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Using wireless in a high noise environment? — Parallax Forums

Using wireless in a high noise environment?

T ChapT Chap Posts: 4,223
in General Discussion
If you were trying to use wireless around a number of large motors and lots of noise is there is a "best" method to look at? I have used the Nordic nRF24L01+ where you can send some limited data control signals Prop to Prop. 1 Master module talking to multiple slaves. Even if there was a packet failure there is time to make multiple attempts to get a chksum to pass. 50' max. 25' minimum.

Comments

  • localrogerlocalroger Posts: 3,451
    Nothing comes close to an ESP8266 or ESP32. Look into the ESPnow protocol, which is optimized for range and performance with relatively light data loads and allows up to about 20 modules to form a peer to peer network without all the folderol of maintaining a hotspot, SSID's, joining, and so on. For even better performance use a camera module which has a plug for an external antenna. (Camera modules do this because of the camera bandwidth, but the ext antenna also improves range and signal strength for other data if you're not using the camera.)
  • WBA ConsultingWBA Consulting Posts: 2,934
    Depending on the effort to adjust code for them, you could look at 900Mhz modules. We have a customer at work that just started making 900Mhz versions of their 2.4Ghz products specifically for your exact scenario. Their products originally intended for use in a datacenter environment were actually being used by a few of their customers in industrial level manufacturing environments (AKA many large DC/AC motors in the area) and they asked for a more reliable version for the ones being used next to large motors. They prototyped a 900Mhz version and had none of the issues of the 2.4Ghz version.

    If the environment is not that severe, I second localroger's suggestion of the ESP series. I cannot believe how easy they are to use and how well they have performed in undesired locations. (I know someone that has one INSIDE their dust collection system connected to a pressure sensor)
  • localrogerlocalroger Posts: 3,451
    WBA, do you have any links or part numbers to suggest? I'm always on the prowl for something better...
  • T ChapT Chap Posts: 4,223
    Thanks for the suggestions guys.

    I remember years ago trying some devices like this XBEE Pro 900. Seems connecting a Prop direct to these was just like connecting straight wire between devices. Is this similar to what you are describing for 900 devices?

    https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/digi/XBP9B-XCST-001/3482817
  • WBA ConsultingWBA Consulting Posts: 2,934
    localroger wrote: »
    WBA, do you have any links or part numbers to suggest? I'm always on the prowl for something better...

    The most recent one used on boards for high noise environments was TI CC1312R. I did not realize it was not a module until I looked at the customer's design again, so I will dig a little deeper for the other modules that we have placed.
  • WBA ConsultingWBA Consulting Posts: 2,934
    Here are the other modules that I have seen used in place of 2.4 specifically due to noisy environments:

    Murata RN2903A-I/RM105
    RF Solutions ZETAPLUS-915-SO
    RF Solutions GAMMA-915-SO

    The Gamma unit was one used on one of the prototypes that ended up settling on the CC1312R solution instead. The Gamma unit worked well, but nowhere near the level of the design specific board layout using the CC1312R.
  • T ChapT Chap Posts: 4,223
    Curious if the "design specific" performance was related to received signal? It's not clear what made the CC1312r better than that Gamma module? I take it that the CC1312r cannot be bought in a module format and must be designed in a board from scratch? Can the Gamma behave like straight wire where you connect a prop to it and set any number of modules as a receiver with a prop with their own ID? I'd like to use it like RS485, send a packet with an ID 1-10 any all receive the packet. If one has the ID sent then it will reply with what is requested.
  • MicksterMickster Posts: 2,693
    I built this 20 axis CNC tube bender back in 2006 to produce fuel injector tubes for Ford/Siemens/Navistar:

    The infinitely rotating indexing table carries 8 closed-loop servo motors. Power is provided by a slip-ring but control signals are WiFi. Never a glitch with the Wi-Fi

    https://youtu.be/CsIPJ6m8hpQ

    Back in 2000, I had a machine that incorporated a high frequency welder + 40HP AC-Vector drive + dozens of solenoid valves. The main controller was Windows based which communicated with a DOS-based PC104 motion controller via WiFi. The high frequency welder caused the CRT to distort like crazy but the WiFi remained rock-solid.

    WiFi will soon be replacing my current 4-wire RS-485/422 bus as I edge towards my goal of the wireless machine (power notwithstanding)
  • T ChapT Chap Posts: 4,223
    edited 2020-11-27 22:32
    Nice video! How are you doing the wifi
  • MicksterMickster Posts: 2,693
    In that case it was wireless CANbus and IIRC, Hilscher was the only option.

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