@Heater I totally agree, that a decent quality Iron that just runs off mains will suit just about any hobby work if you know how to solder. I just think that I soldering station is kind of nice for some things, It allows you to get your iron hot enough to solder a to220 tab, and turn it back down cool enough to solder some 30awg wire without melting the insulation. It is in no way needed and these things can be accomplished with skill alone but with a station you can just make your life a bit easier. If I were only making joints on a printed PCB all day there would be absolutely no need for anything more than a 30 watt mains iron. Also as I said part of this is to be able to power a decent Iron that I can buy quality tips for, and to help keep those tips lasting longer by idling the iron at a low temperature. Some of it is just for fun, who doesn't want to see statistics on a screen, maybe I could even control the iron through the internet, upload the heat profiles to Cosm.com for data loging, LOL, why not turn every simple task in to an overly complicated programmable machine!
The question might be: "Why does anyone need a soldering station as opposed to just a suitable soldering iron?"
We have heard here from somone in a HP repair shop that just weilded a cheap iron. That correlates with my experinces as a young student in the "make it right" department of a big military supplier.
For all my hobby work an iron has been sufficient. Never felt the need for temperture control.
controll no.. BUT here is some Ohms law for us to ponder.
OK a normal 7 USD iron is lets saw 40 Watts It Draws .33 amps @ 120 V . there for the Z is 360 Ohms at this power it will Heat the tip and all its metalic connected thermal mass parts...
now granted most stations are Low voltage ( lets say here its 24V and here is WHY!
a 40 watt station is not rated at 24V but at lets say 12 ... for maths sake .**** most likely its not 12V outtta 24V but 20 or 18 ********
OK 40 watts at 12V is 3.33 amps ..... Its Z is 3.6 Ohms ...... so at a PWM of 50%
and Yes this can be a TRIAC 60 HZ zero crossing OR a fancy DC and a 40 KHz MOSFET ..
At 50 % we get 40 watts of rated power ...... But here is the Catch !!!!
We can use 100% PWM and get a HUGE thermal boost ..... Now normaly a boost like this can Fry a iron Yet Casue its a CLosed loop system the NOS boost is not used till the tip is getting cold .. and Its PWM so its not bang bang on off but a gentile ramp ..
this is Why My Iron can warm up so fast .. and can Put Out more heat per Watt then a fixed iron .
Ill Bet a 40 Watt closed loop iron can Source 60 Watts of effective heat .. this is why I can solder a PL-259 Radio plug with my 65W Hakko .
PID at its Best !!!!!
I dont care If I can adjust the temp ...... but I DO care about warm up time and recovery time and
NOW Id you are so inclined you can use a 0-140V VARAIC on a 120V Iron to do the same and ramp it your self by hand .
( I did this for Years !!! )
remember the cheopo irons use there mass to help with the joint .
light small handle stations use active control to Pump the heat ...
Grantd Once you have a Feed back circiut . a Pot is a easy thing to add and thus this is why all low end Closed loop stations have a knob... \\\
NOW the Weller WCEPT ( the one that has the tips controll the heat ) is a bang bang hard on hard off station . its a tad more crude but still usses the idea of over volt to make it recover faster .
Some of it is just for fun, who doesn't want to see statistics on a screen, maybe I could even control the iron through the internet, upload the heat profiles to Cosm.com for data loging, LOL, why not turn every simple task in to an overly complicated programmable machine!
If you put it like that the sky's the limit. However your threads title does ask "...is this a practical idea?"
Now See If you add a Micon I can see a neeed for a iron
In fact here is a Idea !!!!
Stick RFID tages on the solder you use and a reader on the iron controller box .
have the o iron remmeber Temp presets for the solder you use ... Lead RoHS and Lets say Indum .
and smaller solderrs are used with SMT so the Iron knows to ramp down for those flat paks .
Put a G sensor in it so that it will shut off if not used ....
BIG ONE ! have a 0 ohm 1 Meg and Open switch so that yu can float the iron for those pesky Live jobs ..
@Peter, I think Curious one was saying why not ditch the bulky transformer and use that switching supply to power the hakko handle, not a 120v mains iron. The handle is rated at 24V 50W, and the supply advertises it is capable of 90W and 24V so it should work fine with much more overhead than my 60W transformer. Also the Hakko stations are ran with a 24v 70W transformer from what I can tell... Maybe the cheapies don't supply 24v to an iron handle but thats part of what gives a Hakko such good capacity/recovery. As you said ramping the heat up is the best reason to use PID. Im not sure what's in a Hakko 951 but when you set the iron down it sets the temp to 250 degrees while idle, when you pick it back up you can get back up to the full power range in 10 seconds. I don't know what's in a hakko951, I do know there handles and tips have been redesigned from the hakko 888 stations, but I'm guessing the wonderful recovery is due to a quality power supply a long with digital ramping. If I can idle the iron at a low temp and the get heat recovery in even 20 seconds I will be happy, that will be better than most chinese stations, if they even have an idle feature, which is what its all about.
@Heater, Ok Ok that was a bit impractical I admit it , But there are plenty of practical reasons for the project, and it will be something I use every day.
AFAIK the 888 and the Really nice 951 are close but one has a LCD and a menu not a simple knob..
If I had My way I would take a 888 base and a 951s handle . I REALLY love those heater tips ! . and at 9 USD per tip you are not paying too much for the advantage fof a 2 in one combo ..... I mean tips last months here cose to a year .
Just be carul in those laptop SMPS's they may not Like to be switched while running ... it may Gltch the Resistive devider and the feedback loop in the brick ... Be better off just PWMing a external Mosfet with a Micon and set the SMPS brick to 24V mode .
BTW the G3/4 series Macs used 24V so Hint HInt they are a good place to get 24V DC bricks on the cheap .
Yes, I reccomended that power supply for powering 24v iron. And also, you can tweak existing feedback circuit, to have temperature adjustment. That would even lower the costs of development.
I bought my Ersa TC70 (temp controlled 70W) soldering iron in 1979. I love it. It's easy to set the temp, it's mains directly, and there is no 'station' which takes up space on a cluttered desk.
They even sell the same iron today! Expensive, but with payback time over 30 years, it's not bad.
Didn't want to kill the forum iron innovation, just needed to share this.
Comments
controll no.. BUT here is some Ohms law for us to ponder.
OK a normal 7 USD iron is lets saw 40 Watts It Draws .33 amps @ 120 V . there for the Z is 360 Ohms at this power it will Heat the tip and all its metalic connected thermal mass parts...
now granted most stations are Low voltage ( lets say here its 24V and here is WHY!
a 40 watt station is not rated at 24V but at lets say 12 ... for maths sake .**** most likely its not 12V outtta 24V but 20 or 18 ********
OK 40 watts at 12V is 3.33 amps ..... Its Z is 3.6 Ohms ...... so at a PWM of 50%
and Yes this can be a TRIAC 60 HZ zero crossing OR a fancy DC and a 40 KHz MOSFET ..
At 50 % we get 40 watts of rated power ...... But here is the Catch !!!!
We can use 100% PWM and get a HUGE thermal boost ..... Now normaly a boost like this can Fry a iron Yet Casue its a CLosed loop system the NOS boost is not used till the tip is getting cold .. and Its PWM so its not bang bang on off but a gentile ramp ..
this is Why My Iron can warm up so fast .. and can Put Out more heat per Watt then a fixed iron .
Ill Bet a 40 Watt closed loop iron can Source 60 Watts of effective heat .. this is why I can solder a PL-259 Radio plug with my 65W Hakko .
PID at its Best !!!!!
I dont care If I can adjust the temp ...... but I DO care about warm up time and recovery time and
NOW Id you are so inclined you can use a 0-140V VARAIC on a 120V Iron to do the same and ramp it your self by hand .
( I did this for Years !!! )
remember the cheopo irons use there mass to help with the joint .
light small handle stations use active control to Pump the heat ...
Grantd Once you have a Feed back circiut . a Pot is a easy thing to add and thus this is why all low end Closed loop stations have a knob... \\\
NOW the Weller WCEPT ( the one that has the tips controll the heat ) is a bang bang hard on hard off station . its a tad more crude but still usses the idea of over volt to make it recover faster .
Good idea BUT
What good is a 12V xupply to a 120 V iron ,,,,,,,
If you use the 360 Ohms I derived . you get .033333 Amps and that X 12 V gets ya .4 watts !!!!!!!!!!!!!! Its R ^2 at its best
He would need to use a 12V I iron to make this work..
remember Watts are Drawn not Pushed .....
Volts are presented and thus with a path Current is Drawn and Watts are Drawn .....
If you put it like that the sky's the limit. However your threads title does ask "...is this a practical idea?"
In fact here is a Idea !!!!
Stick RFID tages on the solder you use and a reader on the iron controller box .
have the o iron remmeber Temp presets for the solder you use ... Lead RoHS and Lets say Indum .
and smaller solderrs are used with SMT so the Iron knows to ramp down for those flat paks .
Put a G sensor in it so that it will shut off if not used ....
BIG ONE ! have a 0 ohm 1 Meg and Open switch so that yu can float the iron for those pesky Live jobs ..
@Heater, Ok Ok that was a bit impractical I admit it
If I had My way I would take a 888 base and a 951s handle . I REALLY love those heater tips ! . and at 9 USD per tip you are not paying too much for the advantage fof a 2 in one combo ..... I mean tips last months here cose to a year .
Just be carul in those laptop SMPS's they may not Like to be switched while running ... it may Gltch the Resistive devider and the feedback loop in the brick ... Be better off just PWMing a external Mosfet with a Micon and set the SMPS brick to 24V mode .
BTW the G3/4 series Macs used 24V so Hint HInt they are a good place to get 24V DC bricks on the cheap .
They even sell the same iron today! Expensive, but with payback time over 30 years, it's not bad.
Didn't want to kill the forum iron innovation, just needed to share this.
Erlend