Yet another servo question
Archiver
Posts: 46,084
Would the BS2P24 (or for that matter the mormal BS2) be capable in speed to sit
between a normal RC car receiver and servo and act as a fail safe for when my
batteries for the receiver go dead? I would need less than 20ms lag between
input and output, and a reaction time inside of 20ms as well.
In addition, I need to to collect data from all 4 wheels and 2 points on the
drive shaft and control 3 seperate brakes to start on an ABS type system for my
RC rally car (its gas powered). I'll need to send a few samples every few
seconds via wireless, control an electric gas valve.
Would a stamp be up to this task or am I looking into the wrong MCU for this
application? If I am looking into the wrong MCU, any suggestions as to what I
should use? Basic requirements are low power, low weight, and small footprint,
but it isn't a deal breaker if low power or low weight can't be met, but small
footprint is a solid requirment. There is already a small wireless camera and a
few other sensors for feul level and head temp so I've got limited space
remaining. The ground speed is around 45mph and the entire car is subjected to
severe vibration (engine tops out at near 30,000 rpm) so ruggedness could play a
part in the final choice.
Thanks for your time,
Rob
[noparse][[/noparse]Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
between a normal RC car receiver and servo and act as a fail safe for when my
batteries for the receiver go dead? I would need less than 20ms lag between
input and output, and a reaction time inside of 20ms as well.
In addition, I need to to collect data from all 4 wheels and 2 points on the
drive shaft and control 3 seperate brakes to start on an ABS type system for my
RC rally car (its gas powered). I'll need to send a few samples every few
seconds via wireless, control an electric gas valve.
Would a stamp be up to this task or am I looking into the wrong MCU for this
application? If I am looking into the wrong MCU, any suggestions as to what I
should use? Basic requirements are low power, low weight, and small footprint,
but it isn't a deal breaker if low power or low weight can't be met, but small
footprint is a solid requirment. There is already a small wireless camera and a
few other sensors for feul level and head temp so I've got limited space
remaining. The ground speed is around 45mph and the entire car is subjected to
severe vibration (engine tops out at near 30,000 rpm) so ruggedness could play a
part in the final choice.
Thanks for your time,
Rob
[noparse][[/noparse]Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Comments
i hope this helps.
I am currently in the early stages of designing a autopilot for my R/C
helicopter. It needs to read in 3 inputs from the receiver then 2 inputs
from an external chip then mix these signals and output them to the 3
servos.
What i am finding is that even just reading the receiver then outputing to
the servos seems to slow the response time of the servos by a noticable
amount. I have not investergated this as yet but i think it is because i
might need to change the order the servos are sampled in.
I started using a BS2 but have now moved to a BS2sx ( i needed the ram and
the bs2p was to expensive at the time.)
I am thinking about using one of the serial servo chips that are on the
market to do the servo updates then this would take the load off the BS2 to
allow it to do the mixing as needed.
In short yes the BS2 range can read and then output but how quickly it
responds might be your problem. but if you allready own a BS2 then give it a
shot. what have you got to loose.
If you would like any more info from what i have, let me know and i will
send it to you.
Regards
Peter Rogers
Original Message
From: "Robert Staph" <rstaph@a...>
To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 3:00 PM
Subject: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Yet another servo question
> Would the BS2P24 (or for that matter the mormal BS2) be capable in speed
to sit between a normal RC car receiver and servo and act as a fail safe for
when my batteries for the receiver go dead? I would need less than 20ms lag
between input and output, and a reaction time inside of 20ms as well.
>
> In addition, I need to to collect data from all 4 wheels and 2 points on
the drive shaft and control 3 seperate brakes to start on an ABS type system
for my RC rally car (its gas powered). I'll need to send a few samples
every few seconds via wireless, control an electric gas valve.
>
> Would a stamp be up to this task or am I looking into the wrong MCU for
this application? If I am looking into the wrong MCU, any suggestions as to
what I should use? Basic requirements are low power, low weight, and small
footprint, but it isn't a deal breaker if low power or low weight can't be
met, but small footprint is a solid requirment. There is already a small
wireless camera and a few other sensors for feul level and head temp so I've
got limited space remaining. The ground speed is around 45mph and the
entire car is subjected to severe vibration (engine tops out at near 30,000
rpm) so ruggedness could play a part in the final choice.
>
> Thanks for your time,
> Rob
>
>
> [noparse][[/noparse]Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
> basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject and
Body of the message will be ignored.
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
out [noparse];)[/noparse]
If I could ask you to send me a snippet of the code you're using to read the
servos, that would help more than anything. I was thinking the same thing
with using the serial servo chips that are available to off-load some of the
work.
Lag in the throttle response can be overcome with a little human retraining,
but there can't be any more than the 20ms lag in braking, things on the
courses happen too fast. I think it would be possible to do the intercepting
with the stamp, but the stamp would also have to be counting 6 encoder
wheels (1 on the front drive shaft, 1 on the rear drive shaft, and 1 on each
wheel). I guess I could drop to just have the front wheels being anti-lock
reducing my sample load by 50%. I could even use a second controller to
detect a wheel lock situation, and just bring an alarm pin high on the stamp
with the servos.
Once we have the basics of doing the ABS system completed, our ultimate goal
is an "all wheel drive" system with 4 independant brakes at each wheel and
maybe a slightly more real-time configurable center differential. With
things being as close as they are even over a 2 hour race (1st and 8th place
are normally seperated by less than a minute), an advantage in the turns
like all wheel drive and ABS could make things interesting. At least for my
team [noparse]:)[/noparse]
Robert Staph, W3RCS
Original Message
From: "Peter Rogers" <molly7@o...>
To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 8:12 AM
Subject: Re: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Yet another servo question
> Robert,
>
> i hope this helps.
>
> I am currently in the early stages of designing a autopilot for my R/C
> helicopter. It needs to read in 3 inputs from the receiver then 2 inputs
> from an external chip then mix these signals and output them to the 3
> servos.
> What i am finding is that even just reading the receiver then outputing to
> the servos seems to slow the response time of the servos by a noticable
> amount. I have not investergated this as yet but i think it is because i
> might need to change the order the servos are sampled in.
> I started using a BS2 but have now moved to a BS2sx ( i needed the ram and
> the bs2p was to expensive at the time.)
> I am thinking about using one of the serial servo chips that are on the
> market to do the servo updates then this would take the load off the BS2
to
> allow it to do the mixing as needed.
>
> In short yes the BS2 range can read and then output but how quickly it
> responds might be your problem. but if you allready own a BS2 then give it
a
> shot. what have you got to loose.
>
> If you would like any more info from what i have, let me know and i will
> send it to you.
>
>
> Regards
>
> Peter Rogers
>
Original Message
> From: "Robert Staph" <rstaph@a...>
> To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 3:00 PM
> Subject: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Yet another servo question
>
>
> > Would the BS2P24 (or for that matter the mormal BS2) be capable in speed
> to sit between a normal RC car receiver and servo and act as a fail safe
for
> when my batteries for the receiver go dead? I would need less than 20ms
lag
> between input and output, and a reaction time inside of 20ms as well.
> >
> > In addition, I need to to collect data from all 4 wheels and 2 points on
> the drive shaft and control 3 seperate brakes to start on an ABS type
system
> for my RC rally car (its gas powered). I'll need to send a few samples
> every few seconds via wireless, control an electric gas valve.
> >
> > Would a stamp be up to this task or am I looking into the wrong MCU for
> this application? If I am looking into the wrong MCU, any suggestions as
to
> what I should use? Basic requirements are low power, low weight, and
small
> footprint, but it isn't a deal breaker if low power or low weight can't be
> met, but small footprint is a solid requirment. There is already a small
> wireless camera and a few other sensors for feul level and head temp so
I've
> got limited space remaining. The ground speed is around 45mph and the
> entire car is subjected to severe vibration (engine tops out at near
30,000
> rpm) so ruggedness could play a part in the final choice.
> >
> > Thanks for your time,
> > Rob
> >
> >
> > [noparse][[/noparse]Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> > To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
> > basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject
and
> Body of the message will be ignored.
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
> basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject and
Body of the message will be ignored.
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
Helicopters are fun. and your right you probably will crash. if its not your
first flight then your second or third etc. But thats part of the fun. and
if you take it slowly you can say well i know what i did wrong there so i
wont do that again. Also with helicopters its possible to learn to fly by
yourself ( unlike planes.) as the first thing you learn is to take off,
hover and land. then you learn to fly.
to check out my code etc look at my web page.
http://members.optushome.com.au/progers/
i think all the info is there but the layout is not very good. but hey im
not a web page designer. :-)
Also the problem im having does not seem to be a delay its more like the
servo is moving at a slower speed.
Also if i remember right on most RC cars with 4wd are direct drive systems
either by belt or something right. So where do the brakes come into it? or
am i thinking about the wrong type of RC
Let me know how you go.
Also if i can answer any questions or if you can answer some of mine :-)
please let me know
Regards
Peter Rogers
Original Message
From: "Robert Staph" <rstaph@a...>
To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 11:47 PM
Subject: Re: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Yet another servo question
> I almost got into RC heli's, but I know I'd crash and burn the first
flight
> out [noparse];)[/noparse]
>
> If I could ask you to send me a snippet of the code you're using to read
the
> servos, that would help more than anything. I was thinking the same thing
> with using the serial servo chips that are available to off-load some of
the
> work.
>
> Lag in the throttle response can be overcome with a little human
retraining,
> but there can't be any more than the 20ms lag in braking, things on the
> courses happen too fast. I think it would be possible to do the
intercepting
> with the stamp, but the stamp would also have to be counting 6 encoder
> wheels (1 on the front drive shaft, 1 on the rear drive shaft, and 1 on
each
> wheel). I guess I could drop to just have the front wheels being
anti-lock
> reducing my sample load by 50%. I could even use a second controller to
> detect a wheel lock situation, and just bring an alarm pin high on the
stamp
> with the servos.
>
> Once we have the basics of doing the ABS system completed, our ultimate
goal
> is an "all wheel drive" system with 4 independant brakes at each wheel and
> maybe a slightly more real-time configurable center differential. With
> things being as close as they are even over a 2 hour race (1st and 8th
place
> are normally seperated by less than a minute), an advantage in the turns
> like all wheel drive and ABS could make things interesting. At least for
my
> team [noparse]:)[/noparse]
>
> Robert Staph, W3RCS
>
>
>
Original Message
> From: "Peter Rogers" <molly7@o...>
> To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 8:12 AM
> Subject: Re: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Yet another servo question
>
>
> > Robert,
> >
> > i hope this helps.
> >
> > I am currently in the early stages of designing a autopilot for my R/C
> > helicopter. It needs to read in 3 inputs from the receiver then 2 inputs
> > from an external chip then mix these signals and output them to the 3
> > servos.
> > What i am finding is that even just reading the receiver then outputing
to
> > the servos seems to slow the response time of the servos by a noticable
> > amount. I have not investergated this as yet but i think it is because i
> > might need to change the order the servos are sampled in.
> > I started using a BS2 but have now moved to a BS2sx ( i needed the ram
and
> > the bs2p was to expensive at the time.)
> > I am thinking about using one of the serial servo chips that are on the
> > market to do the servo updates then this would take the load off the BS2
> to
> > allow it to do the mixing as needed.
> >
> > In short yes the BS2 range can read and then output but how quickly it
> > responds might be your problem. but if you allready own a BS2 then give
it
> a
> > shot. what have you got to loose.
> >
> > If you would like any more info from what i have, let me know and i will
> > send it to you.
> >
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Peter Rogers
> >
Original Message
> > From: "Robert Staph" <rstaph@a...>
> > To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 3:00 PM
> > Subject: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Yet another servo question
> >
> >
> > > Would the BS2P24 (or for that matter the mormal BS2) be capable in
speed
> > to sit between a normal RC car receiver and servo and act as a fail safe
> for
> > when my batteries for the receiver go dead? I would need less than 20ms
> lag
> > between input and output, and a reaction time inside of 20ms as well.
> > >
> > > In addition, I need to to collect data from all 4 wheels and 2 points
on
> > the drive shaft and control 3 seperate brakes to start on an ABS type
> system
> > for my RC rally car (its gas powered). I'll need to send a few samples
> > every few seconds via wireless, control an electric gas valve.
> > >
> > > Would a stamp be up to this task or am I looking into the wrong MCU
for
> > this application? If I am looking into the wrong MCU, any suggestions
as
> to
> > what I should use? Basic requirements are low power, low weight, and
> small
> > footprint, but it isn't a deal breaker if low power or low weight can't
be
> > met, but small footprint is a solid requirment. There is already a
small
> > wireless camera and a few other sensors for feul level and head temp so
> I've
> > got limited space remaining. The ground speed is around 45mph and the
> > entire car is subjected to severe vibration (engine tops out at near
> 30,000
> > rpm) so ruggedness could play a part in the final choice.
> > >
> > > Thanks for your time,
> > > Rob
> > >
> > >
> > > [noparse][[/noparse]Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
> > > basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > > from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject
> and
> > Body of the message will be ignored.
> > >
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
> > basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject
and
> Body of the message will be ignored.
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
> basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject and
Body of the message will be ignored.
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
This sounds like an interesting project!
Doug
On 9 Oct 2001, at 1:00, Robert Staph wrote:
> Would the BS2P24 (or for that matter the mormal BS2) be capable in
> speed to sit between a normal RC car receiver and servo and act as a
> fail safe for when my batteries for the receiver go dead? I would
> need less than 20ms lag between input and output, and a reaction time
> inside of 20ms as well.
>
> In addition, I need to to collect data from all 4 wheels and 2 points
> on the drive shaft and control 3 seperate brakes to start on an ABS
> type system for my RC rally car (its gas powered). I'll need to send
> a few samples every few seconds via wireless, control an electric gas
> valve.
>
> Would a stamp be up to this task or am I looking into the wrong MCU
> for this application? If I am looking into the wrong MCU, any
> suggestions as to what I should use? Basic requirements are low
> power, low weight, and small footprint, but it isn't a deal breaker if
> low power or low weight can't be met, but small footprint is a solid
> requirment. There is already a small wireless camera and a few other
> sensors for feul level and head temp so I've got limited space
> remaining. The ground speed is around 45mph and the entire car is
> subjected to severe vibration (engine tops out at near 30,000 rpm) so
> ruggedness could play a part in the final choice.
>
> Thanks for your time,
> Rob
>
>
> [noparse][[/noparse]Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
> basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the Subject
> and Body of the message will be ignored.
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
voltage) to the radio and have the stamp replace the servo's input
with the stop position? You don't have to do any conversion. Use
a bilateral switch between the radio receiver and the servo, and one
between the stamp and the servo. Us the stamp's output to
operate the switches and switch in either the signal from the radio
(normal operation) or the appropriate signal to stop (error
condition). This way there is no lag at all and you don't hav eto
monitor anything but voltage to the radio. You could also add a
loss-of-carrier error measurement incase the radio control unit quits
for whatever reason. This would shut down the car in the event you
tripped, or the battery dies in your controller, etc.
On 10 Oct 2001, at 21:58, Peter Rogers wrote:
> Robert,
>
> Helicopters are fun. and your right you probably will crash. if its
> not your first flight then your second or third etc. But thats part of
> the fun. and if you take it slowly you can say well i know what i did
> wrong there so i wont do that again. Also with helicopters its
> possible to learn to fly by yourself ( unlike planes.) as the first
> thing you learn is to take off, hover and land. then you learn to fly.
>
> to check out my code etc look at my web page.
> http://members.optushome.com.au/progers/
>
> i think all the info is there but the layout is not very good. but
> hey im
> not a web page designer. :-)
>
> Also the problem im having does not seem to be a delay its more like
> the servo is moving at a slower speed.
>
> Also if i remember right on most RC cars with 4wd are direct drive
> systems either by belt or something right. So where do the brakes come
> into it? or am i thinking about the wrong type of RC
>
>
> Let me know how you go.
> Also if i can answer any questions or if you can answer some of mine
> :-) please let me know
>
> Regards
>
> Peter Rogers
>
Original Message
> From: "Robert Staph" <rstaph@a...>
> To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 11:47 PM
> Subject: Re: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Yet another servo question
>
>
> > I almost got into RC heli's, but I know I'd crash and burn the first
> flight
> > out [noparse];)[/noparse]
> >
> > If I could ask you to send me a snippet of the code you're using to
> > read
> the
> > servos, that would help more than anything. I was thinking the same
> > thing with using the serial servo chips that are available to
> > off-load some of
> the
> > work.
> >
> > Lag in the throttle response can be overcome with a little human
> retraining,
> > but there can't be any more than the 20ms lag in braking, things on
> > the courses happen too fast. I think it would be possible to do the
> intercepting
> > with the stamp, but the stamp would also have to be counting 6
> > encoder wheels (1 on the front drive shaft, 1 on the rear drive
> > shaft, and 1 on
> each
> > wheel). I guess I could drop to just have the front wheels being
> anti-lock
> > reducing my sample load by 50%. I could even use a second
> > controller to detect a wheel lock situation, and just bring an alarm
> > pin high on the
> stamp
> > with the servos.
> >
> > Once we have the basics of doing the ABS system completed, our
> > ultimate
> goal
> > is an "all wheel drive" system with 4 independant brakes at each
> > wheel and maybe a slightly more real-time configurable center
> > differential. With things being as close as they are even over a 2
> > hour race (1st and 8th
> place
> > are normally seperated by less than a minute), an advantage in the
> > turns like all wheel drive and ABS could make things interesting.
> > At least for
> my
> > team [noparse]:)[/noparse]
> >
> > Robert Staph, W3RCS
> >
> >
> >
Original Message
> > From: "Peter Rogers" <molly7@o...>
> > To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 8:12 AM
> > Subject: Re: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Yet another servo question
> >
> >
> > > Robert,
> > >
> > > i hope this helps.
> > >
> > > I am currently in the early stages of designing a autopilot for my
> > > R/C helicopter. It needs to read in 3 inputs from the receiver
> > > then 2 inputs from an external chip then mix these signals and
> > > output them to the 3 servos. What i am finding is that even just
> > > reading the receiver then outputing
> to
> > > the servos seems to slow the response time of the servos by a
> > > noticable amount. I have not investergated this as yet but i think
> > > it is because i might need to change the order the servos are
> > > sampled in. I started using a BS2 but have now moved to a BS2sx (
> > > i needed the ram
> and
> > > the bs2p was to expensive at the time.)
> > > I am thinking about using one of the serial servo chips that are
> > > on the market to do the servo updates then this would take the
> > > load off the BS2
> > to
> > > allow it to do the mixing as needed.
> > >
> > > In short yes the BS2 range can read and then output but how
> > > quickly it responds might be your problem. but if you allready own
> > > a BS2 then give
> it
> > a
> > > shot. what have you got to loose.
> > >
> > > If you would like any more info from what i have, let me know and
> > > i will send it to you.
> > >
> > >
> > > Regards
> > >
> > > Peter Rogers
> > >
Original Message
> > > From: "Robert Staph" <rstaph@a...>
> > > To: <basicstamps@yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 3:00 PM
> > > Subject: [noparse][[/noparse]basicstamps] Yet another servo question
> > >
> > >
> > > > Would the BS2P24 (or for that matter the mormal BS2) be capable
> > > > in
> speed
> > > to sit between a normal RC car receiver and servo and act as a
> > > fail safe
> > for
> > > when my batteries for the receiver go dead? I would need less
> > > than 20ms
> > lag
> > > between input and output, and a reaction time inside of 20ms as
> > > well.
> > > >
> > > > In addition, I need to to collect data from all 4 wheels and 2
> > > > points
> on
> > > the drive shaft and control 3 seperate brakes to start on an ABS
> > > type
> > system
> > > for my RC rally car (its gas powered). I'll need to send a few
> > > samples every few seconds via wireless, control an electric gas
> > > valve.
> > > >
> > > > Would a stamp be up to this task or am I looking into the wrong
> > > > MCU
> for
> > > this application? If I am looking into the wrong MCU, any
> > > suggestions
> as
> > to
> > > what I should use? Basic requirements are low power, low weight,
> > > and
> > small
> > > footprint, but it isn't a deal breaker if low power or low weight
> > > can't
> be
> > > met, but small footprint is a solid requirment. There is already
> > > a
> small
> > > wireless camera and a few other sensors for feul level and head
> > > temp so
> > I've
> > > got limited space remaining. The ground speed is around 45mph and
> > > the entire car is subjected to severe vibration (engine tops out
> > > at near
> > 30,000
> > > rpm) so ruggedness could play a part in the final choice.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for your time,
> > > > Rob
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [noparse][[/noparse]Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE, just send mail to:
> > > > basicstamps-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > > > from the same email address that you subscribed. Text in the
> > > > Subject
> > and
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>servo is moving at a slower speed.
>
>Also if i remember right on most RC cars with 4wd are direct drive systems
>either by belt or something right. So where do the brakes come into it? or
>am i thinking about the wrong type of RC
The car is modified from the stock pieces to have limited slip front and rear
differentials, as well as an adjustable-slip center differential. Its all shaft
driven, and behaves very much like a real rally car. On a shorter track you
spend more time braking than anything thing else. On loose dirt and small
gravel tap the brake a little to hard and your in for a 180. We don't get to
have a reverse gear, so staying straight and forward is the most important thing
to do. The brakes come into play either on the outdrives from the center diff
or, once we have them all machined out, 4 disc brakes at the wheels.
-Rob
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