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Stepper ? — Parallax Forums

Stepper ?

ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
edited 2002-11-03 16:11 in General Discussion
Am I correct to assume that if I have a 3 volt stepper and a 10v power
supply, I can safely PWM the 10v supply to 30% and enjoy additional torque?
Is this what they call a "Chopper Drive?
Can I apply a 30% pwm signal to the drain of a transistor as long as the
freq is much faster than my step sequence?
any help or link would be greatly appreciated.

Jeff

Comments

  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-11-02 04:12
    At 22:51 11/01/02, Jeff Mitchell wrote:
    > Am I correct to assume that if I have a 3 volt stepper and a 10v power
    >supply, I can safely PWM the 10v supply to 30% and enjoy additional torque?
    >Is this what they call a "Chopper Drive?

    No, but you can use your 10-volt supply with your 3-volt stepper if you put
    a resistor in series with each winding to assure you limit the current to
    the specified value for the stepper.

    PWM and "chopper drives" are used with standard DC motors, not stepper motors.

    >Can I apply a 30% pwm signal to the drain of a transistor as long as the
    >freq is much faster than my step sequence?

    That isn't how a stepper works. A stepper doesn't work by just pulsing the
    current to the windings; it works by applying current to the windings in a
    specific sequence.

    Go to http://www.google.com and search for "stepper motor" and you'll get a
    zillion hits on more info.


    Jim H
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-11-02 14:26
    Thanks for your reply Jim.
    I do have the stepper operational at this point and I do understand the
    stepper sequencing. Instead of providing a second low voltage power supply
    for the steppers in this stamp project,I would like to be able to PWM my
    main supply voltage down to a voltage specified by the manufacturer. I
    bought a stepper/linear actuator from Hayden Switch and Insturment. The
    person I talked with on the phone explained that the torque figures in the
    specs were obtained with a chopper drive. My question should have read: Can
    I PWM the supply voltage for the transisters at each of my stepper windings?
    Sorry for the elementary questions that are not directly stamp related.

    Original Message
    From: Jim Higgins [noparse]/noparse]mailto:[url=http://forums.parallaxinc.com/group/basicstamps/post?postID=bWMMr3VVncNgc1l6h9oHuahtak94X2Y8iDw5Viu4y7P81vfTqwqxU4JJCVd3sbGLxii4eKZoDgPHk88]HigginsJ@s...[/url
    Sent: Friday, November 01, 2002 11:12 PM
    To: basicstamps@yahoogroups.com
    Subject: Re: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Stepper ?


    At 22:51 11/01/02, Jeff Mitchell wrote:
    > Am I correct to assume that if I have a 3 volt stepper and a 10v power
    >supply, I can safely PWM the 10v supply to 30% and enjoy additional torque?
    >Is this what they call a "Chopper Drive?

    No, but you can use your 10-volt supply with your 3-volt stepper if you put
    a resistor in series with each winding to assure you limit the current to
    the specified value for the stepper.

    PWM and "chopper drives" are used with standard DC motors, not stepper
    motors.

    >Can I apply a 30% pwm signal to the drain of a transistor as long as the
    >freq is much faster than my step sequence?

    That isn't how a stepper works. A stepper doesn't work by just pulsing the
    current to the windings; it works by applying current to the windings in a
    specific sequence.

    Go to http://www.google.com and search for "stepper motor" and you'll get a
    zillion hits on more info.


    Jim H


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  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-11-02 14:30
    YES, but if you can find a 24 volt power supply, you will get a
    little better performance, 48 even better 60volts is a great target
    if you have the potential.

    Try for between 5 and 25 times the nameplate voltage.
    Current is fixed. the listed current is what is needed to energize
    the coils. Power output increases proportionally with supply voltage.
    Losses in the motor increase with the square of the voltage. At some
    point the motor just gets too hot.

    There are two places to search
    jones on steppers. very good tutorial and will explain why you don't
    want to use a unipolar drive with a resistor as the current limit.
    My 1.7 volt, 4.5 amp steppers run on 35 volts. figure out how big the
    resistor is, how much it would cost, and how much voltage it would
    drop. then figure out how to shed the heat

    The second place is www.geckodrives.com and read the white paper
    about power supplies.

    Another thing is that if you build larger units. I have 4 steppers
    rated as above, your switching power supply may have a problem. it
    is not desigend for that type of load. Much better with a
    transformer, rectifier and capacitor. actually a big capacitor.
    And remember that DC voltage will be 1.414 time AC when you rectify
    and put in the large capacitor. so your 24v transformer will really
    offer a 34 volt power supply.


    One note is that pac-sci motors may already be rated for 20x. the
    nameplate may list 35v. if you do the math on wattage, the voltage
    would be much lower.

    Steppers are an odd device in that the nameplate rating is the
    testing point for induction and capacatance. LC.

    Go to the stepper motor manufacturers web site and you'll see the
    performance graphs listed way higher than your nameplate voltage.

    Dave





    --- In basicstamps@y..., "Jeff Mitchell" <EL-JEFE@P...> wrote:
    > Am I correct to assume that if I have a 3 volt stepper and a 10v
    power
    > supply, I can safely PWM the 10v supply to 30% and enjoy additional
    torque?
    > Is this what they call a "Chopper Drive?
    > Can I apply a 30% pwm signal to the drain of a transistor as long
    as the
    > freq is much faster than my step sequence?
    > any help or link would be greatly appreciated.
    >
    > Jeff
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-11-03 13:08
    hi jim if you put a resistor in the legs of the stepper motor you are
    wasting power. why not use a lm317 voltage regulator to regulate the voltage
    to 3 volts
    neil
    Original Message
    From: "Jim Higgins" <HigginsJ@s...>
    To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
    Sent: Friday, November 01, 2002 11:12 PM
    Subject: Re: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Stepper ?


    > At 22:51 11/01/02, Jeff Mitchell wrote:
    > > Am I correct to assume that if I have a 3 volt stepper and a 10v power
    > >supply, I can safely PWM the 10v supply to 30% and enjoy additional
    torque?
    > >Is this what they call a "Chopper Drive?
    >
    > No, but you can use your 10-volt supply with your 3-volt stepper if you
    put
    > a resistor in series with each winding to assure you limit the current to
    > the specified value for the stepper.
    >
    > PWM and "chopper drives" are used with standard DC motors, not stepper
    motors.
    >
    > >Can I apply a 30% pwm signal to the drain of a transistor as long as the
    > >freq is much faster than my step sequence?
    >
    > That isn't how a stepper works. A stepper doesn't work by just pulsing
    the
    > current to the windings; it works by applying current to the windings in a
    > specific sequence.
    >
    > Go to http://www.google.com and search for "stepper motor" and you'll get
    a
    > zillion hits on more info.
    >
    >
    > Jim H
    >
    >
    > To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
    > basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
    > from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject and
    Body of the message will be ignored.
    >
    >
    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
    >
    >
    >
    >
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-11-03 16:11
    Hi Neil,

    the stepper requires the amps to spin, and amps are the limiting
    factor.

    the induction load of a non-moving motor is near infinity and will
    draw an infinite ammount of amps.

    how to they put it ? Pop! goes the Weasle.

    the resistor us a cheap way to get a uni-polar motor to spin when you
    don't need either power or speed, and you have a small motor. Floppy
    disk drive for example.

    (yes, a stepper can get high speeds, but that is dependant on size
    and number of steps per rev. a floppy or CD motor to spin are
    typically around 50 steps per rev, whereas a floppy head posistoning
    motor might be 200 or 400 steps per revolution.)

    The limiting resistor provides that protection. The chopper drive
    allows the needed power to get to the motor without the heat.

    Dave






    --- In basicstamps@y..., "Neil Excel Representative"
    <excelneil@m...> wrote:
    > hi jim if you put a resistor in the legs of the stepper motor you
    are
    > wasting power. why not use a lm317 voltage regulator to regulate
    the voltage
    > to 3 volts
    > neil
    >
    Original Message
    > From: "Jim Higgins" <HigginsJ@s...>
    > To: <basicstamps@y...>
    > Sent: Friday, November 01, 2002 11:12 PM
    > Subject: Re: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Stepper ?
    >
    >
    > > At 22:51 11/01/02, Jeff Mitchell wrote:
    > > > Am I correct to assume that if I have a 3 volt stepper and a
    10v power
    > > >supply, I can safely PWM the 10v supply to 30% and enjoy
    additional
    > torque?
    > > >Is this what they call a "Chopper Drive?
    > >
    > > No, but you can use your 10-volt supply with your 3-volt stepper
    if you
    > put
    > > a resistor in series with each winding to assure you limit the
    current to
    > > the specified value for the stepper.
    > >
    > > PWM and "chopper drives" are used with standard DC motors, not
    stepper
    > motors.
    > >
    > > >Can I apply a 30% pwm signal to the drain of a transistor as
    long as the
    > > >freq is much faster than my step sequence?
    > >
    > > That isn't how a stepper works. A stepper doesn't work by just
    pulsing
    > the
    > > current to the windings; it works by applying current to the
    windings in a
    > > specific sequence.
    > >
    > > Go to http://www.google.com and search for "stepper motor" and
    you'll get
    > a
    > > zillion hits on more info.
    > >
    > >
    > > Jim H
    > >
    > >
    > > To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
    > > basicstamps-unsubscribe@y...
    > > from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the
    Subject and
    > Body of the message will be ignored.
    > >
    > >
    > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
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