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TDA 7052 - Low volume? — Parallax Forums

TDA 7052 - Low volume?

John A. ZoidbergJohn A. Zoidberg Posts: 514
edited 2013-04-02 16:30 in General Discussion
Hello there,

I've just made my first simple WAV player prototype, but it's not fully perfect until I have a louder amplifier.

So, I have here are the 7052s and the volume is quite low when it's on a 6V supply. The input is from the PWM DAC from the microcontroller. With the lower volume, there's a bit of noise.

Then I connected to +12~13V supply (two used 9V batteries combined), it's significantly louder and lesser distortion.

Could I connect the 7052 to a +12V AC-adaptor with 1.2A current? I checked the datasheet - I can't seem to find the max.current specs there.

Also, I'm using the 8ohm 0.25W speaker. If I connect it to a 1W speaker, could it be much louder?

Pardon my ignorance on audio systems - I'm in the midst of studying them. :)

Comments

  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2011-01-25 08:31
    Larger speakers are more sensitive.

    I've always had plenty of volume from the TDA7052 at 6V. They won't fill a room, though. Post your schematic, you might have it connected wrong.
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2011-01-25 08:37
    John,

    I've been working some with that amp lately but have not noticed any problems with low volume or distortion. In fact, even with a 5V supply, I get good volume from a 6W-rated 8-ohm speaker. (I've even managed to blow out a couple mini 0.25W speakers with it, so you have to be careful what you connect it to.) Did you follow NXP's recommended schematic? How have you fed the DC volume control input? Also, it's very important to put your speaker in an enclosure. You will never get good volume from an unenclosed speaker.

    -Phil
  • John A. ZoidbergJohn A. Zoidberg Posts: 514
    edited 2011-01-25 09:01
    Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) wrote: »
    John,

    I've been working some with that amp lately but have not noticed any problems with low volume or distortion. In fact, even with a 5V supply, I get good volume from a 6W-rated 8-ohm speaker. (I've even managed to blow out a couple mini 0.25W speakers with it, so you have to be careful what you connect it to.) Did you follow NXP's recommended schematic? How have you fed the DC volume control input? Also, it's very important to put your speaker in an enclosure. You will never get good volume from an unenclosed speaker.

    -Phil

    I followed the recommended schematic - including the two filter caps at the supply.

    The sound which came out from the speakers are ok, but I had to touch the negative terminal of the speaker just to hear a much more clearer sound. If not, it's fuzzy. By the way the prototype is temporary and I used crocodile clips which connects the speaker to the breadboarded circuit.

    However, it didn't fill up the room that much. Maybe I need a higher bitrate WAV, or I need a bigger speaker.

    Btw - it's for designing a decoration, which is Christmas, and this is also expandable to the upcoming Chinese New Year, except it's in a red cardboard lantern. :D
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2011-01-25 09:27
    There must be something wrong with your wiring, if it sounds better when you touch the speaker terminal.
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2011-01-25 09:36
    I would also try a different speaker, just to confirm or eliminate the possibility that the one you're testing with has a bad internal connection.

    -Phil
  • John A. ZoidbergJohn A. Zoidberg Posts: 514
    edited 2011-01-26 04:30
    I just rechecked the speaker connections. Sound then came back fine. :)

    However, it's still not loud enough, despite it's 6~7V on the battery. I do not know why upon 7V above, the amplifier isn't working as the max. supply voltage is actually 18V.

    Must I use a more powerful power amp like the other TDA series, or should I use a bigger speaker?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2011-01-26 04:33
    Larger speakers are more efficient.

    It's only a 1 W amplifier. You will have to use a higher power device if you need more volume.
  • John A. ZoidbergJohn A. Zoidberg Posts: 514
    edited 2011-01-26 04:43
    Thanks for the opinion. :)

    Btw, the loudspeakers I have now are only 0.25Watts.

    Any other TDA series you could recommend for higher output? :)
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2011-01-26 05:34
    Use a bigger speaker, it might be loud enough.

    The TDA2030H delivers 14W, which should be more than enough! I've used it in a design and it worked very well, with good audio quality, but don't try it on those little speakers, they will probably explode. It needs quite a few external parts, though. I've got a PCB design somewhere for it, and the PCB I made.
  • John A. ZoidbergJohn A. Zoidberg Posts: 514
    edited 2011-01-26 05:40
    I see. I'll look at the TDA2030H - it seems that it's really powerful!

    Right now I have the TDA7052 - they are much expensive than the LM386, but saves me a lot of trouble from adding the external components.

    I'm building a small decoration unit which plays music in my living room, so I just need to fill up the room a bit. :D
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2011-01-26 05:52
    I found my PCB design.

    The TDA2030 also needs a dual-polarity PS, I used a mains supply delivering +12V and -12V. Batteries won't last long.
  • John A. ZoidbergJohn A. Zoidberg Posts: 514
    edited 2011-01-26 05:57
    Hmm I see.

    Fortunately I'm using an AC-adaptor for the decoration. I've seen one person actually did 12V on the TDA7052 without a heatsink - he is using all AA batteries.

    I wonder if I could do the same on the AC adaptor. Let me check the datasheet again... :)
  • bradharperbradharper Posts: 64
    edited 2011-01-26 06:09
    Not sure exactly what your application is, but I get substantial volume from the TDA7052 using 7.4Vin and 8ohm 1W speakers as small as 28MM.

    1) What code are using to play your audio?
    2) What resistor/capacitor values are you using on your input signal between the prop and amp?
    3) Is the wav data normalized to a sufficient amplitude? Can you hear the same file in other applications at a typical volume level?
  • John A. ZoidbergJohn A. Zoidberg Posts: 514
    edited 2011-01-26 06:17
    Hello bradharper,

    To answer the question,

    1.) I used the simple PWM + WAV decoder in a microcontroller.
    2.) It's only 1k and 100nF.
    3.) I'm not sure of the normalization. Clearly, I could hear the sound from the speaker a few inches away from the speaker. If I'm 3 meters away from the little speaker, can't hear that much. It's audible, but not loud enough to fill up the whole room.

    I guess it is the limitation of the speaker. Let me ask some other occupants of my home to judge the sound of the decoration. :)
  • bradharperbradharper Posts: 64
    edited 2011-01-26 06:28
    @John
    Don't give up on the TDA7052 yet. I routinely produce volumes that are uncomfortable to experience using such small speakers as mentioned above. Again, I don't know the exact nature of your requirements, but I suspect when you get it dialed in correctly it'll be plenty loud for you.
  • John A. ZoidbergJohn A. Zoidberg Posts: 514
    edited 2011-01-26 06:36
    @Bradharper: Don't worry - I'm not giving up the thing at all. I begin to enjoy the TDA7052 instead. Y'know, it's so much better than the LM386s lying around. :)

    Initially we planned for the music of the decoration should fill up the whole room, but due to the small speakers and only limited amount of voltage, it's as loud as the loudest greeting card only.

    On quieter time, the music is very audible and clear, only during mornings (household activities and conversation sounds from people) the sound may be diminished.

    We are trying to make it blare a Chinese New Year song, and some sounds of firecrackers just to have the atmosphere, but the nature of the festive season at home is often noisy as visitors are always around, so I know it could be a limitation there unless I changed the speakers and have a bigger amplifier.

    The decoration, however could be fine in Christmas due to the quieter neighbourhood during the season. :)
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2011-01-26 11:39
    John,

    The TDA7052 is plenty powerful to fill a room with sound. You just need the right speaker with an enclosure. I cannot emphasize the enclosure aspect enough. You simply will not get sufficient volume from any speaker that's not housed in a proper enclosure.

    -Phil
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2011-01-26 11:45
    If it isn't mounted in a proper enclosure the sound waves from the back and front of the cone will mainly cancel each other, resulting in very little output.
  • John A. ZoidbergJohn A. Zoidberg Posts: 514
    edited 2011-01-26 17:21
    I see. Thanks for the opinion. I will get an enclosure too.

    So the enclosure will be in a form of a plastic box? It's usual to drill some holes for the sound to come out from the enclosure? :)
  • LeonLeon Posts: 7,620
    edited 2011-01-26 17:36
    It's a lot more complex than that. It needs to be properly designed, like everything else in electronics.
  • Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi) Posts: 23,514
    edited 2011-01-26 18:21
    John,

    Anything you can do regarding an enclosure is better than nothing -- even a cardboard box. If you don't believe me, cup your hands around your naked speaker while it's producing sound and note the difference in volume and tone!

    -Phil
  • kattanarpatkattanarpat Posts: 1
    edited 2013-04-02 12:53
    plzz tell me any of you
    can i replace my speaker of 2watt 8 ohm to 10watt ohm
  • davejamesdavejames Posts: 4,047
    edited 2013-04-02 13:45
    kattanarpat - sure, no problem. The impedance is the important factor.

    By the way, double posting is a Forum no-no so you're original message has been removed.

    Find the Forum guidelines here:

    http://forums.parallax.com/showthread.php/134682-Forum-Guidelines

    Also, please know that this thread is over two years old. You might want to start a separate one.
  • Peter JakackiPeter Jakacki Posts: 10,193
    edited 2013-04-02 16:07
    John A. Zoidberg wrote: »
    Hello there,

    I've just made my first simple WAV player prototype, but it's not fully perfect until I have a louder amplifier.

    So, I have here are the 7052s and the volume is quite low when it's on a 6V supply. The input is from the PWM DAC from the microcontroller. With the lower volume, there's a bit of noise.

    Then I connected to +12~13V supply (two used 9V batteries combined), it's significantly louder and lesser distortion.

    Could I connect the 7052 to a +12V AC-adaptor with 1.2A current? I checked the datasheet - I can't seem to find the max.current specs there.

    Also, I'm using the 8ohm 0.25W speaker. If I connect it to a 1W speaker, could it be much louder?

    Pardon my ignorance on audio systems - I'm in the midst of studying them. :)

    IIRC, there are two variants, the 7052A and 7052B which had electronic volume control. So double check which you are using and make sure you have it connected correctly. Have you got the input AC coupled? A simple forum etiquette is that when you have problems like these you should supply a schematic and if possible a photo or two.

    BTW, with the speaker it's not so much about having a proper enclosure but having a baffle.
  • davejamesdavejames Posts: 4,047
    edited 2013-04-02 16:28
    ...Peter - this thread is over two years old.

    :smile:
  • Peter JakackiPeter Jakacki Posts: 10,193
    edited 2013-04-02 16:30
    davejames wrote: »
    ...Peter - this thread is over two years old. Does John even still frequent this Forum?

    :smile:

    Oh yeah, it was the double post that caught me, I still hadn't had my morning coffee (decaf) :)
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