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Computer/Tablet Recommendation — Parallax Forums

Computer/Tablet Recommendation

Tim-MTim-M Posts: 522
edited 2014-01-31 11:29 in General Discussion
Hey Guys and Gals,

Our primary home computer (a desktop) went down hard yesterday and it's time for a replacement. Not having owned a tablet or any touch product for that matter as yet, I'd appreciate your advice about which way to go... desktop, laptop or tablet, and what's the better bang for the buck. Our primary use for that machine was online R&D, online banking, email and technical document storage.

The budget is kinda tight right now but I'm always willing to spend more up front for better hardware or a better result, so don't let cost get in the way.

A tablet has advantages of portability, but my eyesight isn't the best and I hedge a little bit at the small screen size... I also want to have schematics and technical docs handy and am wondering if there are PDF or other file type limitations with tablets like there used to be.

Appreciate the help and advice,

Tim

Comments

  • xanatosxanatos Posts: 1,120
    edited 2014-01-28 16:44
    One thing to keep in mind is that if you go with the tablet option, be sure it runs a FULL operating system. The Apple and Android tablets do not run any standard programs you may be used to running on your laptop or desktop - they run "apps".

    I have a lot of programs I need for work, for example, the Propeller Programming tool, and the Basic Stamp Editor. These will not run under the iPad or Android systems.

    I bought a Samsung ATIV 11" tablet running Windows 8 with full touch screen functionality, and it was one of the best investments I've made. It's only got 32 GB of main storage, though, but it has a micro SD card slot in which I've stuffed a 64GB card, and I use that as my archival storage.

    For portability, it can't be beat. It also has USB slots, something iDevices lack - but are required for stamp/propeller programming, as well as several other external items I need to hook up on a daily basis. Its networking is as standard as any other device, so I can transfer files around when my other systems are on the same network.

    With a Windows 8 tablet running touch screen functionality, you'll find it pretty easy to use. Windows 8 without touch (ie., mouse only) is counterintuitive to say the least and very clunky.

    Running Android or iOS will give you issues with file formats like PDF, etc., that vary from system to system. You will possibly need to download apps to handle various files that a full Windows system will handle with ease.

    All tablets and laptops offer accessibility options to increase font and icon sizes as you like. Under Control Panels, look for the Accessibility Options control panel and experiment until you get the interface to a comfortable viewing experience.

    If you've never owned a touch device before - I wouldn't worry too much. It's an extremely intuitive interface. Be sure to get a device that has good touch tech, however. Look for a glass-like, shiny screen that takes very light finger drag. iPads have an excellent touch response. My Samsung ATIV does as well. Avoid the "matte" finished screens - you'll find they need more time to figure out what you're touching and they have poorer resolution, and you'll get frustrated quickly.

    Cost wise, my Samsung ATIV has an 11" screen and ran me around $425.00. It's been worth every fraction of a cent I spent.

    Keep us posted on your progress and choices.

    Dave
  • RDL2004RDL2004 Posts: 2,554
    edited 2014-01-28 16:45
    Best bang for the buck will be a desktop. If the budget is under $500, head to Walmart or one of the other big box stores. One option might be to buy used, Newegg frequently has some good deals on corporate refurbs. In the over $500 range, I'd just assemble one from parts.
  • Mark_TMark_T Posts: 1,981
    edited 2014-01-28 16:57
    If you are ever going to be coding or authoring or suchline, I'd suggest large screen laptop - portable, you won't get
    gorilla hands syndrome using it.

    Tablets are media devices, not programmers tools, but it sounds like that's OK for what you need (you never needed
    the desktop really).

    One little caveat. DVD drive. Tablets don't come with any removable drives other than USB / SDcard (perhaps there's
    a monster one or two that do, but as a rule...).
  • mindrobotsmindrobots Posts: 6,506
    edited 2014-01-28 17:32
    Primary computer? Assuming Windows? A moderately priced large screen i5 laptop with at least 4gb of memory that you csn add memory to. When budget allows, you can upgrade memory and add a monitor to use as a second screen. Once you use two screens for technical work you'll never want to go back to one....and a usb mouse for when you use it on a desk. (Touch pad mouses will drive you crazy!!)
  • Tim-MTim-M Posts: 522
    edited 2014-01-28 17:40
    Great help guys, Thank You! Please keep it coming...

    Really good points made about what software that tablets will run and USB port availability, etc. these are exactly the reasons why I have the laptop I'm using now. Even though the primary uses are as listed, I'd like to have the portability of a tablet, but also the convenience of being able to run programming software, use external devices, etc.

    @ Dave/xantos, thanks for your detailed writeup. I looked up the Samsung ATIV and it appears to come in several flavors... is that the case and do you mind sharing which model you have?
  • LoopyBytelooseLoopyByteloose Posts: 12,537
    edited 2014-01-28 22:55
    I am on my 3rd notebook and still reluctant to get a touchscreen device. I seem to have enough trouble with getting what I say from my mind, through the keyboard, and onto the screen via touch typing. Besides, I want my USB to RS232 converter and PuTTy for serial communications.

    All these changes seem to come at a nuisance cost. Trying to preserve open architecture and open source code.

    Nonetheless, the Samsung Galaxy devices seem to be a good value.. if you must. Today's Taiwan Times has an article claiming 1 billion touchpad telephones are now in use. I am still using a clam-shell phone.
  • Tim-MTim-M Posts: 522
    edited 2014-01-29 11:23
    I can appreciate that Loopy, my wife and I are still using stone-age flip phones. I like having USB ports and serial comms too, so with the good advice of the group here, the direction to go for a computer replacement is becoming clearer with each post.
  • xanatosxanatos Posts: 1,120
    edited 2014-01-29 19:03
    Tim-M wrote: »
    @ Dave/xantos, thanks for your detailed writeup. I looked up the Samsung ATIV and it appears to come in several flavors... is that the case and do you mind sharing which model you have?

    It's model # XE500T1C, 32gb, 11" screen. I also bought the external keyboard that goes with so that when I need to do just a bit more typing than is comfortable on-screen, I can use it as a regular laptop. The voice recognition on this unit is also very, surprisingly, good. I can control it or dictate letters by voice alone.

    That said, I do also have a Sony VAIO laptop running dual monitors for my more involved, tedious from-the-ground-up design work. Dual monitors are really indispensable in that capacity... but the convenience of the tablet when travelling and/or field programming is incredible.

    FYI, I'm typing on the tablet's screen keyboard right now... not too bad!
  • LoopyBytelooseLoopyByteloose Posts: 12,537
    edited 2014-01-29 19:22
    Asus has the Transformer -- a combination notebook/touchpad that operates under Android. This has always appealed to me. Comes with Windows 8.

    http://www.asus.com/in-search-of-incredible/us-en/asus-transformer-book-t100/

    I am just not willing to make the jump from Linux to Android or to Windows 8... that seems a step backwards.
  • RDL2004RDL2004 Posts: 2,554
    edited 2014-01-29 20:15
    Just keep in mind that you can get twice the computer for your money if you go with a standard desktop. If you don't actually need portability, avoid it. You'll just be wasting money.

    I priced out a build this morning for a mid range desktop using top quality parts:

    Intel Core i3 3.3 GHz with HD4000 Graphics
    4 GB DDR3 PC-1600 RAM
    2x USB 3.0
    4x USB 2.0
    Gigabit Ethernet
    SATA III 6 Gb/s
    HDMI/DVI/D-Sub video ports
    Samsung 128 GB SATA III SSD
    SeaSonic 520 watt Active PFC Modular power supply

    Price including a decent $50 case to put it all in was $519

    You would, of course, have to decide on an operating system. If Windows, then add another $100.
  • Tim-MTim-M Posts: 522
    edited 2014-01-29 22:06
    Great to have up-to-date advice everybody, thanks again for the details. If I can make time tomorrow, I'll get out and look around at what's in the stores and report back.

    The all-in-one/transformer idea looks interesting, appearing to give the best of full PC capability and offering portability, I'll take a closer look there Loopy, thank you...

    I appreciate the desktop bang-for-the-buck and the build-your-own advice, strong considerations there too. Thanks for the taking the time to price components and specs RDL2004!

    Dave/Xanatos, I'm going to take a hard look at the Samsung lineup... Thanks for specifics on what you've got in front of you. I'm kind of surprised to hear you were posting from the touch screen... that you are comfortable enough to type that much by that method.

    This is great feedback everybody and I'm grateful. I'll let you know where it goes.

    Tim
  • frank freedmanfrank freedman Posts: 1,983
    edited 2014-01-30 11:31
    I have never been known for my liking of anything microsoft, was big on OS/2, would really rather use any variant of Linux etc, but I have to admit, after a nearly a year with the Surface Pro, original model 4gb/128GB w/ type keyboard, I am very happy with it and win8.1. Yeah, windows still has the same quirks as ever, some new, some no longer there, but it lets me get things done on the fly in real-time. So when I am overrun with work orders from multiple imaging departments, grab and go was a real treat instead of wasting time transcribing what I had done at the end from notes and memory. The surface also lets me do anything I need to troubleshoot network/dicom issues, run service software for some systems, act as a terminal and on and on. When I bought the surface it seemed to be the best buy for the money. May still be, but until this one dies the controller will probably not want me to get the next one. Other offerings may e as good or better now. But I really do like my surface PRO. Be careful with that one as some other units call themselves Pro such as one particular dell unit, but it is really just an atom running the atom version of win8. What you really need and how you want to use it made good guidelines for me. The lower battery life though an annoyance is not a real problem (unless I have to fly a really long time between charging).
  • Tim-MTim-M Posts: 522
    edited 2014-01-30 12:46
    Hi Frank, I've never been much of an MS guy either, in fact I like the company and how they do business less and less as time goes on... That being said, I really do appreciate your first-hand feedback on the SurfacePRO and will consider it. Admittedly it will likely stay toward the bottom of my list, simply because I want to support MS as little as possible, but I will give it a fair shake.

    Thanks very much,

    Tim
  • localrogerlocalroger Posts: 3,451
    edited 2014-01-30 15:51
    I favor a small to medium sized laptop with full size external keyboard, monitor, and mouse. Touch is useless on the desktop and if you can find someone willing to sell you a Win7 box you'll be better off. My laptop is rarely off the desk but if I do travel I can just unplug the monitor and USB cable and I'm portable with all my data. It also won't crash if the power fails.
  • ercoerco Posts: 20,256
    edited 2014-01-30 17:09
    I still enjoy using my 5-year old Acer netbook for certain things. No CD/DVD drive, it's not super powerful (video-wise) and not my everyday machine, but it's tiny and easy to tote. I'm careful with it, I think like many laptops, one good drop and it's history. But I could probably find a used replacement unit for $100.

    Mine came with XP but I'll be installing Win7 soon.
  • Tim-MTim-M Posts: 522
    edited 2014-01-30 18:36
    Localroger - Like you, I prefer to have a full-size keyboard for typing and a larger screen helps with the goofy eye issues I have too.

    Erco - The machine I'm using now is about a 5 year old Acer Aspire. It's done well for us so I can see why you still enjoy yours.

    We did get to take a lap around Best Buy this afternoon and I'm happy to say that choices have dramatically improved and prices have come down considerably since I last looked about 3 years ago. I'm still in homework mode and didn't walk away with something new yet, but some decisions have been made.

    - I will run a full OS, have USB ports/full connectivity, and the ability to run semi-specialty software for programming uC's, PLC's, etc..
    - I'd like a Solid State Hard Drive or Hybrid combo so boot times will be fast.
    - Portability may be nice and so the all-in-ones or docking tablet styles have draw.
    - I feel pretty out of date, so I'm wondering if a touch product would be good just to bring me up to speed a bit... everything has gone that way already.

    Wow, tablet screens sure are nice now! My wife really likes the idea of being able to surf and check email from an easy chair rather than sit at a desk all the time.

    That's the latest everybody. Thanks again for your help and keep the info coming as you think of things, it's really appreciated. All of you are a great resource!

    Tim


    Tim
  • garyggaryg Posts: 420
    edited 2014-01-30 18:56
    Hi
    I may be a bit late at chiming in, but I just purchased an HP Envy Touchsmart m7 Sleekbook.

    It' my 1st attempt at moving forward in time to more recent technology.

    This I my thoughts so far:

    1: Touch screen is nice, but I don't like my screen looking like a dog was licking on it.
    I cleaned the screen after a couple of days use, and have't touched it since.

    2; The mousey pad works ok, but I've always had trouble using those, so I purchased Logitech mouse - the mouse works very good and pretty much eliminates
    the need to use touch screen or mousey pad.

    3: Windows 8.1 - I had the geeks install it, Windows 8.1 is very different from anything I've ever used. I spent many hours trying to find out how to turn things OFF.
    After abut 20 hrs or so, Windows 8.1 is starting to feel relatively natural.

    4: I'm currently attempting to install some CAD software.
    So far I'm stalled out, but am hoping that I'll be able to evaluate, reinstall, uninstall and be able to get things working

    THE FUTURE:
    I have an HP DraftPro DXL plotter.
    It's very obsolete, but I use it on my old XP DELL computer on a regular basis.
    Not much help appears to be available and my original documentation from time of purchase has been lost.
    I'll need to get some type of converter from USB to the DBx connector and also find some type of Driver that will work.
    It's yet another adventure.

    While typing this, it appears that the auto spelling and grammer corrector does not agree with me.
    I'm hoping this post turns out to be readable.

    Just my Two Cents worth.

    Garyg
  • Tim-MTim-M Posts: 522
    edited 2014-01-30 20:02
    Garyg - your situation sounds very similar and your post has to be worth 4 cents at least! I appreciate your detailed first impressions of Windows 8 and touch sensory use. A few years ago, it was my job to keep an older plotter running on the network in an engineering department, and it was indeed a challenge. Just like you, we limped along on an older XP machine which we offered extra TLC for the parallel port it provided to the HP plotter... in fact, we even installed a second parallel port on that machine so we could hang on older label printer off of it too. As expected, there were driver issues for both devices also as time went on. In the end, the company replaced the plotter, label printer and computer for newer technology, much to the relief of myself and a few others.

    Thanks for your help and input,

    Tim

    P.S. My wife and I are planning to move from the Pacific NW to Wisconsin soon to be closer to family. We'll get to share that cold weather with you! You sick of it yet?
  • garyggaryg Posts: 420
    edited 2014-01-30 21:36
    Tim
    I'm attempting to schedule a trip to the Pacific North West to see what it's like.
    Wisconsin is interesting in that depending on where In Wisconsin you are located, weather in the winter is either cold or very cold.
    East coast of Wisconsin - on lake Michigan is normally the warm part of the state.
    Where I live - East coast, it's pretty much like a desert
    Very cold, not that much snow.
    Normal is <32 f from about mid December until sometime in March.
    I've been sick of it for years, but family ties keep me here.

    Good luck on your endevour. Either you will like it or you won't.

    Garyg
  • Tim-MTim-M Posts: 522
    edited 2014-01-31 00:04
    garyg wrote: »
    Tim
    Good luck on your endevour. Either you will like it or you won't.

    Garyg

    Thanks for your well wishes Gary. We have a pretty good idea of what we're in for... and cringe a little bit about it. My wife grew up in Illinois and I lived in Wisconsin as a young kid. Family is important and that's what takes us there now.

    Holler if you have questions about the Pacific NW, I've been here since 1990 and there are others in the group from the area too. It is a beautiful place to live. Western Washington is lush and green with mild winters, all of the seasons are pretty mild actually. The biggest complaint comes from those who stay... the long stretches of gray skies and low light can wear on your head after a while. Washington has a lot of beautiful variety to offer.

    Tim
  • max72max72 Posts: 1,155
    edited 2014-01-31 00:19
    I have a desktop PC and a notebook.
    In both cases the performance was the main requirement, so the habe a lot of memory and a good graphic card. I recently purchased the notebook (a gamer's Asus), and it comes with windows 8.1
    I usually call my programs clicking on the start menu and typing part of the name, so windows 8 is not what I like.
    First thing I found is classicshell.net which brings back the usual interface.
    I use a wired mouse (the touchpad only if really necessary and for the shortest time).
    If you want to keep room for future improvements consider the performance boosts are more memory and SSD.
    Don't try dual monitor!!! It is addictive... I cannot live without it anymore... software like CAD with floating bars scream for a dual monitor...
    Massimo
  • Tim-MTim-M Posts: 522
    edited 2014-01-31 00:29
    Thanks for your feedback Massimo... I'm not much of a gamer but I appreciate good computer performance. Lots of RAM and SSD speed and space would be ideal, but the budget may set the limits this time, I'll let you know how it turns out.

    Tim
  • max72max72 Posts: 1,155
    edited 2014-01-31 02:47
    I'm not a gamer but for my job I had the necessity of a machine on the higher end.
    I'm doing laser scans, and have big huge point clouds to visualize. In my case the best trade off was a gamers notebook.
    With any machine a little bit of room for improvement doesn't hurt. With a notebook you cannot upgrade graphic card or processor.
    Memory and disk offer margin for the future.
    I'm not a fan of costly machines, after all when you hold a new notebook it in your hand it's already old by definition.. :-)

    Massimo
  • GadgetmanGadgetman Posts: 2,436
    edited 2014-01-31 03:27
    What do you have left of the old computer?
    How old are the 'remains'?

    Is the monitor still OK, or is it something you planned to replace anyway?

    If it was the HDD that died, and the rest is 'not too ancient', it may be 'cost effective' to just replace it With a decent SSD.
    (It's what we're planning to do With 3year old machines, and even some of the 4year olds, at the Office)
  • Tim-MTim-M Posts: 522
    edited 2014-01-31 11:29
    Gadgetman - The Dell desktop that went down could be brought back, and I considered it for a second or two, but it's 6-7 years old so I'm thinking it will be better off replaced with newer gear. I completely understand what you're saying and the rebuild point of view.
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