This really bugs me...

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)

Checking out the newly updated "Getting Started" & "Propeller information" pages... (Nicely designed!)

Do we really still consider the Propeller best for Moderate and Advanced skill levels?

I thought good progress had been made this year on entry level information for the Propeller.

OBC

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Coming soon to a browser near you! PropellerPowered.com
Visit the: PROPELLERPOWERED SIG forum kindly hosted by Savage Circuits.

John R.

I would tend to aggree. Personally, while I understand all the material avaialble for the STAMP, given the price, and especially now with the availability of propBasic, I question why a newcomer (or classroom) would go the STAMP route.

Back when I started, it didn't take long for me to dump the STAMPS for the SX, if only because of cost. The protoboards were/are "dirt cheap" (realitively speaking), so why would you go with the STAMP? A Stamp 2 starts at $49. An SX Protoboard is $15. The Prop Protoboard is $25. Just because it CAN do muti-cog doesn't mean you HAVE to use those features. (In the spirit of KISS for beginners)

I can understand that some wouldn't considder SPIN appropriate for "beginners", but if I'm spending the dollars, I buy Props, and go the propBasic (or even Spin) route...

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
John R.
Click here to see my Nomad Build Log

Cluso99

OBC: No, I consider the prop excellent for beginners. Spin is not as easy as basic, but it's not bad. There are no interrupts, pretty much no registers to be setup and you can add Objects from OBEX easily.

When they want to interface to another part, the same prop does the job. No "that PIC doesn't have the xxx interface, you need this one".

If they want to use pasm it's quite easy compared to most assemblers. No INTERRUPTS to explain.

Just look how easy it is to flash a LED. Now a Stamp or other micro with basic is easy too, but try that without such a language and forget it. How complicated are the other chips with all their registers that require setting just to get the chip to flash a LED. I am trying to avoid the PICs and AVRs like the plague, just because I don't want to decode what I need to start the chip. And I have programmed many different micros in the past.

From a different point of view. How many people on this forum build lots of little projects (and commercially) and use props because they use the same chip and it is easy to program.

Postedit: And what about Hanno's 12 blocks - what could be easier !!!!!!!

My 2c

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)·
· Prop OS: SphinxOS·, PropDos , PropCmd··· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBlade Props: www.cluso.bluemagic.biz

potatohead

Parallax is still selling a lot of stamps, and the inertia there is valuable. It makes no sense right now to alter that core positioning, which is why it's phrased the way it is.

Let some of that SX inventory deplete, and Prop II enter the scene, then there will be a cause to modify that. Prop I can be the beginner, "easy" platform, with Prop II being more advanced than that.

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Propeller Wiki: Share the coolness!
8x8 color 80 Column NTSC Text Object
Safety Tip: Life is as good as YOU think it is!

Phil Pilgrim (PhiPi)

The Stamps haven't diminished in power or utility just because there's a Propeller around. And, let's face it, for what they do, they're easier to use. Their inbuilt functionalities require no OBJ incantations to conjure up; they're just always there. And doing one thing at a time is much easier to explain to beginners than doing eight things at once. Plus, contemplate this for a second:

DEBUG "Hello world!"

What does it take to do that in Spin? No, I doubt that the BASIC Stamp will lose its place as an entry ramp for the Parallax product line anytime soon.

-Phil

icepuck

What if you don't need the power of the prop but something better than a bs2?
Will there be a replacement for the SX? The EOL of the SX is the main reason why I've been looking into other MCU's that can be programed in basic.
With that said, if it wasn't for the basic stamps I wouldn't have gone back into electronics.
-dan

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Arguing with myself--sometimes me, myself, and I don't always agree.
(Former) Caterpillar product support technician

kf4ixm

my $0.02 worth as a new learner of the propeller chip from the BS2...
i tend to agree with OBC as the prop can be just as easy to learn as the basic stamp, IF, in my opinion, you start with the prop instead of the basic stamp. i think my biggest obstacle is that i unintentionally in my mind as i learn the prop is to compare commands, syntax, etc. of the .spin language to .bs2 language that i've learned and feel comfortable with, and i find this very irritating at times. if i had to do over, i would have definatly learned the prop first. i have discovered that the prop is a way more capable chip as far as todays microcontroller needs/wants go, and in the same token, the bs2 is as capable in smaller, less complicated projects.

I think that as a newbie to the prop that is proficient with the bs2 looks at the code in the OBEX and reads these forums and just simply gets overwhelmed by what they see and what people are trying to accomplish, and think to themselves 'wow, this is alot to learn, i think i'll stay with the bs2' or what ever. i know i thought this when i first discovered the prop, reading the forums code snippets and objects in the OBEX. But as i've read more, studied the objects in the OBEX, broke them down into each separate functions and understanding what each line means and does in its entirety before moving to the next line, i have learned and understood way more that just diving in throwing code together and seeing what sticks.

Also, i have intentionally ignored the coding of multiple Cogs for the time being just for the reason that John R. states above. i think once i feel comfortable coding .spin in just one cog and become proficient in building/writing simple programs, Then i can move on to multiple cogs and really unleash the power of the prop.

As far as compilers go, i'm only using the PropTool at this time to learn with, i have seen and downloaded the propbasic before and played with it some, but never did anything with it much. As a beginner and someone moving to the prop from the bs2, is it better for me to stick with the proptool for learning or learn to use propbasic? My biggest fear is to go off on a way skewed learning tangent for the time being, only to find out that propbasic will limit what i can program to fully unleash the power of the prop. Any suggestions are appreciated here concerning proptool vs propbasic, or any other compiler. i would really like to hear from users that have used these tools to explain the pros and cons of each.

There are alot of talented people here on the forums that in my opinion seem to be very proficient in the prop, using different compilers and tools to produce outstanding objects in the OBEX and helping others with code snippets and such. But i understand that trying to explain .spin to someone that is moving from the bs2 to the prop is kinda like trying to explain a PID loop to the plant manager in an industrial setting, with him wanting to know why that valve opens so slowly or halfway and not just opening and closing.

As stated earlier, i believe the prop is beginner level-friendly if you start with an open mind and don't compare it with other programming styles. learn the commands first, then the syntax, then work on piecing it all together. At least thats the way im learning, right or wrong.

Wolfbrother

I think that both can be used by a beginner with equal chances of success. I avoided the propeller for a while in my projects because I saw it as more of a programmer's chip and the stamp as more of a casual users micro. I finally decided to learn some of the propeller when I had a project with several things going on at once. In no time at all, I was semi functional and the mistakes I was making were usually easily solved on this forum. I did run into to a tricky hardware issue on the Propeller Robot Control Board. Software wise, I managed to finish a pretty complex art piece without too much problem using the propeller and modifying available objects. It had one DC motor, two servos, a stepper and a clock all running at the same time, I couldn't have done that all with the stamp. The next project I did was one process at a time and I went back to the Stamp for that one. I still only feel semi functional with the propeller, but I know that posting any issues on this forum will get them solved and to me that makes both micros completely useful for any level of user.

ElectricAye

My background is mechanical not electronic, and while in college I experienced fear and loathing when I encountered anything related to microprocessors or microprocessor people. But when I first encountered the BS2, I found it represented a refreshingly different culture. I could start at the VERY beginning, shed my phobias about all things microprocessorial, and I was able to teach myself very comfortably. Years later, when I made the jump to the Propeller, I found myself choking a bit. Compared to the BS2, the documentation for the Propeller still seemed scant, and many of the concepts seemed alien to me. I feel it's only because of the kindness and generosity of forum members that I've been able to gain a working grasp of how to make the Propeller operate well enough for my applications. So, from my perspective, a total beginner might get overwhelmed by all that the Propeller can do and how it works. I think that by encouraging newbies to start with the BS2, you greatly increase the probability that they will actually connect with the basic concepts and be able to grow from there. I think that presenting newbies with the Propeller risks having them choke on "too much too soon" and losing them altogether. For people who have grown up with this technology, the Propeller might seem like a no-brainer, but for kids or for people like me who are coming into this from another world, the mindset that one must adopt might be too much of a stretch. As shocking as this might sound, we don't all think in computerease. In my opinion, the beauty of Parallax is that it has created a cultural bridge like no other in the world of technology. I'm thinking about those commercials where the two guys say "Hi, I'm a Mac... And I'm a PC." Those are obviously two different cultures, two different psychologies at work. Parallax has got a product line that allows everyone, whether Mac- or PC-minded so to speak, to join the party and make things work. Getting newbies started on BS2 might risk that they waste, say, $100 before they realize they can easily graduate to bigger and better things. But to start newbies out on the Propeller risks they crash and burn and abandon electronics forever and go into banking or something where they can really cause the world a lot of problems.

my 2 yuan's worth

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Watching the world pass me by, one photon at a time.

Post Edited (ElectricAye) : 3/19/2010 5:00:06 PM GMT

Jen J.

Would you prefer something like "Some programming experience required"?

Roy Eltham

BASIC Stamp = Very Easy
Prop Spin = Easy
Prop PASM = moderate/advanced

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Check out the Propeller Wiki·and contribute if you can.

Microcontrolled

PASM = only moderate if you watch the PASM webinar


I love the Propeller for what it can do, and as usual I love the Parallax support, but without the forum I would not have gotten a good start in it. The problem with the manuals for the Prop is it teaches you commands but not the exact technique for it all that I have learned on the forum. (In fact, whenever I come up with another good tip or useful code snippet, I write it down in a digital file. Maybe in a year I'll have a book. )

I vote that it should say "Propeller SPIN - Some programming experience recommended".

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Don't click on this.....

Use the Propeller icon!!

RobotWorkshop

When you look at the whole picture (Hardware/Software) I think that Parallax is spot-on. The software side is close enough but the differences on the hardware seem to push it to Moderate instead of beginner. The main reason is that the chip runs on 3.3V Most of the material I see (and have sitting in years worth of magazines and books) show circuit examples and interfacing based on devices that are all using a 5V supply. In many cases connecting them up to the Propeller isn't that bad but it can add an extra layer that a beginner may not expect or be ready to tackle if all they've been studying are designs and techniques based on 5V systems. There are whole threads based on the best way to connect 5V devices that you just don't need to deal with when using the Stamp or other Micro running at 5V.

IRobot2

I think the current description that Parallax is using is not so true any more. I think it is almost just as easy to blink some LED's with a Prop as it is with Stamp and in some cases the Prop may even be easier. Yet one of this big problems that we have all seen is that some one learns how to blink LED's with the Prop and realizes all the other possibilities that lay before him and goes straight to trying to build some kind of low earth orbit space craft. Newly introduced people start seeing all the crazy neat things that many of you are doing on the forum but fail to realize the complexity behind them. They then try to go a similar direction, probably fail more often than not and get discouraged or give up altogether. Where as the Stamp has numerous projects/books/ and tutorials to start knowledge process. I know people get wrapped up in delusions with the stamp too but look at the difference in projects! Even though there is now plenty of documentation and semi-easy projects for the prop, there is still that learning curve brick wall that is much closer than the Stamps.

Long story short though, I think the only real complexity differences is that the stamp has more documentation and projects for beginners and the Prop requires a tad bit more hardware. Other than that how is the Prop any harder to use?

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Alex Burke
"It is not how smart you are rather, it is how you are smart." -Jon Campbell

Chuck Thomas

My 5 cents. I teach high school students 9-12. I am moving to the propeller chip slowly due to budget constraints. The basic Stamp is a good product and I've taught it for·5 years. I am moving to the Propeller because PropBasic is here. I can teach the same type of material on a much more powerful processor. My students want movement and sound. I can't do that with a Basic stamp with a Prop no problem. I also helps to challenge the students who want to go deeper into the lesson than just completing the assignments. It has been pointed out the Basic Stamp module is $50, PropProto board $40.00. I go with the lowest cost. Yes I did start to branch out into the SX chip because it is much cheaper. But with the SX at End of Life and the Propeller at beginning of life I thought it would be the best choice. I don’t think the change will be any more difficult but if this thread is active in June I’ll post an update.

Chuck Thomas

John R.

Phil makes a good point with the "Debug" statement. What level would you call including the serial terminal object, firing up the paralax serial terminal, and remembering to always hit the "enable" button each time your focus leaves the terminal window?

Other than that, and even with that, I'd personally have no problems introducing someone to microcontrollers on the Prop, with, or without programming experience.

If someone has no programming experience, there are going to be some challanges regardless. There are three broad stroke scenarios:

* The user will blindly follow the "do this" steps and focus on learning how to flash the LED, not how/why they have to put the terminal stuff in.

* The user will take the time to understand all of that.

* The user will go "huh" and walk away.

Obviously number 3 is not good, but I don't know if those individuals would have a better experience with the Stamp.

Again, in my mind (this is a dangerous place, and does not necessarily reflect the views of management, and/or reality), this comes down to cost/benefit ratio, and I have a tough time seeing that much value in the Stamp. It's a great product, don't get me wrong, and it's how I got my start in this stuff. But I think you could start someone off on the Prop just as easy (or darned close).

I also have not tried ViewPort yet, and this may be another tool to make life easier (although it works against the cost side of things).

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
John R.
Click here to see my Nomad Build Log

kf4ixm

IRobot2 said...
·I think the only real complexity differences is that the stamp has more documentation and projects for beginners and the Prop requires a tad bit more hardware.

I agree, i for one would like to see more basic examples for the prop much like the examples in 'whats a microcontroller', 'smart sensors', or 'process control'. for these really helped me out with basic stamps "way back when" to actually put 'real world' use examples into context. The book 'Programming and customizing the multicore propeller microprocessor' is a really good start in that direction. but as a prop newbie myself, i was a bit overwhelmed by some of the projects in it. not really saying the examples were long and drawn out, but·some seemed to me, for my learning, to be a bit more that i really wanted to get involved in making or reproducing on my own. It's a great book, don't get me wrong, but i really didn't learn as much as i'd hoped for. I'm not trashing parallax or the authors in any way, shape or form here, i can't say enought good things about parallax, thier products and the members of this forum. They have done an awesome thing for the hobbyist community with the bs2 and prop, and for commercial products also. I'm sitting here now, re-reading the prop manual and thinking to myself that id love to see a simple 'make your servo turn this way then that way' type of example, with explanations on how the code makes the servo turn. thats what i truly miss from learning the basic stamp to the prop.

HollyMinkowski

I'm slowly teaching an 11yr old how to program.

I flattened out the pins on a 40pin prop and eeprom chip so that they are like giant sm parts.
Then we added the parts to make an LED blink project. 3.3v regulator, caps, resistors...etc
We just soldered the parts either directly to the prop or using short lengths of colorful
wire.


It all seemed so much easier with all the connections so visible...even lots easier than
using a solderless breadboard.

Also did the same with an AVR tiny13.

This approach might make a simple beginners program if someone made up a nice .pdf
file with lots of clear pictures and lots of hand holding for getting the programs written and
stored in the eeprom chip.

Post Edited (HollyMinkowski) : 3/19/2010 7:27:11 PM GMT

Graham Stabler

spin- easy to moderate

Microcontrolled

I forgot to mention in my earlier comment that the BS2 is a GREAT learning chip. I could program it when I was 10-12yrs old, with no adult help. It is easy and all the common commands are already implanted into the chip's instruction set. When I started the Propeller, I was drawn to it for it's ability to draw text on a screen. The commands confused me at first, and the code layout was unfamiliar, but in about a month I had some good projects going that were better then ANYTHING I had made with my stamp. In April 2009, Ken sent me some supplies (I was using a DIP propeller with a homemade programmer) I took off. I read the PE text and it was all there, easy and simple. So what I am saying is it depends, if you have the manual and the right equipment, it is easy. If you don't, it is definitely moderate. The versatility is great, if it tells you something I haven't used my stamp in 2 years.

Micro

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Don't click on this.....

Use the Propeller icon!!

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)

Given the addition of great books (Both the PEkit book and the new Propeller book) and PropBASIC,
I'd definitely agree with Easy to Moderate for the Propeller (spin). Advanced for PASM.

Thanks for the great input gang. [noparse]:)[/noparse]

OBC

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Coming soon to a browser near you! PropellerPowered.com
Visit the: PROPELLERPOWERED SIG forum kindly hosted by Savage Circuits.

Scope

Before my interest in robotics, I used to play with Python quite a bit, so, I'm at least familiar with some of the programming concepts.

Oldbitcollector said...
Do we really still consider the Propeller best for Moderate and Advanced skill levels?

I've just completed a "self designed introduction" to microcontrollers using the Stamp 2. I still have lots to learn with the Stamp 2 but I "ran out of functionality" which is why I purchased a Propeller Robot Control Board (?). I thought that piece of equipment, along with the new green book would get me going in no time with my new project.

This was an incorrect assumption.

My experience in learning how to use (and understanding why) the Propeller has been quite challenging. I will eventually "get it" or at least become proficient with it because the more I read about the Propeller, the more I'm fascinated, thus the more I am motivated to keep going. Honestly, the Propeller seems to be the world's most underestimated way of spending $7.

I think if I am patient and work consistently ~and~ I use the Propeller Demo Board along with the new green book book, I'll eventually "get it" It's difficult to follow the book being brand new to the Propeller and only having the Propeller Robot Control Board

Sorry to ramble - I'm not the brightest LED on the breadboard

10gigbill

I am new at the prop and spin, coming from years of basic stamps and sx/b. I am new at object based programming. (I still miss my go-to etc&#8230[noparse];)[/noparse] I can see the advantages and I will stick it out to learn spin.
The prop has been out for how many years? And only in the last few months has Parallax, Bean, and others come forward with “Basic”, “The Official Guide”, and one of the forum members is writing a book. So It is no secret there has been a shortage of easy to learn stuff for the beginner.
If it weren’t for the great guys on this forum, I think a lot of newbies would give up.

Bill

Hanno

My daughter (age 5) is happy programming the Propeller with 12Blocks. No need to teach her about ! or ~ or clkfreq. Just read the block to see what it does and drag it where you want it.
Here some samples (some with more help from Daddy):
Blinking led's

Graphics

Fibonacci

Hanno

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Co-author of the official Propeller Guide- available at Amazon
Developer of ViewPort, the premier visual debugger for the Propeller (read the review here, thread here),
12Blocks, the block-based programming environment (thread here)
and PropScope, the multi-function USB oscilloscope/function generator/logic analyzer

BuildThings

For any car people out there.. they say the Viper is a race car that you can drive on the street, and the Corvette is a street car that you can take to the track…. I feel like the Basic Stamp is the Corvette and the Propeller ..the Viper.

Without thinking about the syntax or complexity comparison of languages, look at the scope of hardware concepts and theory that Prop heads have. I would bet there there are a great number of Stamp users that have built all sorts of gadgets and played with Stamps for years, yet could not tell you a thing about clock rates, PCBs, registers, PLLs, or the difference between an oscilloscope and a stethoscope. Why… because they were able to drive it home and 2 hours later have buttons controlling motors in their science projects, simple control loops watching sump pumps, and etc etc…

The Stamp for me, when I was 15 (13 years ago) was an interface that replaced all of my crazy relays and LEDS that I had wired directly to the serial port. I was able to slowly learn concepts and write software in Visual Basic or C+ and use just a few lines on code on the Stamp to make my serial inputs do "output stuff". The more I learned over the years, the more code I was able to write on the Stamp. Slowly I was able to design some "disconnected" applications with no PC (automatic Flag raiser that put up the flag in the morning and down at dusk). The Basic Stamp became a microcontroller to me, and not just "the stamp" the day it was in a project box all alone doing something. I would not have been able to do the same at that age with the current documentation for the Propeller.

My now… 1.5 months and counting of Spinning has had a slight learning curve, however I know it would have been much worse have I not had an engineering degree and 13 years of Stamping.

IROBOT2 had a great comment about new Prop heads "..trying to build some kind of low earth orbit space craft…" as a first project.

Perhaps it's not how complex the thing is to use, it's how complex of a thing you are trying to do with the thing


-John (Going back to driving 5mph in my Viper)

HollyMinkowski

@hanno

12blocks looks like an amazing teaching tool!

Almost makes one wish they could start over as a beginner to see how easy
12blocks would make learning spin

If your daughter actually has a grasp of programming fundamentals
she must be a brilliant child!

Cluso99

Hanno's 12 Blocks is great. It is a commercial product but look what you get! And when you have a simple (or complex) program running you can see the spin code it produced. Cannot ask for anything simpler can you???

I think this program (with cost) needs to be on the page to just show how simple the prop can be. I know of no other micro with this simplicity to get you going.

Hanno.. If not already done, is there a way to get this into the magazines???

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Links to other interesting threads:

· Home of the MultiBladeProps: TriBlade,·RamBlade,·SixBlade, website
· Single Board Computer:·3 Propeller ICs·and a·TriBladeProp board (ZiCog Z80 Emulator)
· Prop Tools under Development or Completed (Index)
· Emulators: CPUs Z80 etc; Micros Altair etc;· Terminals·VT100 etc; (Index) ZiCog (Z80) , MoCog (6809)·
· Prop OS: SphinxOS·, PropDos , PropCmd··· Search the Propeller forums·(uses advanced Google search)
My cruising website is: ·www.bluemagic.biz·· MultiBlade Props: www.cluso.bluemagic.biz

Hanno

As my friends will tell you- I can talk for hours about how great my kids are...

But no, she's not quite grasping recursive functions yet. But it's amazing how quickly kids (and adults) learn when they have fun. I'll admit that it took me quite some time to grasp spin- having to start with a blank slate, typing in cryptic clock settings, figuring out what ~, ~~, !, := mean, and mastering different objects just to do common things.

I love how 12blocks is turning out- thanks largely to the wonderful feedback of beta testers and early customers. I'll be wearing my "developer" hat for a little bit longer, but will spend May and June traveling all over the world to talk about 12Blocks and some big surprises...
Hanno

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Co-author of the official Propeller Guide- available at Amazon
Developer of ViewPort, the premier visual debugger for the Propeller (read the review here, thread here),
12Blocks, the block-based programming environment (thread here)
and PropScope, the multi-function USB oscilloscope/function generator/logic analyzer

kf4ixm

Just a update·about my learning and view on newbiness-friendly of the prop...

This weekend i woke up, made a big cup of coffee, staring at my proplab, i decided that today i was gonna learn .spin come snowballs or coconuts. i decided that i was just gonna temporarily forget everything i have attempted to learn so far about .spin from reading the prop manual, green book, etc., to start as someone that just crawled out from under a rock and discovered the prop for the first time. i looked on the parallax website prop pages and figured the PE labs text was as good as any to start with. and within the first hour, i was flashing an led! by the end of the day, (9:30pm),·i was all the way through the PE labs text up to the counter modules chapter, (7), and i was flashing leds in every concievable way imaginable, and very happy also that i had a very good understanding up to this point of .spin structure, timing, basic i/o, calling, starting and stopping cogs and methods, and development and use of multiple objects.

I, at last, was very, very happy about finally crossing the hurdles i had encountered in learning the prop and have come to this conclusion about learning the prop.

1. I was making the learning of the prop way harder on myself than it truley is. I had been reading here and there about the prop, here on the forums, looking at the obex objects, seeing all the more complex objects and projects that the talented people here on the forums had made, trying to reverse engineer them and understand how they were made, mostly just confused me that much more. by starting at the very bottom, say flashing an led, gave me more insight to the structure and operation of .spin that up to this point, (3-4 months)·was a mystery to me about how it works.
2. The prop is truley a beginner friendly microprocessor and .spin language is not really any harder to learn than .bs2, you just have to start at the very rock bottom, forget the mindset of 'well i know how to blink an led, i want to make a prop time machine' type metality that i think most of us newbies seem to get into when we first encounter the prop and its capabilities. yes, you can do alot of really cool things with the prop, but you must first learn to crawl before you walk, and this is very true for the prop.

I have learned more in one day than i have in the 3-4 months of reading about the prop and reading the forums and trying to reverse-engineer the obex. at this point i dont even care about whats in the obex, although i know that eventually down the road in my learning·it will be a goldmine of useful objects to use in my own programs that, up till yesterday, was just a pipedream of me ever being able to create.

I want to thank parallax and everyone on the forums for thier contributions, insights and suggestions, for without, i doubt i would even be interested in learning the prop. the prop is a very great product, and the prop 2 is gonna be even better! I think that by the time the prop 2 comes out and on my current newly found learning path, i will be good and ready to start with the prop 2!

My suggestion for someone new to the prop:

STOP reading so much about the capabilities of the prop, this will probably just confuse you more, (as it had me). Get the Propeller Education Labs kit, Start at page one and go though every page and project. You will definatly learn more this way that just diving in. Don't yet worry about what programs to use to program and compile with, just use the Propeller Tool software from parallax, start with this, then as you become more familiar with the structure of .spin feel free to move on to bigger and better software. i think 12blocks is a great program, but for my learning, i think i get a better feel to .spin by actually coding it myself.


Post Edited (kf4ixm) : 3/22/2010 3:22:03 PM GMT

Oldbitcollector (Jeff)

@kf4ixm:


WELCOME TO THE CLUB! [noparse]:)[/noparse] [noparse]:)[/noparse]

It's all exciting stuff from here on... Thanks for sharing your success with spin!

OBC

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Are you Propeller Powered? PropellerPowered.com
Visit the: PROPELLERPOWERED SIG forum kindly hosted by Savage Circuits.

Microcontrolled

Yes! Once you get started, you can't stop! :-D

▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔▔
Don't click on this.....

Use the Propeller icon!!

You had better not start ANOTHER PropII thread.