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Gaffers tape electrical resista — Parallax Forums

Gaffers tape electrical resista

henrytjhenrytj Posts: 90
edited 2013-09-15 05:15 in General Discussion
Of course, vinyl tape is the recommendation for taping stuff electrical. But I find it leaves a sticky residue, and when it gets warm, sometimes comes off too easily. I read that one should NOT use DUCK tape. But what about studio/stage gaffers tape? I've searched for its electrical resistance properties, but find information only on vinyl or duck tapes. Gaffers tape is nice. It's cloth and tears easily in each direction. It doesn't seem to come off as easily as vinyl tape and doesn't leave residue. I can tear small 1/2" by 1/2 square pieces by hand.without scissors or knife.

Now, am using to to cover strew terminals on my projects, in case a wire comes loose, or someone sticks their fingers inside (which they shouldn't be doing.) I do not go from one 120v AC terminal to the next in a single piece, as I'm not sure what the electrical resistance of either the cloth or the adhesive is. Gaffers tape is much easier to work with, But, I can find no critical data on it.

Henry

Comments

  • lanternfishlanternfish Posts: 366
    edited 2013-08-30 01:26
    I wouldn't recommend it as a long term solution for insulating hv. If your terminals aren't properly shrouded e.g. choc block or similar then I respectfully suggest you reconsider how you terminate HV.

    Gaffer does have a tendency to come unstuck after a while especially if it is kept warm for prolonged periods. With higher heating it the adhesive tends to bake on but the cloth disintegrates. Of course some brands are better than others.

    As for it's resistance properties ... ???
  • W9GFOW9GFO Posts: 4,010
    edited 2013-08-30 01:36
    Perhaps Kapton tape would work for you.
  • Don MDon M Posts: 1,652
    edited 2013-08-30 01:47
    Duct tape not duck tape. It is used for taping the seems of ducts not ducks. :-)
  • W9GFOW9GFO Posts: 4,010
    edited 2013-08-30 02:03
    Don M wrote: »
    Duct tape not duck tape. It is used for taping the seems of ducts not ducks. :-)

    True, but what about this?

    81iait0sQPL._SL1500_.jpg
    81iait0sQPL._SL1500_.jpg
    1024 x 1024 - 130K
  • Don MDon M Posts: 1,652
    edited 2013-08-30 02:22
    W9GFO wrote: »
    True, but what about this?

    81iait0sQPL._SL1500_.jpg

    That is a brand of "duct" tape that plays on the fact that people mis-pronounce it.
  • henrytjhenrytj Posts: 90
    edited 2013-08-30 05:43
    My understanding that true "DUCT TAPE" is shiny metal with adhesive for actual duct work, and not the same as common "DUCK Tape." I know it's a name brand, and it apparently causes lots of confusion on the sites where it's talked about.

    I have lots of gaffers tape. Got several rolls handed to me for free from a movie set. Vinyl tape, and maybe what I have is very cheap stuff, leave a considerable amount of black residue. Alcohol doesn't seem to clean it off, and I haven't tried other solvents yet.

    Now, when you talk about HV (high voltage) technically isn't that over 1000 volts? Here's another case where there is confusion about terminology. No, I would not risk gaffers tape, or even electrical vinyl tape on something 1000v or higher. But, are you talking 120VAC?

    H.
  • Ron CzapalaRon Czapala Posts: 2,418
    edited 2013-08-30 05:47
    I have been using the Scotch 2228 Moisture Sealing Electrical Tape for covering contacts and backs of PC boards.
    It is 1.65mm thick

    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Scotch-1-in-x-10-ft-2228-Rubber-Mastic-Electrical-Tape-50727-BA-5/202195402
  • henrytjhenrytj Posts: 90
    edited 2013-08-30 05:51
    W9GFO wrote: »
    Perhaps Kapton tape would work for you.

    Well at $33 a roll (1/2 inch, 2 mil) its a little out of my poverty level budget. But if you want to send me a roll, I accept. But it would be cool to have a roll of "space tape." as that seems to be one of its advertised uses.
  • henrytjhenrytj Posts: 90
    edited 2013-08-30 05:59
    Ron Czapala wrote: »
    I have been using the Scotch 2228 Moisture Sealing Electrical Tape for covering contacts and backs of PC boards.
    It is 1.65mm thick

    http://www.homedepot.com/p/Scotch-1-in-x-10-ft-2228-Rubber-Mastic-Electrical-Tape-50727-BA-5/202195402

    I know that others can not understand $10 being a budget breaker. I just spent $10 on ordering the parts for 3 circuits that I want to build, and I had to think long and hard if I could afford it, before hitting the "complete your order" button. Yes, I'm a crazed tinkerer. I'm also a writer because it's cheap. It's a great feeling to sell a story, but the 6 short stories I have sold haven't provided much boost to my income. Still trying to sell the 10 other short stories I've finished. Give me $100K and I'll make a great movie. But no one has done that yet. Or even $10K, or even $1K. There are actually a lot of things I can do, though making money doesn't seem one of them.
  • Ron CzapalaRon Czapala Posts: 2,418
    edited 2013-08-30 06:04
    henrytj wrote: »
    I know that others can not understand $10 being a budget breaker. I just spent $10 on ordering the parts for 3 circuits that I want to build, and I had to think long and hard if I could afford it, before hitting the "complete your order" button. Yes, I'm a crazed tinkerer. I'm also a writer because it's cheap. It's a great feeling to sell a story, but the 6 short stories I have sold haven't provided much boost to my income. Still trying to sell the 10 other short stories I've finished. Give me $100K and I'll make a great movie. But no one has done that yet. Or even $10K, or even $1K. There are actually a lot of things I can do, though making money doesn't seem one of them.

    I agree that it is a little expensive for 10 feet but if saves you from frying an expensive propeller board or sensor it could be money well spent.
  • Beau SchwabeBeau Schwabe Posts: 6,566
    edited 2013-08-30 06:44
    Using a cloth tape, you must assume the dielectric strength of air which is about 3kV per mm or 3V per micron .... with 120V, the total swing is twice that ... so the breakdown is roughly 80 microns for 120VAC. (240/3V=80) Of course other factors play into effect here that can dramatically reduce the dielectric breakdown, humidity, temperature, electrode shape, etc. are just a few. While 80 microns may seem like a small amount (about 1/300th of an inch) , the thickness of your typical electrical tape is roughly 6 mil (or 150 micron) and is only designed for 600V and is most likely de-rated by at least a factor of two making it closer to 1200V. ...compared to air (non de-rated) for the same distance (150 micron) of 450V.

    The point I want to make is, you should not cut corners with improper insulation. Use what is designed for the job and do not try to make due with a substitute.
  • ercoerco Posts: 20,256
    edited 2013-08-30 08:25
    henrytj wrote: »
    I know that others can not understand $10 being a budget breaker. I just spent $10 on ordering the parts for 3 circuits that I want to build, and I had to think long and hard if I could afford it, before hitting the "complete your order" button. Yes, I'm a crazed tinkerer. I'm also a writer because it's cheap. It's a great feeling to sell a story, but the 6 short stories I have sold haven't provided much boost to my income. Still trying to sell the 10 other short stories I've finished. Give me $100K and I'll make a great movie. But no one has done that yet. Or even $10K, or even $1K. There are actually a lot of things I can do, though making money doesn't seem one of them.

    henrytj: Did you ever consider combining your passions? Write articles for ROBOT or SERVO magazines about your crazed tinkerings. I have written for both and enjoyed getting paid for documenting my ramblings. A few hundred dollars per article won't make you rich, but you will certainly be able to splurge every now and then for some "must have" doohickies.
  • W9GFOW9GFO Posts: 4,010
    edited 2013-08-30 09:23
    henrytj wrote: »
    Well at $33 a roll (1/2 inch, 2 mil) its a little out of my poverty level budget. But if you want to send me a roll, I accept. But it would be cool to have a roll of "space tape." as that seems to be one of its advertised uses.

    Only $9 here.
  • Peter KG6LSEPeter KG6LSE Posts: 1,383
    edited 2013-08-30 11:13
    As a past theatre tech ( and a gaff tape master !) I would NOT use it for anything that needs isolation .


    Gaff tape here is 15-20 bucks a roll !
  • GenetixGenetix Posts: 1,754
    edited 2013-08-30 13:42
    What about Heat-Shrink Tubing and if you think something will come loose then you should ground your enclosure if it's conductive.
  • LoopyBytelooseLoopyByteloose Posts: 12,537
    edited 2013-08-31 03:18
    If you want stable insulation, why use tape at all? Use appropriate shrink-wrap insulation to avoid the mess and to get genuine dialectric resistance.

    I have used 'electrical tape', but the stuff will become unstuck when there is heat or solvents (like automotive oil and gasoline). Tape is just about the worse choice. At times, I use a dollip of epoxy. Or I coat the connection in silicon and then use shrink wrap.
  • davejamesdavejames Posts: 4,047
    edited 2013-08-31 07:04
    I most certainly agree with Mr. Schwabe concerning the use of the right tool.

    Out of curiosity, I've emailed 3M for electrical specifications ("Cloth Gaffers Tape 6910").

    I'll report back should they choose to answer.
  • prof_brainoprof_braino Posts: 4,313
    edited 2013-08-31 07:17
    henrytj wrote: »
    I'm also a writer

    PM sent.
  • henrytjhenrytj Posts: 90
    edited 2013-09-03 22:29
    Found my multimeter, It turned out to be in a box of props, not electronics. Once I saw it, I remember it has been used at a prop, actually set dressing, with the oscilloscope (that I'm not sure works right.)

    So, anyway, using the meter, I set it to AC volts, and put one probe against a AC contact, and the other probe (will it's actually just a soldered length of wire as the actual probe tip came off years ago.) Anyway, it measured about 10v-12v potential through the gaffers tape. I made sure lay the probe sideways against the single layer of tape on a terminal, so the probe was not poking into/through the tape. So, everyone is right. Gaffers tape is not a insulator. I have yet to find one of my rolls of vinyl tape (that I know I also have somewhere) to check for comparison.

    Now, please understand. I am not using the tape to wrap wires. But to put a small 1/2"x1/2" square of tape overtop the SSR screwdown terminals. I am building my boxes with 4-gang plastic junction boxes from a hardware store. I can only find 3-gang cover plates that cover most of the box. Part is left open and it is where I have the SSR attached. So I am usind the tape to cover the AC screw down terminals so that someone is not tempted to reach into the box, where the terminals are visible, and touch them. The tape does not go between the terminals. So it's not a situation where heat shrink tubing will work.
  • Beau SchwabeBeau Schwabe Posts: 6,566
    edited 2013-09-04 06:21
    FYI) If you are measuring AC, then you will have a capacitor effect from the tape (insulator/barrier) acting as a dielectric. Any amount of resistance should be measured without the circuit powered and even then, the meter may not be able to detect anything repeatable. IOW, you may get a reading, but it could vary all over the place.
  • skylightskylight Posts: 1,915
    edited 2013-09-04 06:25
    It is unadvisable to use any tape that is cloth based as dampness could set in affecting the insulation properties.
  • davejamesdavejames Posts: 4,047
    edited 2013-09-14 19:02
    davejames wrote: »
    Out of curiosity, I've emailed 3M for electrical specifications ("Cloth Gaffers Tape 6910").
    I'll report back should they choose to answer.


    Well, I finally received a reply from 3M asking about the voltage breakdown/isolation spec:
    Thanks for contacting 3M the innovation company.

    We apologize for the delay in an immediate response. We have never done any electrical tests on this tape.

    Regards,
    DebS
    3M Customer Contact Center
    Product and Application Support
    Industrial Business
  • ercoerco Posts: 20,256
    edited 2013-09-14 19:59
    Well THAT reply was worth waiting for, huh? :)

    "We have never done any electrical tests on this tape." Suppressed info or claimed no knowledge of = "Get out of jail free" card.

    I'm as suspicious of this as when I see "Be the first to write a review" or "no reviews yet" of an item that's NOT new.
  • skylightskylight Posts: 1,915
    edited 2013-09-15 05:15
    That could be read the other way as "we don't advise using this tape for electrical insulation"
    As I said before I think that PVC tape is the number 1 option as it's impervious to damp
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