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Any one know the current ATF16V8C? — Parallax Forums

Any one know the current ATF16V8C?

davidsaundersdavidsaunders Posts: 1,559
edited 2011-03-27 16:14 in Propeller 1
As part of my 15BPP Propeller VGA I am using a bunch of gates, I would like to go over to these GALs, as I have 8 of them. The problem is they do not work with the old programmer that I have used to program the old 16V8 PAL. Does any one know what the difference is? Any help in making a programmer would be appreciated, or if the problem is just software (different fuse list?) then that would be even more helpful.

Thank you in advance for any advice.

Comments

  • Toby SeckshundToby Seckshund Posts: 2,027
    edited 2011-03-27 12:04
    Just as an exercise in self education, I used some Xilinx 9536/72 chips as ttl substitutes on DracBlades.

    It was pointed out that whilst the chip count plumented it required others to have all that programming software and even parallel ports available.
  • davidsaundersdavidsaunders Posts: 1,559
    edited 2011-03-27 12:12
    True. I would wish to provide a version of the design using logic 74HCT series gates, and a version using the GALs. And It would be nice to eventually design a Propeller based programmer for these. Not to mention that these could be used in so many applications, especially if there were a Propeller based programmer design available. These are so much easier to use than the CPLDs and FPGAs.
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,185
    edited 2011-03-27 13:14
    You might pick up something on eBay ?.
    The ATF16V8xx pgm details are non trivial, needing a Vpp voltage, and different sized shifts.

    We prefer the ATF16V8BQL, as that has lower standby, but it depends on the delay you can tolerate.

    Other choices are ATF1502ASL, which is a larger package, but has easier ISP.
    For those without parallel ports, there is an ATDH1150USB pgmr, but it does cost ~ $50

    Xilinx newest parts in the XC2C series are 1.8V core, and not 5V compatible.

    Do you know how many macrocells you need, and what delays ?
  • davidsaundersdavidsaunders Posts: 1,559
    edited 2011-03-27 13:35
    I need a delay of not greater than 12ns.
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,185
    edited 2011-03-27 14:00
    Is that a clock of 80MHz, or some feedback path that must be under 12ns ?
    Do you have more info on the total Logic you need, and the clock and delays ?
    I guess you also need this 5V operation ?
  • davidsaundersdavidsaunders Posts: 1,559
    edited 2011-03-27 14:34
    Clock is 40MHz, the acceptable delay is 12ns.

    Does not need to be 5V, can be 3.3.

    It comes down to some multiplexing, and simple line/bit twiddling.
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,185
    edited 2011-03-27 15:05
    Do you have the logic you want, already fitting into a single ATF16V8C ?

    The BQL parts use a pin-wakeup system, and above a certain MHz, their Icc and delay, are similar to a non-L.
    The next alternative would be a ATF1502AS-10, which is JTAG isp, but PLCC44.tqfp44
  • davidsaundersdavidsaunders Posts: 1,559
    edited 2011-03-27 15:27
    No it takes 3. I do need it to be dip. has to be socketed.
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,185
    edited 2011-03-27 15:57
    davidsaunders wrote: »
    No it takes 3. I do need it to be dip. has to be socketed.

    3 seems a poor fit - you can socket a PLCC44 ?

    If DIP is really important, you could look at the ATF2500C, that comes in DIP40, should just do 40MHz. Clk-out of 10ns.
    { Programmer support for this device could be a problem. 12.5V & 12.5V pulsed IIRC }

    My suggestion would be to target the ATF1502AS, in PLCC44, over 3x16V8 (60 pins) or 1 x ATF2500C(dip40) ?

    The ATF1502AS-10JU is 5V & ISP, I think with a choice of cables

    If you need to get to a breadboard, for prototypes, there is always Digikey ATF15XXDK3-SAJ44-ND adaptor ?
  • davidsaundersdavidsaunders Posts: 1,559
    edited 2011-03-27 16:04
    Yes PLCC can be socketed, I read PLCC and thought QFP :-) .

    And when I need breadboard compatibility, I get extra chips and solder leads directly to the pins (if they are not DIP, or not 0.1 inch).
  • jmgjmg Posts: 15,185
    edited 2011-03-27 16:12
    Just change your device to

    Device f1502ispplcc44;

    - this reserves 4 pins for ISP, and keeps (re) pgm simple - and then merge your 3 ATF16V8 design files into one.
    (you can use pins as IO with jtag off, or Device f1502plcc44, but then you cannot re-pgm easily.)
  • davidsaundersdavidsaunders Posts: 1,559
    edited 2011-03-27 16:14
    Just glanced over the Data sheet on the ATF1502AS, It looks as if it will do the job very well. Though the ATF1502ASV looks even better (because it is 3.3v). Thank you.
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