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U.S. seeks ideas from professionals to hobbyists on use of available technologies in terror attacks — Parallax Forums

U.S. seeks ideas from professionals to hobbyists on use of available technologies in terror attacks

http://www.computerworld.com/article/3043984/security/defense-dept-wants-your-help-in-imagining-the-worst.html
Uncle Sam wants your brain power, technical expertise and imagination to help defend the U.S. No enlistment required.

The Department of Defense says it needs to understand how everyday objects and available technologies can be used by terrorists.

The range of technologies is so vast that the military's main scientific agency, the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA), says it needs input from as many technical people as possible.

The agency has put out an open call for anyone from a credentialed professional to "skilled hobbyist" in all technical areas, including IT.
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Comments

  • I think that's the smartest thing our government has done in a long time.... I just hope they have some clever way to sort through all the bogus ideas that will be sent in.
  • This makes me nervous for two reasons:

    1. It also means that the US Govt could use that information and those same everyday objects against others.
    2. If you have the skill and know-how to turn everyday objects into terrorist weapons, the US Govt is probably the last one you want to announce that to.
  • Seairth wrote: »
    1. It also means that the US Govt could use that information and those same everyday objects against others.

    What extra power does this give the US government? I think what makes terrorists search for these "everyday object" solutions is because they may not have access to top-of-the-line technology and have to "make do" with low end stuff. They have to MacGyver everything. I wouldn't think the government has this problem.
    Seairth wrote: »
    2. If you have the skill and know-how to turn everyday objects into terrorist weapons, the US Govt is probably the last one you want to announce that to.

    I happen to disagree, but I understand there are lots of others that are probably thinking the same thing. Those worried about this don't have to submit their ideas, though.
  • DavidZemon wrote: »
    Seairth wrote: »
    2. If you have the skill and know-how to turn everyday objects into terrorist weapons, the US Govt is probably the last one you want to announce that to.

    I happen to disagree, but I understand there are lots of others that are probably thinking the same thing. Those worried about this don't have to submit their ideas, though.

    Well, I'm not submitting anything. But that's because I don't have any ideas. Besides, I'm sure I'm already on a list somewhere for having an unusual first name. :D
  • Seairth wrote: »
    Well, I'm not submitting anything. But that's because I don't have any ideas. Besides, I'm sure I'm already on a list somewhere for having an unusual first name. :D

    Of course you don't....

    Hmm... I wonder if I can submit ideas on your behalf.
  • kwinnkwinn Posts: 8,697
    DavidZemon wrote: »
    I think that's the smartest thing our government has done in a long time.... I just hope they have some clever way to sort through all the bogus ideas that will be sent in.

    I agree with you, but I also worry that Seairth may have a valid point.

    Also, lot of damage could be done using chemicals and materials that are available to the general public. No point in providing more ideas along that line.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    Great, so we tell our governments how we could possibly, maybe, wreak havoc with our geek toys and expertise, then the governments starts outlawing or regulating such toys.

    For example, write a blog about your laser guided quadcopter, boom it's taken down from the net and big guys with guns are smashing in your front door.

    See the story of the DIY Cruise Missile project here: http://www.interestingprojects.com/cruisemissile/

    Brilliant.

    Don't tell them anything.

  • Heater. wrote: »
    Great, so we tell our governments how we could possibly, maybe, wreak havoc with our geek toys and expertise, then the governments starts outlawing or regulating such toys.

    That is certainly concerning. My hometown of O'Fallon, MO, USA, has banned all "projectile weapons" even including nerf guns! Even in your own backyard! I can't imagine what other things might be banned by stupid councilmen trying to protect the public.

    I do, at least, have a little more faith in the federal government than O'Fallon.
  • I was federal employee at one of the R&D labs. In the late 1970's administrators at the Assistant Secretary for "this and that" inundated us with new regulations each year that made it very difficult to perform our function. However, by understanding what we needed and having people who could read complex documents, we found legal ways to get our job done in spite of what appeared to be deliberate attempts to make us "non-performing".

    After a few years of this, and their general inability to sufficiently hinder our work, my boss showed me a new letter that had been received from them. It essentially said:

    1. We realize that new regulations over the past few years have hindered your ability to complete your mission.

    2. However, your agency has still performed in an exemplary manner (based on numbers of patents applied for and number issued).

    3. We want to use your agency as a example in our training of other agencies to show how to succeed in spite of difficulties.

    4. Provide us with the methods you are using to continue to succeed in spite of item 1.

    5. Congratulations on your fine service.

    So our local management wanted the bench and first line supervisors to give them lists and examples of how we got things done.

    We told them to just say that it was due to hard work and dedication, but not give them anything else, because all the Secretariat wanted was a list of things to prohibit. Of course some local management/supervisor suck-ups (or maybe they were just too trusting) did give details. The next 2 years most of the things on the list were regulated or prohibited.

    Be careful.
  • Anarchist Cookbook - Crowdsourced Edition

    I will submit my perpetual motion machines, but nothing on time travel so I can undo it if necessary. They'll never learn if you do all of the work for them...
  • Seairth wrote: »
    ...I'm sure I'm already on a list somewhere for having an unusual first name. :D
    Never thought about it but now I'm curious: sea air earth?
  • SeairthSeairth Posts: 2,474
    edited 2016-03-16 18:07
    lardom wrote: »
    Seairth wrote: »
    ...I'm sure I'm already on a list somewhere for having an unusual first name. :D
    Never thought about it but now I'm curious: sea air earth?

    Correct! (Most people don't realize I use my actual first name as my username. Now you know!)
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    sea air earth?

    What happened to fire ?
  • Heater. wrote: »
    sea air earth?

    What happened to fire ?

    My parents refuse to tell me. ;)
  • This list will result in new regulations and licenses to do what can just be done today.
  • Seairth wrote: »
    Heater. wrote: »
    sea air earth?

    What happened to fire ?

    My parents refuse to tell me. ;)

    Hippie parents, by any chance? :)

  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    Soon we are going to be buying our soldering irons, multimeters, scopes and such on the black market.

    Hiding in the darkness of our basements working on our Propeller/Arduino/Raspi projects.

    Exchanging Parallax and other forum updates covertly via USB sticks, like they do in Cuba.

    Up there on the streets, police running around with machine guns, carrying out surprise door to door inspections every now and then, for any "suspicious" and unnecessary use of technology.

    Geek friends and contacts mysteriously disappearing without notice.

    Not a terrorist in sight mind you. Except the government that has petrified us all into submission.

    It's time for a revolution I tell you.




  • It's time for a revolution I tell you.
    Be careful what you wish for, with your dream regime, you still might be hiding in your basement.

    Ray
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    Quite so. Tricky things revolutions. The outcomes are very unpredictable and no doubt not what you had in mind when you started.

    The French revolution went OK didn't it? A bit, maybe. But I felt a bit sorry for Antoine Lavoisier, the father of modern chemistry who got guillotined. Oh and the fact we got stuck with the metric system as a result.

    After that revolutions went down hill.

    Still, Wat Tyler is my hero. Leader of the Peasants' Revolt in in England in 1381. Just a peasant from my home town that managed to take the Tower of London and get a good deal for the surfs from King Richard II.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peasants'_Revolt




  • This thread is quickly moving into politics and away from the original topic. Keep it on topic or we will moderate posts and/or the thread as a whole, if necessary.

    If anyone needs a refresh on what the guidelines say about political talk, please read below.
    Political or Religious Discussions:
    The Parallax Discussion Forums is not the venue to discuss religious/non-religious agendas, nor is it a place for political rants or arguments. As stated above: the forums were created to support the use of products designed and developed by Parallax Inc. If you wish to discuss the existence of things divine, or the most recent upheaval in the legislature of man – find another forum. If you want to speculate about the terrible or benevolent dealings of other persons, countries, or powers – find another forum. Threads or posts of this nature are subject to moderation.

    Thank you.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    It's very difficult Coutney. All of life is politics as much as us geeks like to ignore it. But sometimes politics comes after us anyway. If we continue to ignore it we may end up back in the dark ages.

    That's all I have to say about that.
  • When someone posts a thread like this you have to be able to convince others to NOT help.

    Like Heater said I want soldering irons to be made illegal as late as possible, hopefully at least after my life time, and helping with what the OP posted is not in the best interest of tinkerers.

    We already unknowingly commit 3 felonies a day. Hopefully we can avoid contributing to making that 4 or 5.

    So it's something I'm glad I know about now, and it is inherently political. This is important to discuss, and hopefully we can as long as donkeys and elephants are left out of it.
  • I don't know if I would completely trust submitting an idea to the Dod over the internet. There would be so many submissions to filter through, the job would be monumental and mundane for the person on the other end that your submission could fall through the cracks due to a similar effect as banner blindness. On the other hand, it's better, in my opinion, to get in cahoots with someone that might be in that line of business. A good friend of mine works for the Dod and is also a penetration tester. So far I have had two decent contract jobs working with him and his team. There are plenty of 'hacker' hangouts where people in the know can be approached and you can get a foot in the door that way.

    Now, that said, there is a very real concern that technology can be used in a harmful way, but it can also be used for the good. If we don't do anything at all to stay on top of things, then it's not a matter of IF, but WHEN, until someone is harmed will ill directed technology.

    Take a hammer for example... You can use it to be completely destructive, or you can build or fix something with it. What ever the outcome, the choice is completely up to you.
  • Everyday objects?

    OK. As we know planes are usable. I guess trains also have a huge potential. Same goes for container ships, all able to carry quite a amount of explosives. As also be seen even a truck with some fertilizer and diesel can do some damage.

    Actually almost everything in your household is dangerous if dropped from enough height onto somebody. Say a Bottle of wine dropped at 5.000 ft. Or a dishwasher and 50 ft.

    Say you run a RC plane into a tail rotor of a helicopter and the helicopter falls down on a truck and trailer full of gasoline in the center of the golden gate bridge and a cruise ship is just below it... Do we now need to ban radio transmitter?

    You can easy kill somebody by sticking a B2 pen into his heart, no pens anymore? You can light a cigarette with a match, or a dynamite stick. Ban matches?

    Almost every everyday object can be used as weapon. I hope nobody mentions @erco's flame throwing robots or the parallax bots get banned.

    Like you can use any MC to provide a timer for a bomb, you can use a mechanical kitchen timer or some slow chemical reaction to provide the needed timeframe to get away secure before it makes BOOM.

    I do not really get what they are asking for.

    confused!

    Mike



  • Take a hammer for example... You can use it to be completely destructive, or you can build or fix something with it.

    Hey Beau... Your comment reminds me of a murder that happened in my hometown in 1985, which gained national attention. Hobart, Indiana makes news in the LA Times: articles.latimes.com/1985-12-08/news/mn-14855_1_police-officer

    The victim was struck 32 times with a hammer. The local and state police both determined it was a suicide. WOW
  • They want to know who as well as how.
  • idbruce wrote: »
    Take a hammer for example... You can use it to be completely destructive, or you can build or fix something with it.

    Hey Beau... Your comment reminds me of a murder that happened in my hometown in 1985, which gained national attention. Hobart, Indiana makes news in the LA Times: articles.latimes.com/1985-12-08/news/mn-14855_1_police-officer

    The victim was struck 32 times with a hammer. The local and state police both determined it was a suicide. WOW

    Looks like the victim was very strong willed to do that.

    I wouldn't.

    Mike

  • See, this is exactly my point.... You take something and apply ill will to the situation and it escalates into something out of control. .... Personally I want to be constructive, if you wish to be destructive then my participation is done here.
  • Looks like the victim was very strong willed to do that.

    Strong willed? 32 blows... I can't even imagine anyone having that strong of a will.

    At the time, it was the talk of the town, and everyone thought the investigation and final ruling was a complete joke. I won't ever believe it was a suicide. :)
  • Cluso99Cluso99 Posts: 18,069
    They will compile all these ideas into a database and then the terrorists will hack into it to get new ideas :(
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