@ctwardell - I agree, I share my stuff in the hopes that someone else finds it useful and improves on it. Not that I have a say, but I'm perfectly happy with clones, copies, and improvements.
@Sapieha - It might be worth defining what licenses are permissible. I would suggest GPL, MIT, CC-BY and CC-BY-SA, but that's up to Jeff.
The issue is that you seem to be trying to allay some people's fears about open source by saying this is a small community and we won't make use of the right's granted by making it open source.
There is Open Source, and there is what I perceive of the community here. The contest IS Open Source, giving anyone the rights thereof. I'm willing to bet on the gold quality of this community to support anyone's efforts every single time.
The contest IS Open Source, giving anyone the rights thereof. I'm willing to bet on the gold quality of this community to support anyone's efforts every single time.
OBC
So you just said, it IS open source, but anyone making use of that license to it's full extent is not of "gold quality".
That is so inconsistent.
My intent is not to argue with you, I've said all I'm going to say on the matter.
1) If you enter, you are providing information for the betterment of the community and that people must be able to use that information however they please. They are free to create commercial products using it if they want (even a direct copy).
2) Given the community here and the size of the market, it is unlikely that somebody will market a version of your stuff. Especially unlikely if you market it yourself. He seems to think we are mostly "nice" people - which I agree with.
3) If you don't like the conditions, no one is forcing you to enter. The prizes are nice, but if you are selling commercial products the odds are you are making enough to purchase those prizes if you really want them. This may not be true, but it is likely.
I have no problem with giving away my work (in some cases). I have posted complete files, drawings, etc. on this forum to allow people to reproduce some of my work. Of course, based on the incredibly small amount of interest people have exhibited in my threads (based on number of posts) I don't think I would have much to worry about anyway.
I think the important thing to come away with is that if you are uncomfortable providing enough information for other people to (commercially) reproduce your work, don't enter.
The community which you so love would be far better off if you allow anyone to participate on terms that each contributor can enjoy. The current alternative does not appear to be working out very good at this point.
To me, a schematic image and software should be enough for a hobbyist to produce their own working version to enjoy as they will. If someone want's to take that to market, it is "their effort" in producing a functional copy that will be rewarded.
Are you saying that you have a project which you would be willing to share a schematic and software for, but only if you can win a prize? Nothing is preventing anybody from contributing to the community in whatever capacity they feel comfortable with.
You are one of the people I already see sharing a lot of your work with the rest of us (although not necessarily to the extent OBC is requesting). Will this contest change what you do?
I see the contest as a request for people to share at the same level that Gadget Gangster (one of the sponsors) is sharing. Nothing more than that.
You are one of the people I already see sharing a lot of your work with the rest of us (although not necessarily to the extent OBC is requesting). Will this contest change what you do?
I appreciate that observation. I've hung around here for the last 3 years doing what I do. I don't expect that to change much (except that my wife really wants me to do more housework and build a shed for all my junk and maybe sleep there LOL).
I would like the PropTouch to be an open project to the extent that the design can be used and be improved on by anyone; I would appreciate your mechanical acumen on the enclosure effort. I'll provide a schematic and software for anyone to use later and produce motherboards for reasonable prices if someone wants that. The problem with PropTouch is it's cost of goods especially with that beautiful 320x480 touchscreen LCD and the Propeller Platform compatible headers. Producing full designs take time and lots of effort and that is very close to being done, but no one is interested at a full or partial assembly price. Producing boards is easy except for the cost of respin when errors are found - there is a respin that must happen with that.
When I have more time in June I'll post more software for things I'm doing such as drivers for running software from SpinSocket-Flash and GameBaby when that's ready. I'll post any code tricks that I encounter along the way like in the SweetSpot INA to HUB thread. I've been working with David to get a version of XBASIC working on boards that provide up to 4MB of 10 pin interface fast access Flash memory. I'm trying desperately to finish that driver today.
Are you saying that you have a project which you would be willing to share a schematic and software for, but only if you can win a prize?
No. Not at all. I'm happy to share things I do the way that I do. Obviously I'm not trying to win a contest ... otherwise I might be more a** kissy to the orgranizer(s). A contest is a competition though
I would participate and offer help to other participants in a contest if I wasn't forced to give up my dignity and my rights. The forum and this hobby are things I honestly enjoy and I really would like to see grow, but i'm not going to totally w**re myself for it.
Whoa! Sorry to start such a big debate about open-source! I am actually all for open source, because I know in a small community like this I will have witnesses to anything I post and therefore evidence that it was my idea, just in case anyone wanted to start the next Microsoft with it (Now don't start a Windows argument!). I release all of my code, schematics, and even PCB designs and have no problem with it. The only point of not using open source is for a means of getting money, which has never been my intent with designing software.
Hey guys... the rules are the rules. Live with them and contribute, or post your project separately with your rules, or keep your project to yourself. Your choice.
Note: The OBEX is open source in that anyone can take your code and sell it if they want, as long as they give you credit (which I might add can be quite well hidden for the dishonest). We all publish code under these rules. I have, and so have many others, contributed their schematics freely. Now look at DracBlade and the variants, all from TriBlade. And I helped Drac in the first place (which he freely acknowledges). I love to see the variations, and get a thrill that I started that interest. Some time sooner or later, someone will come up with that "magical" solution that will satisfy a big niche, and we will all gain the benefit. I am not in it for the $$$.
@jazzed: I never intentionally place "flame bait", usually what I say just gets taken the wrong way. I was just wondering if he made a mistake in saying that or if that is really what open source represents. I ask because unlike most of you I do not know much about the legal aspect of electronics or programming, I just do it because it's fun, and I don't really care about what happens when I release any source code or designs. I have taken from and contributed to the open source community, and I am 100% for it.
1) If you enter, you are providing information for the betterment of the community and that people must be able to use that information however they please. They are free to create commercial products using it if they want (even a direct copy).
2) Given the community here and the size of the market, it is unlikely that somebody will market a version of your stuff. Especially unlikely if you market it yourself. He seems to think we are mostly "nice" people - which I agree with.
3) If you don't like the conditions, no one is forcing you to enter. The prizes are nice, but if you are selling commercial products the odds are you are making enough to purchase those prizes if you really want them. This may not be true, but it is likely.
I have no problem with giving away my work (in some cases). I have posted complete files, drawings, etc. on this forum to allow people to reproduce some of my work. Of course, based on the incredibly small amount of interest people have exhibited in my threads (based on number of posts) I don't think I would have much to worry about anyway.
I think the important thing to come away with is that if you are uncomfortable providing enough information for other people to (commercially) reproduce your work, don't enter.
I could not have said this better myself... (obviously) Thanks, yes, that pretty much sums it up.
My project carries a significant risk of mechanical failure well before the project deadline, and certainly before Christmas. I don't think these rope lights are designed with G forces in mind. For protection I am going to encase it in a second clear PVC sleeve and hope for the best!
OBC: Just noticed that you don't have a link on the first post to Gadget Gangster or the Platform. Most of us know where to look, but others who see it may not know.
Comments
Easy... submit your BASIC code listing...
@Sapieha - It might be worth defining what licenses are permissible. I would suggest GPL, MIT, CC-BY and CC-BY-SA, but that's up to Jeff.
The issue is that you seem to be trying to allay some people's fears about open source by saying this is a small community and we won't make use of the right's granted by making it open source.
C.W.
There is Open Source, and there is what I perceive of the community here. The contest IS Open Source, giving anyone the rights thereof. I'm willing to bet on the gold quality of this community to support anyone's efforts every single time.
OBC
So you just said, it IS open source, but anyone making use of that license to it's full extent is not of "gold quality".
That is so inconsistent.
My intent is not to argue with you, I've said all I'm going to say on the matter.
C.W.
1) If you enter, you are providing information for the betterment of the community and that people must be able to use that information however they please. They are free to create commercial products using it if they want (even a direct copy).
2) Given the community here and the size of the market, it is unlikely that somebody will market a version of your stuff. Especially unlikely if you market it yourself. He seems to think we are mostly "nice" people - which I agree with.
3) If you don't like the conditions, no one is forcing you to enter. The prizes are nice, but if you are selling commercial products the odds are you are making enough to purchase those prizes if you really want them. This may not be true, but it is likely.
I have no problem with giving away my work (in some cases). I have posted complete files, drawings, etc. on this forum to allow people to reproduce some of my work. Of course, based on the incredibly small amount of interest people have exhibited in my threads (based on number of posts) I don't think I would have much to worry about anyway.
I think the important thing to come away with is that if you are uncomfortable providing enough information for other people to (commercially) reproduce your work, don't enter.
To me, a schematic image and software should be enough for a hobbyist to produce their own working version to enjoy as they will. If someone want's to take that to market, it is "their effort" in producing a functional copy that will be rewarded.
Are you saying that you have a project which you would be willing to share a schematic and software for, but only if you can win a prize? Nothing is preventing anybody from contributing to the community in whatever capacity they feel comfortable with.
You are one of the people I already see sharing a lot of your work with the rest of us (although not necessarily to the extent OBC is requesting). Will this contest change what you do?
I see the contest as a request for people to share at the same level that Gadget Gangster (one of the sponsors) is sharing. Nothing more than that.
I appreciate that observation. I've hung around here for the last 3 years doing what I do. I don't expect that to change much (except that my wife really wants me to do more housework and build a shed for all my junk and maybe sleep there LOL).
I would like the PropTouch to be an open project to the extent that the design can be used and be improved on by anyone; I would appreciate your mechanical acumen on the enclosure effort. I'll provide a schematic and software for anyone to use later and produce motherboards for reasonable prices if someone wants that. The problem with PropTouch is it's cost of goods especially with that beautiful 320x480 touchscreen LCD and the Propeller Platform compatible headers. Producing full designs take time and lots of effort and that is very close to being done, but no one is interested at a full or partial assembly price. Producing boards is easy except for the cost of respin when errors are found - there is a respin that must happen with that.
When I have more time in June I'll post more software for things I'm doing such as drivers for running software from SpinSocket-Flash and GameBaby when that's ready. I'll post any code tricks that I encounter along the way like in the SweetSpot INA to HUB thread. I've been working with David to get a version of XBASIC working on boards that provide up to 4MB of 10 pin interface fast access Flash memory. I'm trying desperately to finish that driver today.
No. Not at all. I'm happy to share things I do the way that I do. Obviously I'm not trying to win a contest ... otherwise I might be more a** kissy to the orgranizer(s). A contest is a competition though
I would participate and offer help to other participants in a contest if I wasn't forced to give up my dignity and my rights. The forum and this hobby are things I honestly enjoy and I really would like to see grow, but i'm not going to totally w**re myself for it.
Note: The OBEX is open source in that anyone can take your code and sell it if they want, as long as they give you credit (which I might add can be quite well hidden for the dishonest). We all publish code under these rules. I have, and so have many others, contributed their schematics freely. Now look at DracBlade and the variants, all from TriBlade. And I helped Drac in the first place (which he freely acknowledges). I love to see the variations, and get a thrill that I started that interest. Some time sooner or later, someone will come up with that "magical" solution that will satisfy a big niche, and we will all gain the benefit. I am not in it for the $$$.
I could not have said this better myself... (obviously)
OBC
http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php?131754-Mammoth-POV-an-almost-5-metre-giant-POV-squencer-for-Christmas-displays-etc
My project carries a significant risk of mechanical failure well before the project deadline, and certainly before Christmas. I don't think these rope lights are designed with G forces in mind. For protection I am going to encase it in a second clear PVC sleeve and hope for the best!
I think I have the layout correct. DIP parts so you can recycle chips from other boards.
We may push the date out just a little because I know folks are also getting ready to attend expos, vacations, etc.
OBC
OBC
I Updated the post on SavageCircuits.com with this info.
--trodoss
OBC
Contest Website: http://www.propellerpowered.com/designcontest/
OBC
Which means there's a lot to do this coming weekend
Great job to all who participated!
OBC