@PurpleGirl said:
.. Just use the syscalls as hooks and do it however appropriate for a P2.
I say get a P2 and do it. Just do it. This helps motivate:
What motivates me is being allowed to mention my eventual plans and motivate myself. Once another acts in the least like a parent over me or criticizes me for merely wanting to discuss it, then my motivation is diminished. Motivation for me tends to come from me and can be diminished by others.
I started this to motivate myself, which for me, requires years of me sharing what I MIGHT do without others attacking my project, and me being allowed to do it on a whim without being rushed. If I cannot spend years discussing something for my own entertainment without others interfering or insisting that I adopt a predatory approach, then that means others are wasting my life and destroying what makes me me.
If you inexplicably really can't deal with constructive comments on your forum threads, may I suggest Microsoft(TM) Word(TM) Version 95 or higher. You can write things there with no pesky randos going inbetween.
If you allegedly need to discuss a project for 3 years without any one commenting any encouragement before starting to work on it, may I ask: Have you ever gotten to that stage? Finished anything? This is coming from a notorious not-finisher of anything, mind you.
I used some hyperbole, but you get my point. For me to be motivated, I need to talk about it in front of others and for others to think I am intelligent, and treat me accordingly. Constructive criticism is welcomed, but not folks questioning my right to make all of my own decisions or timetable, even if it makes no sense to them. I need to be able to be my natural self in front of others without much interaction. So in other words, I need others' energy without their assistance beyond their distance/respect. That should be a familiar environment, as most did 12-14 years of time in what some might consider a prison to learn how to work like that.
Nothing I discuss is with the intention of ever building anything. To me, the theory is the fun part and all that I need. It is just for entertainment for entertainment's sake itself. If more happens, that is fine, but it will never happen if someone tries to push me. While there was little chance of me doing anything in this regard before, it is even lower now.
To me, I need to discuss things to save time. The time that others waste on a breadboard and with useless experimenting is stuff I don't have to do. Imagine simulating code, timings, pathways, and delays, in one's own head. There are people out there whose minds work like that, and they deserve more respect and distance, not less. So you can more quickly rule out what doesn't work.
We need fewer incorrect meritocracy assumptions in society. Someone can take methamphetamines and turn out lots of work. Nobody knows what it is or if it even works, but they produce a ton of objects made from working things they've destroyed while under the influence of drugs. The slang term for that is called "tweaking," both the tremendous amount of work without coherent goals and the use of substances that produce such a state.
Of course, there are other misconceptions, such as treating homebrew projects as if they were gold. Well, the problem with thinking that is when your capital gets destroyed. Actual gold can't be destroyed, per se, but measuring someone's expertise by the number of finished projects they possess is a shortcoming. What if relatives accuse you of being a hoarder and throw your stuff out, thieves break in and steal your inventions (whether they know and appreciate the history or not, and they usually don't, they just want money to buy drugs, gamble, or whatever), or your place is targeted during a war (like the current Ukraine situation). Does that mean what you know or the amount of respect you deserve diminishes?
So, what I really need is an environment of 80s-styled geeks/nerds where we just spend all day discussing such stuff, with no pressure to build. That would be Paradise to me. And really, I think this should be a thread in General. It highlights what I experience in nearly any online community. If others simply stay out of my way and allow me to think out loud in front of them, I'd be able to build far more.
@PurpleGirl said:
Maybe I used some hyperbole, but you get my point. For me to be motivated, I need to talk about it in front of others and for others to think I am intelligent, and treat me accordingly. Constructive criticism is welcomed, but not folks questioning my right to make all of my own decisions or timetable, even if it makes no sense to them. I need to be able to be my natural self in front of others without much interaction.
No one ever infringed on your extant rights to anything or your self expression. However, no one will consider you particularly intelligent if you do not demonstrate that fact. Talking big words is not a demonstration of intelligence. Ever see politicians on TV?
So in other words, I need others' energy without their assistance beyond their distance/respect. That should be a familiar environment, as most did 12-14 years of time in what might as well be a prison to learn how to work like that.
And you think you have a right to "others' energy"?
(Criticism of the school system is to be accepted as valid)
Nothing I discuss is with the intention of ever building anything. To me, the theory is the fun part and all that I need. It is just for entertainment for entertainment's sake itself.
That's fine, but then clearly communicate that so that others don't waste their time if they aren't into that.
If more happens, that is fine, but it will never happen if someone tries to push me or take over the project for me. So while there was little chance of me doing anything in this regard before, it is even lower now. At least I'm grateful I didn't waste my time buying anything to use since I've been known to destroy components when I am not allowed to finish without others trying to rush me with something I don't even care about really, trying to take over the project, or putting me down because I am spending more time discussing it. Project purity is that important to me.
If you put an idea into the world and are then upset that people like the idea and want to see it realized, stop having ideas. No one
Also what do you mean by "Project Purity"?
To me, I need to discuss things to save time. The time that others waste on a breadboard and with useless experimenting is stuff I don't have to do.
You "save time" by getting others to engage in pointless discussion? Jo, hit up @ErNa on that time-saving relativity theory he's onto. Maybe you can co-write his paper and share the nobel prize. /s
Imagine simulating code, timings, pathways, and delays, in one's own head. There are people out there whose minds work like that, and they deserve more respect and distance, not less. So you can more quickly rule out what doesn't work.
Guess what I do before I start any project. That's like, the first step. The easiest step that takes the least time to do. The step that happens before I even speak a single word on it. And often my thinking is pessimistically biased and it ends up working twice as well as intended when put to (metaphorical) paper.
We need fewer incorrect meritocracy assumptions in society. Someone can take some methamphetamines and turn out lots of work. Nobody knows what it is or if it even works, but they produce a ton of objects made from working things they've destroyed while under the influence of drugs. I think the slang term for that is called "tweaking," both the tremendous amount of work without coherent goals and the use of substances that produce such a state.
You act as if there's no obvious qualitative difference between crud and thoughtful work.
Of course, there are other misconceptions, such as treating homebrew projects as if they were gold. Well, the problem with thinking is when your capital gets destroyed. Actual gold can't be destroyed, per se, but measuring someone's expertise by the number of finished projects they possess is a shortcoming. What if relatives accuse you of being a hoarder and throw your stuff out, thieves break in and steal your inventions (whether they know and appreciate the history or not, and they usually don't, they just want money to buy drugs, gamble, or whatever), or your place is targeted during a war (like the current Ukraine situation). Does that mean what you know or the amount of respect you deserve diminishes?
No, because the value created is in your mind. No one (well, no one reasonable) cares about the existence and possession of a physical product when valuing a person. There is a large difference between thinking about doing something and actually doing it and doing it to completion. It is always a learning experience for ways of thinking and intangible little things that hold everything together. If you have never accomplished anything you do infact by definition not possess significant expertise in the relevant field.
So, what I really need is an environment of 80s-styled geeks/nerds where we just spend all day discussing such stuff, with no pressure to build. That would be Paradise to me. And really, I think this should be a thread in General. It highlights what I experience in nearly any online community. If others' simply stayed out of my way and allowed me to think out loud in front of them, I'd be able to build far more.
You will not find a community of remotely smart and experienced people willing to indulge in pointless discussion of hypotheticals. If you introduce a truly good (as-in interesting to enough people) project idea and then don't actually realize it, some else will, in one form or another.
No one ever infringed on your extant rights to anything or your self expression. However, no one will consider you particularly intelligent if you do not demonstrate that fact. Talking big words is not a demonstration of intelligence. Ever see politicians on TV?
I disagree. You can use the big words correctly. Just stringing words together much like a "tweaker" (derogatory drug slang) stringing random objects together obviously means nothing. I miss when "tweaker" was a good term that involved things like running TSRs to get more video performance, reprogramming the PIT in a PC clone to reduce the DMA refresh time to more sensible values for the memory installed, installing a V20 in place of an 8088, defragging diskettes and hard drives, etc.
And you think you have a right to "others' energy"?
Just as much as they do of mine in a vacuum without actually interacting with me. So this is mutual, and fair exchange applies.
(Criticism of the school system is to be accepted as valid)
I think it needs to be more like it once was, where introversion and independence were praised. Others were assumed to simply be different and were allowed to be different to a degree (notwithstanding any bullying) and not patronized and assumed to be stupid because one does things differently, and perhaps more efficiently or otherwise better.
Nothing I discuss is with the intention of ever building anything. To me, the theory is the fun part and all that I need. It is just for entertainment for entertainment's sake itself.
That's fine, but then clearly communicate that so that others don't waste their time if they aren't into that.
Well, I honestly don't know. It is important that I do things on a whim and at the moment I decide, whenever that is. Others should be aware that there are many who are like that, stay out of their way, and help them to keep their options open. If you automatically jump in there to teach them and then you expect them to build something based on maybe your own assumptions, then who is the bigger [jerk], and whose fault is that? If one assumes others need help when they don't and then get upset at giving them so much without getting anything in return, when they never asked, then does such a person have a right to get upset?
If you put an idea into the world and are then upset that people like the idea and want to see it realized, stop having ideas. No one
That's not what I'm criticizing. Demanding that I do it because I merely mentioned it in passing and suggested how I might do it, and then trying to rush me or drop hints that I'm lazy or something is something else entirely.
Also what do you mean by "Project Purity"?
If I do something, it's important that I go into it with complete ignorance and get to learn from the experience itself, with nobody assuming they need to educate me beyond what I explicitly ask. I have a notion of purity of ideas too. I know you might find it absurd, but being told what I already know essentially ruins the value of me already knowing. It's like when I go home to my Higher Power, I'll be judged based on what I know that comes only from me. I feel I was sent here to bring new things to the world that are unique to me and that if I'm told what I already know, then what was previously on my "tally sheet" is removed. I know some will find me to be a jerk for supporting "Social Darwinism," but that is the standard I need to have applied to me.
Now, I leave no room for anyone to suggest hypocrisy. When I share things, the goal really isn't to teach or change others, but is merely a form of self-expression and starting a conversation with presumed equals (until they prove otherwise).
To me, I need to discuss things to save time. The time that others waste on a breadboard and with useless experimenting is stuff I don't have to do.
You "save time" by getting others to engage in pointless discussion? Jo, hit up @ErNa on that time-saving relativity theory he's onto. Maybe you can co-write his paper and share the nobel prize. /s
No, I think you misunderstood. I don't get others to engage at all. I take no responsibility for others choosing to waste time because they think less of me and assume something is so wrong with me that they must waste their time on me. I tend to constantly bend over backward in my life to NEVER create demands or needs for others so they will respect me enough to stay out of my life and not go to either extreme such as acting like they are my mother or trying to kiss up to me as some sort of glommer. I don't want to lead or be led. I don't want either end of power in my life. I don't want to have power over others or to have mere strangers presuming to have power over me. So it should be incredibly easy for most strangers to ignore me since I struggle hard to make that the case. However, in today's social climate, it seems the surest way to get to be left alone is to shove oneself down others' throats. I won't discuss that aspect any further.
Imagine simulating code, timings, pathways, and delays, in one's own head. There are people out there whose minds work like that, and they deserve more respect and distance, not less. So you can more quickly rule out what doesn't work.
Guess what I do before I start any project. That's like, the first step. The easiest step that takes the least time to do. The step that happens before I even speak a single word on it. And often my thinking is pessimistically biased and it ends up working twice as well as intended when put to (metaphorical) paper.
But what if you can't do it to the extent that I can? I can visualize the whole process so well that the entire idea bores me. I feel that society needs to destroy the whole logical fallacy that "Doing > Thinking/speaking." (And that can be seen as supporting the patriarchy or male-supremacist thinking.) No, if you think/say the right things, you don't need to waste your time doing as much work. I know this is not a place for spirituality, but I think we won't be judged so much for how much we do, but whether doing such was necessary. Anyone can do stuff, but it takes an incredible amount of self-control to avoid doing stuff when you don't have to.
We need fewer incorrect meritocracy assumptions in society. Someone can take some methamphetamines and turn out lots of work. Nobody knows what it is or if it even works, but they produce a ton of objects made from working things they've destroyed while under the influence of drugs. I think the slang term for that is called "tweaking," both the tremendous amount of work without coherent goals and the use of substances that produce such a state.
You act as if there's no obvious qualitative difference between crud and thoughtful work.
No, I literally just said the exact opposite. Anyone can take mind-altering chemicals and get "creative," but the pure volume of material produced is no real measure. Anyone can break necks off of CRTs and gut out an alarm clock and wire all that together. But it is not even useful work, and sometimes such contraptions put people at risk needlessly and cause law enforcement agencies to waste time. That reminds me of the kid who "built" an alarm clock and brought it to school. No, he gutted one and left it operational enough to still work. Then that caused the bomb squad to be called and started quite a political show. One can argue that was a "sore" that needed to be lanced, but I saw that as mostly causing undue conflict. I brought things like that to school. I remember an incident where someone taped a bomb threat to a discarded fluorescent ballast. The vice-principal who encountered that merely threw it all away. Apparently, he had
enough janitorial experience to know what a bad fluorescent ballast was. I remember when I was 5 and playing with another kid; we found a discarded shock absorber in some tall grass and pretended it was a bomb. I knew that was a car part from the start.
No, because the value created is in your mind. No one (well, no one reasonable) cares about the existence and possession of a physical product when valuing a person. There is a large difference between thinking about doing something and actually doing it and doing it to completion. It is always a learning experience for ways of thinking and intangible little things that hold everything together. If you have never accomplished anything you do infact by definition not possess significant expertise in the relevant field.
However, so many hold the view that completed projects are like a gold-backed currency. I was just pointing out the fallacy of that notion. To me, thinking about doing something is the same thing if you already possess the knowledge and skill to do it. I'm not popular for holding that view, but I hold it.
So, what I really need is an environment of 80s-styled geeks/nerds where we just spend all day discussing such stuff, with no pressure to build. That would be Paradise to me. And really, I think this should be a thread in General. It highlights what I experience in nearly any online community. If others' simply stayed out of my way and allowed me to think out loud in front of them, I'd be able to build far more.
You will not find a community of remotely smart and experienced people willing to indulge in pointless discussion of hypotheticals. If you introduce a truly good (as-in interesting to enough people) project idea and then don't actually realize it, some else will, in one form or another.
It is not pointless discussion, and I could care less about the "experienced" part. It is teaching (in the abstract, not to specific people), sharing, and learning as a form of entertainment, and much better than wasting your time watching sports that other people play, watching movies that other people write and star in, getting intoxicated on various substances, or having non-procreative intercourse.
I know I'm not the only one who feels this way. Niche fields and businesses are more popular than you think. Nobody thought someone could start a business with overpriced coffee where self-important people could sit around and discuss a certain bent of politics all day and make up special "signature drinks" to broadcast how highly the patrons feel about themselves. Even in libraries, there are books about the "pure sciences," and I checked out a few in elementary school, and they were quite boring. But if nobody was interested or at least needed that information, such books would have never existed. So I see a niche need that I have and you don't get, and I imagine I'm not the only one.
There, you got me to write a pointless WOT.
You chose to do that on your own! LOL! And you gave a lot of food for thought. It is the glaring elephant in the room in most tech forums. I've had this very discussion on Reddit, Discord, the ReactOS off-topic channel, etc.
You chose to do that on your own! LOL! And you gave a lot of food for thought.
I infact did. Because i'm a shithead hyperfocusing on this particular silly forum. And food for thought there is indeed. Perhaps not quite as pointless then?
Ok, we're going that way...
No one ever infringed on your extant rights to anything or your self expression. However, no one will consider you particularly intelligent if you do not demonstrate that fact. Talking big words is not a demonstration of intelligence. Ever see politicians on TV?
I disagree. You can use the big words correctly. Just stringing words together much like a "tweaker" (derogatory drug slang) stringing random objects together obviously means nothing. I miss when "tweaker" was a good term that involved things like running TSRs to get more video performance, reprogramming the PIT in a PC clone to reduce the DMA refresh time to more sensible values for the memory installed, installing a V20 in place of an 8088, defragging diskettes and hard drives, etc.
But those are not acts of speech. You dodged the implied question.
And you think you have a right to "others' energy"?
Just as much as they do of mine in a vacuum without actually interacting with me. So this is mutual, and fair exchange applies.
That assumes that everyone has the same amount of the same kind of "energy" (which is transferred neither by encouragement nor advice?)
(Criticism of the school system is to be accepted as valid)
I was praising it.
If comparing something to prison is an act of prasie, you may need to re-adjust your everything.
I think it needs to be more like it once was, where introversion and independence were praised. Others were assumed to simply be different and were allowed to be different to a degree (notwithstanding any bullying) and not patronized and assumed to be stupid because one does things differently, and perhaps more efficiently or otherwise better.
I don't think it was ever like that, not sure where you'd get that from. The different are always picked on. If anything its better these days.
Nothing I discuss is with the intention of ever building anything. To me, the theory is the fun part and all that I need. It is just for entertainment for entertainment's sake itself.
That's fine, but then clearly communicate that so that others don't waste their time if they aren't into that.
Well, I honestly don't know. It is important that I do things on a whim and at the moment I decide, whenever that is.
I am similar in such regards. I do the things I want when I do. If someone asks me to do something I don't want to do I just say "nah probably not now" and that's that (note that I almost never give anything that can be construed as a promsie, negative or positive. LPT.).
Others should be aware that there are many who are like that, stay out of their way, and help them to keep their options open. If you automatically jump in there to teach them and then you expect them to build something based on maybe your own assumptions, then who is the bigger [jerk], and whose fault is that? If one assumes others need help when they don't and then get upset at giving them so much without getting anything in return, when they never asked, then does such a person have a right to get upset?
No one is at any fault there. In a tech forum (especially one run by a commercial entity in desire to SellProductTM) there is an implication to posting a thread that you want to build something and are looking for feedback and advice on that.
If you put an idea into the world and are then upset that people like the idea and want to see it realized, stop having ideas. No one
That is not what I'm criticizing. Demanding that I do it because I merely mentioned it in passing and suggested how I might do it, and then trying to rush me or drop hints that I'm lazy or something is something else entirely.
A multi-page forum post is not "mentioning something in passing". No one demands you to do anything.
Also what do you mean by "Project Purity"?
If I do something, it is important that I go into it with complete ignorance and get to learn from the experience itself, with nobody assuming they need to educate me beyond what I explicitly ask. I have a notion of purity of ideas too. I know you might find it absurd, but being told what I already know essentially ruins the value of me already knowing. It is like when I go home to my Higher Power that I will be judged based on what I know that comes only from me. I feel I was sent here to bring new things to the world that are unique to me and that if I am told what I already know, then what was previously on my "tally sheet" is removed.
That's squarely a 'you' issue. Statistics show that 99% of internet users do not posses a 3rd eye capable of revealing the contents of your mind to them, so if they assume some knowledge may be of use to you, they post it, because they are nice people.
Now, unless you see room to suggest hypocrisy, that isn't the case here. When I share things, the goal really isn't to teach or change others, but is merely a form of self-expression and starting a conversation with presumed equals (until they prove otherwise).
To me, I need to discuss things to save time. The time that others waste on a breadboard and with useless experimenting is stuff I don't have to do.
You "save time" by getting others to engage in pointless discussion? Jo, hit up @ErNa on that time-saving relativity theory he's onto. Maybe you can co-write his paper and share the nobel prize. /s
No, I think you misunderstood. I don't get others to engage at all. I take no responsibility for others choosing to waste time because they think less of me and assume something is so wrong with me that they must waste their time on me. I tend to constantly bend over backward in my life to NEVER create demands or needs for others so they will respect me enough to stay out of my life and not go to either extreme such as acting like they are my mother (who is deceased and out of my way) or trying to kiss up to me as some sort of glommer. I don't want to lead or be led. I don't either end of power in my life. I don't want to have power over others or to have mere strangers presuming to have power over me. So it should be incredibly easy for most strangers to ignore me since I struggle hard to make that the case.
Creating a forum thread implicitly demands attention from the forum's denizens. A
However, in today's social climate, it seems the surest way to get to be left alone is to shove oneself down others' throats.
As said, if you want to write walls of text in peace, left totally alone, there's an app for that.
Imagine simulating code, timings, pathways, and delays, in one's own head. There are people out there whose minds work like that, and they deserve more respect and distance, not less. So you can more quickly rule out what doesn't work.
Guess what I do before I start any project. That's like, the first step. The easiest step that takes the least time to do. The step that happens before I even speak a single word on it. And often my thinking is pessimistically biased and it ends up working twice as well as intended when put to (metaphorical) paper.
But what if you can't do it to the extent that I can? I can visualize the whole process so well that the entire idea bores me.
I, infact, will go as far as to say that I can do it better than you. Mind, this is my inherently biased view based on your writings here.
I feel that society needs to destroy the whole logical fallacy that "Doing > Thinking/speaking."
(And that can be seen as supporting the patriarchy or male-supremacist thinking.)
If you're trying to imply that only men can do things (???), that is infact not a good look.
No, if you think/say the right things, you don't need to waste your time doing so much work.
If the work or its result is useful/enjoyable (especially to others), the time was not wasted.
Anyone can do stuff, but it takes an incredible amount of self-control to avoid doing stuff when you don't have to.
Mate, I think you might have the exact opposite problem of literally everyone else on the planet. Most people find they need self-control to _do _worthwhile-to-them things instead of shitposting on the internet
No, because the value created is in your mind. No one (well, no one reasonable) cares about the existence and possession of a physical product when valuing a person. There is a large difference between thinking about doing something and actually doing it and doing it to completion. It is always a learning experience for ways of thinking and intangible little things that hold everything together. If you have never accomplished anything you do infact by definition not possess significant expertise in the relevant field.
However, so many hold the view that completed projects are like a gold-backed currency.
That's because they are. They provide some semi-tangible value to someone.
I was just pointing out the fallacy of that notion.
You didn't point out any fallacies.
And you reached the conclusion that I was making here. To me, thinking about doing something is the same thing if you already possess the knowledge and skill to do it. I am not popular for holding that view, but I hold it.
It's unpopular because it is categorically false, as anyone whose ever done anything will tell you. You can have all the theoretical knowledge about playing tennis you want, if you've never hit a ball with a bat you have not played tennis.
With pretty much any technical project, the last 10% of work take 90% of the time. No one, not you, not I, not anyone, possesses the knowledge nd/or skill do to do something without having done it. Both from an empirical perspective ("I can actually walk on water, I'm just too lazy to do it") and from the perspective of the million tiny things you have not thought about that will come up when doing the thing.
So, what I really need is an environment of 80s-styled geeks/nerds where we just spend all day discussing such stuff, with no pressure to build. That would be Paradise to me. And really, I think this should be a thread in General. It highlights what I experience in nearly any online community. If others' simply stayed out of my way and allowed me to think out loud in front of them, I'd be able to build far more.
You will not find a community of remotely smart and experienced people willing to indulge in pointless discussion of hypotheticals. If you introduce a truly good (as-in interesting to enough people) project idea and then don't actually realize it, some else will, in one form or another.
It is not pointless discussion, and I could care less about the "experienced" part.
A bunch of toddlers sitting in a room discussing their plans to build a rocket to fly to mars... Perhaps a good analogy. Nothing wrong with that, as it were. But you can't say it really has a point beyond fleeting entertainment of those participating.
It is teaching (in the abstract, not to specific people), sharing, and learning as a form of entertainment,
But didn't you just object to being thought things you didn't ask for? Like, a lot of your posts include a bunch of easily researchable info that you could assume someone already knows. Are you considering their feelings?
and much better than wasting your time watching sports that other people play, watching movies that other people write and star in, getting intoxicated on various substances, or having non-procreative intercourse.
In your strange opinions perhaps.
I know I'm not the only one who feels this way. Niche fields and businesses are more popular than you think.
Nobody thought someone could start a business with overpriced coffee where self-important people could sit around and discuss a certain bent of politics all day and make up special "signature drinks" to broadcast how highly the patrons feel about themselves. Even in libraries, there are books about the "pure sciences," and I checked out a few in elementary school, and they were quite boring. But if nobody was interested or at least needed that information, such books would have never existed. So I see a niche need that I have and you don't get, and I imagine I am not the only one.
But people in these niches do things and don't just post ultimately inconsequential things online.
Is this post here inconsequential Smile? Probably.
Update: Thread OP has asked for us to re-open this thread, to allow clean-up of some OT posts, and to focus on the intended subject to a conclusion.
So.. thread unlocked. Please make healthy choices!
@rogloh said:
Ok, so I just built and tried out the DEV ROM instead of V5A ROM, no luck with improving the SAVE problem in MS BASIC.
I think this is either:
a real bug in Gigatron MS BASIC SAVE code - surely others would have reported it by now.
a bug in my emulator somewhere, possibly branch related yet only seen with MSBASIC SAVE instruction sequence?
or something to do with the FIFO potentially returning bad read data somehow due to my aggressive timing in the instruction handlers
EDIT: It could also be a real timing problem in Gigatron where the executed code is not 100% deterministic fitting in the scan line budget. For a regular bit banged output by Gigatron some occasional video artifacts like this are probably okay, but syncing things with XCONT on P2 doesn't like it.
With the monitoring code running I have observed that there are no instructions taking longer than 55 clocks. Strange I thought it was reporting 54 last night but it's 55 today.
I'm going to have a brief look at what's needed for enabing a PS/2 keyboard (if it's simple to realize I might include it as well as I've already done most of the coding work for it), and then tidy up the IO pin mapping, bundle it up as a 1.0 and probably leave it alone.
Have you made any more progress on the saving bug?
@PurpleGirl said:
Have you made any more progress on the saving bug?
Haven't been working on it. Did get some PS/2 keyboard stuff going though - made up a breakout board cable and got some initial keyboard data back with the PS2.ino file I converted to SPIN2. Found that a spare PCB from an earlier board I made for a SPI based full size SD card reader was ideal for making a 4 pin (dual) PS/2 adapter. Just soldered in 4 SMD 0603 10k pullups to 5V and I can use another Y-splitter cable I have for doing simultaneous keyboard and mouse experiments with the P2-EVAL.
Haven't been working on it. Did get some PS/2 keyboard stuff going though - made up a breakout board cable and got some initial keyboard data back with the PS2.ino file I converted to SPIN2. Found that a spare PCB from an earlier board I made for a SPI based full size SD card reader was ideal for making a 4 pin (dual) PS/2 adapter. Just soldered in 4 SMD 0603 10k pullups to 5V and I can use another Y-splitter cable I have for doing simultaneous keyboard and mouse experiments with the P2-EVAL.
If interested, I have a working PASM PS/2 keyboard driver in my repository.
If interested, I have a working PASM PS/2 keyboard driver in my repository.
Thanks macca. This PS/2 driver is sort of specific to Gigatron and came from Babelfish on an AVR. It needs to generate multiple codes independent of the regular PS/2 key repeat sequence and time them differently for cursor + special keys mapped to game controller buttons vs the normal alphanumeric keyboard characters. I've attached the hacked up file I used as a test harness. I'm using a SPIN2 API to control it and running a Smartpin in sync receive mode. In comparison the AVR used interrupts on a clock edge and polling and bit shifting is done in an ISR handler. It would be a closer match and simpler port to have used interrupts on the P2 as well but they can't easily be used with SPIN2. I've found the Smartpin polling I'm doing needs to be kept fast enough to not lose scan codes and I don't think it's quite there yet. To remedy it could always be run in its own COG but this is somewhat wasteful. Eg, you might end up having 5-6 COGs for a fully capable base system, like this:
1) one or two USB COGs, so you can have a USB game pad, AND/OR a USB keyboard
2) the Gigatron emulator COG itself
3) an IO COG that outputs VGA, audio, LEDs and accepts game controller input(s)
4) the Babelfish COG in SPIN2
5) a PS/2 COG. Although you could probably then get rid of one of the USB COGs above if it's an either or choice of keyboard type.
Ideally COGs 4&5 are merged. There's enough P2 horsepower for this with simple polling surely, especially at 325MHz or higher. Just have to make sure all repeat loops Babelfish uses keeps testing that PS/2 keyboard data Smartpin for capturing new data to a FIFO.
Comments
What motivates me is being allowed to mention my eventual plans and motivate myself. Once another acts in the least like a parent over me or criticizes me for merely wanting to discuss it, then my motivation is diminished. Motivation for me tends to come from me and can be diminished by others.
I started this to motivate myself, which for me, requires years of me sharing what I MIGHT do without others attacking my project, and me being allowed to do it on a whim without being rushed. If I cannot spend years discussing something for my own entertainment without others interfering or insisting that I adopt a predatory approach, then that means others are wasting my life and destroying what makes me me.
lmao
Can't even tell if shitpost or genuine.
If you inexplicably really can't deal with constructive comments on your forum threads, may I suggest Microsoft(TM) Word(TM) Version 95 or higher. You can write things there with no pesky randos going inbetween.
If you allegedly need to discuss a project for 3 years without any one commenting any encouragement before starting to work on it, may I ask: Have you ever gotten to that stage? Finished anything? This is coming from a notorious not-finisher of anything, mind you.
I used some hyperbole, but you get my point. For me to be motivated, I need to talk about it in front of others and for others to think I am intelligent, and treat me accordingly. Constructive criticism is welcomed, but not folks questioning my right to make all of my own decisions or timetable, even if it makes no sense to them. I need to be able to be my natural self in front of others without much interaction. So in other words, I need others' energy without their assistance beyond their distance/respect. That should be a familiar environment, as most did 12-14 years of time in what some might consider a prison to learn how to work like that.
Nothing I discuss is with the intention of ever building anything. To me, the theory is the fun part and all that I need. It is just for entertainment for entertainment's sake itself. If more happens, that is fine, but it will never happen if someone tries to push me. While there was little chance of me doing anything in this regard before, it is even lower now.
To me, I need to discuss things to save time. The time that others waste on a breadboard and with useless experimenting is stuff I don't have to do. Imagine simulating code, timings, pathways, and delays, in one's own head. There are people out there whose minds work like that, and they deserve more respect and distance, not less. So you can more quickly rule out what doesn't work.
We need fewer incorrect meritocracy assumptions in society. Someone can take methamphetamines and turn out lots of work. Nobody knows what it is or if it even works, but they produce a ton of objects made from working things they've destroyed while under the influence of drugs. The slang term for that is called "tweaking," both the tremendous amount of work without coherent goals and the use of substances that produce such a state.
Of course, there are other misconceptions, such as treating homebrew projects as if they were gold. Well, the problem with thinking that is when your capital gets destroyed. Actual gold can't be destroyed, per se, but measuring someone's expertise by the number of finished projects they possess is a shortcoming. What if relatives accuse you of being a hoarder and throw your stuff out, thieves break in and steal your inventions (whether they know and appreciate the history or not, and they usually don't, they just want money to buy drugs, gamble, or whatever), or your place is targeted during a war (like the current Ukraine situation). Does that mean what you know or the amount of respect you deserve diminishes?
So, what I really need is an environment of 80s-styled geeks/nerds where we just spend all day discussing such stuff, with no pressure to build. That would be Paradise to me. And really, I think this should be a thread in General. It highlights what I experience in nearly any online community. If others simply stay out of my way and allow me to think out loud in front of them, I'd be able to build far more.
Ok, we're going that way...
No one ever infringed on your extant rights to anything or your self expression. However, no one will consider you particularly intelligent if you do not demonstrate that fact. Talking big words is not a demonstration of intelligence. Ever see politicians on TV?
And you think you have a right to "others' energy"?
(Criticism of the school system is to be accepted as valid)
That's fine, but then clearly communicate that so that others don't waste their time if they aren't into that.
If you put an idea into the world and are then upset that people like the idea and want to see it realized, stop having ideas. No one
Also what do you mean by "Project Purity"?
You "save time" by getting others to engage in pointless discussion? Jo, hit up @ErNa on that time-saving relativity theory he's onto. Maybe you can co-write his paper and share the nobel prize. /s
Guess what I do before I start any project. That's like, the first step. The easiest step that takes the least time to do. The step that happens before I even speak a single word on it. And often my thinking is pessimistically biased and it ends up working twice as well as intended when put to (metaphorical) paper.
You act as if there's no obvious qualitative difference between crud and thoughtful work.
No, because the value created is in your mind. No one (well, no one reasonable) cares about the existence and possession of a physical product when valuing a person. There is a large difference between thinking about doing something and actually doing it and doing it to completion. It is always a learning experience for ways of thinking and intangible little things that hold everything together. If you have never accomplished anything you do infact by definition not possess significant expertise in the relevant field.
You will not find a community of remotely smart and experienced people willing to indulge in pointless discussion of hypotheticals. If you introduce a truly good (as-in interesting to enough people) project idea and then don't actually realize it, some else will, in one form or another.
There, you got me to write a pointless WOT.
I disagree. You can use the big words correctly. Just stringing words together much like a "tweaker" (derogatory drug slang) stringing random objects together obviously means nothing. I miss when "tweaker" was a good term that involved things like running TSRs to get more video performance, reprogramming the PIT in a PC clone to reduce the DMA refresh time to more sensible values for the memory installed, installing a V20 in place of an 8088, defragging diskettes and hard drives, etc.
Just as much as they do of mine in a vacuum without actually interacting with me. So this is mutual, and fair exchange applies.
I think it needs to be more like it once was, where introversion and independence were praised. Others were assumed to simply be different and were allowed to be different to a degree (notwithstanding any bullying) and not patronized and assumed to be stupid because one does things differently, and perhaps more efficiently or otherwise better.
Well, I honestly don't know. It is important that I do things on a whim and at the moment I decide, whenever that is. Others should be aware that there are many who are like that, stay out of their way, and help them to keep their options open. If you automatically jump in there to teach them and then you expect them to build something based on maybe your own assumptions, then who is the bigger [jerk], and whose fault is that? If one assumes others need help when they don't and then get upset at giving them so much without getting anything in return, when they never asked, then does such a person have a right to get upset?
That's not what I'm criticizing. Demanding that I do it because I merely mentioned it in passing and suggested how I might do it, and then trying to rush me or drop hints that I'm lazy or something is something else entirely.
If I do something, it's important that I go into it with complete ignorance and get to learn from the experience itself, with nobody assuming they need to educate me beyond what I explicitly ask. I have a notion of purity of ideas too. I know you might find it absurd, but being told what I already know essentially ruins the value of me already knowing. It's like when I go home to my Higher Power, I'll be judged based on what I know that comes only from me. I feel I was sent here to bring new things to the world that are unique to me and that if I'm told what I already know, then what was previously on my "tally sheet" is removed. I know some will find me to be a jerk for supporting "Social Darwinism," but that is the standard I need to have applied to me.
Now, I leave no room for anyone to suggest hypocrisy. When I share things, the goal really isn't to teach or change others, but is merely a form of self-expression and starting a conversation with presumed equals (until they prove otherwise).
No, I think you misunderstood. I don't get others to engage at all. I take no responsibility for others choosing to waste time because they think less of me and assume something is so wrong with me that they must waste their time on me. I tend to constantly bend over backward in my life to NEVER create demands or needs for others so they will respect me enough to stay out of my life and not go to either extreme such as acting like they are my mother or trying to kiss up to me as some sort of glommer. I don't want to lead or be led. I don't want either end of power in my life. I don't want to have power over others or to have mere strangers presuming to have power over me. So it should be incredibly easy for most strangers to ignore me since I struggle hard to make that the case. However, in today's social climate, it seems the surest way to get to be left alone is to shove oneself down others' throats. I won't discuss that aspect any further.
But what if you can't do it to the extent that I can? I can visualize the whole process so well that the entire idea bores me. I feel that society needs to destroy the whole logical fallacy that "Doing > Thinking/speaking." (And that can be seen as supporting the patriarchy or male-supremacist thinking.) No, if you think/say the right things, you don't need to waste your time doing as much work. I know this is not a place for spirituality, but I think we won't be judged so much for how much we do, but whether doing such was necessary. Anyone can do stuff, but it takes an incredible amount of self-control to avoid doing stuff when you don't have to.
No, I literally just said the exact opposite. Anyone can take mind-altering chemicals and get "creative," but the pure volume of material produced is no real measure. Anyone can break necks off of CRTs and gut out an alarm clock and wire all that together. But it is not even useful work, and sometimes such contraptions put people at risk needlessly and cause law enforcement agencies to waste time. That reminds me of the kid who "built" an alarm clock and brought it to school. No, he gutted one and left it operational enough to still work. Then that caused the bomb squad to be called and started quite a political show. One can argue that was a "sore" that needed to be lanced, but I saw that as mostly causing undue conflict. I brought things like that to school. I remember an incident where someone taped a bomb threat to a discarded fluorescent ballast. The vice-principal who encountered that merely threw it all away. Apparently, he had
enough janitorial experience to know what a bad fluorescent ballast was. I remember when I was 5 and playing with another kid; we found a discarded shock absorber in some tall grass and pretended it was a bomb. I knew that was a car part from the start.
However, so many hold the view that completed projects are like a gold-backed currency. I was just pointing out the fallacy of that notion. To me, thinking about doing something is the same thing if you already possess the knowledge and skill to do it. I'm not popular for holding that view, but I hold it.
It is not pointless discussion, and I could care less about the "experienced" part. It is teaching (in the abstract, not to specific people), sharing, and learning as a form of entertainment, and much better than wasting your time watching sports that other people play, watching movies that other people write and star in, getting intoxicated on various substances, or having non-procreative intercourse.
I know I'm not the only one who feels this way. Niche fields and businesses are more popular than you think. Nobody thought someone could start a business with overpriced coffee where self-important people could sit around and discuss a certain bent of politics all day and make up special "signature drinks" to broadcast how highly the patrons feel about themselves. Even in libraries, there are books about the "pure sciences," and I checked out a few in elementary school, and they were quite boring. But if nobody was interested or at least needed that information, such books would have never existed. So I see a niche need that I have and you don't get, and I imagine I'm not the only one.
You chose to do that on your own! LOL! And you gave a lot of food for thought. It is the glaring elephant in the room in most tech forums. I've had this very discussion on Reddit, Discord, the ReactOS off-topic channel, etc.
I like turtles. Just sayin’
I infact did. Because i'm a shithead hyperfocusing on this particular silly forum. And food for thought there is indeed. Perhaps not quite as pointless then?
But those are not acts of speech. You dodged the implied question.
That assumes that everyone has the same amount of the same kind of "energy" (which is transferred neither by encouragement nor advice?)
If comparing something to prison is an act of prasie, you may need to re-adjust your everything.
I don't think it was ever like that, not sure where you'd get that from. The different are always picked on. If anything its better these days.
I am similar in such regards. I do the things I want when I do. If someone asks me to do something I don't want to do I just say "nah probably not now" and that's that (note that I almost never give anything that can be construed as a promsie, negative or positive. LPT.).
No one is at any fault there. In a tech forum (especially one run by a commercial entity in desire to SellProductTM) there is an implication to posting a thread that you want to build something and are looking for feedback and advice on that.
A multi-page forum post is not "mentioning something in passing". No one demands you to do anything.
That's squarely a 'you' issue. Statistics show that 99% of internet users do not posses a 3rd eye capable of revealing the contents of your mind to them, so if they assume some knowledge may be of use to you, they post it, because they are nice people.
Creating a forum thread implicitly demands attention from the forum's denizens. A
As said, if you want to write walls of text in peace, left totally alone, there's an app for that.
I, infact, will go as far as to say that I can do it better than you. Mind, this is my inherently biased view based on your writings here.
I think you just won the "Worst opinion of the year" award. But hey, I can recommend you a community that is entirely built to post pointless thoughts.
If you're trying to imply that only men can do things (???), that is infact not a good look.
If the work or its result is useful/enjoyable (especially to others), the time was not wasted.
Mate, I think you might have the exact opposite problem of literally everyone else on the planet. Most people find they need self-control to _do _worthwhile-to-them things instead of shitposting on the internet
That's because they are. They provide some semi-tangible value to someone.
You didn't point out any fallacies.
It's unpopular because it is categorically false, as anyone whose ever done anything will tell you. You can have all the theoretical knowledge about playing tennis you want, if you've never hit a ball with a bat you have not played tennis.
With pretty much any technical project, the last 10% of work take 90% of the time. No one, not you, not I, not anyone, possesses the knowledge nd/or skill do to do something without having done it. Both from an empirical perspective ("I can actually walk on water, I'm just too lazy to do it") and from the perspective of the million tiny things you have not thought about that will come up when doing the thing.
A bunch of toddlers sitting in a room discussing their plans to build a rocket to fly to mars... Perhaps a good analogy. Nothing wrong with that, as it were. But you can't say it really has a point beyond fleeting entertainment of those participating.
But didn't you just object to being thought things you didn't ask for? Like, a lot of your posts include a bunch of easily researchable info that you could assume someone already knows. Are you considering their feelings?
In your strange opinions perhaps.
But people in these niches do things and don't just post ultimately inconsequential things online.
Is this post here inconsequential Smile? Probably.
Thread seems to have gone as far as it can. Let's close this and move on.
Update: Thread OP has asked for us to re-open this thread, to allow clean-up of some OT posts, and to focus on the intended subject to a conclusion.
So.. thread unlocked. Please make healthy choices!
Have you made any more progress on the saving bug?
Deleted
Haven't been working on it. Did get some PS/2 keyboard stuff going though - made up a breakout board cable and got some initial keyboard data back with the PS2.ino file I converted to SPIN2. Found that a spare PCB from an earlier board I made for a SPI based full size SD card reader was ideal for making a 4 pin (dual) PS/2 adapter. Just soldered in 4 SMD 0603 10k pullups to 5V and I can use another Y-splitter cable I have for doing simultaneous keyboard and mouse experiments with the P2-EVAL.
If interested, I have a working PASM PS/2 keyboard driver in my repository.
Thanks macca. This PS/2 driver is sort of specific to Gigatron and came from Babelfish on an AVR. It needs to generate multiple codes independent of the regular PS/2 key repeat sequence and time them differently for cursor + special keys mapped to game controller buttons vs the normal alphanumeric keyboard characters. I've attached the hacked up file I used as a test harness. I'm using a SPIN2 API to control it and running a Smartpin in sync receive mode. In comparison the AVR used interrupts on a clock edge and polling and bit shifting is done in an ISR handler. It would be a closer match and simpler port to have used interrupts on the P2 as well but they can't easily be used with SPIN2. I've found the Smartpin polling I'm doing needs to be kept fast enough to not lose scan codes and I don't think it's quite there yet. To remedy it could always be run in its own COG but this is somewhat wasteful. Eg, you might end up having 5-6 COGs for a fully capable base system, like this:
1) one or two USB COGs, so you can have a USB game pad, AND/OR a USB keyboard
2) the Gigatron emulator COG itself
3) an IO COG that outputs VGA, audio, LEDs and accepts game controller input(s)
4) the Babelfish COG in SPIN2
5) a PS/2 COG. Although you could probably then get rid of one of the USB COGs above if it's an either or choice of keyboard type.
Ideally COGs 4&5 are merged. There's enough P2 horsepower for this with simple polling surely, especially at 325MHz or higher. Just have to make sure all repeat loops Babelfish uses keeps testing that PS/2 keyboard data Smartpin for capturing new data to a FIFO.