Anybody really use the "reset" button?

Rayman

Just curious...
I have included a reset button in all my designs, but I'm not sure I see the utility of it...
Cycling the power switch does the same thing and better, IMHO.

Perhaps in some bigger system that the Prop was just a part of, it would be nice to reset just the Prop.
But, I've never really had a need for the reset button.

Would anybody miss the reset button?

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My Prop Info&Apps: ·http://www.rayslogic.com/propeller/propeller.htm

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KPR

All of the small boards I have used / played with never had a power switch or a reset button, and let me just say its a pain in the *** to have to pull the power plug all of the time..

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I always have someone watching my back.

Ravenkallen

I agree with rayman. It does seem kinda unneeded. You can cycle the power on and off, plus there is a reboot command.

Mike Green

I would miss the option of having a reset switch. There are occasions during testing when there's a keyboard and display attached where I would want a reset switch. It would be adequate to use the /Reset line on the header for a PropPlug. There would need to be at least a /Reset header (or solder pads for a header) on a board with a built-in USB interface.

ElectricAye

I always put a reset button on my PCBs but I almost never use it. I'm always afraid some stray electrostatic energy might zap my PCB as I reach over to it, so I often hook my power cord to a switch box instead or just reload the present program using F10.

I can see how it might be useful in testing, however.

Chris Savage

I use a reset button all the time when developing/testing programs. There are several advantages, however one immediate thing I dislike about powering something off/on is the inrush current and potential resetting of devices unintended. Sometimes you have a connected device that takes time to initialize so powering off forces you to wait for that device to initialize. Pressing reset lets you retest code without that issue. Went through this recently on GPS code. Every time I powered down the GPS it took several seconds to regain its lock (indoors).

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Chris Savage

Parallax Engineering
·

Rayman

But, wouldn't just doing "identify" from the Prop tool do the same thing? That's even easier than pushing a little button...

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My Prop Info&Apps: ·http://www.rayslogic.com/propeller/propeller.htm

My Prop Products:· http://www.rayslogic.com/Propeller/Products/Products.htm

Toby Seckshund

I have noticed on some of the Dracblade experiments (and others)·that when the power is recycled then sometimes the program doesn't fire up properly but a using a reset, it·does. I was trying to switch out the EEPROM on the first·clock edge of the KBD driver and this fired off before the EEPROM had finished being loaded into the Prop, so the driver couldn't have been started. A reset onto a powered Prop worked every time.

Pulling the power plug all the time does seem a bit brutal.

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Style and grace : Nil point

David B

I use the reset button fairly regularly.

But that doesn't help when an external device also needs a reset. A serial LCD is a good example - a few garbage characters can put it into a non-responsive mode, and then the fastest way to clear everything is to just recycle power.

Ravenkallen

I like never use the reset button. Cycling power ensures that every device is shut off clean and restarted clean. I do use the reboot command a lot, though.

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)

We faced this question in the design of the Propeller-based S2 (Scribbler II) robot. The original BS2-based Scribbler had a real reset button. It also had the ability to count the number of reset button presses by incrementing a count in EEPROM every time it came out of reset and then rereading this count after a PAUSE in the program. We couldn't do that with the Propeller, though, since it takes much longer to reboot than the BS2 does. So we just wired the "reset" button as an input instead. This provides way more flexibility since, with the Propeller's software reboot, this button can be programmed to reset the S2 -- or not -- as well as to keep track of how many button presses were used to do it prior to executing reboot. When the S2 comes out of reset, it can read its EEPROM to obtain the button count and determine its subsequent behavior from that.

tl;dr: A regular button input is more flexible than a reset button and can be programmed to perform a reset.

-Phil

David Carrier

Raymond,
It is generally considered bad design practice to require the use of a reset button in an end product. This is especially true for a peripheral that would be reset separately from the main device. Imagine having a reset button on one of our serial LCDs. pressing it would mess everything up for the microcontroller connected to it, but the microcontroller wouldn't even be aware that the LCD was reset.

Development systems, on the other hand, do need a reset button. They are especially useful to put the microcontroller to sleep if it starts behaving erratically. It is usually faster to press the reset button than to slide the power switch. I have even held the reset button on a board to keep the microcontroller from running then used my other hand to turn the board off.

Like you mentioned, I often use the 'Identify' function of the Propeller Tool to reset the Propeller, by pressing 'F7', then 'Enter' to close the response window. For products that use the Propeller, but don't generally change firmware, we prefer to have a jumper on the DTR line, so that the user can prevent the computer from resetting or programming the Propeller. (See the Propeller Servo Controller, for example.) An exception would be the PropScope, which does not store its firmware in EEPROM; the computer loads it on every use.

Cluso99

I haven't put a reset button on my designs. I like the idea of a jumper to prevent reset. I jumper the PropPlug cct on my TriBlade.

If you have space for 2x0.1" pin stakes you could solder on pins and any old pc will have a 2pin jumper to a switch so you can have add a reset button if you wish and place it where you want it.

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)·
· Prop OS: SphinxOS·, PropDos , PropCmd··· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBlade Props: www.cluso.bluemagic.biz

jrjr

All,

I've been using a R/C cheapo set modded for a remote reset for
more years than I would care to admit.

It used to be with an ethernet download DOS INT 21 hook for a
'loader on file change' and ran a batch file to load the targets.

when necessary, push the button, reset target.

just add a jumper header or pth pair
or cycle the power by remote.

ah, remoting before VNC....

I could <still> use a Prop W98 IDE framework.

jr

Leon

I've put them on the Propeller boards I've designed, as they are intended for development. They aren't really needed for most other MCUs as the in-circuit debugger has control of the reset pin, and the device can be reset from the IDE.

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Leon Heller
Amateur radio callsign: G1HSM

Post Edited (Leon) : 5/13/2010 3:05:36 AM GMT

RobotWorkshop

It really depends on the project and how it is used. I usually have a reset button on Prototypes but that is sometimes left off the final version. I'll usually leave a spot for a 2-pin header connector (one ground the other reset) so I can just add a switch later if I want.

The reset button is used on the hand wired Hydra clone I built. I'd rather use the reset to go back to the menu on the SD card than pulling the plug and powering it back on.

In the case of some of the robots I work on having a reset button is fine and works well as long as it is managed properly. The reset on the main host will also reset any other boards that it needs to in order to ensure everything come back up in an orderly fashion.

Robert

HollyMinkowski

I use reset when I am working out a new project.
But I have never left a reset button in a finished project.

Dr_Acula

I used the reset button about 30 times last night.

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www.smarthome.viviti.com/propeller

Cluso99

Drac: Maybe you should go to a Dr and get checked for RSI *LOL*

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Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)·
· Prop OS: SphinxOS·, PropDos , PropCmd··· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBlade Props: www.cluso.bluemagic.biz

Dr_Acula

RSI = Reset Strain Injury?

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www.smarthome.viviti.com/propeller

BradC

Dr_Acula said...
RSI = Reset Strain Injury?

Well, I guess you need to reset because something went wrong.. so
RSI = Repetitive Silly Input ?

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"Are you suggesting coconuts migrate?"

heater

After the compulsory blinken light LEDs on all my projects which flash to tell me they are sort of working the reset button is the next most important thing for all those occasions when they are not sort of working and I want to catch what happens.

Of course with the Prop and Prop tool the debug, fix, compile, load reset cycle is fast enough in most cases but when you are poking around with a scope, for example, a quick reset button hit can be very useful.

Aside: I wish there was a reset button on the front of my cable TV digi box. Damn thing is always locking up or forgetting to put the Finnish subtitles onto programs etc etc. I have to keep pulling the power plug out to get it back to sanity. Drat, now I have a little project to attend to.

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For me, the past is not over yet.

Toby Seckshund

Aside, on an aside.

Heater our digi recordery thing locks up constantly. This required the pulling of the power as there seems to be a beleif that reset buttons are never required. I noticed a short while ago that my partners daughter could reset it by pulling it forwards a couple of inches and pushing it back again. I assumed that it was the two pin mains plug that was loose, but it turned out to be that one of the house bunnies (four legged sort ) had bitten through the mains wire.

How can they do that and not die ????


On topic, my beloved Nascom had a NMI button too, this gave an on screen dump of all the registers and their contents and initilizes the single step mode

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Style and grace : Nil point

Post Edited (Toby Seckshund) : 5/13/2010 1:02:14 PM GMT

yarisboy

I put a reset button on my first successful board and never used it either during initial coding nor during application usage. During a recent test where I use a version one prototype to test a Propeller based desktop signal generator I found a software dead-end in the early prototype that I would have never noticed in the original application. I may include a two socket header in the next project so an external reset switch can be plugged in but removed for the final application in an enclosure.

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MOORE'S LAW: The capabilities of electronics shall double every 18 months.
cloyd's corollary: Hardware is easy, software is hard.

heater

Ha! A long time ago we had a dog that, when it was young, used to chew up everything in the house. Sofas, cushions, curtains even managed to pull strips of wall paper off the wall. We just couldn't think of a way to stop this bad habit.

Until..one day we came home to find the little mutt had chewed through the refrigerators mains cable. Strangely the chewing habit had stopped.

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For me, the past is not over yet.

Toby Seckshund

Was there a clue in that it didn't bark, or move, anymore? Still, no chewing was a bonus!

That would have been the final reset.

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Style and grace : Nil point

Post Edited (Toby Seckshund) : 5/14/2010 4:57:46 PM GMT

Chris Savage

Rayman said...
But, wouldn't just doing "identify" from the Prop tool do the same thing? That's even easier than pushing a little button...

In my case no because I am typically off to the side of the PC as my bench wraps around.· Recently I was tweaking some DS1302 code for something and I had to keep resetting the BASIC Stamp, but I didn't want to power it off because the DS1302 was on the BoE and didn't have a backup battery.· As I say, there are enough situations where the reset button is the better choice that on a development board it shoud always be included.· Now if you're building and end-user product that is not end-user servicable, then yeah, a pushbutton isn't a good idea.

Did you know on some BASIC Stamp Programs the reset button is used to change modes of the program?· The Scribbler Robot was one example of where this was used.

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Chris Savage

Parallax Engineering
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nyje

Just thrown away my third hand drawn layout for a small dip propeller board with 10 pins free for a breadboarding area, tv out, kbd+mouse etc.
The idea is i'm working toward a self build, cheap component, 'strip board' propeller system to link up to a mini kb and screen in a 'developers heaven'
laptop style thing.
When bored of this, plugging in a RamBlade will allow me to run CP/M and more using the base prop as a terminal

The salient point is all 3 designs so far, and the final 3 stage Vreg monster I'm now working on all have a 4 pin PropPlug header.
I found a instructible maybe here on the foums to build a plug in reset switch. So I adapted it slightly and have built a tiny PCB with just
a tac switch shorting RESN to GND and female and male headers to carry through to the prop-plug. Hey Presto easy resets while coding, both whilst connected to
the pc or not.

I think the idea may be useful to you in that if you're not sure whether to include the reset switch or not, maybe you could provide a small 'Plug In' reset switch. It would
save PCB space if that is an issue.

Post Edited (nyje) : 5/14/2010 8:51:41 PM GMT

Vaati

I would really miss the reset button... If I am running something like bomberman on my gadget gangster boss board, I have to reset it all the time because the color occasionally gets messed up, and you have to manually reset/remove power to start a new game.

Another thing I use it a lot for is if I am running PropDOS, because you have to reset the prop every time you want to select a different program. [noparse][[/noparse]Actually, that would be interesting to get it so resetting isn't necessary... Maybe just have the programs run within propdos itself.]

Another reason I'd need a reset switch is if the prop starts glitching the game I am working on, and adds invisible monsters to the screen which can only be defeated by attacking randomly...

If it's for something other than code that hasn't been completely corrected, or if it has reset routines built in, a reset button wouldn't be necessary.

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