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Parallella vs. Prop? — Parallax Forums

Parallella vs. Prop?

KotobukiKotobuki Posts: 82
edited 2014-03-13 14:44 in General Discussion
Hi,

I was wondering if anyone has done a comparason between the Parallella board and the Propeller. I am going to get the Propeller and board, but was wondering about the Parallella. I have read that some folks have used a Parallella board with a Paspberry Pi (for graphics, which aparantly the Parallella cannot do).

Any information wouild be most welcome.

Best,

joe

Comments

  • rod1963rod1963 Posts: 752
    edited 2014-01-07 11:34
    Completely different animals. The Prop does multiprocessing, the Parallela board does parallel processing. The other thing is, the Parallela isn't shipping at the moment and there is no mention on their site when they will. Evidently they've had teething problems with the boards.
  • Duane DegnDuane Degn Posts: 10,588
    edited 2014-01-07 13:07
    You might want to take a look at this article before deciding if you want to try the Parallella or not.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2014-01-07 13:11
    The Parallax Propeller and Parallella Epiphany chips are not in any way comparable.

    The Propeller has 8 small integer only processors that are closely coupled to the I/O pins. It is a micro-controller designed for interfacing to real world things in real-time. It has multiple processors so that users don't have to worry about programming interrupts and the timing problems they can introduce.

    The Epiphany chip is an array of small processors tuned for floating point maths. It is designed for high speed number crunching where your problem can be tackled in parallel. It has no I/O pins that can be used for controlling external devices. You will want to be familiar with some serious mathematical algorithms and how to parallelize them to make any sensible use of that device.

    The Parallella board is an ARM processor, again a different animal, with an Epiphany chip on the board.

    If you have to ask this question start with a Propeller, it is a wonderfully simple thing to learn about programming with.

    rod1963,

    "...multiprocessing....parallel processing...."

    What is the difference?
  • prof_brainoprof_braino Posts: 4,313
    edited 2014-01-07 18:48
    Heater. wrote: »
    "...multiprocessing....parallel processing...."

    What is the difference?

    I think he's trying to say parallela has a bunch of processors that work together (on the same problem) while the prop has eight processors that work on whatever problem(s), but at the same time, even thought each is independence of the others.

    I'd say prop is more for embedded control, and the parallela is for matrix crunching. Although its all about the custom program one writes for either.

    .
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2014-01-07 18:53
    Braino,

    Yes, Prop for real-world control, Epiphany for number crunching.

    Note however that Epiphany cores are actually independent machines that need not work "on the same problem".
  • David BetzDavid Betz Posts: 14,516
    edited 2014-01-07 19:07
    Heater. wrote: »
    Braino,

    Yes, Prop for real-world control, Epiphany for number crunching.

    Note however that Epiphany cores are actually independent machines that need not work "on the same problem".
    I'm beginning to wonder if I'll ever get my Parallela board. They seem to be having lots of problems.
  • rod1963rod1963 Posts: 752
    edited 2014-01-07 19:45
    Parallela IMO bit off quite a bit, first off using a cutting edge and very expensive FPGA from Xilinx then coupling it to their equally cutting edge chip, then the 6 layer board, then keeping the price to $99.00(The cheapest Zynq chip is around $55.00 ea) all added up to a lot of delays.
  • prof_brainoprof_braino Posts: 4,313
    edited 2014-01-08 07:37
    David Betz wrote: »
    I'm beginning to wonder if I'll ever get my Parallela board. They seem to be having lots of problems.

    If it was EASY, I would have done it myself. Seeing its really is harder than I thought (and I thought it would be hard), I'm glad I left them do the work.

    Personally, I'm in no great hurry to get my hands on the parallela, I would have to find a college kid to program it anyway. I just want it to exist.

    If it does eventually exist as a commercial product with large numbers in the wild, great. If it never comes about (unlikely) its only $99 lost, so who cares?
  • David BetzDavid Betz Posts: 14,516
    edited 2014-01-08 07:45
    prof_braino wrote: »
    If it was EASY, I would have done it myself. Seeing its really is harder than I thought (and I thought it would be hard), I'm glad I left them do the work.

    Personally, I'm in no great hurry to get my hands on the parallela, I would have to find a college kid to program it anyway. I just want it to exist.

    If it does eventually exist as a commercial product with large numbers in the wild, great. If it never comes about (unlikely) its only $99 lost, so who cares?
    It's not so much the loss of $99 as the loss of a cool toy to play with. :-)
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2014-01-16 12:45
    I just received an update about funding:

    http://www.adapteva.com/news/carmel-ventures-and-ericsson-invest-in-adapteva/
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2014-01-16 13:07
    That's great news Leon. At least they won't run out of money before my board is shipped :)
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,173
    edited 2014-01-16 20:45
    rod1963 wrote: »
    Parallela IMO bit off quite a bit, first off using a cutting edge and very expensive FPGA from Xilinx then coupling it to their equally cutting edge chip, then the 6 layer board, then keeping the price to $99.00(The cheapest Zynq chip is around $55.00 ea) all added up to a lot of delays.

    On the topic of Cheap Boards, with extra power, I see Microsemi have just added TQFP144 package to their fusion2 series, which were all in larger 400+ BGAs - only downside, is they seem to drop the DDR2 ability in the 144 pin part.

    http://www.microsemi.com/document-portal/doc_download/132721-smartfusion2-product-brief

    The base parts in the larger pin counts seem to be ~$25, so maybe the TQFP144 will be sub $20, which could enable some low cost eval boards.
  • LoopyBytelooseLoopyByteloose Posts: 12,537
    edited 2014-01-17 05:19
    Maybe it is a time to start a new website to retail microcontrollers as they are crowd sourced and debuted.

    We could call it "ONE_OF_EACH.com". Meanwhile I get more joy from just progressing with the Propeller than having to start over with each and every heart-throbbing new gizmology.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2014-03-01 08:16
    I have received an email stating that my Parallella board has been shipped.
  • prof_brainoprof_braino Posts: 4,313
    edited 2014-03-04 16:24
    This is a cross post but the other thread was old anyway.

    So I got my parallela board just now. Who's got plans or ideas on how to use these in a bot?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2014-03-08 05:11
    Have you tried it yet?

    Mine is now in the UK, and I've paid the charges (£21.18). I should receive it on Monday or Tuesday.
  • prof_brainoprof_braino Posts: 4,313
    edited 2014-03-10 13:46
    Too many irons in the fire at the moment. But it makes me happy just to have it on my desk, I know I have something waiting.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2014-03-10 14:17
    Ahgh, what is going on? I don't see any sign of my Parallella yet. Not even a notification that it might be "real soon".
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2014-03-11 06:29
    What backer number are you? I'm #561, which is quite early.

    The board has just been delivered. It's surprisingly small, now I have it in my hands. It was supplied with a small stick-on heatsink for the Zynq FPGA, and a fan is recommended.

    I've downloaded the latest Cygwin and am looking for a suitable PS and cables. I'll also need to download the SDK and get an SD card for it.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2014-03-12 07:19
    My Parallella board has just booted Linux OK!
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2014-03-12 10:36
    just booted Linux OK!

    Cool! How's the boot up speed? I did read somewhere that it ran the Ubuntu OS. Is that the only option?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2014-03-12 10:49
    It takes about 30 s. It is Ubuntu, but there is no reason why another version of Linux or even a completely different OS couldn't be ported to it.

    I've connected a USB keyboard to it, but can't login with the default user name and password for some reason. I've posted a message to the Parallella forum about it.

    It gets *very* hot, and really needs a fan.
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2014-03-12 12:01
    but there is no reason why another version of Linux

    I'd probably try Linux Mint.

    The default Parallella user name is “linaro”
    The default password is “linaro”


    It's weird that the defaults don't work. Any chance your cap locks are on? Can you try to boot with a different keyboard just in case there is a problem with driver for the keyboard you just tried?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2014-03-12 12:09
    "linaro" is what I used.

    I found a different make of USB keyboard and that was the same.
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2014-03-12 18:12
    Did you try longing in from your laptop to the “linaro-ubuntu-desktop” via SSH - VNC or Putty (port 22)

    http://www.putty.org

    re: HEAT(from the known issues list)
    • The board gets hot and needs a fan to operate reliably over extended periods.
    • Do NOT exceed 500mA of USB load without a powered hub on the USB host port.
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2014-03-12 20:06
    [h=3]_VerifiedPeripherals

    Keyboards[/h]
    • Gear Head KB3700TP
    • Logitech Wireless Keyboard K330
    • Microsoft Wireless Comfort Keyboard 5000
    http://elinux.org/Parallella_VerifiedPeripherals
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2014-03-12 20:15
    Just in case you guys haven't seen this warning : [h=2]Critical issue with non-conforming USB powered hubs.[/h]Forbidden operation:
    -Remove the 5V DC power connector while keeping the USB peripheral connector (J6) connected to a non-conforming powered USB hub.

    Result:
    -USB port of the Parallella board gets fried if left on long enough.

    http://forums.parallella.org/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=841
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2014-03-13 01:28
    I wasn't using a hub. I suppose I ought to get a suitable one and one of the conforming keyboards.

    I have a Logitech MK330 keyboard and mouse on order. I should get them tomorrow.

    A Logitech M210 wireless mouse works OK. I don't need a hub, the USB wireless dongle thingy supplied with the mouse should work with the keyboard, as well.
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,173
    edited 2014-03-13 14:44
    Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) wrote: »
    Just in case you guys haven't seen this warning : [h=2]Critical issue with non-conforming USB powered hubs.[/h]Forbidden operation:
    -Remove the 5V DC power connector while keeping the USB peripheral connector (J6) connected to a non-conforming powered USB hub.

    Result:
    -USB port of the Parallella board gets fried if left on long enough.

    http://forums.parallella.org/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=841



    Sounds a strange failure mode - how can a power supply capability issue fry a USB port ??

    I'd expect the stress to go onto the PC Serial port Power handling, not the remote load USB port ?
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