General Comment: If we are truly looking for the true nature of the value of Pi, statistically or otherwise, what makes anyone think we should image the results in only linear progressions of numbers? Is the Universe linear? No. The reason we have not seen more to Pi is that the nature of our scope is too narrow and constrictive, we must expand our thinking in a broader sense. We should expand our view of pi in ways of visioning that encompass all of the things we have not looked at. I'm not saying bigger and bigger equations here. In the history of science, great leaps of discovery have resulted when someone looked at something in a simple way that no one thought about before.
Won't data loggers have all 10.0 digits? Will data miners ever get trapped underground?
I think so. A few times in advanced physics lab we had to process so many thousands of numbers that we felt up to our necks in numbers. Almost buried.. BTW, one of the standard 101 lab projects was to determine the value of Pi.
Beau said we should look at Pi in different ways. The reason he said that is because he is a Pi-man and can be found inside the value of Pi, in base 27! "I searched 31,415,929 digits of pi, and found BEAU 50 times. The first occurrence is at position 53,371. This means
Where A=1, B=2, C=3, and so on."
The most popular Pi-man is Beau's good friend, Ken Gracey. Searching the same 31,415,929 digits of pi, KEN is found 1,526 times. The first occurrence is at position 1,658.
There seems to be a lot of effort wasted trying to detemine the value of Pi. I wrote a short C program and found that the value of "Pi" is 26960 in decimal, or 6950 in hex.
YES!
It's called a Data Collapse! It's horrible... Bits, signed and unsigned number everywhere, broken ASCII codes dangle here and there, rotated binary digits floating off into real space, bits of base 64, base 16 and 133 code intermixed into an irrational conglomerate of rational data. A tragicomedy of unearthly events happening in the hypercyberspace of today's hyperactive duel cores executing meaningless code using unrealistic OP code to preform unimagined actions with factious irrational data in attempts to obtain rational information.
YES! It's called a Data Collapse! It's horrible... Bits, signed and unsigned number everywhere, broken ASCII codes dangle here and there, rotated binary digits floating off into real space, bits of base 64, base 16 and 133 code intermixed into an irrational conglomerate of rational data. A tragicomedy of unearthly events happening in the hypercyberspace of today's hyperactive duel cores executing meaningless code using unrealistic OP code to preform unimagined actions with factious irrational data in attempts to obtain rational information. KK
Something also to consider that I haven't heard mentioned...
What about compounding errors and their deterioration of accuracy when multiplied or divided together?
Pi is used in Math to attempt to represent something that is fixed and of a specific length. But is that really a correct interpretation? Matter changes and is always in flux, and in larger scale will compound the measurement and add a certain degree of 'noise floor' to the equation.
It's almost as if in order to correctly solve for Pi, you need to integrate the 'organic' element of nature into the equation.
Something also to consider that I haven't heard mentioned...
What about compounding errors and their deterioration of accuracy when multiplied or divided together?
Pi is used in Math to attempt to represent something that is fixed and of a specific length. But is that really a correct interpretation? Matter changes and is always in flux, and in larger scale will compound the measurement and add a certain degree of 'noise floor' to the equation.
It's almost as if in order to correctly solve for Pi, you need to integrate the 'organic' element of nature into the equation.
Yes you are a trouble maker and I disagree with you entirely.
For 1 thing there is no such thing in the pyscal world as a perfect circle. Best you could do is make a circle made up of straight lines 1 plank length long(1.616252818181818x10^-35m) with a radius the size of the observable universe(434x10^24m). Your circle would be made up of roughly 169x10^60 lines. giving you an error factor of...my calculator is not that accurate
Something also to consider that I haven't heard mentioned...
What about compounding errors and their deterioration of accuracy when multiplied or divided together?
Pi is used in Math to attempt to represent something that is fixed and of a specific length. But is that really a correct interpretation? Matter changes and is always in flux, and in larger scale will compound the measurement and add a certain degree of 'noise floor' to the equation.
It's almost as if in order to correctly solve for Pi, you need to integrate the 'organic' element of nature into the equation.
POP!
My brain just exploded!
Thanks Beau, now I got blood all over my office walls!
The thought I have is not to expose the inner workings of pi; because pi is the inner workings of something else! The fact that Pi has repetition in various numeric bases could lead one to couple Pi as the floor, ceiling or midline in Mandelbrot, Fibonacci or even Julia set calculations.
Sorry if it's off the topics, but I'm wondering if it's possible even for both Propeller I and II to be able to calculate Pi, ableit the lack of Floating Point Units (FPUs)?
However, I am sure some of you guys are aware that I am planning to build my own supercomputer, Dendou Oni. I am looking for something really beefy to test that Hypercube array to the limit, which the Pi seems right, so I thought it wouldn't hurt to ask.
Otherwise I am wrong. -_____-
"Yes you are a trouble maker and I disagree with you entirely." - funny, because I agree completely with your following statements :smilewinkgrin:
"For 1 thing there is no such thing in the physical world as a perfect circle...." - I guess we'll just have to go around in circles with this.:smilewinkgrin:
I guess, also what I was trying to say... If Pi is defined as the ratio of the circumference to the diameter of a circle, that our methods for measuring the diameter and circumference must be of even greater precision. Equally, using Pi in reverse, to solve for the circumference based on a known radius or diameter (i.e. an orbiting body in space) in a somewhat large scale. How much of the measurement is going to be 'floor noise' when the distances that are used, are not finite to begin with? There is an element of natural Chaos, noise, interference, whatever you want to call it in the mix that cannot be solved with our current level of comprehension.
Except as an approximation, the value of pi has nothing to do with the physical measurements of real circles of any kind, but only with the ideal measurements of those Platonic circles in flat, isotropic space that mathematicians talk about.
Sorry beau I was trying to say that pi is computes from ideals and attempting to compute the most number of digits theoretical possible to measure. Which I believe is around 70
Matter changes and is always in flux, and in larger scale will compound the measurement and add a certain degree of 'noise floor' to the equation. It's almost as if in order to correctly solve for Pi, you need to integrate the 'organic' element of nature into the equation.
Supporting argument: There are two sides to this discussion, the empirical and the theoretical. In the physical sense, even the position and the velocity of electrons can be uncertain (Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle), so experimentally on a subatomic scale matter is indeed in flux.
The actual use of Pi dates back to the Bible. "And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it about. (I Kings 7, 23)"
and again in II Chronicles 4, 2.
Pi was found in a list of specifications for building the Great Temple of Solomon around 950 BC and used for a large brass casting.
Instead of calculating Pi, you could just memorize it. The Guinness Book of World Records states Lu Chao holds the world record for memorizing the most number of digits of pi which was 67,890 digits. It took him only 24 hours and 4 minutes.
...ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it about.
Those cubits must've been kinda stretchy.
30/10 isn't much farther off the mark than the figure given in the infamous "Indiana Pi Bill" of 1897, which stated, "...disclosing the fourth important fact, that the ratio of the diameter and circumference is as five-fourths to four; ...", which means pi = 3.2!
The Guinness Book of World Records states Lu Chao holds the world record for memorizing the most number of digits of pi which was 67,890 digits. It took him only 24 hours and 4 minutes.
I wrote a short C program and found that the value of "Pi" is 26960 in decimal, or 6950 in hex.
You can find accurate values of Pi here:
Pi B64: 3. 9 3 3d 2a 22 8 16 23
Pi B32: 3. 4 10 1f 16 15 2 4 5 14 c
Pi Hex: 3. 2 4 3 f 6 a 8 8 8 5 a 3 0
Pi Oct: 3. 1 1 0 3 7 5 5 2 4 2 1 0 2 6 4 3 0
Pi Tet: 3. 0 2 1 0 0 3 3 3 1 2 2 2 2 0 2 0 2 0 1 1 2 2 0 3 0 0
Pi Ten: 3. 1 4 1 5 9 2 6 5 3 5 8 9 7 9 3 2 3 8 4 6 2 6 4 3 3 8
Pi Bin:11.0010010000111111011010101000100010000101101000110000
Pi B64: D. J D 9 q i I W j
Pi B64: y Q / a o i F o w http://dvneo.com/pi/pihex.html
Lu is from China. My Chinese friend also has this power. I was teaching him English and he brought in 24 pages of Obama speeches that he had hand written. I was very impressed. But not as impressed as I was about to become. He said it was for English practice and I should speak some words on any of 24 pages. I grabbed something like page 12 and read a few words. He immediately began speaking the rest of the speech! He had memorized all 24 pages! Chinese schools are heavy into advanced memorization and I simply don't know how they do it.
Humanoido should put his cogs to work calculating sqrt(2) to a trillion places. As the cogs proceed, one of them should attempt to match the output stream to an arbitrary sequences of digits selected in advance - perhaps "Sanya Richards runs fast and looks hot!" expressed in ASCII. Later we can worry about Shakespeare.
I was thinking of calculating pi to over 5 trillion places and using many cogs and many chips to do it. In the new machine, one would check each digit against some precalculated reference to confirm the first 5 trillion digits (or some range) are indeed correct. If the program is good, then it would be ok to go beyond 5 trillion. But so far there are no programs that run on the Propeller for comparison and it's unknown how fast FP would run. It looks like this will be a custom job unless someone knows of a quick prop program to do it.
I think "infinity" is the flaw in the Math.
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Will our Sun last forever?...I think not.
Will our universe last forever?...I don't think so.
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Is the number of years to the end to large for us to comprend?...I think so
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I think if irrational numbers had a time base, They wouldn't be irrational.
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pi has some similar patterns to Time,light speed, and gravity,But its way over My head.Much like Graham numbers!
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Comments
Problem is, now I don't know how many fingers I have.
-Phil
Will data miners ever get trapped underground?
http://pi.ytmnd.com/
Where A=1, B=2, C=3, and so on."
The most popular Pi-man is Beau's good friend, Ken Gracey. Searching the same 31,415,929 digits of pi, KEN is found 1,526 times. The first occurrence is at position 1,658.
Yes if this is anything to go by:
http://www.sankaranand.com/blog/2010/09/using-underground-data-center-to-store-your-data/
Or this one in Sweden:
http://hothardware.com/News/Swedens-UltraModern-Underground-Data-Center/
Now, what is the probability of finding similar encodings in sqrt(2) or even "War and Peace"
On data-mining, my wife thinks I'm trapped by my computer all the time.
YES!
It's called a Data Collapse! It's horrible... Bits, signed and unsigned number everywhere, broken ASCII codes dangle here and there, rotated binary digits floating off into real space, bits of base 64, base 16 and 133 code intermixed into an irrational conglomerate of rational data. A tragicomedy of unearthly events happening in the hypercyberspace of today's hyperactive duel cores executing meaningless code using unrealistic OP code to preform unimagined actions with factious irrational data in attempts to obtain rational information.
KK
http://www.eveandersson.com/pi/digits/search?search_string=999
Something also to consider that I haven't heard mentioned...
What about compounding errors and their deterioration of accuracy when multiplied or divided together?
Pi is used in Math to attempt to represent something that is fixed and of a specific length. But is that really a correct interpretation? Matter changes and is always in flux, and in larger scale will compound the measurement and add a certain degree of 'noise floor' to the equation.
It's almost as if in order to correctly solve for Pi, you need to integrate the 'organic' element of nature into the equation.
Yes you are a trouble maker and I disagree with you entirely.
For 1 thing there is no such thing in the pyscal world as a perfect circle. Best you could do is make a circle made up of straight lines 1 plank length long(1.616252818181818x10^-35m) with a radius the size of the observable universe(434x10^24m). Your circle would be made up of roughly 169x10^60 lines. giving you an error factor of...my calculator is not that accurate
sin(360/169x10^60)*434x10^24
2*pi*434x10^24/(169x10^60)
POP!
My brain just exploded!
Thanks Beau, now I got blood all over my office walls!
The thought I have is not to expose the inner workings of pi; because pi is the inner workings of something else! The fact that Pi has repetition in various numeric bases could lead one to couple Pi as the floor, ceiling or midline in Mandelbrot, Fibonacci or even Julia set calculations.
However, I am sure some of you guys are aware that I am planning to build my own supercomputer, Dendou Oni. I am looking for something really beefy to test that Hypercube array to the limit, which the Pi seems right, so I thought it wouldn't hurt to ask.
Otherwise I am wrong. -_____-
"Yes you are a trouble maker and I disagree with you entirely." - funny, because I agree completely with your following statements :smilewinkgrin:
"For 1 thing there is no such thing in the physical world as a perfect circle...." - I guess we'll just have to go around in circles with this.:smilewinkgrin:
I guess, also what I was trying to say... If Pi is defined as the ratio of the circumference to the diameter of a circle, that our methods for measuring the diameter and circumference must be of even greater precision. Equally, using Pi in reverse, to solve for the circumference based on a known radius or diameter (i.e. an orbiting body in space) in a somewhat large scale. How much of the measurement is going to be 'floor noise' when the distances that are used, are not finite to begin with? There is an element of natural Chaos, noise, interference, whatever you want to call it in the mix that cannot be solved with our current level of comprehension.
-Phil
"And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it about. (I Kings 7, 23)"
and again in II Chronicles 4, 2.
Pi was found in a list of specifications for building the Great Temple of Solomon around 950 BC and used for a large brass casting.
Source: http://www.guidetoonlineschools.com/tips-and-tools/pi-facts#ixzz14S8hUwHv
How to Memorize Pi to an initial 200 digits.
http://members.shaw.ca/vseward/pi_main.html
30/10 isn't much farther off the mark than the figure given in the infamous "Indiana Pi Bill" of 1897, which stated, "...disclosing the fourth important fact, that the ratio of the diameter and circumference is as five-fourths to four; ...", which means pi = 3.2!
-Phil
That is pretty fast memorization, Humanoido.
Pi B64: 3. 9 3 3d 2a 22 8 16 23
Pi B32: 3. 4 10 1f 16 15 2 4 5 14 c
Pi Hex: 3. 2 4 3 f 6 a 8 8 8 5 a 3 0
Pi Oct: 3. 1 1 0 3 7 5 5 2 4 2 1 0 2 6 4 3 0
Pi Tet: 3. 0 2 1 0 0 3 3 3 1 2 2 2 2 0 2 0 2 0 1 1 2 2 0 3 0 0
Pi Ten: 3. 1 4 1 5 9 2 6 5 3 5 8 9 7 9 3 2 3 8 4 6 2 6 4 3 3 8
Pi Bin:11.0010010000111111011010101000100010000101101000110000
Pi B64: D. J D 9 q i I W j
Pi B64: y Q / a o i F o w
http://dvneo.com/pi/pihex.html
'
Will our Sun last forever?...I think not.
Will our universe last forever?...I don't think so.
'
Is the number of years to the end to large for us to comprend?...I think so
'
I think if irrational numbers had a time base, They wouldn't be irrational.
'
pi has some similar patterns to Time,light speed, and gravity,But its way over My head.Much like Graham numbers!
'
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