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How Well Will Parallax's PING Sensor Hold Up In Direct Sunlight & Heat... — Parallax Forums

How Well Will Parallax's PING Sensor Hold Up In Direct Sunlight & Heat...

Im New To MicroIm New To Micro Posts: 42
edited 2014-08-22 16:00 in General Discussion
I am in search of a ultrasonic sensor that I can mount onto my remote control lawn mower to prevent it from hitting objects and people when I am using it. I was curious about how well the PING sensor Parallax sells will hold up if I mount the PING sensors to the frame of the RC lawn mower? I'm a little bit worried about debris (grass...etc.) getting inside the circles of the PING sensor, and I don't see a mount that Parallax makes that fully protects the PING sensor. The metal one they make only helps attach it to a object.

Comments

  • ValeTValeT Posts: 308
    edited 2014-08-21 07:31
    Well, you can't completely guard the PING sensor for debris, otherwise it will not work.You might want to look at the laser rangefinder. It is a little more expensive than a PING sensor, but it should do a lot better. Below is the link to the laser rangefinder. Hope this helps!

    http://www.parallax.com/product/28044
  • Im New To MicroIm New To Micro Posts: 42
    edited 2014-08-21 07:36
    ValeT wrote: »
    Well, you can't completely guard the PING sensor for debris, otherwise it will not work.You might want to look at the laser rangefinder. It is a little more expensive than a PING sensor, but it should do a lot better. Below is the link to the laser rangefinder. Hope this helps!

    http://www.parallax.com/product/28044

    I noticed that, but most of Parallax products, I only see people using them "indoors" which worries me that even the laser finder may not be an ideal choice. The laser sensor is also apparently harmful if you look into the laser. Since my remote control vehicle is going to be outside and constantly on the move, I wouldn't want to blind anyone.
  • Duane DegnDuane Degn Posts: 10,588
    edited 2014-08-21 07:41
    ValeT wrote: »
    You might want to look at the laser rangefinder. It is a little more expensive than a PING sensor, but it should do a lot better.

    That rangefinder doesn't work well in the sunlight. The bright light washes out the red laser dot.

    This ultrasound sensor claims to be waterproof. You could just seal the circuit board and leave the waterproof transducer exposed.
  • lardomlardom Posts: 1,659
    edited 2014-08-21 08:05
    Aside from shielding the Ping from debris I believe filtering out mower noise would be a major problem. Why not whiskers? People will hear the mower and give it room. My major challanges for a project like this would be boundaries and inanimate obstacles.
    You did say "remote control", which I think makes it easier to mow in places the user would 'rather' not go into such as steep inclines for example. I am allergic to Poison Ivy and I don't want Lyme desease so a remote controlled machine would do fine for me.
    Aside from all that, I can vaccuum much faster than a Roomba.
    This is just my view.
  • Tracy AllenTracy Allen Posts: 6,664
    edited 2014-08-21 08:06
    Also take a look at maxbotix. Nice application notes there too.
  • Duane DegnDuane Degn Posts: 10,588
    edited 2014-08-21 08:12
    lardom wrote: »
    Aside from shielding the Ping from debris I believe filtering out mower noise would be a major problem.

    This depends a lot on what noises the mower is making.

    The ELEV-8's motors don't interfere with ultrasound sensors but my small $99 quadcopter's motors do interfere.
  • Im New To MicroIm New To Micro Posts: 42
    edited 2014-08-21 08:14
    lardom wrote: »
    Aside from shielding the Ping from debris I believe filtering out mower noise would be a major problem. Why not whiskers? People will hear the mower and give it room. My major challanges for a project like this would be boundaries and inanimate obstacles.
    You did say "remote control", which I think makes it easier to mow in places the user would 'rather' not go into such as steep inclines for example. I am allergic to Poison Ivy and I don't want Lyme desease so a remote controlled machine would do fine for me.
    Aside from all that, I can vaccuum much faster than a Roomba.
    This is just my view.

    I would use limit switches, however, my RC lawn mower is about 48" in length and 20" in width. So I would imagine a lot of whisker switches would be needed to cover the entire perimeter of the RC lawn mower.
  • Im New To MicroIm New To Micro Posts: 42
    edited 2014-08-21 08:15
    Also take a look at maxbotix. Nice application notes there too.

    I have been looking at Maxbotix sensors, but I'm having the hardest time trying to figure out how I would interface that with the Parallax microprocessor since it uses RS232 or IIC which neither I'm very familiar with.
  • Duane DegnDuane Degn Posts: 10,588
    edited 2014-08-21 08:35
    I have been looking at Maxbotix sensors, but I'm having the hardest time trying to figure out how I would interface that with the Parallax microprocessor since it uses RS232 or IIC which neither I'm very familiar with.

    The Maxbotix sensors have several outputs one is a pulse similar to the Ping. You don't need to trigger the pulse, it just keeps coming in at about 50Hz.
  • lardomlardom Posts: 1,659
    edited 2014-08-21 08:42
    I would use limit switches, however, my RC lawn mower is about 48" in length and 20" in width. So I would imagine a lot of whisker switches would be needed to cover the entire perimeter of the RC lawn mower.
    What about a skirt? (Forgive me. This stuff is fun. Jigsaw puzzles just don't do it for me.)
    I'm also wondering out loud if there is a sensor that could detect the 'firmness' of a surface area? eg; sidewalk, dirt...
  • Tracy AllenTracy Allen Posts: 6,664
    edited 2014-08-21 08:54
    I have been looking at Maxbotix sensors, but I'm having the hardest time trying to figure out how I would interface that with the Parallax microprocessor since it uses RS232 or IIC which neither I'm very familiar with.

    Which Parallax processor are you considering? Either the Stamp or the Propeller would easily handle the RS232 output. They offer demo code for the BS2p. You can ask here if you need help with the Propeller. Or just use the old pulse time method. Ultrasound reflections can be tricky. Many of their sensors also offer an analog envelope output.
  • Im New To MicroIm New To Micro Posts: 42
    edited 2014-08-21 10:08
    Which Parallax processor are you considering? Either the Stamp or the Propeller would easily handle the RS232 output. They offer demo code for the BS2p. You can ask here if you need help with the Propeller. Or just use the old pulse time method. Ultrasound reflections can be tricky. Many of their sensors also offer an analog envelope output.

    I didn't even see that on their website! Cool. I wish their sensors weren't so expensive, but I'm willing to bite the bullet if they have some with wide viewing ranges so I don't have to buy so many sensors to sit side by side.
  • Im New To MicroIm New To Micro Posts: 42
    edited 2014-08-21 10:41
    Here is another sensor I stumbed upon that is really cheap and appears to be for outdoor use, but I believe more components for it is probably needed to get it to work with the microprocessor?

    https://www.futurlec.com/Ultrasonic_Sensors.shtml
    14C01.jpg


    Part #: 14C01

    Edit:

    Or, I think I might be able to buy this car backup sensor kit and hack it to work for my application: http://www.amazon.com/XD-066-Display-Reverse-Parking-Sensors/dp/B0055XCLK4/ref=sr_1_5?s=car&ie=UTF8&qid=1408643247&sr=1-5&keywords=ultrasonic+sensor

    :D
    250 x 253 - 18K
  • LoopyBytelooseLoopyByteloose Posts: 12,537
    edited 2014-08-22 07:38
    I would worry far more about half buried dog bones, baseballs, sprinkler heads, and rocks. The look-down and a bit ahead aspect is more critical than the look-ahead.

    My experience with lawn mowers was that anyone of those items were likely to get launched through a neighbor's window at any moment.

    Maybe I should just make a robot that cleans lawns before mowing.
  • Im New To MicroIm New To Micro Posts: 42
    edited 2014-08-22 07:41
    I would worry far more about half buried dog bones, baseballs, sprinkler heads, and rocks.

    My experience with lawn mowers was that anyone of those items were likely to get launched through a neighbor's window at any moment.

    Well that is a concern also, but what exactly could one used to detect that? I mean, sometimes the front of the lawn mower might be close to hitting the grass when going down a hill, and then suddenly going back up another. Basically like a valley type formation. So some sensors may confuse that situation with a rock if I mount the sensor too "low".
  • LoopyBytelooseLoopyByteloose Posts: 12,537
    edited 2014-08-22 08:11
    Well, rather than detect and avoid, I just suggested another robot that would harvest anything of a significant size (say the size of an egg or larger). Of course, such a harvester could be mounted directly in front of the lawn mower and that would eliminate doing two passes over the lawn.

    My guess is a set of rotating combs that pick up all the junk and move it into an overhead bin.

    Avoiding people? I guess you are concerned about the blind and the hard of hearing.

    Avoiding other objects? Hard to say. If nothing ever changes, the lawn could be mapped into a computer. If people are randomly parking bikes or lawn chairs, I wonder why you would mow around these things rather than remove them so you get a nice looking lawn.
  • Im New To MicroIm New To Micro Posts: 42
    edited 2014-08-22 08:25

    Avoiding people? I guess you are concerned about the blind and the hard of hearing.

    Avoiding other objects? Hard to say. If nothing every changes, the lawn could be mapped into a computer. If people are randomly parking bikes or lawn chairs, I wonder why you would mow around these thinks rather than remove them so you get a nice looking lawn.

    I believe I owe my thought process to the industry my job is apart of since I have to constantly think of scenarios that could happen, and we like to implement "safety" measures to avoid any issues we can think of before they do happen. Sure, I can think simple minded and I can do everything you mentioned, "but" I want to increase the smartness of my RC lawn mower by implementing extra object detecting sensors since the technology is out there. Anything can happen if you can imagine it. And sometimes it is just fun to challenge yourself and integrate new technology if you have the funds and time. Thanks though for your suggestions.
  • LoopyBytelooseLoopyByteloose Posts: 12,537
    edited 2014-08-22 09:32
    Fair enough...
    You want to design machines for safety. Frankly I think that this is one of the most difficult tasks in robotics. You have to anticipate everything the machine might encounter and every manner in which the machine might fail.

    A simple Ping sensor might be helpful. You will need a forward looking array. Redundancy might help for failure due to being temporarily covered by clippings. The sensors are not particularly 'all-weather' items.

    Forgive me, but I tend to feel that a lawn mower quite dangerous. I ran an landscape-gardening company for several years and we seemed to always be having nasty events occurring around the lawn mowers.

    Mapping the lawn in memory, including the sprinkler heads would be a great help. I guess that would require GPS or some other form of navigation.

    Some features, such as picking up hidden trash, don't really require any electronics. But the same would make the whole job a lot safer. Dog bones, baseballs, and sprinkler heads really are very common hazards.

    I am very wary of R/C controlled lawn mowers in general. But that is me personally.
  • NWCCTVNWCCTV Posts: 3,629
    edited 2014-08-22 16:00
    Is your lawn mower already built or is this something you are working on? I ask because I am wondering if an electric mower might be a better option, especially for the noise issues. I like the idea and I know there are some on the market but are a bit pricey.
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