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Prox sensor — Parallax Forums

Prox sensor

ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
edited 2001-07-10 22:11 in General Discussion
Dear stampers,

Not really off topic because they will be connected to stamps!

I am looking for a circuit that will be suitable to detect the presence of a
granular fertilizer in a storage silo. Just need a go/no-go type output eg
whether the sensor is covered or not.

Anyone got a suitable circuit?


Tim Stockman


[noparse][[/noparse]Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Comments

  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2001-07-06 01:32
    Some sort of optic sensor be the ticket, although it would have to be sealed
    as the fertilizer would corode any exposed connections. A flap with a
    microswitch would work also, but it would have to be sealed also. I don't
    recall seeing an off-the-shelf sensor for this, but I'm sure some of the
    industrial / batch people may know of one.

    Original Message

    > I am looking for a circuit that will be suitable to detect the
    presence of a granular fertilizer in a storage silo. Just need a go/no-go
    type output eg whether the sensor is covered or not.
    >
    > Anyone got a suitable circuit?
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2001-07-06 08:13
    A pretty standard IR LED proximity pair would potentially work. You would
    need to set the sensor back into the tube a bit and use a window that does
    not reflect so much to be read. The concern would be that the window surface
    would become abraded or dusty and give a false positive. How far is the
    distance across the silo where you want to measure? If it is near an
    constriction, you may be able to put a separated pair and shoot from one side
    to the other.

    If there is normally light inside the silo then a photovoltaic cell would
    potentially work.
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2001-07-06 17:55
    It would help if you could give the minimum amount of weight
    you need to detect. And what sort of granular size.

    For reliable detection I'd suggest some sort of vibrating
    assembly [noparse][[/noparse]could be piezo] - the frequency and energy it
    takes to drive it would vary as it was surrounded with
    material. This assumes that the sensor enclosure material is
    flexible. The vibration would also tend to clean dust off.
    Is the stuff flammable? [noparse][[/noparse]static electric charge could be
    an issue].

    For just pressure you could have a capacitive bridge with
    grounded outer plates which would squeeze toward an inner
    plate. Here the issue would be what would stay uniform over
    time squeezing and un squeezing. Perhaps silicone rubber
    between aluminum plates would work.

    Interlink Electronics has resistive material which changes
    with pressure on it.

    There are membrane elastomers used in keyboards which change
    resistance with pressure.

    Without knowing how much pressure - min and max - you are
    trying to work with it's all up in the guessing region.


    >>
    Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2001 08:28:42 +0930
    From: "Tim Stockman, STOCKMAN ELECTRONICS" <stocky@c...>
    ...
    I am looking for a circuit that will be suitable to detect the presence
    of a granular fertilizer in a storage silo. Just need a go/no-go type
    output eg whether the sensor is covered or not.
    <<

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  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2001-07-08 20:12
    I'm not sure the goal has been well established yet.

    Is this silo used to store this material exclusively? If so,
    could you use sonar to determine the presence of this material
    and a the volume as well?

    George B.


    --- In basicstamps@y..., s premena <premzee@j...> wrote:
    > It would help if you could give the minimum amount of weight
    > you need to detect. And what sort of granular size.
    >
    > For reliable detection I'd suggest some sort of vibrating
    > assembly [noparse][[/noparse]could be piezo] - the frequency and energy it
    > takes to drive it would vary as it was surrounded with
    > material. This assumes that the sensor enclosure material is
    > flexible. The vibration would also tend to clean dust off.
    > Is the stuff flammable? [noparse][[/noparse]static electric charge could be
    > an issue].
    >
    > For just pressure you could have a capacitive bridge with
    > grounded outer plates which would squeeze toward an inner
    > plate. Here the issue would be what would stay uniform over
    > time squeezing and un squeezing. Perhaps silicone rubber
    > between aluminum plates would work.
    >
    > Interlink Electronics has resistive material which changes
    > with pressure on it.
    >
    > There are membrane elastomers used in keyboards which change
    > resistance with pressure.
    >
    > Without knowing how much pressure - min and max - you are
    > trying to work with it's all up in the guessing region.
    >
    >
    > >>
    > Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2001 08:28:42 +0930
    > From: "Tim Stockman, STOCKMAN ELECTRONICS" <stocky@c...>
    > ...
    > I am looking for a circuit that will be suitable to detect the
    presence
    > of a granular fertilizer in a storage silo. Just need a go/no-go
    type
    > output eg whether the sensor is covered or not.
    > <<
    >
    > ________________________________________________________________
    > GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
    > Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
    > Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:
    > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2001-07-08 20:31
    Please excuse my double post.

    A person could try constructing two plates in proximity,
    maybe you could detect a difference in capacitance when the
    material becomes the dielectric verses air? If it worked, dirt
    and dust would not be a problem, gravity would remove the material
    when plates are placed vertical.

    George B.



    --- In basicstamps@y..., gbrecke@y... wrote:
    > I'm not sure the goal has been well established yet.
    >
    > Is this silo used to store this material exclusively? If so,
    > could you use sonar to determine the presence of this material
    > and a the volume as well?
    >
    > George B.
    >
    >
    > --- In basicstamps@y..., s premena <premzee@j...> wrote:
    > > It would help if you could give the minimum amount of weight
    > > you need to detect. And what sort of granular size.
    > >
    > > For reliable detection I'd suggest some sort of vibrating
    > > assembly [noparse][[/noparse]could be piezo] - the frequency and energy it
    > > takes to drive it would vary as it was surrounded with
    > > material. This assumes that the sensor enclosure material is
    > > flexible. The vibration would also tend to clean dust off.
    > > Is the stuff flammable? [noparse][[/noparse]static electric charge could be
    > > an issue].
    > >
    > > For just pressure you could have a capacitive bridge with
    > > grounded outer plates which would squeeze toward an inner
    > > plate. Here the issue would be what would stay uniform over
    > > time squeezing and un squeezing. Perhaps silicone rubber
    > > between aluminum plates would work.
    > >
    > > Interlink Electronics has resistive material which changes
    > > with pressure on it.
    > >
    > > There are membrane elastomers used in keyboards which change
    > > resistance with pressure.
    > >
    > > Without knowing how much pressure - min and max - you are
    > > trying to work with it's all up in the guessing region.
    > >
    > >
    > > >>
    > > Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2001 08:28:42 +0930
    > > From: "Tim Stockman, STOCKMAN ELECTRONICS" <stocky@c...>
    > > ...
    > > I am looking for a circuit that will be suitable to detect the
    > presence
    > > of a granular fertilizer in a storage silo. Just need a go/no-go
    > type
    > > output eg whether the sensor is covered or not.
    > > <<
    > >
    > > ________________________________________________________________
    > > GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
    > > Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
    > > Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:
    > > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
  • ArchiverArchiver Posts: 46,084
    edited 2001-07-10 22:11
    Sorry for beating a thread to death.

    I've read a few replies, some suggest interrupting a light beam in
    one way or another, I think I saw something about a flap and
    microswitch. Here is my 2 cents:

    Ultrasonics- Use a pair of piezo speakers, one as a speaker, the
    other as a pickup (microphone.) Place the "microphone" at the top of
    the silo, place the "speaker" where it would be an inch or two
    beneath the fertilizer (at its maximum desired level). Cover both the
    speaker and microphone with something that will protect them both,
    without adding attenution. (plastic)

    When the fertilizer covers the speaker the microphone misses the
    ultrasonic pulses the speaker produces. This scheme would probably
    work with audio, but, you may hear the thing work, or worse, ambient
    noise may prevent the system from working. This may be less of a
    problem with ultrasonics.

    Electronic overview:

    operating frequency: not terribly importamt, 25Khz or so. Speaker
    driven by 555, square wave output ok, no driver xstr necessary. Run
    555 at 12 volts.

    Receiver: ultrasonic speaker, amplified (op-amp for gain, hi-pass)
    then rectified and inverted. Provides clock pulse for monostable 555.

    Here's what happens.

    silo level low: speaker provides occasional pulse. Microphone detects
    pulse and turns on 555. Next pulse comes before 555 turns off. So
    long as pulses are detected the 555 never turns off.

    Silo fills up:

    Fertilizer covers piezo speaker. Microphone no longer detects pulses.
    555 stops getting trigger pulses, 555 turns off shortly after. The
    555 output corrosponds to the level of fertilizer in the silo.

    Sort of a "missing pulse detection" scheme. When the 555 outputs low
    the fertilizer is at its threshold level in the silo. Running the 555
    used in the "receiver" at 5 volts allows direct connection of the 555
    output to your stamp. (Where would we all be without the 555?)

    If I had a silo of my own I would do this.

    Regards

    Rich






    --- In basicstamps@y..., "Tim Stockman, STOCKMAN ELECTRONICS"
    <stocky@c...> wrote:
    > Dear stampers,
    >
    > Not really off topic because they will be connected to stamps!
    >
    > I am looking for a circuit that will be suitable to detect the
    presence of a granular fertilizer in a storage silo. Just need a
    go/no-go type output eg whether the sensor is covered or not.
    >
    > Anyone got a suitable circuit?
    >
    >
    > Tim Stockman
    >
    >
    > [noparse][[/noparse]Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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