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viewport

pegoongopegoongo Posts: 4
edited 2018-02-09 19:24 in General Discussion
Hello, I wonder if someone knows if Viewport works for Propeller Quick board, or if there is any other program that applies now?

BR,
Peter

Comments

  • MicksterMickster Posts: 2,693
    Viewport should work with any P1 based board. It's a cool IDE. I use it for PropBasic but the latest version of Viewport (that I know of) has a bug. I don't even remember what the bug is but I use the earlier version.
  • pegoongopegoongo Posts: 4
    Thanks!

    I have just started to learn about Propeller and spin code. I like this processor. Just wondering if this side about Viewport is still valued (onerobot.org)? Then it looks like the propeller is quite old.
    I have try to test a simple program, but Viewport only complain about update license. Dose not debug includes the open trail 30 days?


  • MicksterMickster Posts: 2,693
    edited 2018-02-13 08:33
    I purchased the full license from the start so I have always had full functionality.

    I purchased from onerobot.org

    I use the "482" version. The "489" has a problem, at least with PropBasic.
  • pegoongopegoongo Posts: 4
    Ok, Thanks! But this sait does not seems to work anymore. I have try to contact them, but get error message. Strange if there is no support for this software.
    BR,
    Peter
  • WhitWhit Posts: 4,191
    Try http://onerobot.org/#ViewPort

    Worked for me...
  • MicksterMickster Posts: 2,693
    The author, Hanno Sander, hasn't been around for a long time. I heard that he was hurt in an accident. I seem to remember asking about him on this forum but I don't remember the outcome.
  • PublisonPublison Posts: 12,366
    I emailed Hanno yesterday, and he said he fixed the contact portion of the onerobot.org website. He also PM'd the OP with regards to purchasing the software.
  • MicksterMickster Posts: 2,693
    Good to know that he's still around. Thanks!
  • Clock LoopClock Loop Posts: 2,069
    edited 2018-02-21 19:57
    I myself have sent messages to both support pages at http://onerobot.org/#Contact and blockyprop, the onerobot support page gives an error, and the onerobot contact page works, but I didn't get a reply..

    After attempting the first one, and getting an error, and then attempting the second MULTIPLE times.. I gave up.

    My personal opinion is, buyer beware. You won't find support, and DO NOT LOOSE YOUR SOFTWARE KEY, i had a hd failure, and mine was lost, and I can't get any support.

    I supported him by paying for the pro version of viewport, years ago or so, (or more) and can't use it at all because i cannot contact the author.(or won't reply)


    I figured it would keep getting developed and have support, which is why i paid for the most expensive one, But that stopped...
    It seems a few have contact success, while most, are ignored/aren't successfull? I dunno, but how much must one do?

    The sites and contact info remind me of those sites that sell you stuff, but have no way to contact them if there are issues, you are just SOL, if they choose to not respond.
    No business address, phone, etc...

    But the page to purchase product, ALWAYS works, naturally.
  • David BetzDavid Betz Posts: 14,516
    I just noticed that Parallax has only one PropScope remaining in stock and they are EOL so that's the last of them.
  • Clock LoopClock Loop Posts: 2,069
    edited 2018-02-21 19:54
    Wow, wonder whats up with that?

    Probably the hardware (frame, cables, etc) are actually more expensive than they are selling for...
    The good deals always get discontinued, not profitable.


    One thing I learned early on about product development, 75% of the cost is the assembly, enclosure and human interface.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    Such are the perils of closed source software. Vendor goes away or drops support and you are left high and dry. It's a pattern I have seen repeating over and over for decades now.

    I don't mean to say anything bad about Hanno and Viewport. It's just the way things go.

  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    Of course the other 75% of the cost is marketing and distribution.
  • PublisonPublison Posts: 12,366
    Clock Loop wrote: »
    I myself have sent messages to both support pages at http://onerobot.org/#Contact and blockyprop, the onerobot support page gives an error, and the onerobot contact page works, but I didn't get a reply..

    After attempting the first one, and getting an error, and then attempting the second MULTIPLE times.. I gave up.

    My personal opinion is, buyer beware. You won't find support, and DO NOT LOOSE YOUR SOFTWARE KEY, i had a hd failure, and mine was lost, and I can't get any support.

    I supported him by paying for the pro version of viewport, years ago or so, (or more) and can't use it at all because i cannot contact the author.(or won't reply)


    I figured it would keep getting developed and have support, which is why i paid for the most expensive one, But that stopped...
    It seems a few have contact success, while most, are ignored/aren't successfull? I dunno, but how much must one do?

    The sites and contact info remind me of those sites that sell you stuff, but have no way to contact them if there are issues, you are just SOL, if they choose to not respond.
    No business address, phone, etc...

    But the page to purchase product, ALWAYS works, naturally.

    When I contacted Hanno, he said there was a problem with the contact page. That has been fixed as of yesterday.
  • David BetzDavid Betz Posts: 14,516
    Heater. wrote: »
    Such are the perils of closed source software. Vendor goes away or drops support and you are left high and dry. It's a pattern I have seen repeating over and over for decades now.

    I don't mean to say anything bad about Hanno and Viewport. It's just the way things go.
    I wonder if there is any chance that Hanno would release the code as open source if he's not selling the hardware anymore?

  • PublisonPublison Posts: 12,366
    David Betz wrote: »
    Heater. wrote: »
    Such are the perils of closed source software. Vendor goes away or drops support and you are left high and dry. It's a pattern I have seen repeating over and over for decades now.

    I don't mean to say anything bad about Hanno and Viewport. It's just the way things go.
    I wonder if there is any chance that Hanno would release the code as open source if he's not selling the hardware anymore?

    I believe the hardware for the PropScope belongs to Parallax. The software for the PopScope is based on Viewport, which Hanno still owns and sells.

  • Ken GraceyKen Gracey Posts: 7,392
    Publison wrote: »
    David Betz wrote: »
    Heater. wrote: »
    Such are the perils of closed source software. Vendor goes away or drops support and you are left high and dry. It's a pattern I have seen repeating over and over for decades now.

    I don't mean to say anything bad about Hanno and Viewport. It's just the way things go.
    I wonder if there is any chance that Hanno would release the code as open source if he's not selling the hardware anymore?

    I believe the hardware for the PropScope belongs to Parallax. The software for the PopScope is based on Viewport, which Hanno still owns and sells.

    Correct - we own the hardware and he owns the software.
  • MicksterMickster Posts: 2,693
    I also have the full version of Viewport. I value my time and this product has easily justified the investment.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    Ken,
    Correct - we own the hardware and he owns the software.
    Kind of like the IBM PC and MS-DOS then.

    I draw no conclusions...
  • David BetzDavid Betz Posts: 14,516
    Publison wrote: »
    David Betz wrote: »
    Heater. wrote: »
    Such are the perils of closed source software. Vendor goes away or drops support and you are left high and dry. It's a pattern I have seen repeating over and over for decades now.

    I don't mean to say anything bad about Hanno and Viewport. It's just the way things go.
    I wonder if there is any chance that Hanno would release the code as open source if he's not selling the hardware anymore?

    I believe the hardware for the PropScope belongs to Parallax. The software for the PopScope is based on Viewport, which Hanno still owns and sells.
    Okay but does the Viewport software work with any other hardware? If you can't buy the hardware what good is the software?

  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    heater wrote:
    Ken,
    Ken Gracey wrote:
    Correct - we own the hardware and he owns the software.
    Kind of like the IBM PC and MS-DOS then.
    Or a mobile home park, where the owners own the land, but the tenants own the "houses" they live in. :)

    -Phil
  • Ken GraceyKen Gracey Posts: 7,392
    edited 2018-02-22 03:23
    Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) wrote: »
    heater wrote:
    Ken,
    Ken Gracey wrote:
    Correct - we own the hardware and he owns the software.
    Kind of like the IBM PC and MS-DOS then.
    Or a mobile home park, where the owners own the land, but the tenants own the "houses" they live in. :)

    -Phil

    Something like this, I suppose. It's not the best business model for a hardware product because the trailer owner and land owner must be in sync about all aspects of the use: making noise, how many cars can be parked, what to do with garbage, the sewer hookup, and when rent is paid. And this has to happen harmoniously for a long time, else things happen: trailer windows start to break, noise happens and neighbors get upset, etc.

    In this case, rent is getting paid and the trailer owner wants to move, the landlord isn't taking any calls and he might even remove the wheels from the house so the situation is getting stuck. Meanwhile there's a better use for the land.

    Just to be clear: Hanno has served the product well. It's just that the software isn't being revised, better solutions exist, and the BOM cost has wiped out any profit.

    Ken Gracey

  • MicksterMickster Posts: 2,693
    edited 2018-02-22 07:23
    Okay but does the Viewport software work with any other hardware? If you can't buy the hardware what good is the software?

    Just to be clear; the "Viewport software" doesn't require any external hardware.

  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    What does the Viewport software view it it does not have a port?

    I know nothing about it. Just wondering.
  • David BetzDavid Betz Posts: 14,516
    Mickster wrote: »
    Okay but does the Viewport software work with any other hardware? If you can't buy the hardware what good is the software?

    Just to be clear; the "Viewport software" doesn't require any external hardware.
    Ah, okay. That makes more sense.

  • MicksterMickster Posts: 2,693
    Heater. wrote: »
    What does the Viewport software view it it does not have a port?

    I know nothing about it. Just wondering.

    It dedicates a cog to constantly upload the state of the Prop I/O to the terminal.

    You can use WATCH/UNWATCH to upload the value of a variable. During debug, Viewport will generate the extra code required.

    Variables can be modified during execution.

    The state of each Prop pin is graphically displayed and then, of course, there is the scope etc.
  • macrobeakmacrobeak Posts: 354
    Heater,
    I have found Viewport to be quite a useful debugging, data capture and monitoring tool for Prop programs.
    You should read the manual to get a full overview.
    The most useful feature for me is the ability to view and change Prop variables in real time (I guess this is the "view" part) the DSO and Spectrum Analyser.
    In particular, the Fuzzy Logic module allows you to easily build, observe and tune simple Fuzzy Logic control projects.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    Viewport sounds like a great piece of work.

    It closed source though. Off my radar for my hobby projects.

  • MicksterMickster Posts: 2,693
    edited 2018-02-24 04:52
    @Clock Loop
    My key came to my Gmail. I have had to grab it from there a couple of times.

    Edit: I had addressed the wrong forum member.
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