Heater,
OpenWrt deploys Linux completely differently that the Raspberry Pi.
You seem to have NO interest in learning how OpenWrt does things, and yet Cluso and I both share that as a common interest. I have gone out and bought an MR3020 just to learn OpenWrt.
That seems to have in someway offended you and launched into your proving that we are wasting time and effort. You are being RuDE, and intollerant of others. Just let us have our fun.
This thread is NOT about the Raspberry Pi and has nothing to do with comparison of the Raspberry Pi.
In sum, if you cannot participate -- SHUT UP and Leave. I don't want to waste time debating with you. I have invested many hours in the past week or so reading and research OpenWRT, which happens to be of interest to me.
I personally have no interest in learning or using the Raspberry Pi. Can't you grasp that? Arguing with you semantically and point by point doesn't help anyone enjoy using Propellers, but you persist..................
Loopy, I think you will have to accept that the Raspberry Pi is now probably the most wide spread, widely used, widely discussed general purpose Linux based machine in the world. It has certainly raised awareness of Linux an incredible amount. (Yes, Beagles and such are up there to, I have no idea how they compare in adoption rates but what I am saying here applies anyway)
That means that an awful lot of useful Linux tutorials, recipes, projects, blogs and other generically useful Linux know how will be coming from the Raspi world. As we have seen with the articles and software I have linked to above.
Don't forget that 99% of that information is not Raspi specific. It is applicable to any Linux system especially those running Debian or Ubuntu or something similar.
If you skip over all the Raspi stories when googling around for solutions to Linux problems you are going to miss a lot of good and helpful stuff.
So I would advise that you "hold your nose" and dive in. Suck up the info and use it on your system of choice.
@ Heater,
I don't have to accept anything about the Raspberry Pi. I don't own one and have grown to dislike your relentless pursuit of convincing me to accept it.
I don't understand why you are doing this. My reasons for disliking the Raspberry Pi don't even matter. It is the fact that you feel that you can't let that be that is so offensive.
I am aware of what Linux is. But you are NOT aware of what OpenWrt is, how it uses squashfs, and other details that I am struggling with.
Go away............................. go away.................................. go away.......................
No not really. If you have a working system you should be able to cross-compile programs on your PC and then put the executables onto the router via FTP or SCP.
I would even advise against creating a custom image because when the guys upstream update it you have to do all your work again if you want to follow along.
From all my reading at OPENwrt, this won't work with OpenWrt projects. It seems like a generalized Linux solution that will work with the Raspberry Pi.
But trying to do so is likely to confound a new Linux user that is working with squashfs and OpenWrt for the first time.
____________
In sum, a Raspberry Pi solution is not directly transferable to the WR703N as the R-Pi uses BerryBoot and an SDcard filesystem that holds the complete Linux boot image. The Linux boot image in the WR703N is within the squashfs, not separate from it.
In general with routers, nobody bothers with updates if they are secure, stable, and performing adequately. In fact, the WR703N factory install is using Linux V.2.6.33... which is far behind the current kernel version.
OpenWrt uses very up-to-date Linux. Once it is working, I'd likely not update anything without good reason and obvious need.
Oh Loopy, what am I going to do with you? Take a beer and chill out, or take a nap, you are getting all grumpy and flustered for no reason. You have not understood what I have been saying. It's not pleasant being told off and shouted at for saying things that I did not say. As Basil Fawlty said to Manuel whilst beating him about the head "Try to understand before one of us dies!".
Perhaps I did not express myself clearly enough. So let's wipe the whiteboard clean and start over again:
1) Yes of course OpenWRT deploys Linux differently than the Raspi. So does every other system I work on from traffic radar to routers to WIFI connected light bulbs.
2) Do not be so presumptuous as to assume I have no interest in OpenWRT. I'm not sure why you do given my comments about my own D-Link router a little while ago.
3) I am in no way offended by anything. If you are reading my posts you will see that I have not suggested you switch to a Raspi solution since the beginning of this thread. Certainly not in today's posts. That debate has been had and you have made your choice. That is fine by me and only leaves the issue of getting it working.
4) I have not insisted that you learn anything about the Raspi. I certainly do not have "a relentless pursuit of convincing you to accept it [ the raspi ]". That is not what my posts said. What I suggested was that there is a vast ocean of helpful information about Linux being exchanged in the Raspi world (And no doubt in the Beagle and Cubie worlds). That information is generic Linux stuff, and ARM SoC based Linux stuff. It is applicable to many Linux systems including your routers. You can make use of the help offered or you can ignore it, up to you.
5) "But you are NOT aware of what OpenWrt is" This is intolerable. How can you presume such a thing? Did you read my recent post (#69)? I was involved in developing Linux based router solutions almost ten years ago. We built our own cross-compilers and kernels and libraries and routing applications. We wrote and or/customized our own kernel drivers. We used buildroot. We used busybox. Does all this sound familiar? OpenWRT employs a lot of the same software and techniques as we did back then. Admittedly that was quite a while now and things have moved on, details have changed but please don't tell me I don't know what OpenWRT is.
7) "Go away... go away... go away..." No, why should I? Feel free to ignore any advice I offer. Perhaps Clusso and other readers may benefit from it.
Now, Loopy, can we hug and make up and get back to practical issues?
Hey Loopy, heater is only trying to help. While he likes the R.Pi, that doesn't matter. It's still Linux underneath.
BTW My 703 Original FW seems to be 3.14.4 Build 120925 Rel 33133n
I am not sure of the OpenWrt release.
As far as I can tell, what heater is suggesting is basically what I read somewhere about how to initially identify and turn a GPIO on/off. I just haven't had time to relook for it.
Did you follow my links above to the article about GPIO and /sys/class/gpio? I suspect that is the same as what you have seen and it is nicely explained.
Loopy,
From all my reading at OPENwrt, this won't work with OpenWrt projects. It seems like a generalized Linux solution that will work with the Raspberry Pi.
But trying to do so is likely to confound a new Linux user that is working with squashfs and OpenWrt for the first time.
No. Read again. OpenWRT uses both squashfs which is read only and jffs2 which read/write. These two file systems are merged into one by overlayfs thus giving you a writeable fs that it should be possible to SCP/FTP into. This is described here:http://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/techref/filesystems
I hope this applies to the routers you guys are using.
In sum, a Raspberry Pi solution is not directly transferable to the WR703N as the R-Pi uses BerryBoot and an SDcard filesystem that holds the complete Linux boot image. The Linux boot image in the WR703N is within the squashfs, not separate from it.
Pretty much nothing is directly transferable from one machine to another unless they are identical. However what I am suggesting above is applicable.
In general with routers, nobody bothers with updates if they are secure, stable, and performing adequately. In fact, the WR703N factory install is using Linux V.2.6.33... which is far behind the current kernel version.
OpenWrt uses very up-to-date Linux. Once it is working, I'd likely not update anything without good reason and obvious need.
True.
However whilst you are developing your solution, hacking away, trying this and trying that, having to rebuild and reflash the entire firmware image for your router would be a pain in the butt during the edit/test/debug cycle. I'm hoping you can ease such development cycles using SCP/FTP.
Raspi this raspi that. No matter. Every machine that runs Linux is sacred. Even the humble router or light bulb.
Hey, what's this? I just found an old, unused, D-Link DIR-615 at the bottom of a cupboard in the office. Seems it is supported by OpenWRT. I'm just reaching for the screwdriver. You guys may have just wasted my weekend:)
Edit: Oh Smile, first road block. This thing does not have any screws that I can see. I have no idea how to open it up without wrecking it.
Raspi this raspi that. No matter. Every machine that runs Linux is sacred. Even the humble router or light bulb.
Hey, what's this? I just found an old, unused, D-Link DIR-615 at the bottom of a cupboard in the office. Seems it is supported by OpenWRT. I'm just reaching for the screwdriver. You guys may have just wasted my weekend:)
Uh.. oh... Now you really are going to have to learn how OPENwrt configures Linux. And the source code varies depending on DIR-615 version.
The file system is a combination of READ-ONLY on squashfs, and temporary file system in RAM. Installing executable binaries may work, but you have to first install an FTP server to have FTP services. Xmodem or Kermit might be a simpler way to go.
Be careful, the DR-615 has unsupported versions. OpenWRT may not be possible.
However whilst you are developing your solution, hacking away, trying this and trying that, having to rebuild and reflash the entire firmware image for your router would be a pain in the butt during the edit/test/debug cycle. I'm hoping you can ease such development cycles using SCP/FTP.
Well if SCP/FTP are feasible, there are existing OPENwrt packages for picocom, microcom, and minicom available along with related stty utilities.
There is also a document for making one's own OPENwrt packages that would help with compiling a Propeller binary loader.
But all I have read about OPENwrt packages seemed to indicate they were part of the firmware compile process.
I have nothing aside from what I read at OPENwrt and can get from online to figure this all out.
++++++++++++
Obviously, if you had in depth router experience 10 years - you do know more that I. You comments previously to my enthusiasm about such tiny Linux seemed to indicate you were no longer interested in such.
I have had an EEEpc with solid state hard disk and one Asus wr500p router that dealt with these solid-state alternatives to a hard disk. I'd have to say that the EEEPC 701-4g was my first real Linux OS. That wasn't so long ago.
Loopy, yes, it's a minefield. This box is a DIR-615 D1. Seems this is a supported target all be it with some caveats.
I have the box open, It did actually have some screws under the second pair of rubber feet I looked at.
I have located the serial port!
OpenWRT says there are no free GPIO pins here. but I can see an unpoulated LED and switch space. Could always hijack one of the status LED lines I guess.
You comments previously to my enthusiasm about such tiny Linux seemed to indicate you were no longer interested in such
Like I said before, I was always put off by the frustration of fighting against size limitations all the time. Plus I knew already that this is a minefield of different models, versions, incompatibilities and general version churn. I suspect it's a huge time sink. Plus, well, do I actually want a router? I don't have any hobby projects that call for 5 ethernet ports and WIFI etc.
But hey, I have this box open now and all that FLASH space is calling to be to upgrade it:)
Sorry to hear all that about a minefield, I thought you might provide some leadership.. being an old hand at this.
I still am unclear how any FTP executable might be retained if power is removed. While there is a nice presentation of which file systems are used, I can seem to see where they exist and how much of the 4mbyte Flash is squashfs for boot and how much might be some other persistent file system.
That is why I was beginning to consider the need to compile a new binary.
As things are I can load my MR3020 with existing OpenWRT firmware immediately and set up the Rx and Tx in a hardware loopback to test the RS232 terminal. It would take much to remove a resister and install a wire for a GPIO to be used as a Reset.
It also seems that several items might need to be inserted as modules, not merely executable files.
++++++++++
Just maybe you should skip the DIR-615 and buy a WR703N or MR3020. After all, there is a risk that what you do on the DIR-615 isn't going to be transferable to these other devices.
Me to. Actually it's more like a gigantic labyrinth with many exits but even more dead ends with mines at the end. Make a wrong step and you have a brick on your hands. You have circled the OpenWRT web site so I think you know what I mean.
I thought you might provide some leadership.. being an old hand at this.
Old hand at what? I have never looked at OpenWRT before. But I do already recognize that it uses many standard embedded Linux techniques so whatever experience I have might, possibly, maybe, come in handy.
I still am unclear how any FTP executable might be retained if power is removed.
Actually so am I. One of the OpenWRT pages I linked to above describes how there is a sqashfs file system and a jffs2 file system existing in separate parts of the FLASH. Then overlayfs merges those at run time to provide a single writable system to work in.
What does this mean exactly? I'm not sure, never used overlayfs before, but it sounds like if you write to a file, say by downloading with FTP or hacking on an existing file, then it is written to the jffs2 system. The original content stays unchanged in the squashfs system. See the section on "mount points" here: http://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/techref/flash.layout
That is why I was beginning to consider the need to compile a new binary.
I am just now rebuilding the everything from the tools to the final image for my d-link. Just to see how it goes as we might all need to do that at some point. It's taking a long time....
It also seems that several items might need to be inserted as modules, not merely executable files.
Do you mean kernel modules or some other kind of module?
Just maybe you should skip the DIR-615 and buy a WR703N or MR3020....
If they had them on the shelf at out local computer megastore I probably would have already. I'm not about to start ordering from ebay or whatever when I have a suitable candidate to hand.
...After all, there is a risk that what you do on the DIR-615 isn't going to be transferable to these other devices.
Don't care. I don't have those other devices: )
Don't worry, I have no desire to create anything that is not portable. If I have to start doing a lot of work dedicated to this particular box I'm going to give up and do something else.
@Heater,
Okay, okay... I don't need the banter, just a working MR3020. I will keep DIYing.
They happened to be on the shelf and on sale where I am. LOL.
I am happy to hear that the Flash appears to be capable of partitioning between squashfs and jffs2. I am not up to speed on all this as it has been a rapidly changing area of software.
My EEEpc 701-4G may have had another solution as the storage was 4Gbytes, not a mere 4Mbytes. I really loved the extreme fast boot of a 4Gbyte solid-state drive and a full Ubuntu image at the time only took up about 2.8Gbytes.
And YES, I mean kernel modules may need installation, not just executable files.
But I enjoy the tightness. It demonstrates the system with greater clarity than big bloated hard disks.
The EEEpc sounds great. Cost a bit more than a router I guess:) Solid State storage is a great on a PC as well, my Samsung SSDs are the best upgrades I ever made to a PC.
Kernel modules is not a problem. Just select the ones you want to use in "make menuconfig". Then when running on the router just load it into the kernel with "modprobe 'whatever_module_name' ""
Of course if you want to write your own kernel module that might take a bit more work....
Hey, I'm not sure if the way I configured the build is correct for my box but it has finished and produced a bunch of firmware files:
Loopy, yes, it's a minefield. This box is a DIR-615 D1. Seems this is a supported target all be it with some caveats.
I have the box open, It did actually have some screws under the second pair of rubber feet I looked at.
I have located the serial port!
OpenWRT says there are no free GPIO pins here. but I can see an unpoulated LED and switch space. Could always hijack one of the status LED lines I guess.
Fantastic! Yes, hijack the LED and Switch. They were my first thoughts with the 703 and that is what I intend to do first. Loopy has IIRC 4 LEDs to hijack and at least a reset switch.
Beware with the switch in our OpenWrt versions - the switch is used to do some form of minimal reset/boot combo and is sampled about 20+ seconds into the original boot (need to check for exact details).
There are possibly other GPIO that can be soldered directly to the chip, depending on how much pad is available and how good you are at soldering.
BTW I have ordered 2 more routers - a dongle style for $10 and a smaller box than the WR703N called a Votnets Mini300 for $13. Just want to see what else is available for less $$ and if they can be hacked.
heater,
Glad your recompile works. I am sure that info will come in handy later.
From what I understand, when updating the OpenWrt firmware, we have to ftp a new image into the r/w section of the flash, and then with a new reboot it can upgrade and write the new image to the r section of the flash (ie the boot section of the flash).
And it seems we can add modules to the r/w flash and can change the boot script to install these modules. Does this sound right?
Unfortunately, there is a lot of OpenWrt documentation, and there is a lot of conflicting info as well. There seems to be so many ways of doing things and each piece of docs uses a different way. I was pleased to see that my upgrade worked. But I found 4 precompiled versions (2 sets) for the 703. I need to do a diff to see if the sets are identical (later).
Can you post pics of your router and the chip numbers of the 3 main chips (cpu, ram, eeprom) please?
FWIW the 703 has an Atheros AR9331-AL3A (cpu etc), Winbond W9425G6JH-5 (Ram) and Spansion FL032P1F (flash). The flash is easily upgraded as its an SOIC8 but I am not sure what needs to be reflashed (if any) into it before putting on the board. Anyway I am hoping this is unnecessary - in fact hoping I can ultimately use the cheaper 702 or something even cheaper again. But got to get this running first. Probably a good idea to put a USB Memory stick in the USB for additional memory for now if we need it.
I have an old laptop that is probably begging to have Linux installed. But it is going to have to wait for now.
I have just been doing a rebuild again with some different config options. BINGO I now have a bin directory with about a hundred sysupgrade and factory bin
files in it. One of them is openwrt-ramips-rt305x-dir-615-d-squashfs-factory.bin which sounds more like what I might need.
So far so good. I'm happy because these complex build things often fail in a bazillion unexpected ways that takes a month of googling to fix.
You are some steps ahead of me regarding the updating and modules. Let me try and blow my first image on to the box. And first I need a serial port connection.
There certainly is lots of documentation. However I can see it suffers from not being up to date and in sync with the current software.
I'll try and get some pictures when we have some daylight. Not sure it will be worth much as the only camera I have is an old Samsung Galaxy S with a very scratched up lens.
@Heater,
Try to embrace OpenWrt as the solution, not the problem.
If you had asked me, I could have located the DIR-615 firmware for you.
The core problem is the whole concept of Wiki documentation on the WWW. Good documentation really needs an editor that just refuses to release anything for publication that is less than satisfactory, and a clear path to what is published.
OpenWrt is not the only outfit to go down this road. It seems Parallax has done so with SimpleIDE and Learn.
+++++++++++++++
DO NOT Forget that the D1 is one of many versions of the DIR-615. Awkward as it seems, the paragraph that discusses the specific D1 installation says,
Quotation from OpenWRT
Rev. D1-D4
These use a Ralink chipset that only has preliminary support and requires a manual build. D1/D2 models are known to have problems with the latest ethernet driver(s) and require the use of an older driver. D3/D4 are relatively stable with an unmodified trunk build.
The D4 works well if you treat it exactly the same as a DIR-600/B2
: D1/D2 build instructions
The DIR-615D maps to DIR-300b1 therefore there is no dedicated target for 615-D.
end of quotation from OpenWrt
That is a bit disconcerting as it seems to indicate the D4 requires the DIR-600/B2 firmware image, and that the D1 needs some special handling to include older ethernet drivers.
You have to FOLLOW the D1/D2 build intructions.
But they have a 'Fix Me' flag on them. So it seems that installed OpenWRT on the D1 may be unfinished business.. possibly abandoned due to just being an older router that people are not actively hacking. Ralink may not be providing enough information to do so.
+++++++++++++++++++
In summary.....................
You have entered THE TWILIGHT ZONE.
No dedicated target.
Use the DIR-300b1 image at your own risk for the DIR-615 D-1!
The problem is that Ralink requires a manual build to do a proper build. The support for Ralink is ONLY PRELIMINARY.
+++++++++
If I were you, I would abandon any modification of your DIR-615 D1 and find something else.
I had to abandon the WR702N as the Flash memory made it unsupported by OpenWRT.
If you really want to play along I can send you an MR3020 new and complete via DHL as a gift and no cost to you. A gift should go through customs with no duty and no value added tax.
Progress Report
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I have gotten into the MR3020 menus via 192.168.0.254 in Windows7. It seems that using a generic Linux connection is ignored.
From there I was able to burn the new OpenWRT firmware via the Firmware update page.
I haven't yet gotten back into the MR3020 via Windows or Linux. It seems to no longer be recognized by Windows7.
More to come later. I did not change the passwords or security prior to doing this changeover.
First you have a problem, then you see a solution, the solution is a problem until it works, then it's a solution. Just now I'm at the problem with a problem stage:)
As I said I will try a ready made binary first, after getting the serial port working.
But there the confusion sets in. According to D-Link DIR-615 page v12.09 does not support the D1, you need a custom build from source. Hence my messing with building the thing here. But who knows what needs customizing? I just read 10 pages of a openwrt forum thread about the D1 with no clear conclusion as to the state of the art.
That sounds like I might just chance a barrier_breaker binary.
I'll abandon the DIR-615 after I have bricked it. It's a disposable item anyway. It's encouraging to read that "Revisions D1 to D4, H1 as well as I1 are pretty much unbrickable as they have a built-in firmware recovery mode." If we can trust that:)
Thanks for the offer of the MR3020. Let's think about that after I have played with the D-link a bit.
P.S. When they say "The DIR-615D maps to DIR-300b1 therefore there is no dedicated target for 615-D." Do they really mean "615-D1"? How can we know? That does not correspond to what the guys were doing on the forum three years ago.
P.S. When they say "The DIR-615D maps to DIR-300b1 therefore there is no dedicated target for 615-D." Do they really mean "615-D1"? How can we know? That does not correspond to what the guys were doing on the forum three years ago.
Well, since there is NO version D, the series starts with D-1. And D-2 is covered in DIR-300b2. It just seems that a typo crept in. The logic is pointing towards the DIR-300b1.
+=========
You asked what to do with the 4 LAN ports... The answer is nothing. The reason we have zeroed in on the WR703N and MR3020 are for their Serial Port and GPIO. The one LAN port may or may not be of any use.
=++++++++++++++++
I am now into the MR3020 and have been exploring all the directories for good info. Initially the Wifi is shutoff and there is no password after the OpenWrt is loaded. One has to use Putty for a telnet connect to 192.168.1.1 port 23. If you evoke 'passwd' and provide a new one, the device immediately changes to SSH login protocol.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I am including screen dumps that show what BusyBox provides, a lsmod listing, and a few other items. If you want more, I can create other screen dumps or Putty just might track everything in a log file.
heater,
I presume there are no chips underneath. Normally I would say those 2 identical chips are Ram and the Spansion chip is the Flash.I would expect the cpu is hiding under the metal frame. There is aheader past the frame which may be the serial. I suggest you connect a pin via 3-10k to the prop rx at 115200 baud and see if you can find the serial out. And of course an earth. Those leds are going tocome in handy for gpio testing.
Interesting discovery about the pi. Thre are probably a lot more routers of each model out there than 3 million rpis, but not that many would be hacked of course.
Anyway i am hoping you can get an openwrt loaded.
Loopy, looks like you are making some progress.
My wifes laptop died on the trip home from S.korea so bought a replacement today. Luckily it didnt die while she was there (9 weeks) as she was working remotely via the internet while there! Anyway, the laptop has windoze 8 installed. What a heap of Smile... I couldnt find the off button until i did a lot of searching by google. The IE11 when launched from metro doesnt have a close box - you just are supposed to leave it running wasting power. And the metro interface has all these boxes going out to the internet gettin news updates, weather, piics from my hotmail account etc etc.During the install, i had to give ms an email acct so they could email me the password key to validate windows, so it then used that info to set me up as a user, with that password. I normally dont have a password on my laptops - i am not in an office environment, so i like it simple. Here, internet access costs a lot for data ovrr mobile (which is all i have) and i have to get to the bottom it to turn this stuff off! And it wants to download w8.1 which is likely GBs. Wish we could use a Mac!
Comments
OpenWrt deploys Linux completely differently that the Raspberry Pi.
You seem to have NO interest in learning how OpenWrt does things, and yet Cluso and I both share that as a common interest. I have gone out and bought an MR3020 just to learn OpenWrt.
That seems to have in someway offended you and launched into your proving that we are wasting time and effort. You are being RuDE, and intollerant of others. Just let us have our fun.
This thread is NOT about the Raspberry Pi and has nothing to do with comparison of the Raspberry Pi.
In sum, if you cannot participate -- SHUT UP and Leave. I don't want to waste time debating with you. I have invested many hours in the past week or so reading and research OpenWRT, which happens to be of interest to me.
I personally have no interest in learning or using the Raspberry Pi. Can't you grasp that? Arguing with you semantically and point by point doesn't help anyone enjoy using Propellers, but you persist..................
Loopy, I think you will have to accept that the Raspberry Pi is now probably the most wide spread, widely used, widely discussed general purpose Linux based machine in the world. It has certainly raised awareness of Linux an incredible amount. (Yes, Beagles and such are up there to, I have no idea how they compare in adoption rates but what I am saying here applies anyway)
That means that an awful lot of useful Linux tutorials, recipes, projects, blogs and other generically useful Linux know how will be coming from the Raspi world. As we have seen with the articles and software I have linked to above.
Don't forget that 99% of that information is not Raspi specific. It is applicable to any Linux system especially those running Debian or Ubuntu or something similar.
If you skip over all the Raspi stories when googling around for solutions to Linux problems you are going to miss a lot of good and helpful stuff.
So I would advise that you "hold your nose" and dive in. Suck up the info and use it on your system of choice.
I don't have to accept anything about the Raspberry Pi. I don't own one and have grown to dislike your relentless pursuit of convincing me to accept it.
I don't understand why you are doing this. My reasons for disliking the Raspberry Pi don't even matter. It is the fact that you feel that you can't let that be that is so offensive.
I am aware of what Linux is. But you are NOT aware of what OpenWrt is, how it uses squashfs, and other details that I am struggling with.
Go away............................. go away.................................. go away.......................
From all my reading at OPENwrt, this won't work with OpenWrt projects. It seems like a generalized Linux solution that will work with the Raspberry Pi.
But trying to do so is likely to confound a new Linux user that is working with squashfs and OpenWrt for the first time.
____________
In sum, a Raspberry Pi solution is not directly transferable to the WR703N as the R-Pi uses BerryBoot and an SDcard filesystem that holds the complete Linux boot image. The Linux boot image in the WR703N is within the squashfs, not separate from it.
In general with routers, nobody bothers with updates if they are secure, stable, and performing adequately. In fact, the WR703N factory install is using Linux V.2.6.33... which is far behind the current kernel version.
OpenWrt uses very up-to-date Linux. Once it is working, I'd likely not update anything without good reason and obvious need.
Oh Loopy, what am I going to do with you? Take a beer and chill out, or take a nap, you are getting all grumpy and flustered for no reason. You have not understood what I have been saying. It's not pleasant being told off and shouted at for saying things that I did not say. As Basil Fawlty said to Manuel whilst beating him about the head "Try to understand before one of us dies!".
Perhaps I did not express myself clearly enough. So let's wipe the whiteboard clean and start over again:
1) Yes of course OpenWRT deploys Linux differently than the Raspi. So does every other system I work on from traffic radar to routers to WIFI connected light bulbs.
2) Do not be so presumptuous as to assume I have no interest in OpenWRT. I'm not sure why you do given my comments about my own D-Link router a little while ago.
3) I am in no way offended by anything. If you are reading my posts you will see that I have not suggested you switch to a Raspi solution since the beginning of this thread. Certainly not in today's posts. That debate has been had and you have made your choice. That is fine by me and only leaves the issue of getting it working.
4) I have not insisted that you learn anything about the Raspi. I certainly do not have "a relentless pursuit of convincing you to accept it [ the raspi ]". That is not what my posts said. What I suggested was that there is a vast ocean of helpful information about Linux being exchanged in the Raspi world (And no doubt in the Beagle and Cubie worlds). That information is generic Linux stuff, and ARM SoC based Linux stuff. It is applicable to many Linux systems including your routers. You can make use of the help offered or you can ignore it, up to you.
5) "But you are NOT aware of what OpenWrt is" This is intolerable. How can you presume such a thing? Did you read my recent post (#69)? I was involved in developing Linux based router solutions almost ten years ago. We built our own cross-compilers and kernels and libraries and routing applications. We wrote and or/customized our own kernel drivers. We used buildroot. We used busybox. Does all this sound familiar? OpenWRT employs a lot of the same software and techniques as we did back then. Admittedly that was quite a while now and things have moved on, details have changed but please don't tell me I don't know what OpenWRT is.
7) "Go away... go away... go away..." No, why should I? Feel free to ignore any advice I offer. Perhaps Clusso and other readers may benefit from it.
Now, Loopy, can we hug and make up and get back to practical issues?
BTW My 703 Original FW seems to be 3.14.4 Build 120925 Rel 33133n
I am not sure of the OpenWrt release.
As far as I can tell, what heater is suggesting is basically what I read somewhere about how to initially identify and turn a GPIO on/off. I just haven't had time to relook for it.
Loopy, No. Read again. OpenWRT uses both squashfs which is read only and jffs2 which read/write. These two file systems are merged into one by overlayfs thus giving you a writeable fs that it should be possible to SCP/FTP into. This is described here:http://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/techref/filesystems
This page http://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/techref/flash.layout shows that a TP-Link WR1043ND target has 1.5MB of read only squashfs and 5MB of jffs2.
I hope this applies to the routers you guys are using. Pretty much nothing is directly transferable from one machine to another unless they are identical. However what I am suggesting above is applicable. True.
However whilst you are developing your solution, hacking away, trying this and trying that, having to rebuild and reflash the entire firmware image for your router would be a pain in the butt during the edit/test/debug cycle. I'm hoping you can ease such development cycles using SCP/FTP.
Quite so.
Raspi this raspi that. No matter. Every machine that runs Linux is sacred. Even the humble router or light bulb.
Hey, what's this? I just found an old, unused, D-Link DIR-615 at the bottom of a cupboard in the office. Seems it is supported by OpenWRT. I'm just reaching for the screwdriver. You guys may have just wasted my weekend:)
Edit: Oh Smile, first road block. This thing does not have any screws that I can see. I have no idea how to open it up without wrecking it.
Uh.. oh... Now you really are going to have to learn how OPENwrt configures Linux. And the source code varies depending on DIR-615 version.
The file system is a combination of READ-ONLY on squashfs, and temporary file system in RAM. Installing executable binaries may work, but you have to first install an FTP server to have FTP services. Xmodem or Kermit might be a simpler way to go.
Be careful, the DR-615 has unsupported versions. OpenWRT may not be possible.
Well if SCP/FTP are feasible, there are existing OPENwrt packages for picocom, microcom, and minicom available along with related stty utilities.
There is also a document for making one's own OPENwrt packages that would help with compiling a Propeller binary loader.
But all I have read about OPENwrt packages seemed to indicate they were part of the firmware compile process.
I have nothing aside from what I read at OPENwrt and can get from online to figure this all out.
++++++++++++
Obviously, if you had in depth router experience 10 years - you do know more that I. You comments previously to my enthusiasm about such tiny Linux seemed to indicate you were no longer interested in such.
I have had an EEEpc with solid state hard disk and one Asus wr500p router that dealt with these solid-state alternatives to a hard disk. I'd have to say that the EEEPC 701-4g was my first real Linux OS. That wasn't so long ago.
Loopy, yes, it's a minefield. This box is a DIR-615 D1. Seems this is a supported target all be it with some caveats.
I have the box open, It did actually have some screws under the second pair of rubber feet I looked at.
I have located the serial port!
OpenWRT says there are no free GPIO pins here. but I can see an unpoulated LED and switch space. Could always hijack one of the status LED lines I guess.
But hey, I have this box open now and all that FLASH space is calling to be to upgrade it:)
I still am unclear how any FTP executable might be retained if power is removed. While there is a nice presentation of which file systems are used, I can seem to see where they exist and how much of the 4mbyte Flash is squashfs for boot and how much might be some other persistent file system.
That is why I was beginning to consider the need to compile a new binary.
As things are I can load my MR3020 with existing OpenWRT firmware immediately and set up the Rx and Tx in a hardware loopback to test the RS232 terminal. It would take much to remove a resister and install a wire for a GPIO to be used as a Reset.
It also seems that several items might need to be inserted as modules, not merely executable files.
++++++++++
Just maybe you should skip the DIR-615 and buy a WR703N or MR3020. After all, there is a risk that what you do on the DIR-615 isn't going to be transferable to these other devices.
Actually so am I. One of the OpenWRT pages I linked to above describes how there is a sqashfs file system and a jffs2 file system existing in separate parts of the FLASH. Then overlayfs merges those at run time to provide a single writable system to work in.
What does this mean exactly? I'm not sure, never used overlayfs before, but it sounds like if you write to a file, say by downloading with FTP or hacking on an existing file, then it is written to the jffs2 system. The original content stays unchanged in the squashfs system. See the section on "mount points" here: http://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/techref/flash.layout
I am just now rebuilding the everything from the tools to the final image for my d-link. Just to see how it goes as we might all need to do that at some point. It's taking a long time.... Do you mean kernel modules or some other kind of module? If they had them on the shelf at out local computer megastore I probably would have already. I'm not about to start ordering from ebay or whatever when I have a suitable candidate to hand. Don't care. I don't have those other devices: )
Don't worry, I have no desire to create anything that is not portable. If I have to start doing a lot of work dedicated to this particular box I'm going to give up and do something else.
Okay, okay... I don't need the banter, just a working MR3020. I will keep DIYing.
They happened to be on the shelf and on sale where I am. LOL.
I am happy to hear that the Flash appears to be capable of partitioning between squashfs and jffs2. I am not up to speed on all this as it has been a rapidly changing area of software.
My EEEpc 701-4G may have had another solution as the storage was 4Gbytes, not a mere 4Mbytes. I really loved the extreme fast boot of a 4Gbyte solid-state drive and a full Ubuntu image at the time only took up about 2.8Gbytes.
And YES, I mean kernel modules may need installation, not just executable files.
But I enjoy the tightness. It demonstrates the system with greater clarity than big bloated hard disks.
The EEEpc sounds great. Cost a bit more than a router I guess:) Solid State storage is a great on a PC as well, my Samsung SSDs are the best upgrades I ever made to a PC.
Kernel modules is not a problem. Just select the ones you want to use in "make menuconfig". Then when running on the router just load it into the kernel with "modprobe 'whatever_module_name' ""
Of course if you want to write your own kernel module that might take a bit more work....
Hey, I'm not sure if the way I configured the build is correct for my box but it has finished and produced a bunch of firmware files: And a working cross compiler: I'm not about to try and load that to my unit, it's probably wrong. I will try a ready made firmware later.
Beware with the switch in our OpenWrt versions - the switch is used to do some form of minimal reset/boot combo and is sampled about 20+ seconds into the original boot (need to check for exact details).
There are possibly other GPIO that can be soldered directly to the chip, depending on how much pad is available and how good you are at soldering.
BTW I have ordered 2 more routers - a dongle style for $10 and a smaller box than the WR703N called a Votnets Mini300 for $13. Just want to see what else is available for less $$ and if they can be hacked.
Now I will read further on this thread...
Glad your recompile works. I am sure that info will come in handy later.
From what I understand, when updating the OpenWrt firmware, we have to ftp a new image into the r/w section of the flash, and then with a new reboot it can upgrade and write the new image to the r section of the flash (ie the boot section of the flash).
And it seems we can add modules to the r/w flash and can change the boot script to install these modules. Does this sound right?
Unfortunately, there is a lot of OpenWrt documentation, and there is a lot of conflicting info as well. There seems to be so many ways of doing things and each piece of docs uses a different way. I was pleased to see that my upgrade worked. But I found 4 precompiled versions (2 sets) for the 703. I need to do a diff to see if the sets are identical (later).
Can you post pics of your router and the chip numbers of the 3 main chips (cpu, ram, eeprom) please?
FWIW the 703 has an Atheros AR9331-AL3A (cpu etc), Winbond W9425G6JH-5 (Ram) and Spansion FL032P1F (flash). The flash is easily upgraded as its an SOIC8 but I am not sure what needs to be reflashed (if any) into it before putting on the board. Anyway I am hoping this is unnecessary - in fact hoping I can ultimately use the cheaper 702 or something even cheaper again. But got to get this running first. Probably a good idea to put a USB Memory stick in the USB for additional memory for now if we need it.
I have an old laptop that is probably begging to have Linux installed. But it is going to have to wait for now.
I have just been doing a rebuild again with some different config options. BINGO I now have a bin directory with about a hundred sysupgrade and factory bin
files in it. One of them is openwrt-ramips-rt305x-dir-615-d-squashfs-factory.bin which sounds more like what I might need.
So far so good. I'm happy because these complex build things often fail in a bazillion unexpected ways that takes a month of googling to fix.
You are some steps ahead of me regarding the updating and modules. Let me try and blow my first image on to the box. And first I need a serial port connection.
There certainly is lots of documentation. However I can see it suffers from not being up to date and in sync with the current software.
I'll try and get some pictures when we have some daylight. Not sure it will be worth much as the only camera I have is an old Samsung Galaxy S with a very scratched up lens.
Try to embrace OpenWrt as the solution, not the problem.
If you had asked me, I could have located the DIR-615 firmware for you.
The core problem is the whole concept of Wiki documentation on the WWW. Good documentation really needs an editor that just refuses to release anything for publication that is less than satisfactory, and a clear path to what is published.
OpenWrt is not the only outfit to go down this road. It seems Parallax has done so with SimpleIDE and Learn.
+++++++++++++++
DO NOT Forget that the D1 is one of many versions of the DIR-615. Awkward as it seems, the paragraph that discusses the specific D1 installation says,
Quotation from OpenWRT
Rev. D1-D4
These use a Ralink chipset that only has preliminary support and requires a manual build. D1/D2 models are known to have problems with the latest ethernet driver(s) and require the use of an older driver. D3/D4 are relatively stable with an unmodified trunk build.
The D4 works well if you treat it exactly the same as a DIR-600/B2
The DIR-615D maps to DIR-300b1 therefore there is no dedicated target for 615-D.
end of quotation from OpenWrt
That is a bit disconcerting as it seems to indicate the D4 requires the DIR-600/B2 firmware image, and that the D1 needs some special handling to include older ethernet drivers.
You have to FOLLOW the D1/D2 build intructions.
But they have a 'Fix Me' flag on them. So it seems that installed OpenWRT on the D1 may be unfinished business.. possibly abandoned due to just being an older router that people are not actively hacking. Ralink may not be providing enough information to do so.
+++++++++++++++++++
In summary.....................
You have entered THE TWILIGHT ZONE.
No dedicated target.
Use the DIR-300b1 image at your own risk for the DIR-615 D-1!
The problem is that Ralink requires a manual build to do a proper build. The support for Ralink is ONLY PRELIMINARY.
+++++++++
If I were you, I would abandon any modification of your DIR-615 D1 and find something else.
I had to abandon the WR702N as the Flash memory made it unsupported by OpenWRT.
If you really want to play along I can send you an MR3020 new and complete via DHL as a gift and no cost to you. A gift should go through customs with no duty and no value added tax.
Progress Report
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I have gotten into the MR3020 menus via 192.168.0.254 in Windows7. It seems that using a generic Linux connection is ignored.
From there I was able to burn the new OpenWRT firmware via the Firmware update page.
I haven't yet gotten back into the MR3020 via Windows or Linux. It seems to no longer be recognized by Windows7.
More to come later. I did not change the passwords or security prior to doing this changeover.
First you have a problem, then you see a solution, the solution is a problem until it works, then it's a solution. Just now I'm at the problem with a problem stage:)
I found the downloads yesterday already. I presume you mean the stuff here: http://downloads.openwrt.org/attitude_adjustment/12.09/ramips/rt305x/...
As I said I will try a ready made binary first, after getting the serial port working.
But there the confusion sets in. According to D-Link DIR-615 page v12.09 does not support the D1, you need a custom build from source. Hence my messing with building the thing here. But who knows what needs customizing? I just read 10 pages of a openwrt forum thread about the D1 with no clear conclusion as to the state of the art.
That sounds like I might just chance a barrier_breaker binary.
I'll abandon the DIR-615 after I have bricked it. It's a disposable item anyway. It's encouraging to read that "Revisions D1 to D4, H1 as well as I1 are pretty much unbrickable as they have a built-in firmware recovery mode." If we can trust that:)
Thanks for the offer of the MR3020. Let's think about that after I have played with the D-link a bit.
P.S. When they say "The DIR-615D maps to DIR-300b1 therefore there is no dedicated target for 615-D." Do they really mean "615-D1"? How can we know? That does not correspond to what the guys were doing on the forum three years ago.
The SoC is numbered with:
WRGN22...A1G
S29AL032D90TF1O4
842BB014 H
SPANSION
U11 2BD6
And the FLASH:
MIRA P3V28S40ETP
842AFA02-G6
I can't see anything on there that looks like an EEPROM.
Hey, look what I found in the openwrt config:
Well, since there is NO version D, the series starts with D-1. And D-2 is covered in DIR-300b2. It just seems that a typo crept in. The logic is pointing towards the DIR-300b1.
+=========
You asked what to do with the 4 LAN ports... The answer is nothing. The reason we have zeroed in on the WR703N and MR3020 are for their Serial Port and GPIO. The one LAN port may or may not be of any use.
=++++++++++++++++
I am now into the MR3020 and have been exploring all the directories for good info. Initially the Wifi is shutoff and there is no password after the OpenWrt is loaded. One has to use Putty for a telnet connect to 192.168.1.1 port 23. If you evoke 'passwd' and provide a new one, the device immediately changes to SSH login protocol.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I am including screen dumps that show what BusyBox provides, a lsmod listing, and a few other items. If you want more, I can create other screen dumps or Putty just might track everything in a log file.
You have been doing a bit of PhotoShop, haven't you? OpenWRT would never bother with a R-Pi. They wouldn't dare.
See the below link for further explanation.
http://wiki.openwrt.org/toh/raspberry_pi
Nope that is snapped straight out of the openwrt configuration tool.
I need to study 'vi' to get the configuration files in order.
And 'opkg' is already installed to install packages for 'core utilities-stty' and 'picocom'
http://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/packages
That just may be all that is needed to interface a Propeller in Forth.
http://wiki.openwrt.org/doc/techref/opkg
Cool, sounds like you are business. That's a neat package system they have managed to squeeze in there.
I presume there are no chips underneath. Normally I would say those 2 identical chips are Ram and the Spansion chip is the Flash.I would expect the cpu is hiding under the metal frame. There is aheader past the frame which may be the serial. I suggest you connect a pin via 3-10k to the prop rx at 115200 baud and see if you can find the serial out. And of course an earth. Those leds are going tocome in handy for gpio testing.
Interesting discovery about the pi. Thre are probably a lot more routers of each model out there than 3 million rpis, but not that many would be hacked of course.
Anyway i am hoping you can get an openwrt loaded.
Loopy, looks like you are making some progress.
My wifes laptop died on the trip home from S.korea so bought a replacement today. Luckily it didnt die while she was there (9 weeks) as she was working remotely via the internet while there! Anyway, the laptop has windoze 8 installed. What a heap of Smile... I couldnt find the off button until i did a lot of searching by google. The IE11 when launched from metro doesnt have a close box - you just are supposed to leave it running wasting power. And the metro interface has all these boxes going out to the internet gettin news updates, weather, piics from my hotmail account etc etc.During the install, i had to give ms an email acct so they could email me the password key to validate windows, so it then used that info to set me up as a user, with that password. I normally dont have a password on my laptops - i am not in an office environment, so i like it simple. Here, internet access costs a lot for data ovrr mobile (which is all i have) and i have to get to the bottom it to turn this stuff off! And it wants to download w8.1 which is likely GBs. Wish we could use a Mac!