The first of your three photos does show that the two resistors on the CH0 and CH1 pins of the 3202 are, in fact, not connected correctly, and are not actually doing anything.
Look at how they're wired in the diagram that Tracy sent: see that one lead connects to CH0 and then the other lead to a completely separate row of the breadboard? And then the pin from the BS2 connects to that THAT row? (and the same with the other resistor on CH1). In short, you should take one lead from each of those resistors OUT of the row that it's currently in, move it to a row that's not lined up with the 3202 (perhaps rows 19 and 20?), and then plug the two wires from the CO2 sensor into those rows.
Changing this isn't going to make the program work - you must have another problem elsewhere. But it does mean that right now you don't have that protection that Tracy was talking about, in case gremlins come in during the night and connect Vin to CH0 or CH1. If you take that fancy meter and set it to measure resistance, you'll find essentially zero resistance between the CH0 pin and that wire you have connected to it: the 1K resistor is bypassed by the connections inside the protoboard. If you hook it up instead the way Tracy has it in his diagram, you'll find about 1000 Ohms (1 KOhm) of resistance between the CH0 pin and that wire. It's that 1K of resistance that's supposed to protect·the pin.
Post Edited (sylvie369) : 6/28/2010 8:34:35 PM GMT
The first of your three photos does show that the two resistors on the CH0 and CH1 pins of the 3202 are, in fact, not connected correctly... Look at how they're wired in the diagram that Tracy sent: see that one lead connects to CH0 and then the other lead to a completely separate row of the breadboard? And then the pin from the BS2 connects to that THAT row? (and the same with the other resistor on CH1).
Yes, I see that Tracy has the resistors for CH0 and CH1 perpendicular to how·we have them (and a great color diagram, too!) So they go to a separate row then and so·we will install them accordingly.
We'll digest Tracy's diagram, compare it to how our breadboard is wired, then rewire ours and·try it again. We'll report back in a little while.
I just booked our "wheels" for the trip to Nevada and I splurged! I·rented a 15-passenger van so there's plenty of·room for ALL the Rocketeers and all the rocket GEAR... Sylvie and Tracy included. I sure·hope they can make·the trip.·That would be so cool to have the whole project team at the launch. We'd be just like NASA (*Paul, there's plenty of room for·a L-3 cert rocket and for all your GPS tracking devices, too!)
Please post the code you are using for this test, and a photo that shows how you have it hooked up to the CO2 sensor...
Tracy,
·· Thanks again for the excellent diagram. I just got home and I'll check how we have it wired against your diagram. Very colorful and artistic!
Attached is the current program. I'm not sure if it matters but pin3 and pin4, which is where the CH0 and CH1 wires·go,·don't·appear to be·in the·program.·Maybe that's the problem?
TP1 and TP3 are test points on the CO2 module, and those numbers have nothing to do with the numbers in the program.
On my diagram I forgot one wire that should go from the CO2 sensor to the BOE. I'll leave that open as a question. Hint: high 4.
Look at the code in the MCP_get subroutine. Leave in the the line
CO2pp = mvolts1 ' This line writes CO2(?) data to flash drive
This does not write anything to the flash drive at this point in time, but later on in the program execution, the V_write_record subroutine will write whatever happens to be in the variable CO2pp.
Note that your program assigns channel 1 on the ADC to the CO2 level. Is that the way you have it wired--ADC channel 1 to TP1? The program has to match the hardware!
Back to the MCP_get subroutine. Delete everything after that up to (but not including) the RETURN mvolts1 = result1 */ 313 ' This line writes CO2 (?) data to flash drive
DEBUG HOME, CRSRXY, 11, 0, DEC result0, CLREOL, ' Displays voltages & digital value
CRSRXY, 11, 1, DEC mVolts0 DIG 3, ' for both channels
".", DEC3 mVolts0,
CRSRXY, 11, 2, DEC result1, CLREOL,
CRSRXY, 11, 3, DEC mVolts1 DIG 3,
".", DEC3 mVolts1
PAUSE 100
That business with the */313 is superfluous, and the rest is left over from the copy and paste mash-up of the Parallax demo program. The display stuff will scramble the screen. Replace all that with,
DEBUG TAB, DEC mVolts0, TAB, DEC mVolts1
On second thought, I see another problem. There are too many variables. We can consolidate result0, result1, mVolts0, mVolts1, and CO2pp. Only two variables are necessary, and both of them have to be Words. Right now a couple of those that need to be Words are Bytes, and that can give you strange results.
Are any rocketeers (other than Mr. Kibler of course!) following along?
Dr. Allen and Sylvie,
Sorry we haven’t posted to the forum as much as we did when we were in school. We have been e-mailing each other and Andrew is in Florida. Chris and Mr. Kibler are working on·the board·at his house.·We wired the breadboard like you showed in your picture and we put the resistors sideways like Sylvie suggested. Here is our report:
1.··· When a wire is run from CLK to p3 both voltages are ‘0’ ·
2.··· When a wire is run from CLK to p13 both voltages show up. Was the blue wire p3 in the diagram supposed to be p13 like before? We left it on p13 for now. ·
3.··· When a wire is run from the Vdd/VREF pin to Vdd on the ASP-BOE, both voltages appear. One voltage (e.g. 1.600 mV) can be adjusted with the potientiometer and it is very, very stable (+/- 0.010 mV). The other voltage is very low and it hovers near ‘0’ (0.00 to 0.033) ·
4.··· When a wire is run from the Vdd/VREF pin to Vin on the BOE, both voltages appear. One voltage can be adjusted with the potientiometer but the voltage does not match the voltage above. It jumps around from 0.872 to 0.1033 (+/- 0.3.) The voltage is not stable. The lower voltage stays at ‘0’. We will keep the wire from Vdd/VREF to Vdd for now, not to Vin. ·
5.··· Like before, when wires are run from CH0 to TP1 and CH1 to TP3 through resistors like in Dr. Allen’s diagram, you CANNOT adjust voltage with the potentiometer. It jumps around. ·
6.··· When the wires are reversed (CH0 to TP3 and CH0 to TP1) voltage CAN be adjusted with the potentiometer. ·
7.··· We still can’t get the CO2 sensor to read out mV. ·
We just saw your program changes and we'll talk about the wire for ‘HIGH 4’. ·
Thanks! ·
Chris, The Rocketeers, Mr. Kibler, and Bandit·
Tracy Allen said...
Are any rocketeers (other than Mr. Kibler of course!) following along?
Dr. Allen and others,
Most of our team members have been carefully keeping track of what has been happening on the forum, including myself. As Dylan said in a recent e-mail, some team members probably have not felt the need to post simply because they don't have the necessary components to emulate the programming experiments. However, I have asked other team members, at a minimum, to at least post their thoughts and ideas on the current discussion. Additionally, I am eagerly awaiting a serial cable to arrive here in Florida so I can test the recent versions of the program.
Like Andrew said, I think all of us have been keeping track of the forum. I would be posting more frequently, but from 6AM to 5:30PM I'm a staff at a local Boys and Girls Club. I'll be looking into the "high 4" question tommorow and posting later that afternoon.
Dad and I deleted everything up to (but not including) the RETURN alike you said. Then we added the new line of program code in the box below. We changed the wires back to how you said·they should be. The TP1 wire goes to CH0 and the·TP3 wire goes to CH1.·Now the voltages and the alarm status (0 and 1)·show up·in the columns on the screen. But when you adjust the potentometer the voltage still doesn't change unless you change the TP·wires back around.·The co2 sensor voltage still won't change even when we blasted it with co2
mvolts1 = result1 */ 313 ' This line writes CO2 (?) data to flash drive
DEBUG HOME, CRSRXY, 11, 0, DEC result0, CLREOL, ' Displays voltages & digital value
CRSRXY, 11, 1, DEC mVolts0 DIG 3, ' for both channels
".", DEC3 mVolts0,
CRSRXY, 11, 2, DEC result1, CLREOL,
CRSRXY, 11, 3, DEC mVolts1 DIG 3,
".", DEC3 mVolts1
PAUSE 100
DEBUG TAB, DEC mVolts0, TAB, DEC mVolts1
On second thought, I see another problem. There are too many variables. We can consolidate result0, result1, mVolts0, mVolts1, and CO2pp. Only two variables are necessary, and both of them have to be Words. Right now a couple of those that need to be Words are Bytes, and that can give you strange results.
We tried to chnage result1 and mVolts1·BYTE to WORD but there was an error message and it said the WORDS were all used up. Then I chnaged all the WORDS to BYES and BYTES to WORDS and the numbers in the columns swithced around! That was confusing. ······
result 0······· VAR···· Word····················· ' Conversion Result CH0
result1········ VAR···· Byte····················· ' Conversion Result CH1
mVolts0········ VAR···· Word····················· ' Result0 --> mVolts
mVolts1········ VAR···· Byte····················· ' Result1 --> mVolts
ABout the wire you forgot from the co2 sensor to the BOE (the HIGH 4 thing), was the p3·supposed to be the·p13? wire? Was that it?
I have been busy with summer sports and I have playoffs coming up for baseball. Today I looked at the forum and nothing new had happened, and now, I look at the forum and the times and they just all happened to happen while I was at my baseball game today.
Dr.Allen,
Which resistor do you suggest we use? Are we fine with the 1K ohm resistor or do you think that we should use a resistor with more ohm?
Like Andrew said, I think all of us have been keeping track of the forum.
Justin
Thank you for posting to the forum, Justin. I can't believe we have 20 pages of dialogue on the forum. This shows good participation,·more than ever before. I know that you've been following along by e-mail and on the forum·and I understand that you (and all the Rocketeers)·are busy with other responsibilities.·With that said·I certainly·appreciate your efforts and participation. This stuff is... fun... challenging.... confusing..., isn't it?
I'm learning as much as you are!
Stick with it Justin. We'll get there. Remember that a really exciting trip to·Nevada is the light at the end of the tunnel, and·remember to encourage your teammates along the way. Just wait until we get to Nevada You can't imagine what the desert is like...!
·· Thanks for your·comments and insights. I posted·them below and they're right on target. I think·they·may help Dr. Allen and Sylvie understand·the reality of our situation and why we genuinely appreciate their·expertise, help, and guidance. We're scattered all over the place like dandelion seeds in the wind (PS - How's Florida, Andrew?!)·and this is·all so new to most of you.
Fear not!·While ours is a unique and·daunting task but it's not impossible. We're making great progess and we·are getting there. Stick with it,·follow along on the forum, and ask questions. That is how·you will·learn. A lot of this is new to me, too.
Thanks again for sharing your excellent insights. You're learning leadership, maturity, and responsibility·Dylan, and I applaud·you for that.
Mr. Kibler
"Dear Project Team,
If I may ask a question, what (and if there are any), dates are the practices during July?
The reason why I think many of our team are not posting is due to the current events going on in the forums. The current contents of the forum, if I may say, have been out of our, whats the right word, understanding (not so much confusion but participation range). The wiring trouble shooting seems to be, out of our, hmm, line of work. We currently can have set ups of what you are working on, as in the wiring and programming. But cannot trouble shoot like Tracy and Paul have been able to do. We do not have the physically same protoboard or perfboard so we cannot look for user or manufacturer errors, but also neither do Dr. Allen and Sylvie. I think most members (and sometimes me) have been standing out in the outfield, letting Dr. Allen and Sylvie do there thing (No offence to baseball players) and have not found a convenient gap in the forum dialog to add in our thoughts.
If I am taking this the wrong way, please someone inform me.
You should know that while I am very interested in rocketry and dabble in the World Cup, I believe baseball is sacred. I flew to Pittsburgh in April to attend two Brewers games, I'm going to see a minor league game about two hours away tomorrow evening, and next Monday I'm driving all the way to Gary Indiana to see one. The ARLISS project must get attention, but one does not let down a baseball team.
Thanks for your comments and insights. I posted them below and they're right on target. I think they may help Dr. Allen and Sylvie understand the reality of our situation and why we genuinely appreciate their expertise, help, and guidance. We're scattered all over the place like dandelion seeds in the wind (PS - How's Florida, Andrew?!) and this is all so new to most of you.
Fear] While ours is a unique and daunting task but it's not impossible. We're making <b>great progess and we are getting there. Stick with it, follow along on the forum, and ask questions. That is how you will learn. A lot of this is new to me, too.
Thanks again for sharing your excellent insights. You're learning leadership, maturity, and responsibility Dylan, and I applaud you for that.
Mr. Kibler
"Dear Project Team,
If I may ask a question, what (and if there are any), dates are the practices during July?
The reason why I think many of our team are not posting is due to the current events going on in the forums. The current contents of the forum, if I may say, have been out of our, whats the right word, understanding (not so much confusion but participation range). The wiring trouble shooting seems to be, out of our, hmm, line of work. We currently can have set ups of what you are working on, as in the wiring and programming. But cannot trouble shoot like Tracy and Paul have been able to do. We do not have the physically same protoboard or perfboard so we cannot look for user or manufacturer errors, but also neither do Dr. Allen and Sylvie. I think most members (and sometimes me) have been standing out in the outfield, letting Dr. Allen and Sylvie do there thing (No offence to baseball players) and have not found a convenient gap in the forum dialog to add in our thoughts.
If I am taking this the wrong way, please someone inform me.
Dylan Landry"
Mr. Kibler and others,
I agree with everything Dylan said, it was very well stated. It's definitely not easy to keep up with the discussion sometimes, especially when we are scattered all over the country. Speaking of which, I will be sending out an e-mail shortly with some possible dates for our next meeting. If you have any changes in the dates that you said you could or could not attend to, please update them in the Google document link I sent you earlier this month.
I'm not sure what others are thinking, but I definitely see progress being made, and much faster and efficiently than in previous projects. Stay in touch, and don't get lost or left behind.
You should know that while I am very interested in rocketry and dabble in the World Cup, I believe baseball is sacred. I flew to Pittsburgh in April to attend two Brewers games, I'm going to see a minor league game about two hours away tomorrow evening, and next Monday I'm driving all the way to Gary Indiana to see one. The ARLISS project must get attention, but one does not let down a baseball team.
Yeah, it's a tough juggle for the Rocketeers sometimes for sure. One foot in adolescence, one foot in adulthood, and pulled in three directions all at once. I admire them for sticking with the ARLISS team/ project over the summer~! It would be easy to say, "School's out", but as we know learning never ceases. Their stick-to-it-ness shows maturity and responsibility, skills that will serve them well in high school and beyond. These lessons-- and others like them-- are why I do projects like ARLISS, gratis.·We have the joy and privilege of teaching·a bunch of great·kids·valuable life-long skills, and together we help shape the future. Pretty cool.
Sacre bleu(es)!
So you like AAA baseball Sylvie?·Do you favor·AAA over the major league teams? We have the Manchester Fischer Cats and the Portland Sea Dogs and we try to take in a game or three every summer. I've always enjoyed·the "pure" feeling of a smaller stadium and AAA baseball. But watching the Orioles at Camden Yards sure was special. Which team is in Gary? Have you ever seen 'Klinger's' team, the Toledo Mud Hens play?
Have you checked the perfboard for any manufacturing errors? Or even the surface of which you are operating on? Your TPS heat shield project made us pay attention even the smallest of details.
Could there be a scratched out connection under the perfboard? Or even an over soldered hole that is connecting to another row vertically? That could cause the BoE to be communicating to different components. Maybe the reason why the voltage is not reading out correctly is because the 3202 is just connected to VIN and not what we need it to go to. That could be why its reading out the full 5V.
My father is more Canadian then you could possibly imagine. And with that last entry of, "Sacre bleu(es)!" made me think... Was that implying that he was going far as in."into the sacred blues"? My father uses this expression more then you can believe, and just wanted to know if you could imply something other, "Darn" in English terms.
Dylan Landry
Post Edited (Dylan Landry) : 6/29/2010 2:52:23 PM GMT
I like major league baseball, and I'm a devout lifetime Milwaukee Brewers fan, from their beginning 40 years ago. I was a stadium guard and ticket taker at old Milwaukee County Stadium in the late 70s, just as the team started getting good.
I've never seen a AAA game - we only have lower minor league teams around here. But I do love the minor league ballpark atmosphere, and you can't beat the prices. They make such an effort to be entertaining. Last year at the Beloit stadium we told a beer vendor we weren't ready for a beer yet, but probably would be in a couple of innings. He asked what kind we'd want, and sure enough, two innings later, delivered the beers without having to ask again.
The Gary team is the South Shore Railcats. I've never seen them, but you see their stadium from the interstate as you drive by, and I always thought I'd love to see a game there. My best friend lives 25 miles away, so we made plans for Monday.
==========================
ARLISS content -
You should understand that in order for the BoE to communicate with the 3202, it needs four connections (besides power and ground): Chip select, Data in, Data out, and Clock. You have the Data in and Data out connections sharing a pin. You should make certain that you know which of the Stamp pins makes which of those four connections, physically, and make sure that matches what you have in the constant declarations in your program. If those aren't right, nothing else will matter.
Your program (above) has this:
' ----- [noparse][[/noparse] MCP I/O definitions ] -------
CH0 PIN 3 ' Wire comes from TP1 on the CO2 sensor to the CH0 pin on the ADC breadboard.
CH1 PIN 4 ' Wire comes from TP3 on the CO2 sensor to the CH1 pin on the ADC breadboard.
DataOut PIN 6 ' DataIn and DataOut ADC pins are jump-connected with 1 K ohm resistor.
' A separate wire runs from each ADC pin. DataIn and DataOut wires
' are connected into one wire. This single wire goes into p6 on the ASP-BOE.
DataIn PIN 6 ' DataIn and DataOut ADC pins are jump-connected with 1 K ohm resistor.
' A separate wire runs from each ADC pin. DataIn and DataOut wires
' are connected into one wire. This single wire goes into p6 on the ASP-BOE.
CS PIN 12 ' Wire comes from the CS/SHDN pin on the ADC. It goes to BOE p12.
Clock PIN 13 ' Wire comes from the CLK pin on the ADC. It goes to BOE p13.
The last four lines of that code tell you where the program expects those wires to go.
BoE:·
3202:
BS2 Pin 6 - The 3202's Data in and Data out pins (pins 5 and 6 on the 3202)
BS2 Pin 12 - The 3202's CS/SHDN pin (pin 1 on the 3202)
BS Pin 13 - The 3202's CLK pin (pin 7 on the 3202)
You're usually using a resistor in series with those connections, as we just discussed.
I think you might be confusing yourself slightly with the first two lines of that code, which describe the connections between the CO2 sensor and the 3202 chip. Those connections have nothing to do with pins on the BoE. Looking at the code, you'd expect that pins 3 and 4 of your BS2 are used by the 3202, but in fact they are not. In fact, I'm not sure where "3" and "4" are coming from. Do you have wires from the 3202's CH0 and CH1 pins going to the BoE? You should not. Those two pins - CH0 and CH1 are ONLY for the voltages coming from the sensor into the 3202. They should not be connected to the BoE at all. Nor do they need to be part of your program (though it'd be a perfectly good idea to have a comment in the program describing those connections).
The analog voltages from the sensor go into the CH0 and CH1 pins on the 3202. The 3202 then messes around with those voltages internally, and turns them into digital numbers that can be reported to the BS2. It sends those digital representations of the CH0 and CH1 voltages out through the Data out pin, when commanded to do so by signals from the BS2 program on the Data in, CS, and Clock pins.
·I don't see any sign in your program that anything at all should be attached to pins 3 and 4 on your BoE. Do you have any wires going into those pins?
Post Edited (sylvie369) : 6/29/2010 3:12:11 PM GMT
And with that last entry of, "Sacre bleu(es)!" made me think... Was that implying that he was going far as in."into the sacred blues"? My father uses this expression more then you can believe, and just wanted to know if you could imply something other, "Darn" in English terms.
Dylan,
·· Actually, 'sacre bleu(es)' was a double entendre* *This is your vocabulary word for the day. What does it mean? You might actually see it on the SAT exam!
As I understand,·'sacre bleu'·means something like "Holy Cow!" But I also intended it to have a double meaning (a double entendre) which I'm sure Sylvie picked up on. Here are the double (triple!) meanings I intended:
1) I meant, "Holy Cow, Sylvie!" You like AAA baseball, too?! Sacre bleu!
2) Also, Sylvie·said, "I believe baseball is sacred (because Sean·has been busy with·baseball)... ·one does not let down a baseball team."
3) Sylvie also cheered for the French World Cup soccer team, "Les Bleues".
So you see Dylan, 'sacre bleu'-- or as·I wrote it, sacre bleu(es)-- has·multiple meanings. It was a double entendre, a play on words.·Mrs. Castle would be proud that you're learning Language Arts over the summer...! Dylan said...
"Have you checked the perfboard for any manufacturing errors? Or even the surface of which you are operating on? Your TPS heat shield project made us pay attention even the smallest of details.
Could there be a scratched out connection under the perfboard? Or even an over soldered hole that is connecting to another row vertically?"
We're actually not soldering anything on the perfboard yet. All the wiring is being done on the breadboards until we figure out where the wires finally go. Then you and your teammates will learn how to solder perfboard
Did you get·your flight reservation information by e-mail a little while ago?
Thanks for posting to the forum and keep up the good work!
"Thanks for asking about the plane tickets. I'll let you know when
the bill comes in (a month or so from now.) No need to worry about it
until then."
Was this what you where talking about when you said, "Did you get your flight reservation information by e-mail a little while ago?"
From my own, "Original" understanding, 'sacre bleu(es)' meant sacred Blue, as in the ocean. In many of my childhood Canadian games or books, I heard that term whenever something bad happened to the person. I came to know it of a sort of Canadian version of, "Darn".
I don't see any sign in your program that anything at all should be attached to pins 3 and 4 on your BoE. Do you have any wires going into those pins?
' ----- [noparse][[/noparse] MCP I/O definitions ] -------
CH0 PIN 3 ' Wire comes from TP1 on the CO2 sensor to the CH0 pin on the ADC breadboard.
CH1 PIN 4 ' Wire comes from TP3 on the CO2 sensor to the CH1 pin on the
I'm at Borders on the way back from a doctor's appointent. As I recall, two of the wires go from·the CO2 sensor's·CNTL/HSW and ALM·pins to p3 and p4 on the BOE. The other two CO2 sensor pin wires go from, and to, Vss and Vin·(on·the BOE.)·The TP1 and TP3 wires are soldered to the CO2 sensor and they connect to CH0 and CH1 (Tracy, NOTE: TP1 ==> CH0 and TP3 ==> CH1. There the wires will stay until we receive further instructions.)
It's amazing that I can actually visualize·the wires and wiring scheme·here at Borders. I even dreamed about wiring and programming the ASP-BOE last night! Then Susanne woke me up for a doctor' appointment....
...when you said, "Did you get your flight reservation information by e-mail a little while ago?"
I just wanted to check and make sure that you got the flight information by e-mail-- dates, departure and arrival times, flight numbers, etc. so your parents can plan. That's all.
I think 'sacre bleu' is an idiomatic expression (what does that mean?) It's not meant literally; when you say 'sacre bleu', nothing is really·'blue'.
It's like saying someone "has eyes in the back of their head." Do they really? Doubtful. Most cultures and most countries have unique idiomatic expressions that don't make sense if you take them literally.
My, "how time flies". I'll have to "put the pedal to the metal" to get home in time for lunch!
I don't see any sign in your program that anything at all should be attached to pins 3 and 4 on your BoE. Do you have any wires going into those pins?
' ----- [noparse][[/noparse] MCP I/O definitions ] -------
CH0 PIN 3 ' Wire comes from TP1 on the CO2 sensor to the CH0 pin on the ADC breadboard.
CH1 PIN 4 ' Wire comes from TP3 on the CO2 sensor to the CH1 pin on the
I'm at Borders on the way back from a doctor's appointent. As I recall, two of the wires go from·the CO2 sensor's·CNTL/HSW and ALM·pins to p3 and p4 on the BOE. The other two CO2 sensor pin wires go from, and to, Vss and Vin·(on·the BOE.)·The TP1 and TP3 wires are soldered to the CO2 sensor and they connect to CH0 and CH1 (Tracy, NOTE: TP1 ==> CH0 and TP3 ==> CH1. There the wires will stay until we receive further instructions.)
It's amazing that I can actually visualize·the wires and wiring scheme·here at Borders. I even dreamed about wiring and programming the ASP-BOE last night! Then Susanne woke me up for a doctor' appointment....
Mark
Yes, you need a connection from a BoE pin to the CNTL pin on the CO2 sensor, so you have control over the heater. Sorry - I'd·forgotten about that. But it's a connection directly from BoE to the CO2 sensor, and has nothing to do with the 3202.
The ALM pin on the CO2 sensor won't need a connection in your final product, though it might be useful for testing.
I did manage to miss this in your code, where pins 3 and 4 are used:
' -----[noparse][[/noparse] Carbon dioxide ]-----
' Added June 11, 2010 - Tracy, Dylan, Justin
Carbon_collect:
HIGH 4 'This activates the Heat Switch (HSW)
' <--- this does not really need to be repeated, but it doesn't hurt
CO2pp = IN3 ' read the CO2 level. Later, we will make this do more than just the alarm status
DEBUG TAB, DEC CO2pp ' show the CO2 level
RETURN
So we can assume that you have no connections from the 3202 to pins 3 and 4 of the BoE, right? That pins 3 and 4 go directly to the CO2 sensor?
Post Edited (sylvie369) : 6/29/2010 4:41:20 PM GMT
sylvie369 said...
You should know that while I am very interested in rocketry and dabble in the World Cup, I believe baseball is sacred. I flew to Pittsburgh in April to attend two Brewers games, I'm going to see a minor league game about two hours away tomorrow evening, and next Monday I'm driving all the way to Gary Indiana to see one. The ARLISS project must get attention, but one does not let down a baseball team.
Sylvie, · I agree with you a 100%. Baseball is America's pastime (at least to me!). The feeling of being at a minor league or the MLB baseball games are just relaxing yet so exciting and you know that you want to be the one to catch that foul ball. Whether your team is up by ten or down by ten it is always fun, at least for me. I have only gone to one redsox game and even though it was a blowout, I still had an amazing time. · Sean ···················
Chris said...
4. When a wire is run from the Vdd/VREF pin to Vin on the BOE, both voltages appear. One voltage can be adjusted with the potientiometer but the voltage does not match the voltage above. It jumps around from 0.872 to 0.1033 (+/- 0.3.) The voltage is not stable. The lower voltage stays at ‘0’. We will keep the wire from Vdd/VREF to Vdd for now, not to Vin.
Never connect the Vdd/Vref pin on the MCP chip to Vin! Only to Vdd. The chip is rated for 5.5 V maximum, and it might burn out it if is connected to 9 Volts!!!!
The CO2 sensor Vin does need to be connected to Vin of at least 6.5 Volts. Otherwise the heater will not get hot enough to detect CO2. So, MCP3202 to Vdd only. CO2 sensor to Vin only.
Chris said...
2. When a wire is run from CLK to p13 both voltages show up. Was the blue wire p3 in the diagram supposed to be p13 like before? We left it on p13 for now.
You're right. I don't know how I got the idea that it was supposed to go into p3. MAybe it was because we were using that for the ALM signal from the sensor. The nice thing about the Stamp is that you can shuffle around the pin assignments until the program matches the hardware! Later on I'll revise my diagram to match the ASP program.
Chris said...
5. Like before, when wires are run from CH0 to TP1 and CH1 to TP3 through resistors like in Dr. Allen’s diagram, you CANNOT adjust voltage with the potentiometer. It jumps around.
6. When the wires are reversed (CH0 to TP3 and CH0 to TP1) voltage CAN be adjusted with the potentiometer.
7. We still can’t get the CO2 sensor to read out mV.
Hmmm. Something is wrong. Tthe ASP program is not written to display readings from both channels. Look at the program to see what gets "DEBUGged" You could go back to using the demo program until you are sure the CO2 hardware is working.
I have one running here now using a variation of the demo program that displays both channels (photo-I'll upload the program after I make the pin changes to match the ASP program). The CO2 reading does in fact jump around quite a bit. That may be real noise from the TP1 sensor itself, not the ADC. The reading from the tp3 potentiometer is rock solid. If there is indeed noise from the CO2 sensor, we may need to do some averaging in software.
This morning I woke up and checked the forums, read up and re-read some of the earlier post, and then got breakfast and went outside for a bit. Came back inside after a few hours of playing soccer, and checked my emails, no new emails... so I checked the forums. And BAM! 21 pages, I couldn't believe it... Unbelievable communication here. I'll post my answers to the questions after triple checking them tomorrow. Enjoy the rest of your night!
▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔ "Learn to obey before you command."
Thanks for uploading the picture Tracy. Christopher and I have been at it for hours now and we made what seemed to be good progress. LOTS of back-channel action from the Rocketeers by e-mail, too. Sometimes I think they're shy (and a bit intimidated) about posting. C'mon guys. Like the poster in science class says, "Even Einstein asked questions." You just might be the next Einstein...
First we "... [noparse][[/noparse]went] back to using the demo program until you are sure the CO2 hardware is working" like you suggested. We rebuilt the simple version of the CO2 sensor "test stand" (four wires and two resistors), ran the demo software, and all our hardware is intact. "No components were harmed in making this program" (*another double entendre, Dylan!)
Next we (nobly) tried to build the same set-up as in your picture. But ultimately we put it aside because we couldn't see all where all the wires went. Lots of printer ink was used to make various size enlargements so we could "see around the corner", behind the CO2 sensor in your photo. Unfortunately our X-ray vision was thwarted by Kryptonite today... but there's always tomorrow.
*Last and most importantly we did get the program to read out "CO2 concentration" (millivoltage for both the potientiometer and CO2.) Huzzah! We took your hint and defined ALM and CNTL as PIN 3 and PIN 4 (instead of CH0 and CH1 as PIN 3 and PIN 4.) Thanks for the hint! This gave us an alarm status #, CO2 millivoltage, and potientiometer voltage on the computer screen. The potentiometer voltage was very stable as you said it was, but the CO2 millivoltage was "squirrley." No squirrels were involved in the process.
With all the wires where they 'should' be (TP1 to CH0, ALM pin wire to p3, and CNTL to p4) the CO2 sensor/voltage WAS responsive to pure CO2. But when the voltage stabilized and dropped to '0' it was unresponsive to CO2 (see the comments to the right of the ALM and CNTL pin definitions in the attached program.)
We switched the CO2 sensor's ALM and CNTL wires from p3 to p4 and from p4 to p3 and the CO2 number was much higher and much more stable (700-800 range.) But when CO2 was applied the readings rose, dropped, then stayed 'hung up' at a slightly higher level each time (e.g if the reading was 700 and we applied CO2 to get a reading of 775 it stayed around 775. When we applied CO2 at 775 the reading went to 815-ish, stabilized, then stayed near 810, etc.) Think of stair steps.
I think we're getting close Tracy. Seeing all the "right" numbers appear on the screen today was redeeming. We've been at it literally for hours every day-- e-mail, read, post, build, repeat-- and so it's nice to see it all start coming together. I think we may need to switch the wires back and forth and tweak the program a bit. But that seems small compared to where we were.
Oh, and we learned about (OK, we tinkered with) changing "Bytes" to "Word" and "Word" to "Bytes." What fun learning! We also discovered that we're out of "Word" syntax/space in the program, and we have noooooooo idea how or where to get more. I'm all out of words.
When you said, "So we can assume that you have no connections from the 3202 to pins 3 and 4 of the BoE, right? That pins 3 and 4 go directly to the CO2 sensor?", i thought the only connection DIRECTLY into the BoE's pins from the CO2 sensor was CNTL. Ground and power went to the corresponding rails and ALM was not needed. Am I mistaken?
UPDATE: With the p3 (CNTL) and p4 (ALM) wires reversed on the BOE, and with the CO2 sensor’s Vdd wire connected to Vin on the BOE (to activate the heater), we’re getting “good” CO2 numbers, consistently between 875 and 1080. This is real good progress. When pure CO2 is applied to the sensor, the numbers (millivoltage?) increase as you would expect, then stabilize nicely back to ‘baseline’ (between 875 and 1080 or so.)
When the data is graphed on Microsoft Excel a trend is obvious. Also, the high and low data points “equal out” when data is collected for 10-15 minutes (the data spikes are less noticeable and they seem to be equal in height. See the attached graph.) Could this be interference from other wires that Dr. Allen mentioned?
We’re curious:
1) Why do we have to reverse the ALM and CNTL wires for p3 and p4 around to get “good” data? When they’re not reversed the CO2 millivotage (ppm?) drops quickly and steadily to ‘0’ and then it hardly responds to CO2.
2) What are the CO2 units that we’re seeing? Are they millivolts? Are they parts per million?
3) When Dr. Allen talked about “averaging out” the data to adjust for data spikes, what did he mean and how do you do it?
Attached is a graph of one of this evening’s experimental trials (remember the TPD Heat Shield experiment last fall, Rocketeers?!) Also attachedd is the program we ran to get the data.
Mark in NH said...
UPDATE: With the p3 (CNTL) and p4 (ALM) wires reversed on the BOE, and with the CO2 sensor’s Vdd wire connected to Vin on the BOE (to activate the heater), we’re getting “good” CO2 numbers, consistently between 875 and 1080. This is real good progress. When pure CO2 is applied to the sensor, the numbers (millivoltage?) increase as you would expect, then stabilize nicely back to ‘baseline’ (between 875 and 1080 or so.)
When the data is graphed on Microsoft Excel a trend is obvious. Also, the high and low data points “equal out” when data is collected for 10-15 minutes (the data spikes are less noticeable and they seem to be equal in height. See the attached graph.) Could this be interference from other wires that Dr. Allen mentioned?
We’re curious:
1) Why do we have to reverse the ALM and CNTL wires for p3 and p4 around to get “good” data? When they’re not reversed the CO2 millivotage (ppm?) drops quickly and steadily to ‘0’ and then it hardly responds to CO2.
2) What are the CO2 units that we’re seeing? Are they millivolts? Are they parts per million?
3) When Dr. Allen talked about “averaging out” the data to adjust for data spikes, what did he mean and how do you do it?
Attached is a graph of one of this evening’s experimental trials (remember the TPD Heat Shield experiment last fall, Rocketeers?!) Also attachedd is the program we ran to get the data.
Thank you for a productive day,
Mr. Kibler, Chris, and The Rocketeers
Mr. Kibler,
I just tried to open up the graph you uploaded, but it doesn't seem to be in a format that even the newest version of Excel recognizes. Could you please change the format and re-upload it? I'm really curious to see the data for myself. I'm looking over the newest version of the program right now, as well.
OK, here's the graph of the CO2 data as an Excel file again (I hope.) The ASP-BOE ran for over·an hour until after midnight and the data looks 'OK'. But it·needs some critical examinstion to be sure we're measuring what we think we are... CO2.
Two things:
1) I agree that we may want better resolution in the CO2 data. There seems to be "a lot" of variation (200+ units, whatever the units are.)
2) The sample number resets to 0 every time it reaches 255 (a variable of 256, 515, 1024, etc.) Hmmm...
Comments
Look at how they're wired in the diagram that Tracy sent: see that one lead connects to CH0 and then the other lead to a completely separate row of the breadboard? And then the pin from the BS2 connects to that THAT row? (and the same with the other resistor on CH1). In short, you should take one lead from each of those resistors OUT of the row that it's currently in, move it to a row that's not lined up with the 3202 (perhaps rows 19 and 20?), and then plug the two wires from the CO2 sensor into those rows.
Changing this isn't going to make the program work - you must have another problem elsewhere. But it does mean that right now you don't have that protection that Tracy was talking about, in case gremlins come in during the night and connect Vin to CH0 or CH1. If you take that fancy meter and set it to measure resistance, you'll find essentially zero resistance between the CH0 pin and that wire you have connected to it: the 1K resistor is bypassed by the connections inside the protoboard. If you hook it up instead the way Tracy has it in his diagram, you'll find about 1000 Ohms (1 KOhm) of resistance between the CH0 pin and that wire. It's that 1K of resistance that's supposed to protect·the pin.
Post Edited (sylvie369) : 6/28/2010 8:34:35 PM GMT
We'll digest Tracy's diagram, compare it to how our breadboard is wired, then rewire ours and·try it again. We'll report back in a little while.
I just booked our "wheels" for the trip to Nevada and I splurged! I·rented a 15-passenger van so there's plenty of·room for ALL the Rocketeers and all the rocket GEAR... Sylvie and Tracy included. I sure·hope they can make·the trip.·That would be so cool to have the whole project team at the launch. We'd be just like NASA (*Paul, there's plenty of room for·a L-3 cert rocket and for all your GPS tracking devices, too!)
·
·· Thanks again for the excellent diagram. I just got home and I'll check how we have it wired against your diagram. Very colorful and artistic!
Attached is the current program. I'm not sure if it matters but pin3 and pin4, which is where the CH0 and CH1 wires·go,·don't·appear to be·in the·program.·Maybe that's the problem?
On my diagram I forgot one wire that should go from the CO2 sensor to the BOE. I'll leave that open as a question. Hint: high 4.
Look at the code in the MCP_get subroutine. Leave in the the line
This does not write anything to the flash drive at this point in time, but later on in the program execution, the V_write_record subroutine will write whatever happens to be in the variable CO2pp.
Note that your program assigns channel 1 on the ADC to the CO2 level. Is that the way you have it wired--ADC channel 1 to TP1? The program has to match the hardware!
Back to the MCP_get subroutine. Delete everything after that up to (but not including) the RETURN
mvolts1 = result1 */ 313 ' This line writes CO2 (?) data to flash drive
DEBUG HOME, CRSRXY, 11, 0, DEC result0, CLREOL, ' Displays voltages & digital value
CRSRXY, 11, 1, DEC mVolts0 DIG 3, ' for both channels
".", DEC3 mVolts0,
CRSRXY, 11, 2, DEC result1, CLREOL,
CRSRXY, 11, 3, DEC mVolts1 DIG 3,
".", DEC3 mVolts1
PAUSE 100
That business with the */313 is superfluous, and the rest is left over from the copy and paste mash-up of the Parallax demo program. The display stuff will scramble the screen. Replace all that with,
On second thought, I see another problem. There are too many variables. We can consolidate result0, result1, mVolts0, mVolts1, and CO2pp. Only two variables are necessary, and both of them have to be Words. Right now a couple of those that need to be Words are Bytes, and that can give you strange results.
Are any rocketeers (other than Mr. Kibler of course!) following along?
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Tracy Allen
www.emesystems.com
Sorry we haven’t posted to the forum as much as we did when we were in school. We have been e-mailing each other and Andrew is in Florida. Chris and Mr. Kibler are working on·the board·at his house.·We wired the breadboard like you showed in your picture and we put the resistors sideways like Sylvie suggested. Here is our report:
1.··· When a wire is run from CLK to p3 both voltages are ‘0’
·
2.··· When a wire is run from CLK to p13 both voltages show up. Was the blue wire p3 in the diagram supposed to be p13 like before? We left it on p13 for now.
·
3.··· When a wire is run from the Vdd/VREF pin to Vdd on the ASP-BOE, both voltages appear. One voltage (e.g. 1.600 mV) can be adjusted with the potientiometer and it is very, very stable (+/- 0.010 mV). The other voltage is very low and it hovers near ‘0’ (0.00 to 0.033)
·
4.··· When a wire is run from the Vdd/VREF pin to Vin on the BOE, both voltages appear. One voltage can be adjusted with the potientiometer but the voltage does not match the voltage above. It jumps around from 0.872 to 0.1033 (+/- 0.3.) The voltage is not stable. The lower voltage stays at ‘0’. We will keep the wire from Vdd/VREF to Vdd for now, not to Vin.
·
5.··· Like before, when wires are run from CH0 to TP1 and CH1 to TP3 through resistors like in Dr. Allen’s diagram, you CANNOT adjust voltage with the potentiometer. It jumps around.
·
6.··· When the wires are reversed (CH0 to TP3 and CH0 to TP1) voltage CAN be adjusted with the potentiometer.
·
7.··· We still can’t get the CO2 sensor to read out mV.
·
We just saw your program changes and we'll talk about the wire for ‘HIGH 4’.
·
Thanks!
·
Chris, The Rocketeers, Mr. Kibler, and Bandit·
Dr. Allen and others,
Most of our team members have been carefully keeping track of what has been happening on the forum, including myself. As Dylan said in a recent e-mail, some team members probably have not felt the need to post simply because they don't have the necessary components to emulate the programming experiments. However, I have asked other team members, at a minimum, to at least post their thoughts and ideas on the current discussion. Additionally, I am eagerly awaiting a serial cable to arrive here in Florida so I can test the recent versions of the program.
Thank you,
Andrew
Like Andrew said, I think all of us have been keeping track of the forum. I would be posting more frequently, but from 6AM to 5:30PM I'm a staff at a local Boys and Girls Club. I'll be looking into the "high 4" question tommorow and posting later that afternoon.
Justin
Dad and I deleted everything up to (but not including) the RETURN alike you said. Then we added the new line of program code in the box below. We changed the wires back to how you said·they should be. The TP1 wire goes to CH0 and the·TP3 wire goes to CH1.·Now the voltages and the alarm status (0 and 1)·show up·in the columns on the screen. But when you adjust the potentometer the voltage still doesn't change unless you change the TP·wires back around.·The co2 sensor voltage still won't change even when we blasted it with co2
mvolts1 = result1 */ 313 ' This line writes CO2 (?) data to flash drive
DEBUG HOME, CRSRXY, 11, 0, DEC result0, CLREOL, ' Displays voltages & digital value
CRSRXY, 11, 1, DEC mVolts0 DIG 3, ' for both channels
".", DEC3 mVolts0,
CRSRXY, 11, 2, DEC result1, CLREOL,
CRSRXY, 11, 3, DEC mVolts1 DIG 3,
".", DEC3 mVolts1
PAUSE 100
On second thought, I see another problem. There are too many variables. We can consolidate result0, result1, mVolts0, mVolts1, and CO2pp. Only two variables are necessary, and both of them have to be Words. Right now a couple of those that need to be Words are Bytes, and that can give you strange results.
We tried to chnage result1 and mVolts1·BYTE to WORD but there was an error message and it said the WORDS were all used up. Then I chnaged all the WORDS to BYES and BYTES to WORDS and the numbers in the columns swithced around! That was confusing.
······
result 0······· VAR···· Word····················· ' Conversion Result CH0
result1········ VAR···· Byte····················· ' Conversion Result CH1
mVolts0········ VAR···· Word····················· ' Result0 --> mVolts
mVolts1········ VAR···· Byte····················· ' Result1 --> mVolts
ABout the wire you forgot from the co2 sensor to the BOE (the HIGH 4 thing), was the p3·supposed to be the·p13? wire? Was that it?
thank you
Chris Kibler
I have been busy with summer sports and I have playoffs coming up for baseball. Today I looked at the forum and nothing new had happened, and now, I look at the forum and the times and they just all happened to happen while I was at my baseball game today.
Dr.Allen,
Which resistor do you suggest we use? Are we fine with the 1K ohm resistor or do you think that we should use a resistor with more ohm?
Sean
I'm learning as much as you are!
Stick with it Justin. We'll get there. Remember that a really exciting trip to·Nevada is the light at the end of the tunnel, and·remember to encourage your teammates along the way. Just wait until we get to Nevada You can't imagine what the desert is like...!
Mr. Kibler
·
·· Thanks for your·comments and insights. I posted·them below and they're right on target. I think·they·may help Dr. Allen and Sylvie understand·the reality of our situation and why we genuinely appreciate their·expertise, help, and guidance. We're scattered all over the place like dandelion seeds in the wind (PS - How's Florida, Andrew?!)·and this is·all so new to most of you.
Fear not!·While ours is a unique and·daunting task but it's not impossible. We're making great progess and we·are getting there. Stick with it,·follow along on the forum, and ask questions. That is how·you will·learn. A lot of this is new to me, too.
Thanks again for sharing your excellent insights. You're learning leadership, maturity, and responsibility·Dylan, and I applaud·you for that.
Mr. Kibler
"Dear Project Team,
If I may ask a question, what (and if there are any), dates are the practices during July?
The reason why I think many of our team are not posting is due to the current events going on in the forums. The current contents of the forum, if I may say, have been out of our, whats the right word, understanding (not so much confusion but participation range). The wiring trouble shooting seems to be, out of our, hmm, line of work. We currently can have set ups of what you are working on, as in the wiring and programming. But cannot trouble shoot like Tracy and Paul have been able to do. We do not have the physically same protoboard or perfboard so we cannot look for user or manufacturer errors, but also neither do Dr. Allen and Sylvie. I think most members (and sometimes me) have been standing out in the outfield, letting Dr. Allen and Sylvie do there thing (No offence to baseball players) and have not found a convenient gap in the forum dialog to add in our thoughts.
If I am taking this the wrong way, please someone inform me.
Dylan Landry"
Mr. Kibler and others,
I agree with everything Dylan said, it was very well stated. It's definitely not easy to keep up with the discussion sometimes, especially when we are scattered all over the country. Speaking of which, I will be sending out an e-mail shortly with some possible dates for our next meeting. If you have any changes in the dates that you said you could or could not attend to, please update them in the Google document link I sent you earlier this month.
I'm not sure what others are thinking, but I definitely see progress being made, and much faster and efficiently than in previous projects. Stay in touch, and don't get lost or left behind.
From (very) hot and sunny Florida,
Andrew
Sacre bleu(es)!
So you like AAA baseball Sylvie?·Do you favor·AAA over the major league teams? We have the Manchester Fischer Cats and the Portland Sea Dogs and we try to take in a game or three every summer. I've always enjoyed·the "pure" feeling of a smaller stadium and AAA baseball. But watching the Orioles at Camden Yards sure was special. Which team is in Gary? Have you ever seen 'Klinger's' team, the Toledo Mud Hens play?
Could there be a scratched out connection under the perfboard? Or even an over soldered hole that is connecting to another row vertically? That could cause the BoE to be communicating to different components. Maybe the reason why the voltage is not reading out correctly is because the 3202 is just connected to VIN and not what we need it to go to. That could be why its reading out the full 5V.
My father is more Canadian then you could possibly imagine. And with that last entry of, "Sacre bleu(es)!" made me think... Was that implying that he was going far as in."into the sacred blues"? My father uses this expression more then you can believe, and just wanted to know if you could imply something other, "Darn" in English terms.
Dylan Landry
Post Edited (Dylan Landry) : 6/29/2010 2:52:23 PM GMT
I've never seen a AAA game - we only have lower minor league teams around here. But I do love the minor league ballpark atmosphere, and you can't beat the prices. They make such an effort to be entertaining. Last year at the Beloit stadium we told a beer vendor we weren't ready for a beer yet, but probably would be in a couple of innings. He asked what kind we'd want, and sure enough, two innings later, delivered the beers without having to ask again.
The Gary team is the South Shore Railcats. I've never seen them, but you see their stadium from the interstate as you drive by, and I always thought I'd love to see a game there. My best friend lives 25 miles away, so we made plans for Monday.
==========================
ARLISS content -
You should understand that in order for the BoE to communicate with the 3202, it needs four connections (besides power and ground): Chip select, Data in, Data out, and Clock. You have the Data in and Data out connections sharing a pin. You should make certain that you know which of the Stamp pins makes which of those four connections, physically, and make sure that matches what you have in the constant declarations in your program. If those aren't right, nothing else will matter.
Your program (above) has this:
' ----- [noparse][[/noparse] MCP I/O definitions ] ------- CH0 PIN 3 ' Wire comes from TP1 on the CO2 sensor to the CH0 pin on the ADC breadboard. CH1 PIN 4 ' Wire comes from TP3 on the CO2 sensor to the CH1 pin on the ADC breadboard. DataOut PIN 6 ' DataIn and DataOut ADC pins are jump-connected with 1 K ohm resistor. ' A separate wire runs from each ADC pin. DataIn and DataOut wires ' are connected into one wire. This single wire goes into p6 on the ASP-BOE. DataIn PIN 6 ' DataIn and DataOut ADC pins are jump-connected with 1 K ohm resistor. ' A separate wire runs from each ADC pin. DataIn and DataOut wires ' are connected into one wire. This single wire goes into p6 on the ASP-BOE. CS PIN 12 ' Wire comes from the CS/SHDN pin on the ADC. It goes to BOE p12. Clock PIN 13 ' Wire comes from the CLK pin on the ADC. It goes to BOE p13.The last four lines of that code tell you where the program expects those wires to go.
BoE:·
3202:
BS2 Pin 6 - The 3202's Data in and Data out pins (pins 5 and 6 on the 3202)
BS2 Pin 12 - The 3202's CS/SHDN pin (pin 1 on the 3202)
BS Pin 13 - The 3202's CLK pin (pin 7 on the 3202)
You're usually using a resistor in series with those connections, as we just discussed.
I think you might be confusing yourself slightly with the first two lines of that code, which describe the connections between the CO2 sensor and the 3202 chip. Those connections have nothing to do with pins on the BoE. Looking at the code, you'd expect that pins 3 and 4 of your BS2 are used by the 3202, but in fact they are not. In fact, I'm not sure where "3" and "4" are coming from. Do you have wires from the 3202's CH0 and CH1 pins going to the BoE? You should not. Those two pins - CH0 and CH1 are ONLY for the voltages coming from the sensor into the 3202. They should not be connected to the BoE at all. Nor do they need to be part of your program (though it'd be a perfectly good idea to have a comment in the program describing those connections).
The analog voltages from the sensor go into the CH0 and CH1 pins on the 3202. The 3202 then messes around with those voltages internally, and turns them into digital numbers that can be reported to the BS2. It sends those digital representations of the CH0 and CH1 voltages out through the Data out pin, when commanded to do so by signals from the BS2 program on the Data in, CS, and Clock pins.
·I don't see any sign in your program that anything at all should be attached to pins 3 and 4 on your BoE. Do you have any wires going into those pins?
Post Edited (sylvie369) : 6/29/2010 3:12:11 PM GMT
·· Actually, 'sacre bleu(es)' was a double entendre* *This is your vocabulary word for the day. What does it mean? You might actually see it on the SAT exam!
As I understand,·'sacre bleu'·means something like "Holy Cow!" But I also intended it to have a double meaning (a double entendre) which I'm sure Sylvie picked up on. Here are the double (triple!) meanings I intended:
1) I meant, "Holy Cow, Sylvie!" You like AAA baseball, too?! Sacre bleu!
2) Also, Sylvie·said, "I believe baseball is sacred (because Sean·has been busy with·baseball)... ·one does not let down a baseball team."
3) Sylvie also cheered for the French World Cup soccer team, "Les Bleues".
So you see Dylan, 'sacre bleu'-- or as·I wrote it, sacre bleu(es)-- has·multiple meanings. It was a double entendre, a play on words.·Mrs. Castle would be proud that you're learning Language Arts over the summer...!
Dylan said...
"Have you checked the perfboard for any manufacturing errors? Or even the surface of which you are operating on? Your TPS heat shield project made us pay attention even the smallest of details.
Could there be a scratched out connection under the perfboard? Or even an over soldered hole that is connecting to another row vertically?"
We're actually not soldering anything on the perfboard yet. All the wiring is being done on the breadboards until we figure out where the wires finally go. Then you and your teammates will learn how to solder perfboard
Did you get·your flight reservation information by e-mail a little while ago?
Thanks for posting to the forum and keep up the good work!
Mr. Kibler
·
the bill comes in (a month or so from now.) No need to worry about it
until then."
Was this what you where talking about when you said, "Did you get your flight reservation information by e-mail a little while ago?"
From my own, "Original" understanding, 'sacre bleu(es)' meant sacred Blue, as in the ocean. In many of my childhood Canadian games or books, I heard that term whenever something bad happened to the person. I came to know it of a sort of Canadian version of, "Darn".
It's amazing that I can actually visualize·the wires and wiring scheme·here at Borders. I even dreamed about wiring and programming the ASP-BOE last night! Then Susanne woke me up for a doctor' appointment....
Mark
I think 'sacre bleu' is an idiomatic expression (what does that mean?) It's not meant literally; when you say 'sacre bleu', nothing is really·'blue'.
It's like saying someone "has eyes in the back of their head." Do they really? Doubtful. Most cultures and most countries have unique idiomatic expressions that don't make sense if you take them literally.
My, "how time flies". I'll have to "put the pedal to the metal" to get home in time for lunch!
Mr. Kibler
The ALM pin on the CO2 sensor won't need a connection in your final product, though it might be useful for testing.
I did manage to miss this in your code, where pins 3 and 4 are used:
' -----[noparse][[/noparse] Carbon dioxide ]----- ' Added June 11, 2010 - Tracy, Dylan, Justin Carbon_collect: HIGH 4 'This activates the Heat Switch (HSW) ' <--- this does not really need to be repeated, but it doesn't hurt CO2pp = IN3 ' read the CO2 level. Later, we will make this do more than just the alarm status DEBUG TAB, DEC CO2pp ' show the CO2 level RETURNSo we can assume that you have no connections from the 3202 to pins 3 and 4 of the BoE, right? That pins 3 and 4 go directly to the CO2 sensor?
Post Edited (sylvie369) : 6/29/2010 4:41:20 PM GMT
·
I agree with you a 100%. Baseball is America's pastime (at least to me!). The feeling of being at a minor league or the MLB baseball games are just relaxing yet so exciting and you know that you want to be the one to catch that foul ball. Whether your team is up by ten or down by ten it is always fun, at least for me. I have only gone to one redsox game and even though it was a blowout, I still had an amazing time.
·
Sean
···················
Never connect the Vdd/Vref pin on the MCP chip to Vin! Only to Vdd. The chip is rated for 5.5 V maximum, and it might burn out it if is connected to 9 Volts!!!!
The CO2 sensor Vin does need to be connected to Vin of at least 6.5 Volts. Otherwise the heater will not get hot enough to detect CO2. So, MCP3202 to Vdd only. CO2 sensor to Vin only.
You're right. I don't know how I got the idea that it was supposed to go into p3. MAybe it was because we were using that for the ALM signal from the sensor. The nice thing about the Stamp is that you can shuffle around the pin assignments until the program matches the hardware! Later on I'll revise my diagram to match the ASP program.
Hmmm. Something is wrong. Tthe ASP program is not written to display readings from both channels. Look at the program to see what gets "DEBUGged" You could go back to using the demo program until you are sure the CO2 hardware is working.
I have one running here now using a variation of the demo program that displays both channels (photo-I'll upload the program after I make the pin changes to match the ASP program). The CO2 reading does in fact jump around quite a bit. That may be real noise from the TP1 sensor itself, not the ADC. The reading from the tp3 potentiometer is rock solid. If there is indeed noise from the CO2 sensor, we may need to do some averaging in software.
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Tracy Allen
www.emesystems.com
Post Edited (Tracy Allen) : 6/29/2010 5:17:39 PM GMT
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"Learn to obey before you command."
-Solon
Thanks for uploading the picture Tracy. Christopher and I have been at it for hours now and we made what seemed to be good progress. LOTS of back-channel action from the Rocketeers by e-mail, too. Sometimes I think they're shy (and a bit intimidated) about posting. C'mon guys. Like the poster in science class says, "Even Einstein asked questions." You just might be the next Einstein...
First we "... [noparse][[/noparse]went] back to using the demo program until you are sure the CO2 hardware is working" like you suggested. We rebuilt the simple version of the CO2 sensor "test stand" (four wires and two resistors), ran the demo software, and all our hardware is intact. "No components were harmed in making this program" (*another double entendre, Dylan!)
Next we (nobly) tried to build the same set-up as in your picture. But ultimately we put it aside because we couldn't see all where all the wires went. Lots of printer ink was used to make various size enlargements so we could "see around the corner", behind the CO2 sensor in your photo. Unfortunately our X-ray vision was thwarted by Kryptonite today... but there's always tomorrow.
*Last and most importantly we did get the program to read out "CO2 concentration" (millivoltage for both the potientiometer and CO2.) Huzzah! We took your hint and defined ALM and CNTL as PIN 3 and PIN 4 (instead of CH0 and CH1 as PIN 3 and PIN 4.) Thanks for the hint! This gave us an alarm status #, CO2 millivoltage, and potientiometer voltage on the computer screen. The potentiometer voltage was very stable as you said it was, but the CO2 millivoltage was "squirrley." No squirrels were involved in the process.
With all the wires where they 'should' be (TP1 to CH0, ALM pin wire to p3, and CNTL to p4) the CO2 sensor/voltage WAS responsive to pure CO2. But when the voltage stabilized and dropped to '0' it was unresponsive to CO2 (see the comments to the right of the ALM and CNTL pin definitions in the attached program.)
We switched the CO2 sensor's ALM and CNTL wires from p3 to p4 and from p4 to p3 and the CO2 number was much higher and much more stable (700-800 range.) But when CO2 was applied the readings rose, dropped, then stayed 'hung up' at a slightly higher level each time (e.g if the reading was 700 and we applied CO2 to get a reading of 775 it stayed around 775. When we applied CO2 at 775 the reading went to 815-ish, stabilized, then stayed near 810, etc.) Think of stair steps.
I think we're getting close Tracy. Seeing all the "right" numbers appear on the screen today was redeeming. We've been at it literally for hours every day-- e-mail, read, post, build, repeat-- and so it's nice to see it all start coming together. I think we may need to switch the wires back and forth and tweak the program a bit. But that seems small compared to where we were.
Oh, and we learned about (OK, we tinkered with) changing "Bytes" to "Word" and "Word" to "Bytes." What fun learning! We also discovered that we're out of "Word" syntax/space in the program, and we have noooooooo idea how or where to get more. I'm all out of words.
Thanks ever so much, Tracy and Sylvie!
It's dinner time,
Mark and Chris
When you said, "So we can assume that you have no connections from the 3202 to pins 3 and 4 of the BoE, right? That pins 3 and 4 go directly to the CO2 sensor?", i thought the only connection DIRECTLY into the BoE's pins from the CO2 sensor was CNTL. Ground and power went to the corresponding rails and ALM was not needed. Am I mistaken?
When the data is graphed on Microsoft Excel a trend is obvious. Also, the high and low data points “equal out” when data is collected for 10-15 minutes (the data spikes are less noticeable and they seem to be equal in height. See the attached graph.) Could this be interference from other wires that Dr. Allen mentioned?
We’re curious:
1) Why do we have to reverse the ALM and CNTL wires for p3 and p4 around to get “good” data? When they’re not reversed the CO2 millivotage (ppm?) drops quickly and steadily to ‘0’ and then it hardly responds to CO2.
2) What are the CO2 units that we’re seeing? Are they millivolts? Are they parts per million?
3) When Dr. Allen talked about “averaging out” the data to adjust for data spikes, what did he mean and how do you do it?
Attached is a graph of one of this evening’s experimental trials (remember the TPD Heat Shield experiment last fall, Rocketeers?!) Also attachedd is the program we ran to get the data.
Thank you for a productive day,
Mr. Kibler, Chris, and The Rocketeers
Mr. Kibler,
I just tried to open up the graph you uploaded, but it doesn't seem to be in a format that even the newest version of Excel recognizes. Could you please change the format and re-upload it? I'm really curious to see the data for myself. I'm looking over the newest version of the program right now, as well.
Thank you and good night,
Andrew
Two things:
1) I agree that we may want better resolution in the CO2 data. There seems to be "a lot" of variation (200+ units, whatever the units are.)
2) The sample number resets to 0 every time it reaches 255 (a variable of 256, 515, 1024, etc.) Hmmm...
Yawn,·
Mr. Kibler