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Voltage Conversion - UP — Parallax Forums

Voltage Conversion - UP

ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
edited 2002-04-01 16:27 in General Discussion
Is there a decent circuit to be had that will allow me to make a 12v 20 Ah
battery supply (safely and smoothly) 14v at some still respectable current?
I have a robot that has a pair of 12v battery supplies, but I'd like to step
the upper electronics lines to 14v and then regulate them down to 12v again
for line stability.
I have video and audio circuits that are voltage sensitive and I'd rather
spend the batteries capabilities quicker at a higher voltage than deal with
the noise of 11.5v or so over a longer period. The motors are on the second
battery and aren't voltage sensitive, so my current requirements are
probably under 1500 mA.
Hopefully I have made my goal clear. (°;

TIA!

---

Jeff Abrams
clavier@b...

SUPERCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 2.5 liter 1993 Mazda MX-3 GS
http://www.mazdamaniac.com
TURBOCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 1.8 liter 1997 Mazda MX-5 Miata


A PBS mind in an MTV world.

Comments

  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-03-28 20:18
    If you took your 12 volt battery and two or more 1.2 volt D cells in
    series this would et you 12.6 (assuming a lead acid battery) + 2.4
    volts. Is that close enough? The current requirements are in line. A
    'D' size rechargeable Nicad could easily handle 1500 MA..

    regards,

    Leroy

    Jeff Abrams wrote:
    >
    > Is there a decent circuit to be had that will allow me to make a 12v 20 Ah
    > battery supply (safely and smoothly) 14v at some still respectable current?
    > I have a robot that has a pair of 12v battery supplies, but I'd like to step
    > the upper electronics lines to 14v and then regulate them down to 12v again
    > for line stability.
    > I have video and audio circuits that are voltage sensitive and I'd rather
    > spend the batteries capabilities quicker at a higher voltage than deal with
    > the noise of 11.5v or so over a longer period. The motors are on the second
    > battery and aren't voltage sensitive, so my current requirements are
    > probably under 1500 mA.
    > Hopefully I have made my goal clear. (°;
    >
    > TIA!
    >
    > ---
    >
    > Jeff Abrams
    > clavier@b...
    >
    > SUPERCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 2.5 liter 1993 Mazda MX-3 GS
    > http://www.mazdamaniac.com
    > TURBOCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 1.8 liter 1997 Mazda MX-5 Miata
    >
    > A PBS mind in an MTV world.
    >
    > To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
    > basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
    > from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject and Body
    of the message will be ignored.
    >
    >
    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-03-28 22:30
    I'm having a hard time understanding your needs. You've got 12. You want to
    take part of that and clean it up? Putting cells in series as one list member
    suggested would work, but you might find it tricky getting the capacities
    matched such that all your batteries give you the same life. In other words, do
    you care if you're always replacing the D batteries but not the others?

    I would look at DC/DC converters. They're all over the net, so you should be
    able to find the capacity (amps) and price that fits your needs. Good luck.

    Clark Hughes

    Jeff Abrams wrote:
    >
    > Is there a decent circuit to be had that will allow me to make a 12v 20 Ah
    > battery supply (safely and smoothly) 14v at some still respectable current?
    > I have a robot that has a pair of 12v battery supplies, but I'd like to step
    > the upper electronics lines to 14v and then regulate them down to 12v again
    > for line stability.
    > I have video and audio circuits that are voltage sensitive and I'd rather
    > spend the batteries capabilities quicker at a higher voltage than deal with
    > the noise of 11.5v or so over a longer period. The motors are on the second
    > battery and aren't voltage sensitive, so my current requirements are
    > probably under 1500 mA.
    > Hopefully I have made my goal clear. (°;
    >
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-03-29 08:23
    Hi Jeff,

    A 12V lead acid battery will typically stay at about 13 volts through
    most of its discharge curve. As for stability, a battery of 20 Ah has a
    low internal impeadence . DC-DC converters by their nature are noisy. If
    you're worried about volt drop down cables and noise affecting control
    circuits. Separate the control circuit cabling from the power circuit.
    As for adding "unmatched" cells to a battery, this can cause problems as
    the battery discharges. In fact you can get cell polarity reversal.

    Rob


    Original Message
    From: Jeff Abrams [noparse]/noparse]mailto:[url=http://forums.parallaxinc.com/group/basicstamps/post?postID=Z5mppbCa_RE8Z9Yti-6zB2M0DP0FGMp4_CmHIW_ZOCwO2KpNtws4GTtOqYUDEmac1fPrz76kC3B2NbcZox8khvk]clavier@b...[/url
    Sent: 28 March 2002 19:47
    To: Basicstamps@Yahoogroups. Com
    Subject: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Voltage Conversion - UP

    Is there a decent circuit to be had that will allow me to make a 12v 20
    Ah
    battery supply (safely and smoothly) 14v at some still respectable
    current?
    I have a robot that has a pair of 12v battery supplies, but I'd like to
    step
    the upper electronics lines to 14v and then regulate them down to 12v
    again
    for line stability.
    I have video and audio circuits that are voltage sensitive and I'd
    rather
    spend the batteries capabilities quicker at a higher voltage than deal
    with
    the noise of 11.5v or so over a longer period. The motors are on the
    second
    battery and aren't voltage sensitive, so my current requirements are
    probably under 1500 mA.
    Hopefully I have made my goal clear. (°;

    TIA!

    ---

    Jeff Abrams
    clavier@b...

    SUPERCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 2.5 liter 1993 Mazda MX-3 GS
    http://www.mazdamaniac.com
    TURBOCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 1.8 liter 1997 Mazda MX-5 Miata


    A PBS mind in an MTV world.




    To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
    basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
    from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject
    and Body of the message will be ignored.


    Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-03-29 16:35
    Let me clarify my intentions:

    I have a robot with two distinct power sources, both of which are 12v 7.2 Ah
    SLAs.
    The motors are on one battery and I am not bothered by the sag there.
    However, the video and audio circuits are on the other battery and if they
    see even .2v or so below 12v they act funny.
    Typically under load, that battery looks like about 11.7v after 5 minutes of
    use. It will stay there for about 2 hours and then drops off.
    I would be happy with less battery time if I could have a real stable 12v so
    what I am really looking to do is make a power conditioner that will bump
    the voltage up to 14v or so and then re-regulate it back down to 12v.
    FWIW, I will probably replace the batteries with a single 12v 24 Ah, so the
    re-regulation will be even more important since the motors WILL be on that
    battery pulling about 6A on there own intermittently.

    ---

    Jeff Abrams
    clavier@b...

    SUPERCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 2.5 liter 1993 Mazda MX-3 GS
    http://www.mazdamaniac.com
    TURBOCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 1.8 liter 1997 Mazda MX-5 Miata


    If women can have PMS, then men can have ESPN.




    Original Message
    From: Rob [noparse]/noparse]mailto:[url=http://forums.parallaxinc.com/group/basicstamps/post?postID=gcwqcROsaNICA6SyvEO57pjVVB0bxvj5mV8bAYzNZbe7nUf8IMD2LcyhN3cUkoh3NERivd7oFXn592fGKk-y-ew]robbed666@b...[/url
    Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 3:24 AM
    To: basicstamps@yahoogroups.com
    Subject: RE: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Voltage Conversion - UP


    Hi Jeff,

    A 12V lead acid battery will typically stay at about 13 volts through
    most of its discharge curve. As for stability, a battery of 20 Ah has a
    low internal impeadence . DC-DC converters by their nature are noisy. If
    you're worried about volt drop down cables and noise affecting control
    circuits. Separate the control circuit cabling from the power circuit.
    As for adding "unmatched" cells to a battery, this can cause problems as
    the battery discharges. In fact you can get cell polarity reversal.

    Rob
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-03-30 14:01
    Can you use a fancy voltage regulator to bring under 12 back up to 12v and
    that will ensure a solid 12v source?
    BEN
    Jeff Abrams <clavier@b...> wrote: Let me clarify my intentions:

    I have a robot with two distinct power sources, both of which are 12v 7.2 Ah
    SLAs.
    The motors are on one battery and I am not bothered by the sag there.
    However, the video and audio circuits are on the other battery and if they
    see even .2v or so below 12v they act funny.
    Typically under load, that battery looks like about 11.7v after 5 minutes of
    use. It will stay there for about 2 hours and then drops off.
    I would be happy with less battery time if I could have a real stable 12v so
    what I am really looking to do is make a power conditioner that will bump
    the voltage up to 14v or so and then re-regulate it back down to 12v.
    FWIW, I will probably replace the batteries with a single 12v 24 Ah, so the
    re-regulation will be even more important since the motors WILL be on that
    battery pulling about 6A on there own intermittently.

    ---

    Jeff Abrams
    clavier@b...

    SUPERCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 2.5 liter 1993 Mazda MX-3 GS
    http://www.mazdamaniac.com
    TURBOCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 1.8 liter 1997 Mazda MX-5 Miata


    If women can have PMS, then men can have ESPN.




    Original Message
    From: Rob [noparse]/noparse]mailto:[url=http://forums.parallaxinc.com/group/basicstamps/post?postID=oJ7LPeB9zsTRQx3aK7jt2nsKEmPnT98AkxFiRmoBS-Jlp4qDkMETCIvHX2twzU6_7pID2FXZyStONzv93GndaZc]robbed666@b...[/url
    Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 3:24 AM
    To: basicstamps@yahoogroups.com
    Subject: RE: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Voltage Conversion - UP


    Hi Jeff,

    A 12V lead acid battery will typically stay at about 13 volts through
    most of its discharge curve. As for stability, a battery of 20 Ah has a
    low internal impeadence . DC-DC converters by their nature are noisy. If
    you're worried about volt drop down cables and noise affecting control
    circuits. Separate the control circuit cabling from the power circuit.
    As for adding "unmatched" cells to a battery, this can cause problems as
    the battery discharges. In fact you can get cell polarity reversal.

    Rob


    To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
    basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
    from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject and Body of
    the message will be ignored.


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    BEN (TEAM DBR)
    http://www.geocities.com/temdbr



    Do You Yahoo!?
    Get personalised at My Yahoo!.

    [noparse][[/noparse]Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2002-04-01 16:27
    This is called a Boost regulator, that simply uses the back EMF from an
    inductor in a controlled manor to increase the output voltage to a desired
    level.

    http://www.national.com/ds/LM/LM2698.pdf

    The example shows a 4.5V to 5.5V input providing a 12V 400mA output. The
    feedback resistors R1 and R2 can be altered for a different output voltage.
    As it was stated earlier DC-DC converters are typically noisy. This
    regulator provides two modes of switching frequency 600kHz or 1.25MHz.
    I would think that either one would do well for your application.




    > Can you use a fancy voltage regulator to bring under 12 back up to
    > 12v and that will ensure a solid 12v source?
    >BEN
    > Jeff Abrams <clavier@b...> wrote: Let me clarify my intentions:
    >
    >I have a robot with two distinct power sources, both of which are 12v 7.2 Ah
    >SLAs.
    >The motors are on one battery and I am not bothered by the sag there.
    >However, the video and audio circuits are on the other battery and if they
    >see even .2v or so below 12v they act funny.
    >Typically under load, that battery looks like about 11.7v after 5 minutes of
    >use. It will stay there for about 2 hours and then drops off.
    >I would be happy with less battery time if I could have a real stable 12v so
    >what I am really looking to do is make a power conditioner that will bump
    >the voltage up to 14v or so and then re-regulate it back down to 12v.
    >FWIW, I will probably replace the batteries with a single 12v 24 Ah, so the
    >re-regulation will be even more important since the motors WILL be on that
    >battery pulling about 6A on there own intermittently.
    >
    >---
    >
    >Jeff Abrams
    >clavier@b...
    >
    >SUPERCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 2.5 liter 1993 Mazda MX-3 GS
    >http://www.mazdamaniac.com
    >TURBOCHARGED & INTERCOOLED 1.8 liter 1997 Mazda MX-5 Miata
    >
    >
    >If women can have PMS, then men can have ESPN.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    Original Message
    >From: Rob [noparse]/noparse]mailto:[url=http://forums.parallaxinc.com/group/basicstamps/post?postID=-6qm6bi2Q3gsf3vp1GT7AjUDfOnlKlGqFJO4Zg3ZeIh6PgKqSph4xGjSnVEg4Er1E5rmiI5qTteCLUBf7tVKbg]robbed666@b...[/url
    >Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 3:24 AM
    >To: basicstamps@yahoogroups.com
    >Subject: RE: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Voltage Conversion - UP
    >
    >
    >Hi Jeff,
    >
    >A 12V lead acid battery will typically stay at about 13 volts through
    >most of its discharge curve. As for stability, a battery of 20 Ah has a
    >low internal impeadence . DC-DC converters by their nature are noisy. If
    >you're worried about volt drop down cables and noise affecting control
    >circuits. Separate the control circuit cabling from the power circuit.
    >As for adding "unmatched" cells to a battery, this can cause problems as
    >the battery discharges. In fact you can get cell polarity reversal.
    >
    >Rob

    Beau Schwabe Mask Designer IV - ATL
    National Semiconductor Enterprise Networking Business Unit
    500 Pinnacle Court, Suite 525 Wired Communications Division
    Mail Stop GA1 Norcross, GA 30071
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