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Any Automotive Programmer here? — Parallax Forums

Any Automotive Programmer here?

holly52holly52 Posts: 3
edited 2014-08-29 01:24 in General Discussion
I own a 2012 Chevrolet Volt, I am looking for a programmer that can modify the SOC - State Of Charge of my car main lithium Ion battery. In other words, I want to be able to charge my 16.5kw battery to full 100% and be able use it and deplete all the way to zero before the generator kicks on. Any help or other site suggestion would appreciated!

Comments

  • william chanwilliam chan Posts: 1,326
    edited 2014-08-27 18:23
    Wouldn't it dramatically reduce your battery's life if you do that?
  • holly52holly52 Posts: 3
    edited 2014-08-27 18:59
    All type of batteries has this huge reserved buffer, I think its a waste not able to use it all. The battery has already temperature control by way of liquid heating and cooling system and that is also one security. I already had the car for 2 years and I think its time to use it to the max. Would you know of anybody on how to for a fee?
  • kwinnkwinn Posts: 8,697
    edited 2014-08-27 20:03
    I do not have the expertize to do this programming, but I know for certain that totally discharging the batteries will reduce the life dramatically. If you are lucky you might get a few charge/discharge cycles out of it, but more likely once they have been discharged they will be done.
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2014-08-27 22:30
    I worked as a military mechanic many moon ago LOL and it was never a good idea to let a lead acid battery discharge too much. There was the possibility of warping the plates and sulfation of the plates. However, she did say lithium Ion battery. which is a different beast.

    From a tips list here is the recommendation:
    [h=1]Five tips for extending lithium-ion battery life:[/h]http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/five-apps/five-tips-for-extending-lithium-ion-battery-life/
    [h=2]: Avoid completely discharging lithium-ion batteries[/h] If a lithium-ion battery is discharged below 2.5 volts per cell, a safety circuit built into the battery opens and the battery appears to be dead. The original charger will be of no use. Only battery analyzers with the boost function have a chance of recharging the battery.



    [h=2]3: Allow partial discharges and avoid full ones (usually)[/h] Unlike NiCad batteries, lithium-ion batteries do not have a charge memory. That means deep-discharge cycles are not required. In fact, it's better for the battery to use partial-discharge cycles.
    There is one exception. Battery experts suggest that after 30 charges, you should allow lithium-ion batteries to almost completely discharge. Continuous partial discharges create a condition called digital memory, decreasing the accuracy of the device's power gauge. So let the battery discharge to the cut-off point and then recharge. The power gauge will be recalibrated
  • LoopyBytelooseLoopyByteloose Posts: 12,537
    edited 2014-08-27 23:17
    Regarding State of Charge of Lithium cells, the discharge line is an S curve with dramatic tails at both ends of a very flat line.

    The high and low tails are where the battery suffers damage during charge and discharge. And since this is not a straight line, there is not much to get out of the Lithium cell at the low end... just a big risk of having to replace the cells.

    I suspect you need to learn more about the actual battery chemistry and the discharge and charge curves before you consider modifications. It is more than likely that the Volt was optimized in a reasonable fashion.

    Above all, no battery is going to recharge without damage after being driven to zero... regardless of chemistry. In general, going below 50% of maximum charged voltage is going to upset the cell chemistry. There is a voltage region where charge and discharge do the least to wear out the cell and it is nearer the peak charged voltage.

    The problem could be more that your gauges always indicate something less that 100% and more that 0% due to how they present the information... so you think there is more to be gained. That very flat middle of the lithium ion discharge line makes the calculation of how much charge is available very difficult to provide with precision similar to how much gas is in a tank.

    If it was my car, I wouldn't dare reprogram the charging software.
  • HappyHippoHappyHippo Posts: 6
    edited 2014-08-28 09:58
    There are several reasons why they have extra reserve:
    1) The calendar life of the battery is adversely affected at higher state of charge. Calendar life is the life of the battery when it's just sitting there, neither charging nor discharging.
    2) GM has designed the battery pack to meet OBDII requirements which are 10 years or 100,000 miles. The battery is a part of the "emissions system." Ten years is a very long time for any battery to last. So GM may be banking on some of the reserve to carry it through the CARB regulated lifetime by making some use of the reserve as the battery ages. When a battery ages it loses both capacity (energy) and power (increased resistance).
    3) The battery at high state of charge is more prone to a "safety incident".


    There are dozens of engineers at GM which worked hard to make sure hacking the system is not possible (or at least very difficult). If you raise the SOC past it's designed "full charge" set-point, no doubt over-voltage diagnostics and other similar protections will kick in and open the contactors of the pack. This type of battery from LG-Chem is not as affected by over discharge as it is by over charge. By over discharge I mean like going to 2.3 V per cell. 0 V per cell would be ridiculous. But nevertheless, it's not recommended to mess with GM's settings.

    I am an automotive engineer who works on hybrid/electric vehicle batteries but not for GM.
  • holly52holly52 Posts: 3
    edited 2014-08-28 10:37
    Thank you for all the smart input and concerned! When I got the car I really like the idea of running full electric but also have a backup gas engine in case there is no place to charge. As time goes on realizing I can only go between 40 – 55 miles before gas engine kick on. It’s kind of irritating that out of 16.5kw battery I can only used about around 10.5kw of that energy. This got me thinking about maybe there is a way to use it all. Well I guess I will have to settle to what I got right now until any new technology or add on upgrade comes up.
  • LoopyBytelooseLoopyByteloose Posts: 12,537
    edited 2014-08-29 01:24
    In this modern world of marketing, the 16.5kw advertised capacity just might have never be there. The 10.5kw of what you see and get is the reality. I do understand your disappointment, but your dealership service department is best equiped to get more kw out of the system.

    Hacking into any system that has defenses against hacking really is dubious. The real risk is that you damage the system beyond repair and have lost your resale value in the car.
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