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VIA Hops on the Low Cost PC Bandwagon with a $49 APC Android System — Parallax Forums

VIA Hops on the Low Cost PC Bandwagon with a $49 APC Android System

Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
edited 2012-11-05 22:56 in General Discussion
[h=1]VIA Hops on the Low Cost PC Bandwagon with a $49 APC Android System[/h]Tuesday, May 22, 2012 - by Paul Lilly
The vibe Silicon Valley must be getting from the masses is that low cost, pint-sizedPCs are the wave of the future, hence why we're seeing so many of them recently. The most popular of the bunch right now is the Raspberry Pi PC, but lo and behold, VIA is jumping in the ring with a $49 APC Android PC.

"APC brings the familiarity and convenience of Android to the PC at a US$49 price point that will open up exciting new markets and applications," said Richard Brown, VP of Marketing, VIA Technologies, Inc. "Like a bicycle for your mind, APC will enable more people than ever before to explore the vast online universe."



http://hothardware.com/News/VIA-Hops-on-the-Low-Cost-PC-Bandwagon-with-a-49-APC-Android-System/


http://apc.io/about/


:cool:
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Comments

  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2012-05-22 21:38
    "Bicycle for the mind"
    Hmm...it gets you there, slowly, and you are exhausted when you arrive. At least it has a low power consumption and small size compared to the current cadilacs for the mind.
    Sometimes I think I'm done with the "vast online universe".

    Anyway, it's a great looking board, a good price, and small.

    All it needs is a real OS and a means of hooking up the Propellers.

    It's yet another item on my wish list.
  • Martin_HMartin_H Posts: 4,051
    edited 2012-05-23 04:48
    VIA has been making low cost low power consumption systems for years, but they're x86 based not ARM. I followed the link and this looks like a repackaged board in a smaller form factor. You should be able to run an off the shelf Linux distribution on this board. Although drivers for VIA's graphics chip set are often not available which can be a pain.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2012-05-23 04:58
    Martin_H,
    ...this looks like a repackaged board in a smaller form factor...


    Not sure I follow you, it's ARM instead of x86, half the size of their normal standard and so a totally new board layout.

    What is it repackaged from?

    Edit: Scratch the above. Seems it may actually be an x86 board and not ARM. Which is good because now it has fallen off of my wish list:)

    Edit edit: Scratch the edit, turns out it is an ARM processor from WonderMedia.
    Damn, it's back on my wish list...

    So Martin the question still stands.
  • Martin_HMartin_H Posts: 4,051
    edited 2012-05-23 06:07
    Heater, full specs are hard to come by, but two things on the product page gave me this impression.

    * The CPU is a VIA 800MHz processor which sounds like their existing C3 chip. I could be wrong though.

    * The software says Android 2.3 (PC System) which sounds like the x86 Gingerbread port.

    Also the board looks like some of their existing mini-ITX stuff with the PCI and memory slot side of the board removed.

    Update: Mini-ITX news and the PC World blog both say it is the Wonder Media processor which is ARM based. So that leaves me wondering about the OS description.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2012-05-23 07:34
    Yep, that home page at apc.io is particularly useless w.r.t. specs.

    But this news release http://www.guru3d.com/news/via-apc-is-a-49-android-pc-/ says "Powered by a WonderMedia ARM processor" as do a few others.

    Makes sense really, an Android machine using x86 would not be much use for all those Android apps that make use of native code. Also I'm sure x86 power consumption would be higher.

    And here is a video of it working https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96Gfo6V9zxE

    That half size ITX form factor is a lot bigger than a Pi or my ISEE IGEP board.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2012-05-23 13:19
    Here's a good description:

    http://www.eetimes.com/electronics-blogs/other/4373638/A-peek-at-Via-Tech-s--49-Android-PC?cid=NL_EETimesDaily

    It's an ARM11 like the Raspi, which is a pity. There are better ARM cores.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2012-05-23 13:42
    Just what I'm looking for for a project that needs 100's of such units as cheap as possible. Except:
    I need smaller, cigarette packet size.
    I need a temp spec. down to -40C
    I can do without HDMI, VGA, AUDIO.
    Better if it has a RS232/485 port and Ethernet.
    Better if it runs a standard Debian or such.

    So far the best I have come up with is the IGEP v2 board from ISEE. But that's up at 188 Euro.
    Smaller, cheaper ARM boards often don't have enough speed for this particular application which is a bit floating point intensive.
    Anyone got any other suggestions?
  • LawsonLawson Posts: 870
    edited 2012-05-23 13:56
    Anyone else notice the socketed BIOS chip on the VIA board? So what's the part number of that (I assume) cheap socket for SOIC-8 parts?

    Lawson
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2012-05-23 14:14
    Heater,

    The $89 BeagleBone might be suitable.
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2012-05-23 14:40
    BeagleBone looks good. Can't find a temp spec. and it seems to be as hard to get as a Raspberry Pi.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2012-05-23 15:47
    I got one when it was announced. I think it is intended for the normal commercial temp range, so might not be suitable for your application.
  • TubularTubular Posts: 4,706
    edited 2012-05-23 18:08
    What I like about this is it goes into a standard PC case, with standard motherboard mounts (at least a subset of them).

    So, lets to a prop version that fits in old (or new) ATX PC cases

    Anyone know sources of stacking connections like used on many motherboards? I'm aware 4ucon has some. I think Foxconn used to manufacture some. Kycon? Anyone know any sources?
  • prof_brainoprof_braino Posts: 4,313
    edited 2012-05-24 07:51
    Heater. wrote: »
    Except:
    I need smaller, cigarette packet size.
    ....
    Anyone got any other suggestions?

    Get larger cigarettes

    Well, you didn't say GOOD suggestions
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2012-05-24 08:03
    Braino,

    Ouch...I already smoke far to much.
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2012-05-24 12:51
    @Heater.
    re:I need smaller, cigarette packet size.

    FXI Cotton Candy
    The Cotton Candy is a USB stick sized compute device allows users a single, secure point of access to all personal cloud services and apps through their favorite operating system, while delivering a consistent experience on any screen. The device will serve as a companion to smartphones, tablets, and notebook PC and Macs, as well add smart capabilities to existing displays, TVs, set top boxes and other media that supports USB mass storage. Download

    http://www.fxitech.com/products/
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,183
    edited 2012-05-25 04:37
    Lawson wrote: »
    Anyone else notice the socketed BIOS chip on the VIA board?

    Yes - interesting looking part, but I'd expect only on prototypes, surely ?
    If they have a protected area for boot loader-reflash of new BIOS, the easiest way to make late changes to that is using a socket ?
  • ForrestForrest Posts: 1,341
    edited 2012-05-26 18:24
    Regarding FXI, the company who makes the Cotton Candy - I don't know what to make of this press release from their website

    'TRONDHEIM, Norway – April 27, 2012, FXI announced today it is the recipient of the Red Herring Top 100 award. Given in recognition of leading private companies from Europe, the Top 100 celebrates technology innovations across their respective industries.'

    The words Red Herring doesn't instill confidence about this company. It ranks right up there with vaporware ;)
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2012-06-11 16:14
    Got this message today:" We are now accepting pre-orders and anticipate APC will ship early July, 2012."

    I ordered two boards.(the pre-order limit) The shipping and handling for one board is almost the cost of the board but averages out on two or more boards.

    $49.00 USD 2 $98.00 USD
    Subtotal $98.00 USD
    Shipping and handling $43.00 USD
    Total $141.00 USD
    :cool:






















  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2012-06-12 01:46
    Damn. I got that notification last night and was to tired to pursue it. This morning they are all sold out.

    From the order page:
    APC Pre-ordersLast night at 10:30pmTaiwantime (GMT+8) we began to accept pre-orders of APC. Those who had registered to be notified were given the first opportunity to place orders, which were limited to a maximum of 2 units. Due to the staggering demand we sold out in just a few hours

    It's Rasberry PI syndrome all over again!!


  • TonyDTonyD Posts: 210
    edited 2012-06-12 03:07
    Heater. wrote: »
    Damn. I got that notification last night and was to tired to pursue it. This morning they are all sold out.

    From the order page:

    It's Rasberry PI syndrome all over again!!


    [/FONT][/COLOR]

    The same thing happen to me. Got the pre-order notification only to find them sold out. Deja Vu
  • JLockeJLocke Posts: 354
    edited 2012-06-12 03:39
    I read the notification and went to the site. It appeared that they were still accepting orders at that time. I was going to order one, but saw the $38 shipping cost (for a $49 board) and decided to hold off a while.
  • RDL2004RDL2004 Posts: 2,554
    edited 2012-06-12 05:53
    Really. There is no way anyone could justify shipping and handling charges that high on such a small item. It's just a cheap tactic that allows them to advertise a low selling price. It's actually a $79 board. Also, did anybody notice it only comes with a 30 day warranty?
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2012-07-27 20:05
    re: I was going to order one, but saw the $38 shipping cost (for a $49 board) and decided to hold off a while.

    I ordered 2 boards to keep the shipping cost per board down. LOL

    My board was shipped a few days ago :cool:

    I don't see any GPIO pins but hopefully I can find a way to communicate with it and a Prop Chip.
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2012-07-27 20:07
    http://us5.campaign-archive2.com/?u=502910cc28cb186a9e829f748&id=d9ec6fd54e&e=30daf5b511

    [h=3]APC ROM, Kernel and Bootloader Available for Public Download[/h] We are pleased to announce that the APC ROM, kernel and bootloader are now available for download at http://apc.io/library. Our efforts are focused on creating the most stable and user friendly Android experience for APC and with this release we are aiming to provide developers with the tools you need to begin creating new and exciting apps for our Android environment. At the same time we understand the desire and passion that exists from the hacker and developer communities and we want to allow you the freedom to experiment with installing other distributions to match your needs.
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,183
    edited 2012-07-27 20:42
    I see the FAQ says this

    Q:Are there any GPIO, SPI, or UART connections on the board?
    A:There are none at this point in time.

    which rather limits what you can do with this.... you would need a USB-Serial adapter to get out into the real world..
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2012-07-28 03:43
    I got that annoncement as well so I checked again. Still cannot order one.
    Still can't figure out if Debian can be installed on it.
    The lack of GPIO and UART makes it a lot less attractive.
    It's quite a big board.

    So just now I have enough to consume my time with the raspi which already has a huge following and hence great community support which is pretty vital when you are constantly running into little problems on an unfamiliar platform.
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,183
    edited 2012-07-28 22:42
    Heater. wrote: »
    The lack of GPIO and UART makes it a lot less attractive.
    It's quite a big board.

    Yes, it is a big board.
    They could have sensibly done an install-option for something like this newly announced NCT6106D IO device from Nuvoton ?

    http://www.nuvoton.com/NuvotonMOSS/Community/ProductInfo.aspx?tp_GUID=e56fbc0d-7c2e-4c66-a3f6-b7e9c1954cef

    ["NCT6106D provides 6 full-function UART, and each UART supports up to 128-byte FIFO, 9-bit mode, RS-485 auto flow control and optional 14.7456MHz external clock input for UART baud rate setting.
    - also has SMbus and Parallel port options....
    "]

    Someone buying a bare board, is not a retail customer, but Via seem to have overlooked this.

    Perhaps on the next release ?

    Google did find a nice Higher-end Industrial box using that new Nuvoton part
    http://cfnewsads.thomasnet.com/pnn-pdf/607241.pdf
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2012-07-29 06:40
    @Heater.

    re :Still can't figure out if Debian can be installed on it.

    A thread has been started on the APC forum Q:Are there any GPIO, SPI, or UART connections on the board?
    A:There are none at this point in time.

    which rather limits what you can do with this.... you would need a USB-Serial adapter to get out into the real world..


    I did see that but hopefully I can use Bluetooth to communicate with the prop. Also, I did see a USART jumper on the board but I'm not sure if that's something that I can tap into.
  • Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL)Bob Lawrence (VE1RLL) Posts: 1,720
    edited 2012-07-31 19:28
    It's here and I'm using it for this post. I had a lot of crashes with the stock Browser (mostly while typing) so I Downloaded
    the free Dolphin Browser and it's been great for the past few hours. Xmas in July LOL
  • Heater.Heater. Posts: 21,230
    edited 2012-11-02 02:40
    Seems the APC is now more generally available. Like the Raspberry Pi it's available in Europe from RS-Online.
    http://us5.campaign-archive1.com/?u=502910cc28cb186a9e829f748&id=0fa0ddfc30&e=5c55628547

    I'm not tempted to jump in in a hurry as I only just got my Raspberry Pi from RS five months after ordering it! Farnel were much quicker in that case.

    The good news is that there is a version of the Raspberry Pi Raspian Linux fro the APC under development.
    http://apc.io/blog/2012/09/14/raspbian-apricot-bootable-image-for-apc-available/

    The bad news is that I have yet to see how easily we can hook it up to the Prop or other real world gadgets.
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