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Did I miss it? (Part 2) Propeller C — Parallax Forums

Did I miss it? (Part 2) Propeller C

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)Oldbitcollector (Jeff) Posts: 8,091
edited 2013-05-13 16:51 in General Discussion
Isn't today rumored to be the official unveiling of C (and Propeller Activity Board)?

This is an exciting launch that hopefully will also bring attention to folks who have labored feverishly on this project.

Jeff

Comments

  • jazzedjazzed Posts: 11,803
    edited 2013-05-08 07:33
    Oldbitcollector (Jeff) wrote: »
    Isn't today rumored to be the official unveiling of C (and Propeller Activity Board)?

    This is an exciting launch that hopefully will also bring attention to folks who have labored feverishly on this project.

    Jeff

    Not sure when the big release/promotion is right now.

    Looking for hardware? Only 4 boards left in stock until the next build.

    http://www.parallax.com/Store/Microcontrollers/PropellerDevelopmentBoards/tabid/514/ProductID/902/List/0/Default.aspx?SortField=ProductName,ProductName
  • Oldbitcollector (Jeff)Oldbitcollector (Jeff) Posts: 8,091
    edited 2013-05-08 08:53
    Hardware on the way! (plus some for stock for Propellerpowered)

    Jeff
  • David BetzDavid Betz Posts: 14,516
    edited 2013-05-08 09:23
    jazzed wrote: »
    Not sure when the big release/promotion is right now.

    Looking for hardware? Only 4 boards left in stock until the next build.

    http://www.parallax.com/Store/Microcontrollers/PropellerDevelopmentBoards/tabid/514/ProductID/902/List/0/Default.aspx?SortField=ProductName,ProductName
    Looks cool but it's not enough different from the PropBOE for me to buy one. Thanks to Parallax, I already have several PropBOEs! :-)
  • rjo__rjo__ Posts: 2,114
    edited 2013-05-08 09:49
    I tried to learn C in college... and failed. Then when I started programming on a Mac, I tried again ... and failed.

    If Parallax is going to the trouble to wrap it up in a nice package and supported it for $49... I am willing to fail again... or possibly Parallax knows how
    to put it all together so that it actually fosters learning.

    order number 114514
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2013-05-08 10:00
    rjo___
    Don't give up. 300 thousand or so Arduino users are using C++. Many of them are beginners to programming and not tech gurus.
    From what I have seen of the Parallax tutorials and educational materials, as shown at the expo, they are going to make it as easy as Spin.
  • 4x5n4x5n Posts: 745
    edited 2013-05-08 10:16
    The problem I've been having with programming the prop in C is getting past the memory models. For some reason I'm really hung up on it. I think it's time to give it another try just using LMM.
  • jazzedjazzed Posts: 11,803
    edited 2013-05-08 10:22
    We once considered killing all memory models except CMM (the smallest one), but decided they were all worth something to various users.

    All tutorials use CMM. Stick with it and do whatever Andy says. You'll be fine.
  • Martin_HMartin_H Posts: 4,051
    edited 2013-05-08 10:27
    rjo__ wrote: »
    I tried to learn C in college... and failed. Then when I started programming on a Mac, I tried again ... and failed.

    I join Heater in trying to encourage you to learn C. Both PBasic and C/C++ are in the Algol language family and have more in common than not. With regards to language basics the differences are less conceptual and more syntactic. The conceptional differences are the presence of things like structures, classes, pointers and dynamic allocation in the heap. You can actually get quite far with the language without using that stuff.

    Indeed on the Arduino they tend to use static allocation of objects and never call new.
  • Mike GreenMike Green Posts: 23,101
    edited 2013-05-08 10:30
    If you don't want to learn C, you can still use Spin with SimpleIDE (the IDE for Parallax's GCC). You can either compile the Spin directly or translate it into C using Spin2GCC which is pretty good. You can use PropBasic to produce Spin/PASM which you can then compile ... lots of choices.
  • rod1963rod1963 Posts: 752
    edited 2013-05-08 10:34
    _rjo

    Programming in C isn't hard especially if you limit yourself to a subset which is done with Arduino/Wiring, which was to make C accessible to non-technicals. Mbed development system for the ARM does the same.
  • mindrobotsmindrobots Posts: 6,506
    edited 2013-05-08 10:35
    Don't go into it expecting to write a multi-cog killer application exploiting all the features of the Propeller with your first program, you'll do ok. It's new, it's different and you'll stub your toes and bump into things. Andy's material is looking very good from the tutorial standpoint and as a reference point for the new "simple tools". SimpleIDE makes it very painless and there will be a bunch of people trying to swim up the same stream you are. I've learned (maybe) C in a very haphazard way. I'm planning on going through the tutorials just to dot the i's and cross the t's and make sure I haven't missed anything important, useful or relevant to future learning.

    CMM will take you quite far and when you are ready to try new things, you should have a good foundation to build on. If you are new the the Propeller too, you'll learn about it along the way. If you already know the Propeller, then you'll be able to pick out the subtle differences and the ways to leverage C on the Propeller.

    There will always be the big Parallax safety net underneath in case you fall.
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,173
    edited 2013-05-08 14:59
    Mike Green wrote: »
    If you don't want to learn C, you can still use Spin with SimpleIDE (the IDE for Parallax's GCC). You can either compile the Spin directly or translate it into C using Spin2GCC which is pretty good. You can use PropBasic to produce Spin/PASM which you can then compile ... lots of choices.

    .. and doing more than one at a time, is not a bad idea for learning.
    Write it in Spin, use Spin2GCC, and then modify the C created and try to improve it....

    I think Prop GCC also had a mode for C -> PASM ? (for small enough programs) Is that operational yet ?
    That is another good way to learn C, and even learn PASM...
  • 4x5n4x5n Posts: 745
    edited 2013-05-08 16:05
    mindrobots wrote: »
    Don't go into it expecting to write a multi-cog killer application exploiting all the features of the Propeller with your first program, you'll do ok. It's new, it's different and you'll stub your toes and bump into things. Andy's material is looking very good from the tutorial standpoint and as a reference point for the new "simple tools". SimpleIDE makes it very painless and there will be a bunch of people trying to swim up the same stream you are. I've learned (maybe) C in a very haphazard way. I'm planning on going through the tutorials just to dot the i's and cross the t's and make sure I haven't missed anything important, useful or relevant to future learning.

    CMM will take you quite far and when you are ready to try new things, you should have a good foundation to build on. If you are new the the Propeller too, you'll learn about it along the way. If you already know the Propeller, then you'll be able to pick out the subtle differences and the ways to leverage C on the Propeller.

    There will always be the big Parallax safety net underneath in case you fall.

    But I WANT to write multi-cog killer apps that exploit the complete capabilities of the propeller from the get go!!!! :-)
  • __red____red__ Posts: 470
    edited 2013-05-09 06:24
    I think the hardest thing I had to gr0k in the whole world of propeller was choosing a stack size. The method of determining it appears to be similar in C as spin... "Guess a high-ish number then reduce it until your code stops working".

    I have a real hard time with that :-/
  • Dave HeinDave Hein Posts: 6,347
    edited 2013-05-09 06:34
    Stack usage can be determined by initializing the stack to a known pattern or value, and then locating the lowest address (or highest in the case of Spin) that was changed after running the code.
  • TymkrsTymkrs Posts: 539
    edited 2013-05-10 19:57
    We're going to start focusing on the Prop's ability to do C on the podcast First Spin (http://firstspin.tv) from the very basics since I too have tried and failed. Maybe that'll help!
  • RS_JimRS_Jim Posts: 1,766
    edited 2013-05-11 05:53
    . Atdiy
    I look forward to this as I have been fighting learning C for about 25 years!
    Jim
  • Sir GawainSir Gawain Posts: 32
    edited 2013-05-11 20:25
    4x5n wrote: »
    But I WANT to write multi-cog killer apps that exploit the complete capabilities of the propeller from the get go!!!! :-)
    okay := braincoginit(@noshame, @intrying)

DAT
noshame             org
:4joy               add tried, failed
                    mov success, past

                    dirA[x], nolimits
                    jmp #:4joy
    Now it's the only way I can really express myself.
    Go for it!!!
    Your desire is the greatest part. Parallax has great books and good folks.
  • tritoniumtritonium Posts: 543
    edited 2013-05-13 16:51
    4X5n said
    "But I WANT to write multi-cog killer apps that exploit the complete capabilities of the propeller from the get go!!!! :-) "
    Well I was hoping that propbasic was going to do that, but it seems to have fizzeled out and simpleide doesn't support it.
    I've done lots of arduino programming, but every time I start a new project I copy and paste the last one in - comment it all out - and then use that as a reference for the syntax for the bits I need, because no matter what I do I just can't get to grips with [] {} () ; != | || & && and ALL the rest of it!!!
    By the way I still cant type straight into the message box as the enter key has no effect - this was created in notepad - and I can only hope when I paste it into the message box it formats ok because I will not be able to edit it - am I missing something??
    Dave
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