Looking for suggestions pertaining to a UHF/VHF antenna

idbruce

Hello Everyone

One of my lastest goals is to reduce reoccuring costs. Considering the cost of Dish Network, DirectTV, and cable, I have decided to hook up an antenna to my TV to pick up local broadcasts, and I have also decided to hook up my computer to the TV and subscribe to Netflix for $8 a month to obtain some decent movies.

Considering the advances in modern technology, I was wondering if anyone had some good suggestions for a UHF/VHF antenna. I currently have a fairly nice antenna stashed away from years ago, but it is one of those big and bulky aluminum antennas. In the past, I had this antenna just laying in the attic to avoid defacing the house by mounting it to the brickwork or rooftop, however I would now like to eliminate this from the attic and go with something a little more modern and with a much smaller footprint. I currently have a DirectTV satelite dish mounted to the balcony and although I did not like it at first, I have come to accept it. If I could find an antenna that has great reception to replace DirectTVs satelite dish, I would seriously consider buying a new antenna.

Any suggestions?

Bruce

Mike Green

You don't need the bulky VHF part ... all local broadcasts are in the UHF portion of the old TV spectrum. What's marketed as a "digital TV antenna" is just a UHF antenna. That's the good news. The bad news is that you really do need a better signal than with analog UHF TV ... not hugely so, but you're probably going to need some amplification where you may not have needed it before. You'll need to use quality cable if your antenna is any significant distance from your TV. Pay attention to where the transmitters are located. A good antenna is directional. If the transmitters you want are located in different directions, you may need multiple antennas. What you will need depends a lot on your situation. I've used simple amplified antennas from RadioShack, but I'm in a city ... transmitters in slightly different directions from where I'm located. Some stations come in well and some don't unless you turn the antenna. On the other hand, one TV is on the 2nd floor and it's easy to reach up to the top of a bookshelf and turn the little table-top antenna I use.

Martin_H

With digital TV you either get great reception or unusable reception. A better antenna with directional sensitivity extends range, but ultimately you are limited by stations being over the horizon. Antenna web (http://www.antennaweb.org/) has a list of stations and can tell you what range you can expect with different sorts of antennas.

Since we live ten miles from the tower we get great reception with a set of amplified rabbit ears. Things only go to pot when there's a lot of rain or snow. Then the signal is strong, but the multipath distortion renders the signal intermittently useless.

With all the ham enthusiasts in this forum I'm hoping to hear some creative reception improvement schemes. Preferably something involving Moon bounce and reception of signals the South Pole.

Don M

Mike Green wrote: »

You don't need the bulky VHF part ... all local broadcasts are in the UHF portion of the old TV spectrum...

Mike- not completely true. In my area there are VHF digital stations along with the UHF ones. Bruce will need to refer to the website from Martin as a good reference to see what bands (UHF / VHF) are used in his area.

This is my area of expertise. Having spent the majority of my adult life owning and operating a tv and appliance store for 25 years plus growing up being involved in the one that my father owned. I can't begin to tell you the number of tv antennas I have installed and or repaired through those years. Plus I was involved from the very beginning of satellite tv starting with the Winegard 10' square fiberglass antenna with an Alliance tv rotor used for odd/even polarity selection along with a hand crank to move the dish antenna. As the industry matured I also was involved with DirecTV and DISH Network when they first became available. I had already been selling Echosphere equipment so the transition to DISH was inevitable.

All the years I sold small satellite systems we were always "competing" with cable. The ONLY reason I would switch anyone from cable to a small dish was if there were specific programs that they felt they needed to have. As far as cost comparison, in the long run the small dish was more expensive. As a customer you were required to maintain your own system (lightning was a major culprit) and you still needed an antenna if you wanted to watch your local channels. For those that had multiple tv's this became even more of a nightmare for families that needed the ability to watch more than one satellite channel at a time. Plus the installation nightmares in some homes in particular with the phone hookup for those that had multiple receivers (required) or if they wanted the ability to purchase PPV movies. In the end I would tell customers that cable was really their best choice as it allowed for easy multiple tv connections (splitter) and they took care of all maintenance. Obviously people outside the reach of cable had no choice.

Regarding the tv antenna selection, again refer to the website Martin listed to get an idea of what direction and how far away your stations are. You may need a rotor. In my area the channels are basically in 2 different directions but only about 45 degrees apart and approximately 40 - 60 miles away. I use a small UHF/VHF combo antenna and most importantly I use a Channel Master preamp. If amplification is needed than I would recommend a preamp hands down as compared to any other amplifier. The preamp amplifies the signal closest to the source thereby reducing noise (increases S/N). I also use a good grade of Belden RG-6 coax. I have my antenna aimed in between the 2 directions that my stations come from and it alleviates my need for a rotor. Every situation is different. Foliage, buildings etc. also play an important part in determining your needs. The larger / longer your antenna the more narrow the beam of reception thus the higher the gain.

If you need any help or tips let me know. I used to love doing antenna work. Rohn tv towers were my favorite. The tallest I ever put up was 70 feet. Made special mounts to install small dishes on the sides of them. I even installed a C band dish on one once.

Those were the days you could make a good living until the small dishes came about but that is a story for another day.....

PJAllen

http://makeprojects.com/Project/Homemade-Yagi-Antenna/623/1

http://www.grantronics.com.au/docs/StkYagis.pdf

http://www.ehow.com/how_4479506_make-yagi-antenna.html

ElectricAye

Martin_H wrote: »

... I'm hoping to hear some creative reception improvement schemes. Preferably something involving Moon bounce....

Moon bounces are an excellent idea. I live in an area where zoning codes prevent the installation of radio telescopes, etc. but Moon Bounces are permitted. I've used my Disney Princess moon bounce to house my VLF antennae and to monitor communications and conversations throughout the neighborhood. Works like a charm except in high winds. The helium option provides even better reception, especially when you want to monitor thunderstorms on Jupiter. Neighbors, however, can't understand why I never allow my grand kids to play on or around it.

Ron Czapala

Mike Green wrote: »

You don't need the bulky VHF part ... all local broadcasts are in the UHF portion of the old TV spectrum.

@Mike,
Actually some stations elected to broadcast in the VHF frequencies. The site Martin_H mentioned lets you enter your zip code to see local station info: http://www.antennaweb.org/

I got a DB2 antenna from http://www.antennasdirect.com/store/outdoor.html and it does a good job but Louisville does have a VHF station and the DB2 antenna doesn't do quite as well for that station...

ctwardell

Bruce,

I did the same thing you are looking at about a year ago, cut the cable, and just watch the broadcast channels.

We live about 20 miles from Columbus, OH and I get a good signal on all the Columbus stations using one of the small flat "Digital" antenna models that has a built in amplifier that I bought a Wally World for $29.95.

There a both VHF and UHF stations that we receive, the major networks are all on VHF, with PBS and a few other stations being UHF.

I hung in from a nail in the attic, the power injector for the amp is located at the TV.

I've saved over $1000 so far.

C.W.

idbruce

I am always amazed when I think a thread will only gather slight attention, but when I come back a few hours later, it is filled with responses.

Thanks guys, I really appreciate the input.

With the exception of one local station, all the channels come straight out of Chicago which is fairly due West. Before going to "DISH", I had a rotor for the antenna in the attic, but have since disassembled it for gearing, motor, etc.... DOH

The only time that I really needed to adjust the antenna was to get good reception on the local channel and perhaps a few VHF stations.

I still have RG59 running from behind the TV to the antenna in the attic, where it goes it an adapter for the antenna, and then attaches. However, like I was saying, I would like something low profile to mount to the balcony, and I was planning on just using the heavy duty cable installed for the dish. Perhaps I might be better off just keeping the old an antenna, mounting it to the back of the garage, fabricate a rotor from one of beloved stepper motors, and get a preamp like Don suggests.

I will definitely research the links and all information provided here.

Thanks a lot guys.

Bruce

RDL2004

I was checking into this myself not too long ago. Just Google search on "DIY HDTV antenna", There's actually some that look pretty decent that are made from really cheap stuff (like coat hangers), and there are a few how-to videos on YouTube.

idbruce

I just visited the link that Martin_H suggested and it appears that all channels except one went to UHF like Mike hinted, and I can live without that channel. Pretty much all of them are at either 322 or 324 degrees, but they do recommend a rooftop mount with a preamp. Making holes in a perfectly good roof just doesn't make sense to me , so perhaps the attic is the best place for it, but I will do more research to find a good setup.

Thanks again guys.

Bruce

@C.W.

I've saved over $1000 so far.

Local broadcasts and Netflix sounds good to me. Money is just too hard to come by to spend it frivilously.

bill190

I got rid of paid TV years ago. They kept increasing their prices every year and it was getting to be ridiculous for something I seldom use (I prefer to read books). I was having to pay for a lot of stupid TV when I only watched a couple of "intelligent" channels. They did not offer

KMyers

My suggestion would be to use a good quality quad shield RG6 coax with snap&seal style connectors. NOT the twist on ones that the shack sells. The crimp connectors can if not properly installed can cause problems on digital signals.

For UHF I would look at perhaps a chimney mount system. A rotor could also help. Of course your mileage might vary depending on location. UHF dont work well in the mountains like I live. BTW I was an engineer in several cable systems during my work career.....

Mark_T

If you know the frequencies of all the stations/channels you want you can tailor the antenna design to the wavelength and bandwidth - you also need to know the polarisation(s) too.

Yagi antenna design applets and programs shouldn't be too hard to find I'd have thought...

Ron Czapala

I've been thinking about dropping cable TV as well. I watch local channels about 95% of the time.
I tried out my DB antenna this afternoon and I get a great picture even on the VHF channel.
All of my local station antennas are about 16-17 miles away.

My biggest concern is losing DVR capabilities - I REALLY enjoy being able to record two shows at the same time and watch them later.

I used to have a TIVO so I may go that route again - two of the models have dual tuners.

ChannelMaster also has a DVR which has antenna two tuners.

idbruce

@Mark_T

If you know the frequencies of all the stations/channels you want you can tailor the antenna design to the wavelength and bandwidth - you also need to know the polarisation(s) too.

I believe they give the frequencies on that page that Martin linked to and I believe that sounds like a very cool idea. A tuned antenna I like it.

Bruce

NR1X

try these, scale em for your frequency. You may even get away with something close as your not trying to transmit. I built 2 of them 11 elements each for 432mhz ham use and noticed considerable gain and front to back was really good.

http://www.fredspinner.com/W0FMS/CheapYagi/vjbcy.html