

    Brian, N7QJB

    Original Message
    From: "Brian Grimm" <n7qjb@m...>
    To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
    Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 11:43 PM
    Subject: RE: Battery Backup (Lead Acid Battery)


    > Chris,
    >
    > This might be a solution for you.
    > http://www.farcircuits.net/battery2.htm#2battery This charger uses the
    > UC3906 chip specifically for sealed lead-acid batteries. I don't have the
    > magazine article with me right now, but it provides one voltage and
    current
    > while the battery is charging, another for the last 5-10% of charge, and a
    > third when the battery is topped off.
    >
    > If you know any amateur radio operators (or are one yourself), find a copy
    > of the 1992 Radio Amateur's Handbook by the ARRL. This project appeared
    in
    > Chapter 27, figure 66. I just received the circuit board and IC, but I
    > haven't assembled it yet so I can't give any real feedback.
    >
    > Also, I found this while searching Google for project above...
    > http://www.geocities.com/vk3em/sla-charger/sla-charger.html This also
    uses
    > the UC3906 chip. There is a higher parts count, and I haven't read the
    > article closely enough to know if its better, but at least it has the
    theory
    > of operation of the chip.
    >
    > Good luck!
    > Brian, N7QJB
    >
    > >Message: 14
    > > Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 13:20:22 -0800 (PST)
    > > From: Chris Savage <knight_designs@y...>
    > > Subject: RE: Battery Backup (Lead Acid Battery)
    > >
    > > --- "John D. Kerr" <jdkerr@p...> wrote:
    > > > Chris,
    > > > I had a need also to charge Gel Cell batteries.
    > > > There were a few requirements that I had:
    > > > - simple
    > > > - would maintain a battery on charge indefinitely
    > > > without the worry or
    > > > overcharging it
    > > > - low cost
    > > > - readily available components
    > > > Looked at several options and came up with a circuit
    > > > using an LM317 and a
    > > > handful of components. Take a look at:
    > > > http://www.projectx.com/Kits/GelCell/
    > >
    > > John,
    > > While this looks like an excellent charger, my
    > > project calls for the battery to be charged until
    > > needed. Perhaps it's beyond the scope of asking in
    > > the group (Since it's really more about the power
    > > supply for a BS2 and not the BS2 itself). However, I
    > > was hoping to be able to have my BS2 run off a
    > > Wall-Wart or home-made supply (Which will include both
    > > 5VDC & 12VDC outputs) and then if the AC power fails,
    > > the Lead Acid Battery would take over powering the
    > > circuit.
    > >
    > > Recently I have watched discussion regarding battery
    > > backups in BS2 circuits, and as I stated earlier, I
    > > was a part of an earlier one myself, but I wasn't sure
    > > if the same circuit would apply or not. I don't want
    > > the Lead Acid Battery to potentially lose it's charge
    > > over time, or, if when needed by the circuit, get low,
    > > then remain that way until next time it's needed.
    > >
    > > I guess what I'm asking is this: If you run the
    > > battery power to the regulator through a diode and do
    > > the same thing with the DC power from the Wal-Wart of
    > > supply, will the supply keep the battery charged
    > > through leakage via the diode.
    > >
    > > Somewhere back a ways was a discussion about
    > > this...But my connection keeps getting dropped
    > > everytime I start searching it seems... =(
    > >
    > >
    > > =====
    > > Chris Savage
    > > Knight Designs
    > > 324 West Main Street
    > > Montour Falls, NY 14865
    > > (607) 535-6777
    > >
    > > http://www.knightdesigns.com
    >
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-12-02 18:20
    --- Tracy Allen <tracy@e...> wrote:
    > Hi Chris,
    > If you have a sealed Pb-acid battery, it can be
    > charged continuously
    > at a constant voltage of around 13.6 to 13.8 volts.

    <message trimmed>

    Tracy, the battery (I am at the shop now) is a
    Universal Battery UB1213, Non-Spillable Sealed
    Lead-Acid Battery. Says on it:

    Constant Voltage Charge Volt Reg Init Current
    @20 degrees Celcius

    STANDBY USE 13.5-13.8V NO LIMIT
    CYCLIC USE 14.0-15.0V 0.38A MAX

    (That was supposed to be a table)

    > Notice that the PB137 touts as a feature that its

    <trimmed>

    Also, what is the PB137? I looked at my VR listing
    last night and did not see that part # listed. Does
    it cross with something else?

    Thanks!



    =====
    Chris Savage
    Knight Designs
    324 West Main Street
    Montour Falls, NY 14865
    (607) 535-6777

    http://www.knightdesigns.com

    __________________________________
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    Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now
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  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-12-02 18:26
    --- Brian Grimm <n7qjb@m...> wrote:
    > Chris,
    > This might be a solution for you.
    > http://www.farcircuits.net/battery2.htm#2battery

    <trimmed>

    No schematic, circuit diagram or pics... =(

    > If you know any amateur radio operators (or are one
    > yourself), find a copy
    > of the 1992 Radio Amateur's Handbook by the ARRL.

    <trimmed>

    I do know one (N2UZQ), and if I ever hear from him
    again, I will see if he has it. Until then I am going
    to attempt Tracy's idea. Meanwhile, if you do happen
    to build it, post for us how well it works. Thanks!



    =====
    Chris Savage
    Knight Designs
    324 West Main Street
    Montour Falls, NY 14865
    (607) 535-6777

    http://www.knightdesigns.com

    __________________________________
    Do you Yahoo!?
    Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now
    http://companion.yahoo.com/
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-12-02 20:51
    >--- Tracy Allen <tracy@e...> wrote:
    >> Hi Chris,
    >> If you have a sealed Pb-acid battery, it can be
    >> charged continuously
    >> at a constant voltage of around 13.6 to 13.8 volts.
    >
    ><message trimmed>
    >
    >Tracy, the battery (I am at the shop now) is a
    >Universal Battery UB1213, Non-Spillable Sealed
    >Lead-Acid Battery. Says on it:
    >
    >Constant Voltage Charge Volt Reg Init Current
    >@20 degrees Celcius
    >
    >STANDBY USE 13.5-13.8V NO LIMIT


    This standby charging is what the PB137 does. It is a 13.7 volt regulator.

    >CYCLIC USE 14.0-15.0V 0.38A MAX


    These batteries can be fast charged to a voltage of 14 to 15 volts.
    Some automatic or "two- or three-step" fast chargers have been
    mentioned in response to your query. An automatic fast charger is a
    more sophisticated circuit. It has to limit the initial current, to
    less than 0.38 amp in this case, and they have to know when to
    switch from fast charging at the higher voltage back to standby
    charging at ~13.7 volts. A fast charger can be designed to power an
    external load as well as charge the battery, but it has to monitor
    the battery current separate from the load current. The best ones
    also monitor temperature, too. Like I said, more sophisticated.

    You have a 12 volt, 1.3 amp-hour battery, I think.

    The current limiting on the PB137 is about 2.5 amps, which is not
    well matched to a 1.3 amp-hour battery. But in standby use, it
    should not be a problem. Many batteries are self-limiting in
    standby, and the "NO LIMIT" designation suggests that it might be
    true of this battery. A way to be safe about it is to use a 16 volt
    power adapter rated at about 400 milliamps. That would serve to
    limit the inrush current to the battery should it become severely
    depleted.

    Charging at 13.7 volt is typical at around room temperature, say from
    40 to 100 Fahrenheit. Very cold environments take a higher voltage,
    and very hot places a lower voltage. All these gritty details are in
    manufacturer's literature.

    >
    >(That was supposed to be a table)
    >
    >> Notice that the PB137 touts as a feature that its
    >
    ><trimmed>
    >
    >Also, what is the PB137? I looked at my VR listing
    >last night and did not see that part # listed. Does
    >it cross with something else?


    Go to http://www.mouser.com, and enter "PB137" into the search box.
    It will come up there, and you will also find a link to technical
    info, a pdf data sheet here:
    http://www.STmicroelectronics.com/stonline/books/pdf/docs/6278.pdf

    The battery needs to be matched to the current drain of the system
    and the length of time the battery would have to cover a power
    failure. And the risk factors of having it fail in a longer than
    expected power failure.

    I've used this chip. But not for solar chargers. It works there
    too, but its quiessent current of 4ma and its dropout voltage of 2
    volts are not that great for small solar apps.

    -- Tracy


    >
    >Thanks!
    >
    >
    >
    >=====
    >Chris Savage
    >Knight Designs
    >324 West Main Street
    >Montour Falls, NY 14865
    >(607) 535-6777
    >
    >http://www.knightdesigns.com
    >
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  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2003-12-03 01:14
    About five years ago (maybe more) I built the A&A charger kit and it has
    been in constant use since then and works as advertised. Have had the same
    battery for all this time and it is still in excellent shape.

    Al, W3AL

    Original Message
    From: "Brian Grimm" <n7qjb@m...>
    To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
    Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2003 1:57 AM
    Subject: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Re: Battery Backup (Lead Acid Battery)


    > I also forgot about A&A Engineering (http://www.a-aengineering.com/).
    They
    > have a couple of complete kits.
    >
    > Brian, N7QJB
    >
    >
    Original Message
    > From: "Brian Grimm" <n7qjb@m...>
    > To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
    > Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 11:43 PM
    > Subject: RE: Battery Backup (Lead Acid Battery)
    >
    >
    > > Chris,
    > >
    > > This might be a solution for you.
    > > http://www.farcircuits.net/battery2.htm#2battery This charger uses the
    > > UC3906 chip specifically for sealed lead-acid batteries. I don't have
    the
    > > magazine article with me right now, but it provides one voltage and
    > current
    > > while the battery is charging, another for the last 5-10% of charge, and
    a
    > > third when the battery is topped off.
    > >
    > > If you know any amateur radio operators (or are one yourself), find a
    copy
    > > of the 1992 Radio Amateur's Handbook by the ARRL. This project appeared
    > in
    > > Chapter 27, figure 66. I just received the circuit board and IC, but I
    > > haven't assembled it yet so I can't give any real feedback.
    > >
    > > Also, I found this while searching Google for project above...
    > > http://www.geocities.com/vk3em/sla-charger/sla-charger.html This also
    > uses
    > > the UC3906 chip. There is a higher parts count, and I haven't read the
    > > article closely enough to know if its better, but at least it has the
    > theory
    > > of operation of the chip.
    > >
    > > Good luck!
    > > Brian, N7QJB
    > >
    > > >Message: 14
    > > > Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 13:20:22 -0800 (PST)
    > > > From: Chris Savage <knight_designs@y...>
    > > > Subject: RE: Battery Backup (Lead Acid Battery)
    > > >
    > > > --- "John D. Kerr" <jdkerr@p...> wrote:
    > > > > Chris,
    > > > > I had a need also to charge Gel Cell batteries.
    > > > > There were a few requirements that I had:
    > > > > - simple
    > > > > - would maintain a battery on charge indefinitely
    > > > > without the worry or
    > > > > overcharging it
    > > > > - low cost
    > > > > - readily available components
    > > > > Looked at several options and came up with a circuit
    > > > > using an LM317 and a
    > > > > handful of components. Take a look at:
    > > > > http://www.projectx.com/Kits/GelCell/
    > > >
    > > > John,
    > > > While this looks like an excellent charger, my
    > > > project calls for the battery to be charged until
    > > > needed. Perhaps it's beyond the scope of asking in
    > > > the group (Since it's really more about the power
    > > > supply for a BS2 and not the BS2 itself). However, I
    > > > was hoping to be able to have my BS2 run off a
    > > > Wall-Wart or home-made supply (Which will include both
    > > > 5VDC & 12VDC outputs) and then if the AC power fails,
    > > > the Lead Acid Battery would take over powering the
    > > > circuit.
    > > >
    > > > Recently I have watched discussion regarding battery
    > > > backups in BS2 circuits, and as I stated earlier, I
    > > > was a part of an earlier one myself, but I wasn't sure
    > > > if the same circuit would apply or not. I don't want
    > > > the Lead Acid Battery to potentially lose it's charge
    > > > over time, or, if when needed by the circuit, get low,
    > > > then remain that way until next time it's needed.
    > > >
    > > > I guess what I'm asking is this: If you run the
    > > > battery power to the regulator through a diode and do
    > > > the same thing with the DC power from the Wal-Wart of
    > > > supply, will the supply keep the battery charged
    > > > through leakage via the diode.
    > > >
    > > > Somewhere back a ways was a discussion about
    > > > this...But my connection keeps getting dropped
    > > > everytime I start searching it seems... =(
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > =====
    > > > Chris Savage
    > > > Knight Designs
    > > > 324 West Main Street
    > > > Montour Falls, NY 14865
    > > > (607) 535-6777
    > > >
    > > > http://www.knightdesigns.com
    > >
    >
    >
    >
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