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Corel Draw to Gerber Converter — Parallax Forums

Corel Draw to Gerber Converter

John BoardJohn Board Posts: 371
edited 2012-08-31 00:28 in General Discussion
G'day,

I've gotten back from State Titles of RoboCup, and was chosen to represent the state with my robot at Nationals. I am currently designing a PCB Board Schematic in Corel Draw to be routed out using a CNC router. The router's file format requirement is "Gerber", and I am wondering if anyone knows how to convert a Corel Draw "drawing" into a Gerber file.

Thanks,

John

Comments

  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2012-08-27 17:09
    Oh, goodness, John! You're doing things the hard way! CorelDraw is a great program -- I use it myself -- but it's totally ill-suited for creating PCB artwork. Why not download one of the many free PCB CAD programs that generate Gerber files as a matter of course?

    -Phil
  • John BoardJohn Board Posts: 371
    edited 2012-08-27 17:12
    Well, to be honest, I have played around with EAGLE, and I don't like it as much as using Corel - I've been using it for much longer... half my life. I'm seeing if I can find some way to convert Corel to something eagle will open, if not, I guess I'll have to use EAGLE.
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2012-08-27 17:22
    You definitely don't have to use EAGLE. That program sucks, IMO. Do a Google search for free pcb cad. Even if you could export the traces from CorelDraw to Gerber, that still doesn't solve the problem of creating an NCD drill file.

    -Phil
  • WBA ConsultingWBA Consulting Posts: 2,935
    edited 2012-08-27 17:25
    CorelDraw will make it tough to get gerber as an output file, but it is not impossible. In DipTrace, you can import graphics and then export them within gerber. So, if you have a graphic that is your board design, you can bring it in to DipTrace. When you export your design, it will convert the graphic into RS274X (gerber format) which will get you the desired result, albeit the long way around......
  • John BoardJohn Board Posts: 371
    edited 2012-08-27 17:33
    Although it may be the long way around, I don't mind the effort, at the moment I feel like strangling EAGLE, if I could...

    Thanks for the response!

    -John
  • John BoardJohn Board Posts: 371
    edited 2012-08-27 17:46
    Quick question, what is an NCD file?
  • Duane C. JohnsonDuane C. Johnson Posts: 955
    edited 2012-08-27 18:12
    NC Drill. Numerical Control Drill, is kind of like a Gerber file but for drills.

    Excellon_format drill files are quite popular, and there are others.
    While technically Gerber can be used the drill formats have features not in Gerber specifically for drilling.

    Duane J
  • John BoardJohn Board Posts: 371
    edited 2012-08-27 18:44
    Is it a necesity? Or could I manually drill it out using our drop-drill?

    -John
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2012-08-27 18:50
    John,

    For heavens sake! If you're going to have boards fabricated at a board house, you don't want to do the drilling yourself -- especially with two-sided boards. Suck it up, forget CorelDraw, and use a proper PCB CAD program! Sheesh!

    -Phil
  • John BoardJohn Board Posts: 371
    edited 2012-08-27 19:01
    Sorry, but I don't have (1) Time (2) Resources to get it done at a proper PCB manufacturing house, I'm needing to use my local uni's CNC router. The thing is, I'm (1) Moving house, (2) Trying to get a robot ready for National Titles, (3) Having to attend another event all within the space of 2 weeks, I really need a solution, and quickly. The board is being designed so it isn't double sidded.

    -John
  • John BoardJohn Board Posts: 371
    edited 2012-08-27 19:07
    I'm liking DipTrace, when I get the time to explore it, I definatly will.
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,183
    edited 2012-08-27 19:18
    John Board wrote: »
    Sorry, but I don't have (1) Time (2) Resources to get it done at a proper PCB manufacturing house, I'm needing to use my local uni's CNC router. The thing is, I'm (1) Moving house, (2) Trying to get a robot ready for National Titles, (3) Having to attend another event all within the space of 2 weeks, I really need a solution, and quickly. The board is being designed so it isn't double sidded.

    -John

    Normally, PCBs are fastest made using Film imaging, and Photo sensistised laminate.
    You can get commercial filmwork via Postscript files, so do not need Gerber.

    If you want to use a CNC router to remove copper, full copper removal is very slow, but you maybe able to google Vinyl Cutter/Plotter support.

    That is an outline based plot, and Corel Draw is widely used in that industry.
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2012-08-27 19:32
    John Baord wrote:
    I'm needing to use my local uni's CNC router.
    That would have been helpful info to provide from the get-go. I hope the router is one that's especially designed for engraving PCBs. I suppose you could export or print your design as a PDF and use this tool:

    I've never used it, so I can't say how well it works.

    -Phil
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2012-08-27 19:38
    jmg wrote:
    ...but you maybe able to google Vinyl Cutter/Plotter support. That is an outline based plot, and Corel Draw is widely used in that industry.
    Lines in CorelDraw are strokes with width; they are not outlined polygons. I have a vinyl cutter and use CorelDraw, and I know from experience that unless all traces are done as polygons, then "welded" together with all the pads -- a ridiculous way to go about it, BTW -- you do not get an "outline-based plot."

    -Phil
  • Oldbitcollector (Jeff)Oldbitcollector (Jeff) Posts: 8,091
    edited 2012-08-27 21:21
    Another vote for learning Diptrace. It isn't that bad. I committed to six months of learning it and now getting good results.

    If I can do it, anyone can do it.

    Jeff
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,183
    edited 2012-08-27 21:41
    Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) wrote: »
    Lines in CorelDraw are strokes with width; they are not outlined polygons. I have a vinyl cutter and use CorelDraw, and I know from experience that unless all traces are done as polygons, then "welded" together with all the pads -- a ridiculous way to go about it, BTW -- you do not get an "outline-based plot."

    Ridiculous to you and me, perhaps, but the OP sounds like he knows Corel well, and already has a (simple?) design almost done.
    So he could try a 'weld' operation and a outline plot, and see what the time cost is , and what the issues are ?

    If the "local uni's CNC router" can accept plot files as a path, that may be good enough ?

    I found comments about the 'weld' command earlier on google, but less luck on tool width(pencil?) compensation, since if you wanted to push this, the cutter width would need to be taken into account when creating the path polylines.
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2012-08-27 22:18
    jmg wrote:
    So he could try a 'weld' operation and a outline plot, and see what the time cost is , and what the issues are ?
    A weld operation has to occur between two closed curves. If traces are drawn as thick lines instead of closed polygons, they won't be able to be welded to the pads. Drawing the traces as closed polygons is what I referred to as "ridiculous"; at best it would be frustratingly tedious. One could conceivably convert the drawing to a bitmap and use a trace program to create the outline path, but such programs seldom produce clean results, since they are unable to infer the difference between smooth nodes and those that are intended to be corners.

    I think the best strategy is to export the drawing to a standard format such as PDF or HPGL and find a program that can convert that to Gerber, from which the university's software can convert to the necessary engraving outlines.

    But, in the long run, I do hope that John gets up to speed with a bona fide PCB CAD program, since it will boost his productivity over Corel enormously.

    -Phil
  • John BoardJohn Board Posts: 371
    edited 2012-08-27 22:26
    G'day,

    Thanks for the responses,

    Here is a link to my starting schematics (so, if there are flaws, please tell me, but keep in mind that it isn't complete).

    PDF: https://docs.google.com/open?id=0BwUSzZIPH0AiQTlzYmNiVEU5Qlk
    CDR: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BwUSzZIPH0AieHFSbm9ranVXTHM/edit

    Also if you could say if my design has any issues or not, i.e. tracks are too close together. This is the first time that I have really made any PCB boards, so I want any advice I can get,

    -John
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2012-08-27 22:33
    John, it's impossible to say whether the design has issues. You will need to check with your university's fab department to find out what their design rules are. These are typically given in terms of minimum trace width and minimum spacing. For photo-etched boards, an 8-mil width and 8-mil space is adequate to ensure a quality product. But mechanically-engraved boards may have different rules.

    One of the advantages of a good PCB CAD system is that it will do a design-rule check for you automatically and point out where traces are either too thin or too close.

    -Phil
  • John BoardJohn Board Posts: 371
    edited 2012-08-27 22:42
    I now condede that using DipTrace could be of use - I'm probably going to do it that way ;)
  • max72max72 Posts: 1,155
    edited 2012-08-27 23:37
    Go with diptrace!
    I prefer Diptrace, but you could check also other free solutions, like the combo tinycad+freepcb or kicad.
    And don't forget to ask around is some of your friends has experience in any of the above mentioned, this will speed you up so much.
    For Diptrace there are video tutorials on the website, or the tutorials here: http://gadgetgangster.com/tutorials.html
    Moreover many boards on gadget gangster's site and on parallax site have the diptrace files available. You can grab working footprints, and learn a lot...

    Massimo
  • LoopyBytelooseLoopyByteloose Posts: 12,537
    edited 2012-08-28 04:55
    IMHO, Eagle is just fine and it does generate a commercially useful set of files - including Gerber files, drill files, and so on. The best thing about it is that it is free. The second best is they support a rather large FTP server library of addon files for items such as the BasicStamps and the Propeller.

    I have used it to commercially order boards in small production runs of 25 and the outcome was perfect.

    Linux is likely to have some support of utility files for Gerber, but I doubt you will find a converter for Corel Draw. Cenon.app just might work if your Corel Draw will output a format that it accepts for conversion.
  • WBA ConsultingWBA Consulting Posts: 2,935
    edited 2012-08-28 09:15
    I would definitely recommend DipTrace as the way to create the board without doing any conversion of your Corel file. You can insert what you have done as a picture to use as a reference while creating the board in DipTrace. DipTrace is very easy to learn and I bet you could recreate your board in a couple hours as a new DipTrace user. I have done a few basic designs in DipTrace and I could probably re-make your board in ~20 minutes.

    Out of curiosity, I took the PDF of your board, captured a BMP from it, inserted it into DipTrace, scaled it to proper size, exported it back out as gerber, loaded it into GC-Prevue, and then captured it as a JPEG. It works ok for most of it, but you can see how the graphic to gerber conversion ability is limited in DipTrace because any fine details should be done using DipTrace's native tools. Your smaller traces are bleeding together and your notched corners are still an issue. The BMP-to-gerber image is how it looks in GCPrevue, the JPEG-file image is my capture from the PDF. TopAssy.gbr is the actual gerber output file. Took me about 5 minutes to do all that.
    JohnBoard_BMP-to-gerber.jpg
    984 x 646 - 88K
    JohnBoard_jpeg-file.jpg
    926 x 633 - 98K
    gbr
    gbr
    TopAssy.gbr
    278K
  • max72max72 Posts: 1,155
    edited 2012-08-31 00:28
    I just discovered Diptrace can import dxf. You can do a layer by layer relationship.
    So far I tested holes and silkscreen, and it looks pretty good.
    Probably if you add a plane with the CNC clearance/tool size you can speed up machining.

    Massimo
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